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Star Wars coming to Blu Ray (UPDATE: August 30 2011, No! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!) — Page 7

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http://popwatch.ew.com/2010/04/20/james-cameron-talks-to-ew-about-avatar-dvd-the-sequel-and-the-future-of-3-d-and-why-clash-of-the-titans-isnt-it/

That's the new article from which the Cameron quote came from:

but it's interesting that this article came up when looking.

http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,286397,00.html (Jan 10, 1997

In the firmament of cinematic second-guessers, there are plenty of leading lights. Consider James Cameron, who has noodled around with expanded ''special editions'' of Aliens, The Abyss, and Terminator 2: Judgment Day for TV and video.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aliens_(film)#Special_edition

Confirms that the noodling alluded too, was additional scenes.  Of course at this time Cameron didn't have the digital playground so who knows what might happen now that he's got the tools.

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Thanks for the reply, ImperialFighter.

Interesting interview, None.

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I'm no big fan of James Cameron but his thinking chimes with the rationale of most of the people here.

Look at what we do.

We have people who make reconstructions and preservations of different versions of the Star Wars films, people who remix and archive documentary footage and people who make alternate versions of these films all rubbing shoulders with each other and usually getting on while under a banner of wanting the original theatrical editions being restored and preserved for future generations to enjoy and study.

Lucas is basically saying "These are my films and if you want the latest version of them go out and buy them...by the way the previous version will no longer be available...oh stop crying here's a crappy laserdisc transfer".

I love doubleofive's ReVHSed project for a number of reasons but one of them is that it's almost a spoof of that asinine attitude.

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sadly, the GOUT will be the only version of the OOT that will be around 15 years from now.

What did it do to deserve this?Why, why, why WHY!?

The OOT will never be remastered, THE OOT WILL NEVER BE REMASTERED!!!

 

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Take a deep breath, it will be ok.  I promise.  We'll all get through this together.

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Whatever you do don't start saying you will one day become the most powerful film archivist and that one day you will even be able to stop films from dying...not unless you really will.

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There would not be a problem if film,VHS, and laserdisc were not the unstable elements that they are.

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There would because even if they lasted for a thousand million years they wouldn't be a restoration or an archive of the material as originally presented.

The resolution is much lower in all of those formats.

All you'd have would be a near permanent record of the VHS, Betamax, Laserdisc etc transfers (which is an important but separate archive goal in of itself).

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Well, not 35mm film, which is both the native resolution of the original and also the most stable format yet devised... :p

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And the most inconvenient and fragile.

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

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Well, I suppose it's inconvenient, but its not really fragile compared to the others. It's actually the most durable, longest-lasting format ever invented. Celluloid preserves for generations and generations, depending on the type, I mean we have original technicolor film from the 1930s still in remarkable shape. Optical disks will rot in ten years, and most forms of tape will be severely deteriorated after twenty. Star Wars was shot on a very unstable film stock, but that's an exceptional circumstance in the format's history due to laziness/cheapness at the time of manufacture. And even then, the information is still there, you just have to play around with it in post to get the colors to read correctly, and it will continue to uphold such quality for another ten years at least. At about a fifty year lifespan for Eastman color film and at seventy and counting for Technicolor film, the format is a godsend.

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Maybe.  But I wouldn't trust my 5 year old to put it in the 35mm player.  ;)

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

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Gaffer Tape said:

I honestly don't see any difference.  A change is a change.  PERIOD.  Is the extended version of Avatar replacing the theatrical version?  Yes.  That's all there is to it.  To me, it has nothing to do with mindset, with passage of time, with any of that.  He's changing the film and has no ground to stand on to call Lucas out for it.  They're equally wrong.

 

Agreed! Using the passage of time as a defense for Cameron is asinine. He can release his "Special Edition" or Ultimate Cut of Avatar but it looks as if he is planning to replace the current theatrical cut with what he considers to be a better version which would give him no right to call out Lucas! On the other hand if the theatrical cut is still considered valid and isn't wiped off the face of the Earth Cameron can get away with it.

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There are variant cuts of The Terminator, Aliens, The Abyss, T2 etc out already but they haven't supplanted the theatrical versions and none of them as far as I know have ever had a theatrical release, they certainly haven't replaced the original cuts as the only possible means of a theatrical showing.

The real test of Cameron's words will come when the DVD/Blu Ray come out and if Avatar gets further theatrical runs.

If this longer version is the only version available to own and see for further generations then yes he is being a knob for calling out Lucas.

If both versions are available and serve both functions then there would be no difference between what he has done and what Peter Jackson did with the extended versions of LOTR or what Spielberg did with ET.

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The version that comes out today on DVD/Blu is the theatrical cut.

http://www.amazon.com/Avatar-Two-Disc-Blu-ray-DVD-Combo/dp/B002VPE1B6/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1271955341&sr=1-1

It is, however, in 2D and in 1.85, so it's not the exact same movie I saw in theatres...

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

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Rebel1one1 said:

Agreed! Using the passage of time as a defense for Cameron is asinine. He can release his "Special Edition" or Ultimate Cut of Avatar but it looks as if he is planning to replace the current theatrical cut with what he considers to be a better version which would give him no right to call out Lucas! On the other hand if the theatrical cut is still considered valid and isn't wiped off the face of the Earth Cameron can get away with it.

