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Spence's Obi-Wan Kenobi (V3 Released) — Page 4

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SpenceEdit said:

So, just so everyone is aware, there will be a Version 3 of this, and that will likely be the final version. The only way I would consider making a Version 4 is if some of the effects work being done on the Grand Inquisitor’s look some intrepid fans are doing on Reddit come to fruition. I would incorporate those.

I’m going to spend a bit longer between V2 and V3 just to make sure I have every piece of feedback and have left no stone unturned before releasing V3. So, if you’ve watched it and have things you’d like to share, please do so. Even if I don’t use the feedback, I appreciate every piece of it. Some times a new idea that I don’t want to lose will lead to other creativity I do want to use.

I am also upgrading my source for this to 2160p. I don’t know that I’ll be releasing a 4k version, as I’ve never done that before, but at minimum the final version of this will look significantly better than the current ones.

Thanks for all your hard work! I will try to watch V2 and provide feedback soon. And while a 4K version would be nice, I think a high bitrate 1080p version with the new source would also look quite good. If you don’t release a 4K, the 2160p source might give you more latitude to crop or reframe certain shots if you find a reason to do that.

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Octorox said:

Thanks for all your hard work! I will try to watch V2 and provide feedback soon. And while a 4K version would be nice, I think a high bitrate 1080p version with the new source would also look quite good. If you don’t release a 4K, the 2160p source might give you more latitude to crop or reframe certain shots if you find a reason to do that.

It’s already helping with that. I have one shot that I slowed using Flowframes and another I cropped substantially that both now look significantly better. Thanks for your help!

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SpenceEdit said:

I am also upgrading my source for this to 2160p. I don’t know that I’ll be releasing a 4k version, as I’ve never done that before, but at minimum the final version of this will look significantly better than the current ones.

Cool! This always helps too if you ever need to zoom into a shot a little to crop something out. The shot in the final encode will still be 1080! I stopped releasing much in 4K because there isn’t much of a demand. But I still edit in 4K when possible.

So then will you have to convert from HDR to SDR? Or are you releasing in HDR?

heil palpatine!

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krausfadr said:

SpenceEdit said:

I am also upgrading my source for this to 2160p. I don’t know that I’ll be releasing a 4k version, as I’ve never done that before, but at minimum the final version of this will look significantly better than the current ones.

Cool! This always helps too if you ever need to zoom into a shot a little to crop something out. The shot in the final encode will still be 1080! I stopped releasing much in 4K because there isn’t much of a demand. But I still edit in 4K when possible.

So then will you have to convert from HDR to SDR? Or are you releasing in HDR?

The source I pointed Spence to was already SDR despite being 4K. I’m not sure if someone tonemapped it or there is a 4K SDR version on D+ for those who’s TVs don’t support HDR, but I can confirm it looks correct to my eyes.
Personally I don’t think fan editing in HDR is worth it at this point in time unless you’re planning on doing your own color grade and just want as much color data as possible to work with. Afaik the tools to do a proper HDR release just aren’t there yet at the consumer level.

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Someone on the fanedit subreddit has posted some great tests of a VFX enhanced grand Inquisitor and fifth brother along with Vader flying his TIE, would love to see those added when it releases.

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They probably tonemapped it then. Full version of Resolve also includes Dolby Vision which does a great job tonemapping as well. I try to release in SDR because there’s a handful of people that don’t like it if it’s in HDR. Spence’s final version will look pretty stellar.

heil palpatine!

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hinventon said:

Someone on the fanedit subreddit has posted some great tests of a VFX enhanced grand Inquisitor and fifth brother along with Vader flying his TIE, would love to see those added when it releases.

I love the GI and tie fighter stuff that’s being worked on, and the creator of those clips already said he’d let me use them. That’s what I mean by a version 4. It would just be to incorporate that. I’m not going to wait for that to be done but would definitely add it in when they are finished.

I’d also be open to adding a crawl as an alternate version if there is demand. I personally don’t think it needs one.

