Sign In

Star Wars: The Rise Of Skywalker Redux Ideas thread — Page 120

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Posted this in Hal’s thread a few days ago but didn’t get much traction - on reflection this probably belongs here anyway…

One of the biggest fourth wall breaking moments of TROS that still really rubs me the wrong way on repeat viewings is the now-infamous “somehow, Palpatine returned” line.

I’ve tried to trim the line to give it a more dramatic punch, without being as clunky and tension-killing as it is in the final cut. Poe now simply says “We’ve decoded the intel from the First Order spy, and it confirms the worst… Palpatine.” Palpatine’s presence (in any form, alive or dead) will always be a terrifying, bone-chilling threat to the Rebels and Resistance - why would they need to speculate on if he’s actually alive or not? Surely even just discovering an old contingency plan would be enough to evoke the same exact reaction?

With the original “somehow” framing, this moment has a predominantly speculative tone. Unfortunately, this speculation swiftly becomes pointless and irrelevant as the moment doesn’t actually lead to anything new being revealed to the audience. With this very minor cut, the “The Emperor is dead” & “Dark Science, Cloning, Secrets only the Sith knew…” etc. lines become independent responses that aren’t necessarily factual to the canon of the film, but are instead just pieces of frantic back-and-forth chatter amongst individual characters. In the final film these lines seemingly only serve to act as heavy exposition to try and (poorly) spell everything out to the audience. This cut hopefully makes this exposition-dump of a scene just that tiny bit less of a, well, dump.

Hopefully this also goes to somewhat preserve a casual viewer’s curiosity regarding Palpatine’s exact means of resurrection, something which in my opinion the theatrical cut otherwise abruptly shoo’s away with the “Somehow” framing. “Has the Emperor truly returned, or is there more to it?” - This is a question and mystery that the audience should have in the back of their mind throughout the majority of the runtime, all the way up to Palps, Ben and Rey’s final confrontation, where the exact nature of his existence and plans all begin to click into place and are fully revealed.

Maybe with this cut it could even make the idea of having the Fortnite broadcast subtly playing as the decoded message slightly more believable?

https://vimeo.com/439658209
password: fanedit

The only problem with this cut is that Poe’s head quickly jerks upwards (due to the removal of “Somehow”). I tried to add some subtle interpolation to this particular moment but - mostly due to my poor editing and FX abilities - there’s still 3 or 4 interpolated frames which unsurprisingly have some weird blurring and artifacts on Poe’s face… I should note as well that this was done just with Hal’s V3 workprint in FCPX, so maybe with a lossless source and someone who actually knows what they’re doing (i.e. not someone like me!), we may be able to tease out a far more positive result to make this line/word removal totally seamless and without any weird frame interpolation oddities?

I am in no way a pro editor, as you’ve likely gathered by now lol. This is just a very rough mockup of an idea that I had in an effort to try and (marginally) improve this pretty dreadful moment… presented here as a means to hopefully throw it over into more capable hands to see it fully realised, if anyone’s interested in giving it a proper shot?

Author
Time

I don’t think Handbrake handles HDR at all, so it doesn’t do any tonemapping from Rec/BT 2020 to Rec709, hence the washed out colours on the 4K rip. To handle 4K rips properly, you’ll need to make sure you’re encoding to a 10-bit colour or higher format (if you have the hard drive space, consider DNxHR HQX or 444), to preserve all the colour information. Then you’ll have to tonemap the movie yourself in your editing software. I think Davinci Resolve has various built in LUTs for this, and there are a few that were made for the new OT Blurays at The Star Wars Trilogy forums. Alternatively, you could try ffmpeg using some of the settings discussed in this thread, which would allow you to tonemap the movie down to SDR and convert it in a single step. As an alternative, there are also some already-tonemapped “10bit SDR” encodes of 4K Blurays floating around on the internet - you’ll have some generational quality loss if you use these as a source, but they’re very convenient.

Author
Time

This is fantastic information. I use Premiere Pro but being colourblind it’s an absolute nightmare to get the LUT right, especially to match it exactly with other scenes that people have made from the standard blu-ray.

I’ll give these a try to see if I can find a work around. Thanks!

Check out - http://www.youtube.com/moviesremastered

Author
Time
 (Edited)

For Leia’s death I think it would nice to extend her dialogue using lines from TFA: “there’s still light in him, I know it” could be used make “Ben, come home, there’s still light in you, I know it”

This guy on youtube did something similar.
https://youtu.be/QiAFwBV--Gg

Peace is a lie
There is only passion…

Author
Time
 (Edited)

idir_hh said:

For Leia’s death I think it would nice to extend her dialogue using lines from TFA: “there’s still light in him, I know it” could be used make “Ben, come home, there’s still light in you, I know it”

This guy on youtube did something similar.
https://youtu.be/QiAFwBV--Gg

Ooh, I really like this. (not necessarily the whole sequence, but the line)

Author
Time

“Comme home” is being done by DominiCobb. You would need a “you” to replace “There’s still light in him” I would suggest using “Me, you” from Leia’s discussion with Han in TFA.

