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TFA: A Gentle Restructure — Page 82

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Hal 9000 said:

^ Not sure what you mean, Dom. If there are exceptions, the neo-fundamentalist-SW-orthodoxy seems to have failed out the gate.

I mean, the concept of a novelization/adaptation is sort of an outlier to begin with anyway. But more important is that I don’t think their intention is for the canon to be as stringent as fans have made it out to be.

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nl0428 said:

Hal 9000 said:

And it’d be reeeeal weird to have a ~17 year old Ben Solo address Rey as ‘sweetheart.’

It may not be from the past, it could very likely be said by him in the future, possibly in The Rise of Skywalker. Afterall, her vision did foreshadow their duel on Starkiller Base.

Maybe we should wait and see what happens in TRoS. If Ben says something like that, or if we learn something new about Rey’s parents then you could extract a line from there and put it in TFA or record a new line based on what we know.

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Perhaps, but I don’t see a strong need for this, anyway.

Maybe I’m mistaken, but if indeed the position from LFL is that everything is equally weighted canon, I poke that in the eye as an impossible standard. Of course, I’ve got a sensitive spot personally for airtight systems of belief with no wiggle room.

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Can I get a download link? Prepping for my Episode 9 Marathon and this version of TFA seems to be the one to watch.

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PM sent

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I’m a big fan of TFA anyway but watched this at my friend’s house and it was excellent! Thanks!

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Well thanks for saying so. I like TFA too. I was reluctant to do this, but the idea was too elegant not to at least try to implement. After I did a not-truly-viable V1 that I felt was disappointing, NeverAr and Sir Ridley stepped up to deliver a dramatically improved V2.

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Any chance of getting a seed for the TinyEncode? Where I’m at, I only have internet on my phone, so dlc/multipart files have been a pain.

Preferred Saga:
PT: Hal9000
4/5: Adywan
6: NSP
7/8: Hal9000

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The edits are not split into separate zip files on Google Drive, so you may be able to stream it directly to your phone in real time. I will send you a PM.

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Hi Hal/Community

So I watched this in it’s entirety last night.

What an amazing effort not only from an editing/story structure perspective, but also technically!

I’ve lurked on the periphery of the fan edit community for years…albeit I’ve been on a lengthy hiatus, but to come back into the fold and see how works like this have evolved is just jaw dropping!

The work here really is pretty seamless. I may have to rewatch this a few more times to really absorb it but on initial viewing this may be my ‘go to’ version of TFA from now on. It just seems to be so logical that it would be structured this way.

If I had any ‘critisism’ or observations to make at all (and I’m scraping the barrel here)…it would be that there might be a few more avenues to explore with regard to restructuring/reordering some of the original scenes.

Because I was watching this with an overly critical eye (which is a polite way of saying that I was LOOKING for/expecting flaws) a scene jumped out at me as being questionably placed (with regard to it’s timing within the story)

I cross referenced it’s placement against the original cut and its placement is the same (although the scene in question has been trimmed/edited as part of the restructure) and so I thought this may be worth a look if/when you ever go back to the edit on this (which I’m aware you have said you will not - unless Ep9 requires it)

Anyhow the scene in question:

Immediately following the Rathtar escape and the Falcon jumping to Hyperspace, the ‘Death Gang’ leader puts out the APB on the Falcon with instructions to inform the First Order that BB8 is in the possession of Han Solo.

Cut to:-

The revised Snoke and Kylo scene.

The scene plays fine, but I think by removing Hux and his dialogue in order to facilitate the overall Starkiller restructure, the scene now runs quite short and so when Snoke reveals to Kylo that Han Solo has entered the fold, to me it doesn’t feel like there has been enough time within the time frame of the actual movie for the message from Death Gang leader to have been transmitted, received at the highest levels and then have Kylo be called to Snoke to be informed.