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Phase3 said:

SpenceEdit said:

There’s only three shots from that scene in the edit, you still find that to be too much?

The small-file version of V2 I downloaded has most of the chase sequence intact, lasting around 50 seconds. Does the large-file version truncate that sequence?

She runs away from them for a couple of shots, then sees the guard and yells to him, guard gets shot, and then they catch her. It’s about as short as that scene can get while still existing. I’m not really sure what else you think could be removed from it?

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Phase3 said:

SpenceEdit said:

There’s only three shots from that scene in the edit, you still find that to be too much?

The small-file version of V2 I downloaded has most of the chase sequence intact, lasting around 50 seconds. Does the large-file version truncate that sequence?

I mean, you could always make your own edit that removes more of the chase if you want, my dude.

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SpenceEdit said:

hinventon said:

Someone on the fanedit subreddit has posted some great tests of a VFX enhanced grand Inquisitor and fifth brother along with Vader flying his TIE, would love to see those added when it releases.

I love the GI and tie fighter stuff that’s being worked on, and the creator of those clips already said he’d let me use them. That’s what I mean by a version 4. It would just be to incorporate that. I’m not going to wait for that to be done but would definitely add it in when they are finished.

I’d also be open to adding a crawl as an alternate version if there is demand. I personally don’t think it needs one.

Oh boy, talking about “under pressure” haha
I’m aiming for a before-Christmas release, so that we all have something to look forward to. Plus it’s a tradition for the past few years 😃

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PixelJoker95 said:

SpenceEdit said:

hinventon said:

Someone on the fanedit subreddit has posted some great tests of a VFX enhanced grand Inquisitor and fifth brother along with Vader flying his TIE, would love to see those added when it releases.

I love the GI and tie fighter stuff that’s being worked on, and the creator of those clips already said he’d let me use them. That’s what I mean by a version 4. It would just be to incorporate that. I’m not going to wait for that to be done but would definitely add it in when they are finished.

I’d also be open to adding a crawl as an alternate version if there is demand. I personally don’t think it needs one.

Oh boy, talking about “under pressure” haha
I’m aiming for a before-Christmas release, so that we all have something to look forward to. Plus it’s a tradition for the past few years 😃

No worries! I’ll do my thing and you do yours, and if they sync up one day we will make something cool.

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BrotherOfSasquatch said:

Phase3 said:

SpenceEdit said:

There’s only three shots from that scene in the edit, you still find that to be too much?

The small-file version of V2 I downloaded has most of the chase sequence intact, lasting around 50 seconds. Does the large-file version truncate that sequence?

I mean, you could always make your own edit that removes more of the chase if you want, my dude.

I’m genuinely interested in any and all feedback, regardless of if I use it or not. I’m just not sure what else can be cut.

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Killing it as always, Spence. Can’t wait for your final version! Your edits are always worth the wait.

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Please don’t misunderstand – I mean no disrespect! I really do think that your V2 is a great edit! I apologise if it sounded like a complaint – that’s not what I meant at all!!

I was only thinking in terms of pacing; it could be cut so that after Flea says “You!”, Leia is instantly kidnapped: the bag / sack gets put over her head, thereby eliminating the ridiculous-looking “chase” through the forest, where the adult actors were clearly running slowly.

SpenceEdit said:

Phase3 said:

SpenceEdit said:

There’s only three shots from that scene in the edit, you still find that to be too much?

The small-file version of V2 I downloaded has most of the chase sequence intact, lasting around 50 seconds. Does the large-file version truncate that sequence?

She runs away from them for a couple of shots, then sees the guard and yells to him, guard gets shot, and then they catch her. It’s about as short as that scene can get while still existing. I’m not really sure what else you think could be removed from it?

Phantom Menace - Streamlined fan edit:
https://originaltrilogy.com/topic/The-Phantom-Menace-Streamlined-finished-and-released/id/98999

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I don’t think there’s anything in Spence’s version that looks ridiculous. Wanting to cut it completely for time is one thing but it’s definitely possible to trim out the silly bits, which Spence did.