Peace is a lie
There is only passion…

Author
Time

Movies Remastered said:
That was the point of removing it. I’ve added visions of Exegol in TLJ but I wanted Palp to be a new threat and not manipulating anyone until TROS. I thought it weakened the story on all sides trying to shoehorn Palp into “the shadows”

Ok, then we are on different sites on this one. Certainly palps return in general was a surprise but one of the very few things I liked about TROS is that they gave him some substance being in the shadows, confusing kylo and pulling the strings. Otherwise, like in your case is comes out of nowhere. Did you moved his appearance further back in your edit since the little zoom view? This would work at least for me, but to appear in the first quarter of the movie undermines the new hidden threat from him. In my opinion.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

LesPaul32 said:

Posted this in Hal’s thread a few days ago but didn’t get much traction - on reflection this probably belongs here anyway…

One of the biggest fourth wall breaking moments of TROS that still really rubs me the wrong way on repeat viewings is the now-infamous “somehow, Palpatine returned” line.

I’ve tried to trim the line to give it a more dramatic punch, without being as clunky and tension-killing as it is in the final cut. Poe now simply says “We’ve decoded the intel from the First Order spy, and it confirms the worst… Palpatine.” Palpatine’s presence (in any form, alive or dead) will always be a terrifying, bone-chilling threat to the Rebels and Resistance - why would they need to speculate on if he’s actually alive or not? Surely even just discovering an old contingency plan would be enough to evoke the same exact reaction?

With the original “somehow” framing, this moment has a predominantly speculative tone. Unfortunately, this speculation swiftly becomes pointless and irrelevant as the moment doesn’t actually lead to anything new being revealed to the audience. With this very minor cut, the “The Emperor is dead” & “Dark Science, Cloning, Secrets only the Sith knew…” etc. lines become independent responses that aren’t necessarily factual to the canon of the film, but are instead just pieces of frantic back-and-forth chatter amongst individual characters. In the final film these lines seemingly only serve to act as heavy exposition to try and (poorly) spell everything out to the audience. This cut hopefully makes this exposition-dump of a scene just that tiny bit less of a, well, dump.

Hopefully this also goes to somewhat preserve a casual viewer’s curiosity regarding Palpatine’s exact means of resurrection, something which in my opinion the theatrical cut otherwise abruptly shoo’s away with the “Somehow” framing. “Has the Emperor truly returned, or is there more to it?” - This is a question and mystery that the audience should have in the back of their mind throughout the majority of the runtime, all the way up to Palps, Ben and Rey’s final confrontation, where the exact nature of his existence and plans all begin to click into place and are fully revealed.

signed.

Author
Time

Movies Remastered said:

Absolutely! Removed Palp from the crawl and moved his appearance back so your protagonists and antagonists are both hunting for the waywinders at the same time. It makes WAY more sense this way.

How far back?

Author
Time

I know we’ve pretty much retired the Ajan Kloss = Naboo idea, but the more I think about it, Ajan Kloss we wouldn’t have to change the canon to make Ajan Kloss into a planet we’ve seen before: On Wookieepedia, there’s no official information as to where Luke’s Jedi Temple (from the flashbacks in TLJ) was located, and given that it was where Luke trained Leia it would make sense for Ajan Kloss to be that same planet.
Can anyone think of a way to make that clearer in the movie?

You’ve got to ask yourself one question: “Am I making Carrie Fisher’s ghost proud?”
Well, are ya, punk?

Author
Time

Ed Slushie said:

I know we’ve pretty much retired the Ajan Kloss = Naboo idea, but the more I think about it, Ajan Kloss we wouldn’t have to change the canon to make Ajan Kloss into a planet we’ve seen before: On Wookieepedia, there’s no official information as to where Luke’s Jedi Temple (from the flashbacks in TLJ) was located, and given that it was where Luke trained Leia it would make sense for Ajan Kloss to be that same planet.
Can anyone think of a way to make that clearer in the movie?

I think I assumed that Luke trained Leia on Endor, as the flashbacks resemble that forest. Luke’s Jedi Temple from the flashbacks in The Force Awakens and The Last Jedi don’t resemble this forest area to me at all.

Author
Time

Honestly, almost entirely based on the fact that it’s a grassland and that it has a history with Jedi Temples in the EU(and also the saga), part of me had always assumed Luke’s temple was built on Dantooine, probably near where Arca Jeth’s Enclave was in Legends continuity.

Author
Time

omnimuffin said:

Honestly, almost entirely based on the fact that it’s a grassland and that it has a history with Jedi Temples in the EU(and also the saga), part of me had always assumed Luke’s temple was built on Dantooine, probably near where Arca Jeth’s Enclave was in Legends continuity.

Or Lothal? Abrams has avoided the old EU/Legends more than anyone else since the Disney buyout.