Considering that we then immediately cut back to the Falcon having troubles in Hyperspace and the scene where the heroes 'get to know each other’ and generally bring the audience up to date on what’s gone on with our OG heroes these last 30 years, the Snoke/Kylo scene and the nature of that discussion seems like it could be shuffled over in order to be more effective?

My first thoughts are this:-

The Falcon escapes the Death Gang/Rathtars.
Death Gang Leader orders his crew to inform First Order.

Cut to:-

Falcon in Hyperspace. Heroes have their scene/dialogue – Up until Han mentions that they have arrived at Maz’s planet and walks off toward/enters the cockpit

Cut to:-

Snoke/Kylo Scene – Plays and ends as before

Cut to:-

Falcon dropping out of Hyperspace and then the Takodana arrival and subsequent scene plays and ends as before.

I feel that the extra time aboard the Falcon would allow the audience to catch their breath and spend more time with characters we know/like and also allow for more ‘in movie’ time to pass so that the Kylo/Snoke scene has had more time to generate itself within the context of the movie?

(especially now that Hux and Snoke’s dialogue has been removed and the scene serves no other purpose than to inform Kylo that his father is involved in his pursuit of the Heroes)

The only other part that I though needed ‘something’ was on Takodana when the First Order Star Destroyer arrives.

This is such an amazing replacement for the original Starkiller sequence and works perfectly….as I said above, I think it’s actually better.

But if I could nitpick just a few of the details, the only thing that seemed ‘unearned?’ or just missing a piece, is when the First Order arrive at Takodana.

Not when Fin looks up to see the Star Destroyer, as that can be put down to instinct/luck/intuition/seeing it out the corner of his eye…despite the First Order arriving stealthily.

It’s the following shot of Han and the Crowd gathered outside Maz’s Castle looking up and reacting to the arrival.

What drew them all out at that moment?

I feel there needs to be some sort of sound cue/tremor/commotion that would actually cause everyone to go outside, together and see what’s up at that exact moment?

Obviously the original cut had all the drama relating to the Starkiller weapon, but without that in this edit, I feel there just needs to be something that catalyses the gathering of a crowd outside?

Anyhow, those are my only two pieces of (hopefully) constructive feedback in what is otherwise an exemplary piece of work.

Thanks so much for all of the time and effort you put into your edits, I’m REALLY enjoying them

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Hey Pearce! I hope Hal doesn’t mind me chiming in, but it is really nice to hear constructive feedback from a fresh perspective. Your thought on the scene reordering is interesting but makes total sense. I’ll leave that to Hal and see what he says about it.

About the Star Destroyer reaction, maybe in the shot of Finn walking up the steps of the ship, you could insert a sound of the Star Destroyer jumping out of hyperspace, just like what we hear at the beginning of The Last Jedi when the Resistance was evacuating. That would be the simplest addition I think.

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Thank you for the praise about this project, which I agree with and am glad to see spread among its contributors.

I’m not sure, though, that reshuffling the post-rathtar scenes would be an improvement. As it stands, in both the original and fan edited versions, we cut to the APB to a conversation with Snoke in which he reveals he is aware of it. Given how frenetic TFA is otherwise, it doesn’t seem to stand out to me. What would seem more frenetic would be to cut to the Falcon in hyperspace immediately. And cutting to Snoke after Han says, “this is out stop” would seem to be a bit jarring.

As far as the star destroyer, remember that the Empire has been gone for decades and the First Order has yet to reveal themselves. Remember Poe’s awed expression when he is taken aboard one at the start of the movie. When it appears, the locale of criminals react with alarm, Finn hear’s the commotion and turns to see what’s up. Han and company come out of the bar to see this star destroyer which is a very unusual sight. If I were to add a sound effect for the destroyer exiting hyperspace, that would necessitate that Finn was reacting to that specific sound, and I can’t obviously have it before the beginning of the shot. That might make it feel more abrupt than to have him react to the commotion around him, which seems more organic since it was what was happening in the shot originally.

I understand that these are small points, but I wanted to respond to them with consideration. I just don’t see alternatives as superior to what’s there for those two points.

