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Star Wars coming to Blu Ray (UPDATE: August 30 2011, No! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!) — Page 89

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generalfrevious said:


The thing I most hate about him is his stubbornness in refusing to release the OOT (no the GOUT really doesn't count) on modern video format.

zombie's post actually settles the question in my mind as to why GL didn't release the OOT and never will. It's not just that modern digital effects allowed him to realize visuals he couldn't achieve in the 70s and 80s. I suspect Lucas felt that the OOT is not 100% his and he privately hated that. The special editions were a way of satisfying his own need to have the final say – which, as creator he's entitled to have, for better or worse.

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Wow. He has really perverted intellectual property to destroy film. I want the OOT NOW and not 50 years from now when it enters public domain. I think many people think the same way I do in that the OOT deserves better than this, and I am fucking angry that GL is twisting the first amendment to destroy a film that should be seen by the public and not a bonus feature. This is why I feel so pissed. The OOT is rotting frame by frame and we cannot stop the destruction.

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I wonder what it would have been like if he had done the changes back during 78-82, since the movie was being re-released every year anyway, it must have crossed his mind. Especially since Spielberg did exactly that with Close Encounters, right down to the "special edition" tag. He even had access to the still age-appropriate actors (Spielberg brought back Dreyfuss and Bob Balaban 3 years later) and was apparently so tortured and emo about the shots that didn't work, he might have done something interesting.

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The decision to re-do the FX in 1993 was not his idea. It was Dennis Muren who pressed it on him. Lucas just wanted to add the Jabba scene, an addition which he attempted to do for the 1981 modification which had the new crawl. He might have wanted to also add a few BG elements to Mos Eisley, but this is not totally clear. So, he never had the idea of doing large-scale FX changes until Dennis Muren and then other ILM staff started suggesting it. He then surmised it would be good R&D for the prequels, and so he started thinking up changes that would have relevant research qualities (i.e. crowd replication, BG replacement, CG close to camera).

It was a slippery slope and once he started he realized how much he liked it. But he was really just interested in sprucing up Mos Eisley and adding the deleted Jabba scene. If it was 1981 and he could have done whatever he wanted, evidence suggests this is all he would have done. I prefer the non-Jabba edit, just as I prefer the original crawl, but I would have let him get away with it for consistency/relevance the same as the 1981 crawl; not a big deal. I think most people would feel similar.

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asterisk8 said:

generalfrevious said:


The thing I most hate about him is his stubbornness in refusing to release the OOT (no the GOUT really doesn't count) on modern video format.

zombie's post actually settles the question in my mind as to why GL didn't release the OOT and never will. It's not just that modern digital effects allowed him to realize visuals he couldn't achieve in the 70s and 80s. I suspect Lucas felt that the OOT is not 100% his and he privately hated that. The special editions were a way of satisfying his own need to have the final say – which, as creator he's entitled to have, for better or worse.

 for me...

i think there were WAY more releases of the OOT than the special editions..

if you go back, there were VHS, CED, and laserdiscs of every possible

permutation of the OT.... pan and scan, widescreen, THX etc..

i would never complain about their being a lack of versions  being available

of it...

although i never owned a VHS deck (until about a year ago), and  have

had the definitive laserdisc versions for several years  (japanese, US,

boxsets etc).. so i've been happy with those, the few times i've watched

them, along with the DVD versions..

 

i don't blame lucas at all, because the hold up on newer restored versions

is more due to personal/legal issues, than just financial and philosophical

issues..

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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generalfrevious said:

Wow. He has really perverted intellectual property to destroy film. I want the OOT NOW and not 50 years from now when it enters public domain. I think many people think the same way I do in that the OOT deserves better than this, and I am f*cking angry that GL is twisting the first amendment to destroy a film that should be seen by the public and not a bonus feature. This is why I feel so pissed. The OOT is rotting frame by frame and we cannot stop the destruction.

 is there documented evidence (besides the occasional report), that all

the original prints have been destroyed?

unless someone actually goes into the 'mythical' lucasfilm archives and

tells us there aren't any prints there....i wouldn't know..