Author
Time

Ed Slushie said:

I know we’ve pretty much retired the Ajan Kloss = Naboo idea, but the more I think about it, Ajan Kloss we wouldn’t have to change the canon to make Ajan Kloss into a planet we’ve seen before: On Wookieepedia, there’s no official information as to where Luke’s Jedi Temple (from the flashbacks in TLJ) was located, and given that it was where Luke trained Leia it would make sense for Ajan Kloss to be that same planet.
Can anyone think of a way to make that clearer in the movie?

That’s a really good idea.
In the scene where Rey looks into the distance, I wonder if the temple could be rotoscoped into that shot somehow. It would kinda set up her training a new generation of Jedi down the line.

Peace is a lie
There is only passion…

Author
Time

JakeRyan17 said:

Ed Slushie said:

I know we’ve pretty much retired the Ajan Kloss = Naboo idea, but the more I think about it, Ajan Kloss we wouldn’t have to change the canon to make Ajan Kloss into a planet we’ve seen before: On Wookieepedia, there’s no official information as to where Luke’s Jedi Temple (from the flashbacks in TLJ) was located, and given that it was where Luke trained Leia it would make sense for Ajan Kloss to be that same planet.
Can anyone think of a way to make that clearer in the movie?

I think I assumed that Luke trained Leia on Endor, as the flashbacks resemble that forest. Luke’s Jedi Temple from the flashbacks in The Force Awakens and The Last Jedi don’t resemble this forest area to me at all.

The flashback I believe has been confirmed to be Ajan Kloss. As to where Luke’s temple is supposed to be? I don’t know.

Author
Time

Imagine if Kylo had straight up killed Palpatine at the start and been the primary antagonist. TLJ turned all the villains into jokes, with Hux being ragdolled around, Snoke dying like Jar Jar, and Kylo throwing a tantrum at Luke. Phasma not so much, but she was wasted too, so…

Getting Kylo back on track to be a genuine threat would’ve helped raise the emotional stakes and made his evolution over the trilogy more interesting.

Unfortunately…I don’t think this is editable with current material. Probably 10 years away to be able to edit that with deepfakes and video games.

Author
Time

I think the training course Rey runs is supposed to be the same setting in the Luke and Leia flashback.

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

Author
Time

thebluefrog said:

Imagine if Kylo had straight up killed Palpatine at the start and been the primary antagonist. TLJ turned all the villains into jokes, with Hux being ragdolled around, Snoke dying like Jar Jar, and Kylo throwing a tantrum at Luke. Phasma not so much, but she was wasted too, so…

Getting Kylo back on track to be a genuine threat would’ve helped raise the emotional stakes and made his evolution over the trilogy more interesting.

Unfortunately…I don’t think this is editable with current material. Probably 10 years away to be able to edit that with deepfakes and video games.

That was the intention with The Last Jedi killing Snoke, to set Kylo up as Episode IX’s main antagonist. That’s what Colin Trevorrow’s Duel of Fates did as well. I think that was the prevailing idea forward until Abrams’ came back.

Author
Time

Hal 9000 said:

I think the training course Rey runs is supposed to be the same setting in the Luke and Leia flashback.

You’re right, I didn’t know that until looking it up after your comment. I guess the planet with Luke’s Temple was a “secret only known by the order” and has yet to be revealed in the comics or ancillary materials. Definitely grasslands, based on the comics.

Author
Time

JakeRyan17 said:

thebluefrog said:

Imagine if Kylo had straight up killed Palpatine at the start and been the primary antagonist. TLJ turned all the villains into jokes, with Hux being ragdolled around, Snoke dying like Jar Jar, and Kylo throwing a tantrum at Luke. Phasma not so much, but she was wasted too, so…

Getting Kylo back on track to be a genuine threat would’ve helped raise the emotional stakes and made his evolution over the trilogy more interesting.

Unfortunately…I don’t think this is editable with current material. Probably 10 years away to be able to edit that with deepfakes and video games.

That was the intention with The Last Jedi killing Snoke, to set Kylo up as Episode IX’s main antagonist. That’s what Colin Trevorrow’s Duel of Fates did as well. I think that was the prevailing idea forward until Abrams’ came back.

Of course, Treverrow’s script didn’t handle it particuarily well either, contriving an excuse for Kylo to get an even more Vader-ey mask and having him lose the final fight because Rey becomes a bad fanfiction grey Jedi using both the light and dark, and with later revisions pulling the ‘last minute turn to the light’ and making one of the Knights of Ren (coincedentally, one that was very much not visible during the flashback in TFA, because a) she’s a woman and b) she has the darksaber) be the eleventh hour final boss.

Author
Time

omnimuffin said:

contriving an excuse for Kylo to get an even more Vader-ey mask

An excuse that was completely stolen from Doctor Doom, by the way. It’s so stupid how Trevorrow planned for Kylo, by far the most empathetic villain in the entire franchise, to become a one-dimensional bad guy who gets redeemed at the last minute.

Kylo staying evil could have been handled well, but Trevorrow’s script completely botched it.