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Hi RogueLeader

Thanks for the response!

Funnily enough, the exit hyperspace sound from TLJ was EXACTLY what I had in mind too, as I said, something as ‘simple’ as just a sound cue, to just give some context to why people might be gathering to look up at the sky.

With regard to both of those observations I made, I haven’t picked it all apart enough to have even a rough idea of what would be involved. ie working around wipes and fades, sound and music mix either side of the edits etc.

Please know that I am VERY aware that it’s very easy for someone like me to throw ideas and suggestions around when I’m not the one who has spent months/years labouring over the project.

I totally appreciate that me sitting here from the comfort of my desk without the relevant software/hardware/general skills and having the nerve to make recommendations is a bit rich…

If I did have the kit, I’d definitely see what I could throw together just to ‘give back’ a bit, especially when HAL has clearly busted his ass to make something so near to perfect (and lets be honest the actual ordering of the main scene in question is inherent to the original cut, not so much as a creative decision made by HAL)

However, considering the effort that has gone into EVERYTHING here, editing, VFX, sound mix etc…I think anything I’d add or shuffle would just look and sound amateur and the product would ultimately be worse for my involvement with (MUCH!) less skilled execution.

If/when HAL does chime in, please know that I only brought these ideas to the table BECAUSE the product is so damn good well thought out and executed that these ideas are only supposed to be suggestions relating to last ditch house keeping/refinement/polishing rather than anything that needs changing.

I love your work. Thanks again for all of your effort.

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I remember the destroyer sound effect being brought up in discussion when SirRidley was working on the sound/music for this scene and there were a few attempts at making this change. Unfortunately none of them felt entirely seamless and so the idea was dropped from the final edit.

As for the reshuffled Snoke scene, your thought process is quite close to mine. In my hopefully-soon-to-be-finished edit (which uses Hal’s as a base) this change is implemented.

What a grand and intoxicating innocence. How could you be so naive? There is no escape. Come, lay down your weapons. It is not too late for my mercy.
Episode 9 Rewrite THE SHATTERED SWORD (Complete!)
The Force Awakens Restructured (V3 Released!) and The Starlight Project (WORKPRINT RELEASED!)

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Hi HAL

As I was just saying to RogueLeader

I haven’t even begun to pick apart what would be involved and even if those idea would work.

The closest I got was ‘skipping the chapter’ on the player to get a worse than rough idea on whether it could flow.

I hadn’t even got to the point where I trimmed the pieces and placed in a rough edit to see if there was anything there, so I’m not even talking from a place where I’ve means tested these ideas. They really were just the start of some thoughts.

You are the one who has laboured over this and picked it apart and put it all back together again so I’ll happily accept that you might just know what you are talking about here 😃

Thanks again.

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No worries; it’s really hard to tell sometimes what might work until it’s all there in front of you picked apart.
Even then in my case, sometimes I don’t think something is doable until I take a break and enough people tell me to try again.

EDIT: I think this fan edit is the strongest project I’ve been part of, and the one I’m most proud of. I guess my edit of Ep3 would be the most controversial, either strong or misguided depending on your POV.

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NeverarGreat said:

I remember the destroyer sound effect being brought up in discussion when SirRidley was working on the sound/music for this scene and there were a few attempts at making this change. Unfortunately none of them felt entirely seamless and so the idea was dropped from the final edit.

Yeah. There isn’t really a natural place for the sound effect. If you place it early and Finn doesn’t react until later it wouldn’t have the impact needed. If you place it just before Finn reacts I think his reaction still doesn’t match, a sudden sound should lead to a quick reaction. And if the sound is what they react to there’s still the question of how everyone got out to look so soon. I think a sequence where the sound could work would need a new shot, perhaps a shot like in TLJ where the Star Destroyer appears above Takodana (which would explain what the sound is, that would be unclear for first time viewers) or perhaps an interior shot of people in the bar hearing a loud bang outside and going out to see what’s going on, followed by the sequence as it is or maybe with the crowd shot moved before the shot of Finn.