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Phase3 said:

Please don’t misunderstand – I mean no disrespect! I really do think that your V2 is a great edit! I apologise if it sounded like a complaint – that’s not what I meant at all!!

I was only thinking in terms of pacing; it could be cut so that after Flea says “You!”, Leia is instantly kidnapped: the bag / sack gets put over her head, thereby eliminating the ridiculous-looking “chase” through the forest, where the adult actors were clearly running slowly.

SpenceEdit said:

Phase3 said:

SpenceEdit said:

There’s only three shots from that scene in the edit, you still find that to be too much?

The small-file version of V2 I downloaded has most of the chase sequence intact, lasting around 50 seconds. Does the large-file version truncate that sequence?

She runs away from them for a couple of shots, then sees the guard and yells to him, guard gets shot, and then they catch her. It’s about as short as that scene can get while still existing. I’m not really sure what else you think could be removed from it?

Hey. No offense taken! I’ll say I’m fairly happy with that sequence as it is now, but if I find a more efficient way to tell that story beat that still feels natural, I’m open to it.

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So I finally got a chance to sit down and watch V2. Overall I think it’s a big improvement, and as close to a perfect “movie length” rendition as you can get. That said, I do still have some quibbles. In particular, I think there are a few lines and scenes where either a setup or payoff is removed, so they don’t land as well as they should. I feel like 5-10 more minutes of breathing room, which would put the overall length in the ballpark of The Last Jedi, would really be the sweet spot.

-When Leia tells her father that “she’s not a real Organa”, we no longer have the context of it being something Leia was told by her cousin that she internalized. In this new context, it seems like it was Leia’s original thought, which imo doesn’t quite add up. I personally don’t mind Leia’s precocious reading of her cousin because I interpreted it as an example of her latent Force ability. I wonder if there’s any way you could reinstate some of that scene, at least enough to get the original context of the line back.

-when Reva stabs the Grand Inquisitor in the chest, she says “who’s in the gutter now?” Unfortunately the original line spoken to Reva by the Grand Inquisitor about “finding her in the gutter” has been cut, so this no longer makes much sense. It’s repeated by The Grand Inquisitor again at the end, and there it feels like it’s calling back to something that we no longer hear.

-In Fortress Inquisitorius, Tala says something to the effect of “what are they hiding down there” but we no longer have the payoff of the Jedi tomb scene. I would just trim this line out if possible.

-Tala’s death feels like it carries significantly less weight without her relaying her full history with the Empire in a heart to heart with Obi-Wan. Her character has a reduced presence overall, and while I think you were smart to cut a lot of the antics in the Fortress Inquisitorius, I feel like this scene should have stayed.

-When we see Leia dress up with her boots and holster at the end, it no longer mirrors her introductory scene. I was glad you reinstated her scene in the woods but I still missed this parallel, which showed the character’s growth in how she feels about her role as a representative of Alderaan.

-In this cut, the fact that Reva is behind Leia’s kidnapping is now revealed when Obi-Wan learns it. I think this is a smart change, but I wonder if something about the score or the editing could be tweaked to really underline the fact that this is a reveal to the audience.

-At around 1 hours and 37 minutes in, Roken mouths a line but it can’t be heard. I assume this is just an editing mistake.

Some other tidbits that probably aren’t essential but I missed nonetheless, because I felt they added texture to the world:

-Obi-Wan digs up his and Anakin’s lightsabers: I would like to see if this scene could be incorporated without intercutting it with Reva. It’s a nice call forward to the saber’s final resting place in Rise of Skywalker
-Obi-Wan sees a Clone Wars vet begging on the street (this is so short that I can’t imagine it would significantly impact the runtime to reinstate it)
-Haja’s whole “Fake Jedi” dog and pony show. I feel like his status as a huckster doesn’t quite land as clearly in this edit.
-For whatever reason, I felt the absence of Obi-Wan packing up his stuff in his cave at the end. I really liked the symbolic aspect of him getting a fresh start by moving to a new home.

