twooffour said:
tldr; I brought it up as a joke, in the "presenting long chewed pet peeves as a novelty" sense.
Well... now I feel silly.
tl;dr - Relativity makes it all work, and makes Luke's life make more sense as a bonus.
I've read and written a lot of posts with these same ideas and suggestions myself ;)
While we're at it, OWN DONT RECOGNIZE CRPS!!!!
twooffour said:
While we're at it, OWN DONT RECOGNIZE CRPS!!!!
POTY
Keep Circulating the Tapes.
END OF LINE
(It hasn’t happened yet)
Y-Pot?
So maybe there was a Republic, and before that there was an Old Republic. That way, the Jedi could be around longer than the Republic.
"Close the blast doors!"
Puggo’s website | Rescuing Star Wars
But then what were they doing in the non-old republic? :DD
timdiggerm said:
twooffour said:
Oh... and... SOLO HAD NO LIGHTSPEED BUT MADE IT TO BESPIN!! PLOTHOLE!!!!This has been discussed ad nauseum, but I'll explain the "No it's fine" side:
Bespin is not too far away from Hoth. Not in the same planetary system, but nearby. We do not know how long it takes them to get to Bespin. In fact, all we know for sure is that while they're en route:
- Luke trains with Yoda
- Boba Fett follows them without being noticed
- Vader waits for his bounty hunters to report back
Vader waiting has no real time problems. The man can wait with the starfleet doing Imperial things for as long as he needs. He's not likely to find the Falcon during this gap, as the Falcon is flying in the big empty spaces between star systems and that's just not very easy to search. Besides, he's counting on the bounty hunters to turn something up whenever the Falcon reemerges at spaceport from wherever they disappeared to (remember, Vader doesn't actually know where they went).
The longer Luke trains with Yoda, the more plausible ROTJ becomes, as he can learn loads and loads from Yoda, but only really get the practice and meditation he needs to be a Jedi in between ESB & ROTJ (thus explaining why he's not so much a Jedi during the ESB duel). This is, for me, the biggest thing in favor of the Hoth->Bespin journey being long.
As for the Falcon and Slave 1 flying for so long... They don't have hyperdrive, only their engines. Spaceship engines are never really well explained in Star Wars (because it's a space opera, thank god), so we don't actually know much about how much they can accelerate a ship, for how long, fueling, etc. However, if we assume that they just put the engines on FULL-GO-FAST for the whole trip, then perhaps we can say that they spend the whole trip accelerating up to as near lightspeed as they can go. Relativistic effects become noticeable, and the occupants of both the Falcon and Slave 1 experience a far shorter journey than Luke does while training. In this way, we solve their food problems.
No, I don't know how Fett manages to not be detected. Perhaps he follows (somehow stealthily) for a short period, long enough to get their heading and extrapolate where they're going, then turns off the engines andlets them fly away a little longer so they won't notice him when hyperdrives back to civilization to bounty hunter things. Later, knowing approximately when they'd arrive at Bespin, he informs Vader and they all hyperdrive to Bespin just before the Falcon arrives.
And yes, I'm introducing relativistic effects in a movie series where spaceships move like WWII fighter planes.
Still probably won't work. First, if Bespin were close enough to be reached at sublight speeds, then you'd think it would be the first place they'd look. They just went from Hoth system to Anoat system without light speed, then they wish to travel to Bespin system. If the suns of each system were close enough to be travelled to at sublight speeds in such a short time, they would actually be part of a binary or trinary star system. If we wish for them to have enough distance to be somewhat realistic, let's look at Alpha Centauri, the second closest star system to us (the sun being the closest). At the speed of light, it would take over four years to reach Alpha Centauri from good ol' earth. I don't see any realistic way of making it work.
That being said, I don't care. I am watching the movie for entertainment value, not because I demand realism. There are other sci-fi films for that. This is simply good fun.
darth_ender said:
That being said, I don't care.
(for the record, I don't care either)
WRONG PICSURE!
The Imperials don't know the Hyperdrive is busted. Admiral Piett even speculates the Falcon "could be half way across the Galaxy by now". This is why the fleet disperses and goes to light speed, leaving the area.
