Star Wars OT & 1997 Special Edition - Various Projects Info (Released) — Page 72

DJ, you've got an email from me.

Mielr said:

 

ChainsawAsh said:

I'm using a crappy $40 Sony DVD player from Target, and it plays through layer breaks seamlessly every time.

I have a crappy $50 Sony DVD player from Target, and it pauses on all layer breaks, commercial or homemade discs.
What model is yours? Mine is DVP-SR500H.
But, I get the same pauses on my Panasonic Blu-Ray player, too (BD65).

 

Mine's a DVP-SR200P.

Sounds great!

LeeThorogood said:

is that still just the raw GOUT upscaled or have you now moved onto upscaling the V3?

fwiw, the best practice for upscaling is to first upscale the raw data (preferably even larger than your final target), then perform all cleanup/tweak scripts on the overly large video, and then shrink the video down to your target size. 

The reasoning is:

1. Blow up the raw data (even "extra" blow it up); this preserves as much of the raw data as possible.  For example, if the raw data is 480, and your final target is 1080, then you might over blow it up from 480 to 2160 (twice the final target res) in this step.
   
   
2. Perform clean-up and tweaks on the blown up video; this performs the data improvement on the overly blown up video
   
   
3. Shrink back down to your target resolution (shrink from 2160 to 1080).  This final shrink will increase the sharpness and hide any artifacts that might have been produced by the tweaks in step 2.

The erroneous procedure would be:

1. First run the clean up and tweaks on the raw data.  This will reduce the raw data (lose some light and dark detail, etc)
   
   
2. Then blow up the tweaked video to the final target.  This will blow up any artifacts that were intoduced by the clean up and tweaks in Step 1.  Plus it will be blowing up degraded data, since some of the raw data was destroyed in Step 1.

Dufusyte said:

LeeThorogood said:

is that still just the raw GOUT upscaled or have you now moved onto upscaling the V3?

fwiw, the best practice for upscaling is to first upscale the raw data (preferably even larger than your final target), then perform all cleanup/tweak scripts on the overly large video, and then shrink the video down to your target size. 

The reasoning is:

1. Blow up the raw data (even "extra" blow it up); this preserves as much of the raw data as possible.  For example, if the raw data is 480, and your final target is 1080, then you might over blow it up from 480 to 2160 (twice the final target res) in this step.
   
   
2. Perform clean-up and tweaks on the blown up video; this performs the data improvement on the overly blown up video
   
   
3. Shrink back down to your target resolution (shrink from 2160 to 1080).  This final shrink will increase the sharpness and hide any artifacts that might have been produced by the tweaks in step 2.

 

The erroneous procedure would be:

1. First run the clean up and tweaks on the raw data.  This will reduce the raw data (lose some light and dark detail, etc)
   
   
2. Then blow up the tweaked video to the final target.  This will blow up any artifacts that were intoduced by the clean up and tweaks in Step 1.  Plus it will be blowing up degraded data, since some of the raw data was destroyed in Step 1.

This all sounds good but most of us don't really know what to mess with on g-force's script to do this, he said everything on it works together with each other the way it is, I just looked it over and really don't know where to even start to add those kind of settings, but I would definitely try it out if I did though, so right now I am doing everything afterwords.

I pretty much realized though that I should probably stick with 720p, this will still look better than the V3 DVD, plus I want to add ALL audio files to it that are on the V3 DVD, but with the Blu you will have a selection of Dolby Digital or LPCM.

Well I am running out of ideas fast on this 720p V3 "possible" set LOL, I have a few more things to try but nothing so far is really working out on the complete movie, some scenes look really good, while others not so, one sample I tried I thought this is it! but then I got to a shot of Star Destroyers in space and they looked like friggin cartoons where the lighted area were, I am running another sample now and this does not look to bad so far, we will see, so throw out some ideas if you have any.

dark_jedi said:

Dufusyte said:

fwiw, the best practice for upscaling is to first upscale the raw data (preferably even larger than your final target), then perform all cleanup/tweak scripts on the overly large video, and then shrink the video down to your target size. 