 

also, don't you ever check the presevation forum?

==================================

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/forum.cfm/Star-Wars-Preservations-and-Other-Fan-Projects/forum/17/

 

there's plenty of efforts there going on... including scans of

the original reels in 1080p and possibly 2k/4k ... who knows

if/when a restoration will show up.. but it's being looked into

and worked on (eventually)..

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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Baronlando said:

I wonder what it would have been like if he had done the changes back during 78-82, since the movie was being re-released every year anyway, it must have crossed his mind. Especially since Spielberg did exactly that with Close Encounters, right down to the "special edition" tag. He even had access to the still age-appropriate actors (Spielberg brought back Dreyfuss and Bob Balaban 3 years later) and was apparently so tortured and emo about the shots that didn't work, he might have done something interesting.

IIRC, it was the studio that pressured Steven to add the inside of the mothership scene in order to greenlight spending the extra dough on the other changes. He's recut the film a few more times since then, and the mothership interior was omitted.

If George really was unhappy with the Greedo scene back in the day, (or even the other parts of the Cantina scenes) the Holiday Special production would have been a perfect opportunity to go back and reshoot it.

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zombie84 said:

The decision to re-do the FX in 1993 was not his idea. It was Dennis Muren who pressed it on him. Lucas just wanted to add the Jabba scene, an addition which he attempted to do for the 1981 modification which had the new crawl. He might have wanted to also add a few BG elements to Mos Eisley, but this is not totally clear. So, he never had the idea of doing large-scale FX changes until Dennis Muren and then other ILM staff started suggesting it. He then surmised it would be good R&D for the prequels, and so he started thinking up changes that would have relevant research qualities (i.e. crowd replication, BG replacement, CG close to camera).

It was a slippery slope and once he started he realized how much he liked it. But he was really just interested in sprucing up Mos Eisley and adding the deleted Jabba scene. If it was 1981 and he could have done whatever he wanted, evidence suggests this is all he would have done. I prefer the non-Jabba edit, just as I prefer the original crawl, but I would have let him get away with it for consistency/relevance the same as the 1981 crawl; not a big deal. I think most people would feel similar.

To be fair to Muren from what I read at the time and in the years since, he saw it as exciting and something worth pushing because in his eyes they were working on a "Special Edition".  Something fun and different for the times, but an edition nonetheless.  In his eyes the original releases would always be the "real" movies.

I don't think he ever thought George would make a decision to refer to this "special edition" as "the" edition moving forwards, thereby trying to erase the past.

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Regarding the deleted scenes, is there a word on their quality/resolution? Sorry if this has been answered but I'm not going to read 89 pages of "the colors will be fixed!" to get find out.

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No word on any details of the set, other than the date, the price, the number of discs. I suspect the deleted scenes will be unrestored but in HD, but there's no info out there yet AFAIK. Specs will probably be announced in early summer.

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--James Cameron, Entertainment Weekly, April 2010

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Put Captain Solo in the Cargo Hold said:

Regarding the deleted scenes, is there a word on their quality/resolution? Sorry if this has been answered but I'm not going to read 89 pages of "the colors will be fixed!" to get find out.

Then you are going to miss out on some prime entertainment :p

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The new Blu version will look nothing like the deleted scenes for sure. What I'm curious to know is just how much cleanup LFL will put into them.

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captainsolo said:

The new Blu version will look nothing like the deleted scenes for sure. ...

Well, I think the deleted scenes will look exactly like the Blu-ray versions.

 

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The BD were treated by Lowry for dirt and grain removal, to the tune of a couple million dollars, in addition to being chemically-washed and hand-cleaned in 1995 with additional shot-restoration and source-substitution for damaged sections. They ain't gonna be doing that for deleted scenes. It's doubtful they will even wash the film they are printed on, though there could probably be some dirt-removal or just plain ol DNR done to make them look cleaner.