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Well, this TFA edit stands apart from any other ‘fan edits’ I’ve watched before.

I always like seeing well done fan edits, if for no other reason than just to see other peoples ideas

…this however goes beyond that.

It takes what was already there and restructures it into what I (and seemingly a LOT of others) would argue is a more effective narrative structure.

BUT…it’s more than that! …the glue you have used to bind your vision together is nigh on industry standard…or at least in how it appears…so you deserve to be very proud.

I’m also a huge fan of the changes you made to TLJ! I could say the same about that edit as well if I’m honest.

I’m an unapologetic fan of Disney era Star Wars. I think with TFA and TLJ at least the basic content is there to play around with, shuffle, edit, cut, rework and so if you have the skills and resources that you clearly do, I think some of the issues a lot of us fans have with them in their original forms, can be worked with or around.

Funny what you said about EP3 though:-

I’ve been through all of your Prequel edits and I’ll say this:

All of them are exponentially better for your work on them, but it’s so easy to see how little there is to really work with to make them better movies.

Whether it’s the awful expositionary/hollow dialogue and/or poor acting, the ageing CGI (which has held up less well in 20 years than the practical effects from the OT have over 40), the sloppy editing and non-existent cinematography and how all of that combines to make the entire trilogy one huge missed opportunity (well thats MY view on the prequels as a whole)

The jump (at least chronologically) between EP3 to EP4 is jarring enough just on account of the 25 odd years between them…forgetting CGI, even in just how they look (one shot on film and the being shot on relative early digital cameras)

One looks and feels like a FILM, the other looks sterile and artificial, cartoony but without any real ‘joy’.

To this day I still think TPM looks and feels the most Star Wars out of the PT…despite it’s many missteps I think it still holds up, and I really do think that’s because it was shot on film.

Don’t get me started on EP2 though, it’s just the worst. In every way.

Your edits of these have at least got rid of some the intolerable guff and sharpened up some of the narratives across all 3 Prequel movies, but I can fully appreciate how that must have been really hard just on account of having so little to really work with in order to make any of them GREAT in their own right?

So to me your Ep3 (LOE, right?) edit isn’t at all controversial. I think it takes a ‘less is more’ approach, keeps things tighter and more in theme with what we thought we knew when we just had the OT.

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Well, thanks for saying that. Consider leaving TFA:R a review over at FE.org if you haven’t already.

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I am guessing that after TROS there will be a V4 of TFA:R, and a V3 of TLJ:L to remove any inconsistencies in the trilogy.

If Obi Wan does not play a role in TROS would that warrant removing the “Rey, these are your first steps” line from her vision since there would be no connection between Rey and Obi Wan in this trilogy?

Also, since Palpatine is back maybe there could be a way to better hint that in TFA and TLJ.

JUST IN CASE SPOILER ALERT BELOW

If supposed spoilers are true.

Obi Wan’s line in TFA could be replaced by Palpatine using the quotes below:
“Oh, I’m afRAId the deflector shield will be quite operational when your friends arrive.”
&
“…fulfill your destiny”
Palpatine: “Rey, fulfill your destiny.”

The Skywalker Saga Viewing Order:
I: C.O.D. | II: T.A.S. | III: L.O.E.
IV: Revisited | V: Revisited | VI: Revisited
VII: Restructured | VIII: Rekindled | IX: Ascendant

This is the way.

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You may want to edit your post to hide the spoiler like this:

Insert Spoiler Here

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Even in the event that everything being tossed about is correct, I don’t think those would be warranted.

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A new TV spot for TROS released tonight shows repurposed footage from a TFA deleted scene included on the BluRay.

Hoping the new movie won’t require rethinking the scene in TFA:R where Leia sends her envoy to the Senate. I don’t imagine talk of the Senate would fit into this movie anyway, so here’s hoping for no damage!

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