The reasoning is:

1. Blow up the raw data (even "extra" blow it up); this preserves as much of the raw data as possible.  For example, if the raw data is 480, and your final target is 1080, then you might over blow it up from 480 to 2160 (twice the final target res) in this step.
   
   
2. Perform clean-up and tweaks on the blown up video; this performs the data improvement on the overly blown up video
   
   
3. Shrink back down to your target resolution (shrink from 2160 to 1080).  This final shrink will increase the sharpness and hide any artifacts that might have been produced by the tweaks in step 2.

 

The erroneous procedure would be:

1. First run the clean up and tweaks on the raw data.  This will reduce the raw data (lose some light and dark detail, etc)
   
   
2. Then blow up the tweaked video to the final target.  This will blow up any artifacts that were intoduced by the clean up and tweaks in Step 1.  Plus it will be blowing up degraded data, since some of the raw data was destroyed in Step 1.

This all sounds good but most of us don't really know what to mess with on g-force's script to do this, he said everything on it works together with each other the way it is, I just looked it over and really don't know where to even start to add those kind of settings, but I would definitely try it out if I did though, so right now I am doing everything afterwords.

I don't know the inner workings of the script either, and whether it is hardcoded for a specific resolution.  Sounds like the following suggestion would not be workable, but I will throw it out there anyway, since suggestions are being solicited.

1. Step 1: Upscale the GOUT using your favorite upscaler.
   
   
2. Step 2: Run the magic avisynth script to clean it up and tweak it.  (This might not work on an upscaled video if the resolution is hardcoded in the script though, or if certain parameters are resolution dependent)
   
   
3. Step 3: If the video was extra-upscaled in Step 1, then user your favorite down-scaler to downscale the video to the desired target resolution.
   
   

I guess my main suggestion is just to try running the cleanup script after the upres, rather than vice versa.  Hope this helps.

Dufusyte said:

I don't know the inner workings of the script either, and whether it is hardcoded for a specific resolution.  Sounds like the following suggestion would not be workable, but I will throw it out there anyway, since suggestions are being solicited.

1. Step 1: Upscale the GOUT using your favorite upscaler.
   
   
2. Step 2: Run the magic avisynth script to clean it up and tweak it.  (This might not work on an upscaled video if the resolution is hardcoded in the script though, or if certain parameters are resolution dependent)
   
   
3. Step 3: If the video was extra-upscaled in Step 1, then user your favorite down-scaler to downscale the video to the desired target resolution.
   
   

I guess my main suggestion is just to try running the cleanup script after the upres, rather than vice versa.  Hope this helps.

I am actually trying this out right now, so far I have learned it runs slower, and it does "seem" to look pretty good, I will encode a sample in a bit and try it out on my HDTV soon.

OK so I need some input on these MeGUI x264 tunings, I see these as options,

Default
Film
Animation
Grain
PSNR
SSIM
Fast Decode

what do these mean and do to the encoded video? namely the Film & Grain settings, I assume I would use one of these or Default?

Thanks

OK, here is a new 720p sample, I like the crawl much better in this version, not sure if it will get any better, if you look closely on the V3 DVD, or even the GOUT for that matter, it is not perfect either, and as before, I NEED feedback and ideas, this version was encoded at a much higher bitrate than all previous samples.

http://www.sendspace.com/file/4je0jo

http://www.sendspace.com/file/eke35f

http://www.sendspace.com/file/qpvjl3

I will download the new links ASAP.  I've looked at the other links from ealier this week and just haven't had time to respond.  I actually have some screenshot comparisons I'm putting together.

The first 720p blew me away. The sharpness was amazing and the compression didn't look terrible.

The second 720p and first 1080p looked worse honestly.  The sharpness was gone and there were alot more compression artifacts.  (My comparison shots show exactly were the compression is completely removing detail found in the first 720p.)

I also have a big concern with the way your making this "anamorphic." Why are you including the black bars on the top and bottom? Shouldn't that area just be negative space on the tv where there isn't any image information?  if you were to play these files on 4:3 TV, there would be dark black bars on the top and bottom then slightly lighter black bars surrounding the image.

