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Should Jacen, Jaina, and Mara be in the newer films?

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The Skywalker lineage and Luke's wife have been in the EU for quite some time now. What was your reaction when Disney announced that the Legends cannon would exist unto itself, and that long familiar characters (notably the three in the OP) would not be involved in the upcoming films? Did these characters contribute heavily to Luke's development in your opinion, or do you think that it was best for future cannonical films to start anew? Did you find Jacen and Jaina's birth/development to be nothing more than a rehash of Luke/Leia's?

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I saw it coming a parsec away knowing that the new trilogy was being based on an outline from GL.

Despite what the EU fanatics have come to believe, George has always maintained that the EU was not his and he was not beholden to it.

George Lucas said:

Once Vader dies, he doesn't come back to life, the Emperor doesn't get cloned and Luke doesn't get married.

Which is fine with me. A lot of the EU is just terrible. I liked the basic outline of Luke rebuilding the Jedi Order post-ROTJ but the execution of it left a lot wanting.

If what we've heard is true in regards to Luke's life after ROTJ in this new trilogy, I gotta say I'm a little disappointed. Why wait so long?

It seems like George might be recycling the original ideas he had for Luke's sister and using them for Luke now. Which leaves me feeling a little apprehensive.

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Stepping softly in a danger zone…

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Carthage said:

What was your reaction when Disney announced that the Legends cannon would exist unto itself, and that long familiar characters (notably the three in the OP) would not be involved in the upcoming films?

My reaction was pure bliss. The new movies should be able to tell their own story, not be beholden to another story.

If Plagueis shows up in the ST, not only will I refuse to watch the movies, but I won't so much as watch the trailers, either. - DuracellEnergizer

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I'm looking forward to stories not at all tied to 20 years of stories of very mixed quality.

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darklordoftech said:

The new movies should be able to tell their own story, not be beholden to another story.

 Sounds like something you-know-who might have said while the prequels were being written.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Stepping softly in a danger zone…

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Like I said in another thread:

If the leaked plot rumors are true, then I'm glad they're justifying the jettisoning of the EU by going in a totally different direction. Since it's been 30 years, I can kinda see why they got rid of everything. I mean, it actually would've been harder to justify titling your movie "Episode VII" when you've got 40 years worth of epic shit that's happened in the interim.

Yeah, it's awkward that they kept that continuity going for 20 years only to throw it out now, but part of this is due to Lucas' fickle nature. As of October 29, 2012, Episode VII was still "never gonna happen," so it didn't matter to Lucas what they continued to do in the EU. RotJ was "The End" so far as he was concerned. The Thrawn Trilogy onward was "the rest of the story" to satisfy the fans. Now Lucas has changed his mind.

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TheBoost said:

I'm looking forward to stories not at all tied to 20 years of stories of very mixed quality.

 Pretty sure they'll be tied to 28 years of stories of very mixed quality?

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I think that a decision to rub out the existence of Mara Jade, Jacen, Jaina, Anakin Solo and Ben Skywalker would be a giant middle-finger to the Star Wars fan community.
Outside the little group of "Original Trilogy Only" die-hards on this and other movie-oriented forums, there is a great community of Star Wars fans out there who have embraced the dozens and dozens of books that have been published since the Thrawn Trilogy.

I do expect some things to be pulled from the EU into canon - which has happened before - , but we don't know anything yet about anything because nothing of Episode VII's plot has been disclosed yet.

I don't expect anyone to care about the specific stories, and about various side characters, though. Also, people wouldn't mind if some details are different or of some of the character traits of the Solo and Skywalker children were different.

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Darth Lars said:

I think that a decision to rub out the existence of Mara Jade, Jacen, Jaina, Anakin Solo and Ben Skywalker would be a giant middle-finger to the Star Wars fan community.
Outside the little group of "Original Trilogy Only" die-hards on this and other movie-oriented forums, there is a great community of Star Wars fans out there who have embraced the dozens and dozens of books that have been published since the Thrawn Trilogy.

These fans would do themselves worlds of good by just adhering to their own personal canons. Pissing and moaning that the official canon doesn't love their precious EU anymore gets them nowhere but the Land of High Blood Pressure.

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Darth Lars said:

I think that a decision to rub out the existence of Mara Jade, Jacen, Jaina, Anakin Solo and Ben Skywalker would be a giant middle-finger to the Star Wars fan community.
Outside the little group of "Original Trilogy Only" die-hards on this and other movie-oriented forums, there is a great community of Star Wars fans out there who have embraced the dozens and dozens of books that have been published since the Thrawn Trilogy.

I do expect some things to be pulled from the EU into canon - which has happened before - , but we don't know anything yet about anything because nothing of Episode VII's plot has been disclosed yet.

I don't expect anyone to care about the specific stories, and about various side characters, though. Also, people wouldn't mind if some details are different or of some of the character traits of the Solo and Skywalker children were different.