Have I missed something?  The original theatrical is available today.

EDIT: xhonzi beat me to it.

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The version coming back into theaters is an extended edition. The one on sale today is the original 2D theatrical cut. So as long as today's version remains available Cameron can stand by his words. The more important question is will big studios hold back the most complete cut of a film just so they can re-release a “better” version later and make a quick buck? I mean is this extended edition going to be one of many?  I think we are getting to a point where special editions are not just for home video releases anymore and this trend will get worse and worse. Pretty soon we will be asking each other "Which version did you see"?

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Except that it's in 1.85.  ;)  The 2D releases were in 2.35/2.39/2.4 or whatever we're supposed to call it these days.

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

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It's actually 1:78 as far as I know. That's because it's the IMAX ratio, which is what he prefers. It's not cropped. The 2:35 version was cropped from the IMAX ratio.

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Also, Cameron was referring to films being products of their time. Like how he isn't putting in CG to the crappy effects of 1984's Terminator. The film is what it is. Lucas putting CG and radically re-working Star Wars is making something from the distant past something it's not. That's what he was referring to.

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So it's the imax ratio, eh? It played both ways but I guess they have to pick one or the other. The blu of Dark Knight also followed their imax version, (where the ratio switched back and forth). I think Cameron was hoping there'd be more big IMAX screens by now.

Unrated/Extended cuts is a whole new annoying thing, but I guess it's a tacky fact of life now. If you live in the US and want to go to the store and buy a blu-ray of the theatrical Watchmen or Miami Vice (Michael Mann is pretty guilty of going all Lucas on everything) or several others you're just out of luck. At least with Cameron you always have a choice. I'm more worried about other movies fate on blu, like the original version of Apocalypse Now or The Warriors.

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This is exactly what I mean nobody knows what the hell movies are "intended" to be these days with so many different versions and in many cases theatrical cuts non-existent. I think studios should put some sort of rule in place that says the original theatrical cuts of a film need to be made available regardless of how many special editions the filmmaker decides to create. When we lose theatrical cuts it all becomes a confusing mess. Watchmen is a perfect example. I love this movie but if I want to watch it on Blu Ray I have to choose between the Directors Cut or the Ultimate Cut and even if the Ultimate Cut is my preferred way to view the film I still would like to have a Blu Ray option for the theatrical cut when watching it with non-fans. The Ultimate Cut is such a beautiful set but when the word "Ultimate" is in the title the box should include all cuts of the film. Blade Runner is the only real example I have seen for truly doing this the right way with regards to theatrical vs special editions/extended editions.

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Bingowings said:

Whatever you do don't start saying you will one day become the most powerful film archivist and that one day you will even be able to stop films from dying...not unless you really will.

That is freaking amazing.

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When we lose theatrical cuts it all becomes a confusing mess.

I think it's a mistake to think of theatrical cuts as "the" cut. Our particular group has been conditioned to think that way because of Star Wars and the relatively unique situation of revisionism; most people would say the theatrical version is of arbitrary importance, what's normally considered important is usually the "director's cut". But it really comes down to audience demand. If an early cut is crappy and of no historical relevance or radical difference, then no one really cares if they can see it or not. I mean, many horror films of significance were widely shown in R-rated versions, but because these versions are not preferred they are never preserved on DVD, because no one cares.

The thing is movies are shown in different ways in different formats and with different characteristics and differences and you can't always have every single minor detail accounted for in its own release, you have to sort of split the odds and single out the one or two most significant and in-demand versions. This is not a new phenomena, though, it's been there since the birth of the medium. Especially for non-contemporary films, there might be two or three versions of the film throughout its original "release" because releases were staggered in waves and the films were tweaked in response to these evolving "tests", like in the case of Heaven's Gate, and it also gave filmmakers to simply change their mind, like in the case of the sound mixes on Star Wars. You have to sort of accept that you aren't going to be able to have official releases of each and every version, or that said releases might only be rare; and in many cases, the tweaking done is so minor that there almost is no point in having two home video versions. Maybe this will happen to Avatar, because at a measily six minutes for a film that is almost 3 hours I doubt many people will really even notice a difference, unlike the extended cuts of Aliens, T2 and The Abyss, which were all 20 minutes longer and of significantly different character. Its the norm to simply let the studio or filmmaker decided on the one version of the film they think is the best or that the audience will enjoy the most, and then if there is audience demand for alternatives they will release those as necessary. I guess we'll have to see if people really can't do without the six minutes of extra footage, because that's really all it comes down to.

Avatar is a strange case though since it was shown in different formats (1.78 and 2.35), and in different mediums (2D film and 3D digital), and in different versions (original theatrical release and second-wave extended version), and home video is its own can of worms since many people can't--or won't want to--view the 3D version, so you sort of have to expect that you might not be able to view every single difference or see the film exactly as it was in the particular theatre you saw it in. I mean, most people probably saw Lawrence of Arabia in the 35mm ratio, but that ratio never has been and likely never will be seen on home video because people are fine with the 70mm ratio, which is what David Lean wanted anyway.