There are others I can think of, but I feel like reinstating them would be antithetical to your goal of a typical Star Wars movie runtime. And so that my list of suggestions doesn’t consist entirely of additions, I can suggest one cut:

-In the scene where Reva explains that she put a tracker on Kenobi’s ship, I feel like you can cut after Vader says “it seems I have underestimated you”. Maybe end on a self-assured looking reaction shot of Reva if possible. The scene feels a little too drawn out right now, especially since you’ve cut most other bickering between the Inquisitors.

Also I felt like there were a couple other instances where familiar JW themes could have been used:
-I wanted to hear the leitmotif from Battle of the Heroes somewhere. I feel like there are a couple callbacks to that fateful duel where it could have been slotted in. Not the full choir, just a few notes.
-it would have been nice to hear Qui-Gon’s theme when he finally appears.
-As for OT themes, I think you could have used The Rebel Fanfare when the T-47s come to the rescue, and Luke’s theme when Obi-Wan finally gets to meet him. For all of these themes, I would use just a hint and not the most forceful statement. There are quite a few bits of score in the saga films where they are used more subtly.

Overall a really nice job!

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Hey! Thanks, there’s some really great feedback here.

Octorox said:

So I finally got a chance to sit down and watch V2. Overall I think it’s a big improvement, and as close to a perfect “movie length” rendition as you can get. That said, I do still have some quibbles. In particular, I think there are a few lines and scenes where either a setup or payoff is removed, so they don’t land as well as they should. I feel like 5-10 more minutes of breathing room, which would put the overall length in the ballpark of The Last Jedi, would really be the sweet spot.

The goal was always under 2 and a half hours, so I do have a bit of wiggle room.

Octorox said:
-When Leia tells her father that “she’s not a real Organa”, we no longer have the context of it being something Leia was told by her cousin that she internalized. In this new context, it seems like it was Leia’s original thought, which imo doesn’t quite add up. I personally don’t mind Leia’s precocious reading of her cousin because I interpreted it as an example of her latent Force ability. I wonder if there’s any way you could reinstate some of that scene, at least enough to get the original context of the line back.

In all honesty, I tried to get through it all as briefly as possible, as the only scene in that whole Leia intro that’s really essential is her conversation with Bail. I may have overcorrected. I’ll play with it.

Octorox said:
-when Reva stabs the Grand Inquisitor in the chest, she says “who’s in the gutter now?” Unfortunately the original line spoken to Reva by the Grand Inquisitor about “finding her in the gutter” has been cut, so this no longer makes much sense. It’s repeated by The Grand Inquisitor again at the end, and there it feels like it’s calling back to something that we no longer hear.

-In Fortress Inquisitorius, Tala says something to the effect of “what are they hiding down there” but we no longer have the payoff of the Jedi tomb scene. I would just trim this line out if possible.

Both of these things have already been corrected for the next version.

Octorox said:
-Tala’s death feels like it carries significantly less weight without her relaying her full history with the Empire in a heart to heart with Obi-Wan. Her character has a reduced presence overall, and while I think you were smart to cut a lot of the antics in the Fortress Inquisitorius, I feel like this scene should have stayed.

-When we see Leia dress up with her boots and holster at the end, it no longer mirrors her introductory scene. I was glad you reinstated her scene in the woods but I still missed this parallel, which showed the character’s growth in how she feels about her role as a representative of Alderaan.

Respectfully, I think these scenes feel like their missing only because you know they exist. If we weren’t aware they existed, it wouldn’t feel off to not include them. That’s my justification for it anyway.

Octorox said:
-In this cut, the fact that Reva is behind Leia’s kidnapping is now revealed when Obi-Wan learns it. I think this is a smart change, but I wonder if something about the score or the editing could be tweaked to really underline the fact that this is a reveal to the audience.