I will be posting a ton of photos tonight or tomorrow supporting everything I just spoke about.

I know you're working hard on these and I'm game to assist in any way possible.  What program are you using to make these exports? I apologize if this has been stated somewhere else already...

I hope all of this constructive criticism is useful.

The black bars are on there because they are on Blu-ray discs, I have never ripped a Blu-ray movie that didn't have them unless it was 1.77:1, so it is no different than making anamorphic DVD's, they have to be there, this isn't for a MKV encode, this is for Blu-ray blank Disc, if\when I do a MKV file there will be no borders.

Now the other thing you said about an earlier version looking better, LOL, I just fracked myself again, I have done SO many things now, I do not know which is which, except for this latest I just now uploaded, this is why I need help LOL, I NEED comments and tips and ideas.

I will be including every detail you need in my next big post.

Regarding the anamorphic issue...what would happen if you watched your clips on this TV?

http://www.hdtvlounge.net/philips/cinema-219/

Star Wars is 21:9 not 16:9, so is this HDTV. An anamorphic disk played on this TV would look fine since the black bars are not included in the video information.  The video information would simply fill the space given.  Isn't that the point of anamorphic?

Dack Ralter said:

I will be including every detail you need in my next big post.

Regarding the anamorphic issue...what would happen if you watched your clips on this TV?

http://www.hdtvlounge.net/philips/cinema-219/

Star Wars is 21:9 not 16:9, so is this HDTV. An anamorphic disk played on this TV would look fine since the black bars are not included in the video information.  The video information would simply fill the space given.  Isn't that the point of anamorphic?

Beats the hell out of me, I don't have a TV like that and I know no one who does, like I have said, I have never seen a Blu-ray movie(retail BD) that did not have the appropriate borders, do you have a retail BD that is borderless that is not 1.77:1?

Back to the V3 DVD set, Does anyone know why muxman and DVDLab Pro can't place ripped celltimes correctly? I really would like to understand why the V3 DVD's chapters go off and the layer break did not set right, this stuff kind of pisses me off, I wanted these DVD's to be as perfect as I could possibly get them.

I sthere any other software that can set a leyer break and create a iso\image file?

I Don't know anyone who has that kind of crazy TV either. Just using it to make a point.  But your right, it probably just crops blu-rays to play them like that. 

I'm still concerned about this but I'm going to stop myself here and do more research before I really putting my foot in my mouth. 

Well if it helps, I am not taking off the black borders, they are suppose to be there.

Those types of TVs, with a scope aspect ratio, basically have to do with anamorphic scope DVDs and Blu-Rays the same thing people with 16:9 TVs have to do with the GOUT.  Honestly, I don't know why anyone buys them, as no DVD, Blu-Ray, streaming video, or broadcast/cable/satellite feed will ever be made to conform to their specifications.  It's pretty pointless, IMO.

dark_jedi said:

Back to the V3 DVD set, Does anyone know why muxman and DVDLab Pro can't place ripped celltimes correctly? I really would like to understand why the V3 DVD's chapters go off and the layer break did not set right, this stuff kind of pisses me off, I wanted these DVD's to be as perfect as I could possibly get them.

I sthere any other software that can set a leyer break and create a iso\image file?

For the layer break and ISO, I suggest PgcEdit.  It's free and it's pretty straight forward.  Just open the DVD from your hard drive use "Burn DVD / Create ISO" option on the file menu.

As for the chapters and cell times, this sounds similar to a problem with just about every custom disc I've made (most recently my SW Rebellion Collection).  The software I was using to author the discs was MuxMan through GUI for dvdauthor and the chapters gradually became more and more off from the cell times I'd assigned.  I don't know what the deal is, but it has something to do with the dropped frames of NTSC format.

My solution was to get my cell times from an outside video editing program, in my case Vegas 8.0.  I set the timecode clock to SMPTE Non-Drop (29.97 Video) and then just input the new numbers directly into my MuxMan MXP file for each respective chapter before rendering the final product.