Star Wars Colortiming & Cinematography (was What changes was done to STAR WARS in '93?) — Page 2

Yeah, the GOUT Jedi has a weird blue cast on the stars, good to know it isn't on that LD:)

I've wondered for a while if some of the LDs would actually be more enjoyable than the GOUT.

msycamore said:

The -83 rental tape! that is an old one:) Thanks for the trouble. It actually comes very close to the bootleg telecine in color from what I can see, it is pretty much the same on the vintage doc The Making of STAR WARS also. Then I strongly believe what zombie84 already said, that it's probably more accurate or closer in color pallette of the original -77 print in just that scene than the THX/GOUT version is.

Yeah, but still the tape is waaay too light during the whole movie, here's a couple of more examples just for shits and giggles:

I see, the bright JSC transfer look similar to the pics above, great to see that the tape seems to be in pretty good condition though after all these years! 

A few pictures taken inside a theater in '77, posted a few years ago by Belbucus in the The XØ Project thread:

The pictures above where all taken with the same camera settings, which suggests that the scenes in the canyon appeared quite dark.

msycamore said:

I see, the bright JSC transfer look similar to the pics above, great to see that the tape seems to be in pretty good condition though after all these years! 

Indeed it is, no problems at all except the line which goes on the bottom, otherwise it's as good as new. Last summer I copied it on DVD. :)

LexX said:

Indeed it is, no problems at all except the line which goes on the bottom, otherwise it's as good as new. Last summer I copied it on DVD. :)

 Is that DVD something you would be willing to share a copy of?

msycamore said:

LexX said:

Indeed it is, no problems at all except the line which goes on the bottom, otherwise it's as good as new. Last summer I copied it on DVD. :)

 Is that DVD something you would be willing to share a copy of?

The tape had subtitles so I think no one outside this country is interested. :P But I also have a UK version of that rental tape, if I ever get to transfer it. Too bad they are in mono (no, not the mono versions!) even though covers claim that they're in stereo. I also have the first TESB and ROTJ rental tapes but I don't know if they are any different from later releases. I would transfer all of them if I had the devices but I don't.

LexX said:

The tape had subtitles so I think no one outside this country is interested. :P But I also have a UK version of that rental tape, if I ever get to transfer it. Too bad they are in mono (no, not the mono versions!) even though covers claim that they're in stereo. I also have the first TESB and ROTJ rental tapes but I don't know if they are any different from later releases. I would transfer all of them if I had the devices but I don't.

Ah ok, do you know if the tape contains the original greedo subtitles behind the foreign language? If so, would you care to post a pic of it? I don't know if it's true or not but I believe rental tapes actually was of better quality than the usual tapes, to stand up better against wear and tear. Anyway, they're cool to have. ;)

msycamore said:

LexX said:

The tape had subtitles so I think no one outside this country is interested. :P But I also have a UK version of that rental tape, if I ever get to transfer it. Too bad they are in mono (no, not the mono versions!) even though covers claim that they're in stereo. I also have the first TESB and ROTJ rental tapes but I don't know if they are any different from later releases. I would transfer all of them if I had the devices but I don't.

Ah ok, do you know if the tape contains the original greedo subtitles behind the foreign language? If so, would you care to post a pic of it?

Actually, there isn't, just checked it. They must be on the UK version but I wouldn't think they're original since the film is in pan & scan and the subtitles are much wider IMO...

Ok, thanks for checking, LexX.

That's an interesting observation Baronlando, it seems that the THX mastering maybe had a strange effect on the masters, several laser blasts from the TIE's in Empire has very soft almost yellow colors instead of green when chasing the Falcon and is clear blue in the PAL version and the lights on the panel behind C-3PO's oil bath in Star Wars is blue instead of green in some shots or vice versa. A little nitpicking perhaps, but it shows that these video masters also has some color glitches, even if they're overall very good in colors in comparison to other transfers.

Baronlando said:

...So this was actually changed but not in 97 or 04, it was done in 83, (maybe for a second wave of prints that summer? Or after it was too late for 70mm?)

I assume this is the scene you're talking about:

But why do you say it was changed back in '83? Is it not just a screwup on the '93 remaster, just like the green lightsaber in SW-SE?

I really like how Lucasfilm describes all the changes done to the trilogy in these comparison pictures ;) like some propaganda for how really good the new cuts are, (nothing wrong with this pic description though) the one who wrote this, do he actually think the films looked like old LD masters in the cinema, and I still cannot understand how these '04 tranfers got so praised in reviews at the time of its release.

Baronlando said:

I was just assuming the article was accurate (about it being green in 1983).

Yeah, that article should have read '93 not '83 but then their whole SE campaign wouldn't have been so effective. ;)

EvilSupes said:

msycamore said:

Knightmessenger said:

Yeah, the book you're referring to. Isn't that the picture that's missing one of the sun's. It otherwise looks just like the Special Collection screenshot.

It has been discussed that the scene is definitely darker in those areas you mentioned than on pre THX releases. But it was supposed to be shot day for night. I have a good screenshot comparison on another computer but ever since the new software, I haven't been able to properly embed any screenshots into the forum.  

A very late reply, I must have missed your post and completely forgot about this ;) Anyway, this was the picture I was talking about:

And you're right, now when I've seen the Japanese Special Collection transfer recently it is more close to it in color than the "GOUT." But I don't know if this picture is any true representation of it's original cinematography and colortiming, I just got very nostalgic when I saw this photo and thought to myself, this is how it's supposed to look. But I guess we'll never know... 

also the Canyon scene with Artoo being captured is very bright compared to the "GOUT" release.       

Wow, that image there is exactly how I remember Star Wars when I used to watch my pre-1997 VHS tapes. Everything after hasn't looked the same since. The GOUT as you say is much darker and it doesn't look right to me at all.

Wish I still had pre-1997 source like the Japanese transfer. I would do anything to be able to experience that particular 'look' that I remember.

Aww, I feel depressed now. lol.

 

 

Sorry about the late reply also, but that picture right there is a screencap from the 97 SEs for promotion.

Oh... so that is what it was! Now when you say it, I think it resembles the footage in the doc: Magic & the mystery pretty much although that is more saturated. How did you find out?

msycamore said:

Oh... so that is what it was! Now when you say it, I think it resembles the footage in the doc: Magic & the mystery pretty much although that is more saturated. How did you find out?

It's in the SE section of the LFL photo catalog which has all SW pics for promotion.

And usually if there is a straight screenshot in a commercial release, it's not from the original films. I don't remember seeing any screenshots that promote something or are found in books etc., they're all promotional images taken with a camera. There are over 200 screenshot images for promotion from every SE film and now you also have the 2004 in HD where you can get any shot you want so I don't think you are going to find an original screenshot from an official release.

Yes, it's really sad, all the presence of the original films being completely wiped out...

It is still interesting that it doesn't match the appearance in the '97 homevideo releases at all.

msycamore said:

It is still interesting that it doesn't match the appearance in the '97 homevideo releases at all.

I don't know why they are what they are but the shots are even inconsistent with each other. But for example all Mos Eisley shots are just greyish blur but the Yavin battle looks pretty decent. Here's a few I just put together so you can see it...