Maybe a more dramatic musical beat here? That could help.

Octorox said:
-At around 1 hours and 37 minutes in, Roken mouths a line but it can’t be heard. I assume this is just an editing mistake.

Not sure what happened on that one. I’ll look at it.

Octorox said:

-Obi-Wan digs up his and Anakin’s lightsabers: I would like to see if this scene could be incorporated without intercutting it with Reva. It’s a nice call forward to the saber’s final resting place in Rise of Skywalker
-Obi-Wan sees a Clone Wars vet begging on the street (this is so short that I can’t imagine it would significantly impact the runtime to reinstate it)

Yeah, I miss that scene too. I feel like it kind of needs to be there. Maybe just that bit with a new musical queue? Could be a good opportunity to throw some classic JW in there.

Octorox said:
-Haja’s whole “Fake Jedi” dog and pony show. I feel like his status as a huckster doesn’t quite land as clearly in this edit.

Personally, I think we got enough of him being silly and using the magnets to sell it. That portion of the movie needs to move at a higher pace, so I don’t see this going back in.

Octorox said:
-For whatever reason, I felt the absence of Obi-Wan packing up his stuff in his cave at the end. I really liked the symbolic aspect of him getting a fresh start by moving to a new home.

This is (partially) added back in for the next version.

Octorox said:

-In the scene where Reva explains that she put a tracker on Kenobi’s ship, I feel like you can cut after Vader says “it seems I have underestimated you”. Maybe end on a self-assured looking reaction shot of Reva if possible. The scene feels a little too drawn out right now, especially since you’ve cut most other bickering between the Inquisitors.

This is a great suggestion. I’ll see if I can make it work.

Octorox said:
Also I felt like there were a couple other instances where familiar JW themes could have been used:
-I wanted to hear the leitmotif from Battle of the Heroes somewhere. I feel like there are a couple callbacks to that fateful duel where it could have been slotted in. Not the full choir, just a few notes.
-it would have been nice to hear Qui-Gon’s theme when he finally appears.
-As for OT themes, I think you could have used The Rebel Fanfare when the T-47s come to the rescue, and Luke’s theme when Obi-Wan finally gets to meet him. For all of these themes, I would use just a hint and not the most forceful statement. There are quite a few bits of score in the saga films where they are used more subtly.

I actually tried a couple of those, the biggest issue is the muddy center channel. I’d have to rebuild a lot of sound effects to make these work. Though I do feel like we, at minimum, need another Williams track or two in there.

Thanks again for the detailed notes!

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Thanks for your detailed response to my notes! If you’re having trouble with too much music bleed into the center channel, try https://www.lalal.ai/. It can very accurately isolates vocals, although that does mean that you need to rebuild sound effects.

It seems like you have a really strong intention behind your cuts and I respect how you’ve thought everything through, even if some of the choices you’ve made are a bit different from what I would do. Regarding the Leia stuff at the beginning, I get your impulse to try to get through it as quickly as possible, but I do think a lot of it is important to her character arc, and the series/movie is very much a two-hander between Kenobi and Leia. I don’t think you would lose the audience if you spent a little more time there. I always have to remind myself that we don’t meet our main character in the original Star Wars until 20 minutes into the movie.

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Octorox said:

Thanks for your detailed response to my notes! If you’re having trouble with too much music bleed into the center channel, try https://www.lalal.ai/. It can very accurately isolates vocals, although that does mean that you need to rebuild sound effects.

It seems like you have a really strong intention behind your cuts and I respect how you’ve thought everything through, even if some of the choices you’ve made are a bit different from what I would do. Regarding the Leia stuff at the beginning, I get your impulse to try to get through it as quickly as possible, but I do think a lot of it is important to her character arc, and the series/movie is very much a two-hander between Kenobi and Leia. I don’t think you would lose the audience if you spent a little more time there. I always have to remind myself that we don’t meet our main character in the original Star Wars until 20 minutes into the movie.

