(Spoilers)How could The Force Awakens have been more original? — Page 2

John Doom said:

Expositions on the plot can be as long as in ROTJ’s briefing scene (which didn’t affect its overall pacing), there’s no need for waits and conversations longer than there were in the OT.

If you’re going to have espionage scenes and a lot of exposition spread throughout the film it will effect the pacing.

Why do you say it would make more sense in a prequel novel?

Because in real life the Cold War could have resulted in a savage species ending conflict. If war did erupt the Cold War would have been seen as the prelude to it. Also STAR WARS and TFA both start in the thick of it; the only film/s that fixated on what started the war was TPM and most of AOTC.

wasn’t half of SW’s plot about Leia being a spy and Obi-wan’s mission to bring the stolen data tapes to the Rebellion?

You’re right but there was a full blown war still going on and the movie changes direction after Alderaan explodes. It seems as though you want the film to go even further than that which will detract for the other aspect of Star Wars.

IsanRido said:
-No “landing after coming our of hyperspace”, it’s enough with the recycled OT moments, why insert an unused concept from TPM?

Because it never made it into the film thus it would feel new to most people. Hell I didn’t even know it was an unused concept. It hasn’t actually been done so why not?

John Doom said:
Not necessarily, there’s no need for more exposition than there’s in ROTJ (again, think of James Bond films, like Goldeneye, which have just the right amount of expositions without feeling slow).

Exactly how much of this stuff do you want there to be in this hypothetical Episode VII? It seems as though not much because if you wanted to have it in abundance there would be an effect on the pacing but if it were minimal it wouldn’t do much hard.

I see what you mean. If conflicts are an asset in SW to you

I’m sure it’s an asset to every one. It’s called Star Wars for a reason you know.

So, you could start the trilogy with similar wars, but in space. These conflicts then could escalate in a crisis between the superpowers and, in the final movie, bring to a galactic war and its final solution. It’s definitely possible.

This I like so much as the espionage stuff doesn’t detract too much from fire fights, space battles, the servants of the Lights vs the servants of the Dark etc. The espionage would have to be next to nil in Episode IX though.

with different kind of conflicts and enemies

What types of new enemies would you have in mind? I’ve been toying with an idea of having all of the non Force Sensitives hunt down those who use The Force because the galaxy is tired of the wars they bring upon them.

Ditch the Starkiller Base superweapon. It wasn’t needed whatsoever. Instead make Starkiller Base a plain old military base that doesn’t get destroyed.

Dek Rollins said:

IsanRido said:

-Kylo’s saber ought to be a different color, to eliminate the “bad guise use red” cliche.

No. We’re trying to make a good SW film, not some fan-fiction.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvfCNzGK2BQ

I think the cross guard lightsaber should stay. Red is used by villains because it’s an aggressive color. It generally works when designing a villain. Unlike Lucas’ prequel Sith, it makes sense for Kylo Ren to carry a lightsaber because he was once a Jedi (the Emperor specifically called the light saber a “JEDI weapon” not a Sith weapon). The crossguard makes it more similar to swords of religous knights too. If Vader was a samurai Nazi enforcer then Kylo Ren is a religous crusader knight.

I don’t know about using espionage and mirroring the Cold War. This is Star WARS (emphasis on WARS). The Cold War was called the Cold War because there wasn’t much of the usual kinds of battles where people shoot each other. Who’s going to be the hero of the sequel trilogy? A sports player? “Oh look out! It’s Kylo Ren, space Russia’s deadliest chess player!”

Normally I’m against color-coded lightsabers, but since Kylo was a Vader fanboy, I’m cool with his saber being the color as Vader’s.

John Doom said:
I simply meant changing the empire with stuff typical of the Cold War imaginary (ideologies, spies, information control, rogues).

The more I’m reading your ideas on the subject the more I’m liking it though it would be a bit too different for a lot of people. Especially casual fans. Which is a shame because more complex plot lines than what was in the OT with characters that are imbued with moral ambiguity would be a step up in my opinion.

I like your idea a lot too, which also reminds me a bit of KOTOR2. Imagine the main characters/viewers being initially told the Force Sensitives are the plague which once brought war in the galaxy: it could’ve led to a very interesting and original plot 😉

Thank you. There would still be Jedi vs Dark Siders but the added threat of non Force Sensitives using Ysalamiri against practitioners of The Force would lead to some tense moments and a sense of evolution that TFA is lacking. And this is coming from the guy who rates it an 8.3/10

darklordoftech said:

Ditch the Starkiller Base superweapon. It wasn’t needed whatsoever. Instead make Starkiller Base a plain old military base that doesn’t get destroyed.

THIS. I feel the same exact way. The plot still works if you take out the damn superweapon as Kylo kidnaps Rey and they have to go rescue her. The only thing that doesn’t happen is the destruction of the utterly pointless Hosnian system. Just have one roundtable scene touching on the New Republic’s efforts to establish a permanent base, or just don’t blow up the New Republic at all, whatever.

No superweapon would make TFA much, much more enjoyable IMO. I thought it was great besides that.

IsanRido said:
And again, just because they were slightly important in the first film, there’s no reason to feature them again other than “Hey cool! It’s CP30 and R2D2!”.

R2 fixes the hyperdrive in ESB and C3P0 kind of helps the crew from being eaten by Ewoks in ROTJ. So they serves some kind of role after STAR WARS.

EDIT:

mfastx said:
The only thing that doesn’t happen is the destruction of the utterly pointless Hosnian system.

And the destruction of the Republic Fleet. That’s going to play a big role in the rest of the ST. I’m glad that it’s gone but at the very least it’s going to impact things in the future.

mfastx said:

darklordoftech said:

Ditch the Starkiller Base superweapon. It wasn’t needed whatsoever. Instead make Starkiller Base a plain old military base that doesn’t get destroyed.

THIS. I feel the same exact way. The plot still works if you take out the damn superweapon as Kylo kidnaps Rey and they have to go rescue her. The only thing that doesn’t happen is the destruction of the utterly pointless Hosnian system. Just have one roundtable scene touching on the New Republic’s efforts to establish a permanent base, or just don’t blow up the New Republic at all, whatever.

No superweapon would make TFA much, much more enjoyable IMO. I thought it was great besides that.

Adding to this, the plot was about tuhe search for Luke, not Starkiller Base.

IsanRido said:

“He also wore black. Do you want Kylo to wear something else just to emphasize the unnecessary points of originality?”
Originality/subversion alone doesn’t do anything. However, if we’re dealing with a good film that features competent writing, direction and acting, would you think its quality be hurt if you saw the villain wearing white robes and using a blue lightsaber?

Yes however little. It would be a unnecesarily misleading and confusing design choice. Why make the bad guy look so much like the good guys? It’s not even really that original and detracts from the story.

EDIT : Starkiller Base does serve a purpose. It makes the First Order a humongous threat and gives Poe Dameron something to do in the third act.

Yes, 'cause a blue/green lightsaber and a blue/green lightsaber alone would be all it would take to make a bad guy indistinquishable from a good guy. Things like body language, vocal inflection, general attitude and the actions they partake in – those things don’t matter once goddamn iota.

Oh, but I forgot – only little children under the age of five watch SW movies.

[JEDIT]

Oh, this guy is just oh so warm, friendly, and inviting,