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"When George went back and put new creatures into the original Star Wars, I find that disturbing. It’s a revision of history. That bothers me."

--James Cameron, Entertainment Weekly, April 2010

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While I agree that's probably the case, who's to say they won't go all prequel deleted scenes on it?  Remember, where they added CGI effects and stuff to finish them before showcasing them to the public?  I mean, it could be farfetched, but who's to say they wouldn't do the same kind of things to these deleted scenes, so they won't be the "workprint" editions but "George's totally real original vision" version?

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It's possible. If they are going to finish the deleted scenes, then they will have to clean them up. There wouldn't be much to finish, actually; the Wampa scenes were abandoned and don't have the live-action material necessary to complete them, the Anchorhead scenes don't require further work, as does the original Cantina edit, while the sandstorm scene already had a matte painting completed for it before it was cut, and the opening Tatooine deletion was fully scored, edited and had VFX composited. The remaining deletions are just snippets of dialogue here and there, like the ones seen in Empire of Dreams. So I guess they could be finished--the sandstorm scene never had the dialogue recorded so even if they include the matte painting and do the one composite it needed, the scene will be still unfinished.

I would like for them to find the original treadmill negatives and sound tapes, since the silent black and white version was just a workprint dupe (although I don't know why it was silent--maybe they never recorded sound for it and planned to ADR the few lines). In fact, I really would like to see that workprint released in its entirety, like on Blade Runner. As much as I hate the idea of plunking down $120 for the SE yet AGAIN, I wouldn't even give it a second thought if it had the whole workprint. Deleted scenes, no, those will just go on Youtube. Stuff like a whole workprint is how they have to win over OOT'ers.

The Secret History of Star Wars -- now available on Amazon.com!

"When George went back and put new creatures into the original Star Wars, I find that disturbing. It’s a revision of history. That bothers me."

--James Cameron, Entertainment Weekly, April 2010

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I wouldn't mind that the complete saga boxset had a similar layout.

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zombie84 said:

It's possible. If they are going to finish the deleted scenes, then they will have to clean them up. There wouldn't be much to finish, actually...

 They're doing all that?

I thought they were just putting in the "Luke's new lightsaber" scene, which I assumed would be proper cleaned up and inserted into the movie, like they did with Biggs and etc. in 2004.

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Asaki said:



zombie84 said:

It's possible. If they are going to finish the deleted scenes, then they will have to clean them up. There wouldn't be much to finish, actually...


 They're doing all that?

I thought they were just putting in the "Luke's new lightsaber" scene, which I assumed would be proper cleaned up and inserted into the movie, like they did with Biggs and etc. in 2004.
They specifically said they would not be inserting them into the movie. They may "finish" them, but they're going to leave them on the bonus disc, I believe.

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TMBTM said:


In case no one put this picture before:

http://img.filmsactu.net/datas/dvd/s/t/star-wars-coffret-integral/n/4d9e28240d319.jpg


I think it was not posted, because it looks like a fake.

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Well either way I certainly hope that the boxes shown on amazon are just stand-ins. That's some seriously bland packaging.

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zombie84 said: In fact, I really would like to see that workprint released in its entirety, like on Blade Runner. As much as I hate the idea of plunking down $120 for the SE yet AGAIN, I wouldn't even give it a second thought if it had the whole workprint. Deleted scenes, no, those will just go on Youtube. Stuff like a whole workprint is how they have to win over OOT'ers.

I couldn't have said it better, zombie84. This has been a dream of mine ever since I read the article on it in Star Wars Insider.

When Blade Runner came out on BluRay, I remember saying to myself that this was the way to do Star Wars. Sadly, it will never be.

I'm willing to bet that many of the problems with the 2004 DVD set will still be present. For starters, the bad audio, Vader's saber in ESB and ROTJ, and even some of the boxes that still appear around certain ships. I have my doubts that they'll be fixed.

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