I think you’re right. I’m going to expand that scene and put her roasting the cousin back in. Probably retain the rest of my changes that I made though.

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I’m trying to make the escape from Jabim flow better, so I’ve got a little test clip here that I’d love some opinions on.

Basically, the scene needs to hit all the emotional/story beats while avoiding that “something’s missing” feeling due to all the Reva stuff I cut out. This sequence also takes way too long in the show. It works for the show as it’s the intro to an episode, but as a sort of tranistion/breaking point in the final part of a film, it can’t go on too long. So this gets us from leaving Jabim to Obi-Wan luring away Vader in 4 minutes.

There’s a section where I’ll need to rebuild the sound effects of the star destroyer firing at the ship. I did a little just as a placeholder, but if the idea seems to be working I’ll do much more detail on that.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bt7XB2vTq7ftZuDNFw-FH3crpFy2UuSZ/view?usp=sharing

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SpenceEdit said:

I’m trying to make the escape from Jabim flow better, so I’ve got a little test clip here that I’d love some opinions on.

Basically, the scene needs to hit all the emotional/story beats while avoiding that “something’s missing” feeling due to all the Reva stuff I cut out. This sequence also takes way too long in the show. It works for the show as it’s the intro to an episode, but as a sort of tranistion/breaking point in the final part of a film, it can’t go on too long. So this gets us from leaving Jabim to Obi-Wan luring away Vader in 4 minutes.

There’s a section where I’ll need to rebuild the sound effects of the star destroyer firing at the ship. I did a little just as a placeholder, but if the idea seems to be working I’ll do much more detail on that.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bt7XB2vTq7ftZuDNFw-FH3crpFy2UuSZ/view?usp=sharing

I think this almost works but it does feel like something’s missing. Maybe add the line “I’m the one that Vader wants, if I go, he will follow” over the exterior shot? Just before the woman says “what happened to all of us staying together?”

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So I’ve finally sae the V2. Overall - great job. There are things I thing could/should be changed but in generalnl it’s a very Well edited and coherent fanedit, doesnt feel faneditish. It does the job. And I understand you didnt want to alter the official story too much.

So, things I think could be improved:
-The infamous chase scene on Alderaan. I know its a very repetitive feedback but it can really end once we See a suspicious guy in the Forest saying hello. Its well too obvious they re there to kidnap there.
-The running Jedi on Tatooine - I think it can be cit even more - like to cut from Reva igniting the lightsaber directly to the footagr when he’s seen hanging dead in the Town (btw very good job on trimming the first EP).
-Bail convincing Obi-wan. It should be trimmed even more. Obi-wan wouldnt hesitate So much. Maybe the “Phone call” could be cut? Obi-wan shouldnt even be able to contact Bail So easily in the first place. Anyway, we dont need to See him how he enters the spaceship, we can cut directly to him landing On Daimyu.
-The cameo of Temeura should be reinserted 😭
-btw, not necesary for the story, but would be nice to See how Leia disses her cousin.
-I think we could have even less Haja 😉

“When Leia tells her father that “she’s not a real Organa”, we no longer have the context of it being something Leia was told by her cousin that she internalized. In this new context, it seems like it was Leia’s original thought, which imo doesn’t quite add up. I personally don’t mind Leia’s precocious reading of her cousin because I interpreted it as an example of her latent Force ability. I wonder if there’s any way you could reinstate some of that scene, at least enough to get the original context of the line back”

Maybe you are right about this one, but on the other hand, I forgot that it all started with the cousin being mean and it didnt feel off when I was watching the edit. Anyway, The whole Leia dissing her cousin scene was great.

“In Fortress Inquisitorius, Tala says something to the effect of “what are they hiding down there” but we no longer have the payoff of the Jedi tomb scene. I would just trim this line out if possible”
+1

And, I loved rescoring and all the trimming. And you improved soo soo much the Episode 3.