Boba Fett is doing a balancing act trying to get a paycheck from the Empire and Jabba, so he's probably not going to phone Vader up until he's sure where the Falcon is going, and without those four other bounty hunters finding out or being close enough to intervene. It's unlikely he's going to let the Falcon out of his sight.
Bespin is a planet of the Anoat system. (There is no third system that they travel to.) Lando states the mining operation is too small for the Empire to notice or care about.
Where were you in '77?
The first time I saw Star Wars, Han shot first. But starting in 1997, Gringo shot first. Then in 2004, Gringo and Han basically shot at the same time. And then a few years ago, when I found adywan's edit, Han shot first again.
So inconsistent!
Gringo? Hahaha, brilliant my good sir, brilliant!
OT-DAWT-COM nieghbour and sometime poster (Remember, Tuesday is Soylent Green day!)
According to Nookiepedia Bespin is in the Bespin system, the Anoat system is just where the fleet break up and Han pauses to study his options.
So the journey from Hoth to that point (at sub-light speeds) has already taken the Falcon across inter-stella space into another system.
It was a long time ago in another galaxy so maybe they packed star systems a lot closer back then in that place.
Isn't the universe always expanding?
Then theres that buddist? story about the universe being two gods making love and therfore the universe expands and contracts regularly. But i only heard about that bit, could be BS for all i know.
OT-DAWT-COM nieghbour and sometime poster (Remember, Tuesday is Soylent Green day!)
Bingowings said:
According to Nookiepedia Bespin is in the Bespin system, the Anoat system is just where the fleet break up and Han pauses to study his options.
So the journey from Hoth to that point (at sub-light speeds) has already taken the Falcon across inter-stella space into another system.
It was a long time ago in another galaxy so maybe they packed star systems a lot closer back then in that place.
One of my old magazines is either in error, or Lucas changed his mind about Bespin's location since the 80's. ;)
Where were you in '77?
Here at OT.com, we don't usually care what Wookieepedia says, because we try to stick to a films-only canon.
As it's never made clear in the film (Leia points out they are in the Anoat system and there isn't much there and Han notices Bespin which isn't in the Lando system but may or may not be in the Anoat system) either FACT could be true.
While the above is true, it doesn't seem logical with the film's dialogue.
HAN: Let's see, we're in the middle of nowhere. Where should we go. I have a brilliant idea! Let's go to the only inhabited planet in the system to get repairs!
LEIA: You have your moments. Not many of them, but you do have them.
In the end, I just presume that systems are packed more closely together.
It just occured to me, in the RPG it seems that most ships had a much slower backup hyperdrive. Perhaps we could speculate that the Falcon's backup works but that it takes a great deal of time to get up to speed.
In light of speed and relativity mentioned earlier, it is clear that there is no time disparity between those traveling at high speeds and those remaining relatively static. This supports the EU explanation that ships have relativistic shielding to prevent time dilation. This unfortunately negates that aspect of the theory as well.
Bingowings said:
WRONG PICSURE!
I love this so much :D
darth_ender said:
HAN: Let's see, we're in the middle of nowhere. Where should we go. I have a brilliant idea! Let's go to the only inhabited planet in the system to get repairs!
LEIA: You have your moments. Not many of them, but you do have them.
That actually would've been way more awesome :D
Rogue-theX said:
Isn't the universe always expanding?
Then theres that buddist? story about the universe being two gods making love and therfore the universe expands and contracts regularly. But i only heard about that bit, could be BS for all i know.
make love not star wars?
Han accidentally finding himself in a system with one inhabited planet, the main city of which is being run by the guy who previously owned the ship he is sitting in, is the sort of galaxy shrinking coincidence that Anchorhead doesn't like and he likes bees.
Maybe the fleet travelled quite a distance with the Falcon sitting on the back of The Avenger (without anyone else in the fleet noticing it)?
Just watched the scene, and I agree that Bespin's not in the Anoat system.
But I'd like to point out a new inconsistency: C3PO, who is not even turned on, can be seen moving, as if breathing. Droids don't breathe!
Maybe they move like they are breathing as a way of ventilating their circuits or cleaning out dust, in which case it would make sense for them to do this even when they are deactivated.