 They wouldn't have done what they did to the EU unless their hand was forced. I can guarantee you right now that VII will completely contradict everything that has happened postROTJ before now.

The biggest indicator of which is that from the evidence we've seen the Solo's only have one child. I doubt her name will be Jaina but we'll see about that.

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Darth Lars said:


I think that a decision to rub out the existence of Mara Jade, Jacen, Jaina, Anakin Solo and Ben Skywalker would be a giant middle-finger to the Star Wars fan community.
Outside the little group of "Original Trilogy Only" die-hards on this and other movie-oriented forums, there is a great community of Star Wars fans out there who have embraced the dozens and dozens of books that have been published since the Thrawn Trilogy.
But you know who doesn't care about the EU? My mom, and the millions of other people who want to go see a Star Wars movie and never did and never want to read books to get the full story from a movie series. The ST will be designed to sell tickets, and making sequels to various quality books based on movies is not the way to do that.

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Darth Lars said:


Outside the little group of "Original Trilogy Only" die-hards on this and other movie-oriented forums, there is a great community of Star Wars fans out there who have embraced the dozens and dozens of books that have been published since the Thrawn Trilogy.

 I think the fanbases you are talking about is the other way around.  Out of all of my friends who love SW, only 1 really has read the EU novels, as he has kinda filled me in through the years of the characters like Mara Jade, Han/Leia's twins, etc.

And never go by what people are saying on SW forums to form your opinion about how big or small a fanbase is.  All of us here are just a small % of SW fans, as I am the only one of my friends who posts on SW boards.

The bottom line is the mass fanbase of SW fans loves the OT movies, and the PT, EU, etc are niche fanbases.  Disney would not be erasing the EU and constantly talking about old school effects if they didn't think the OT fanbase was the target market for the Sequel Trilogy.

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Darth Lars said:

I think that a decision to rub out the existence of Mara Jade, Jacen, Jaina, Anakin Solo and Ben Skywalker would be a giant middle-finger to the Star Wars fan community.

What I think would be a giant middle finger would be shoving the EU down the throats of people who don't care about "canon". Initially, I wanted the EU to continue as a separate universe from episodes 7-9 but the constant complaining from EU fans made me feel like they deserve a middle finger.

If Plagueis shows up in the ST, not only will I refuse to watch the movies, but I won't so much as watch the trailers, either. - DuracellEnergizer

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I would have preferred the production team had respected the broad strokes of the EU fans have interacted with for decades, but that would be a very messy situation for everyone. I'm still mildly disappointed we haven't gotten a list of a few story-group-approved EU novels to form a bedrock for the new canon, even if all post-ROTJ material has to be let go. 

I do feel bad for fans who have digested and enjoyed the EU for years. I know, "It's all fiction anyway," but they are having to move all their knowledge from the EU into a different realm and brace themselves to accept new continuity that overrides the old.

I've said it before, but I cite the mini-episode of Doctor Who "Night Of The Doctor" as an example of the kind of care I like to see for a franchise's spinoff material. Part of the fun of a "subcreation" world like that of Star Wars is making it all fit together with in-universe explanations. Massive retcons like this can be frustrating. That being said, it's for good reason: a slew of Star Wars feature films.

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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I was one of those who read many of the EU books up until the Yuzzhan Vong war, and the children of Leia had absolutely zero interest for me.

Characters should be written to serve a purpose in the story, and if the only distinguishing characteristic of the children is that their parent is Force Sensitive, well that's not good enough. It was good enough for the OT, but that's been done.

What hasn't been done is have non-Force sensitive children from Jedi parents. If the children of Leia were unable to become Jedi, that would be fertile ground for a new story that I could get behind, with deep implications as to the will and nature of the Force itself.

You probably don’t recognize me because of the red arm.
Episode 9 Rewrite, The Starlight Project (Released!) and ANH Technicolor Project (Released!)

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Hal 9000 said:

I do feel bad for fans who have digested and enjoyed the EU for years... they are having to move all their knowledge from the EU into a different realm and brace themselves to accept new continuity that overrides the old.

 Man.. Life really is hard as hell, ain't it?

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> Jacen, Jaina, and Mara

I'm going to vote NO because these names sound like trendy names given to US-born kids in the 90s and 2000s.

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Darth Lars said:

I think that a decision to rub out the existence of Mara Jade, Jacen, Jaina, Anakin Solo and Ben Skywalker would be a giant middle-finger to the Star Wars fan community.

 Making a movie that is based on stories millions and millions and millions of people have never read could be seen as a 'giant middle-finger' to the lovers of Star Wars moives.

OR we could just say it's a creative choice to try and make the best movie, and accept that nothing will please everyone.

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TheBoost said:


OR we could just say it's a creative choice to try and make the best movie, and accept that nothing will please everyone.

 Or to give us the first suspensful SW movie since 1983.  If they followed alot of the EU, then many fans would know the story (I believe Mara tried to kill Luke in the Thrawn Books?). 

The great thing about the ST is we know NOTHING, other then some rumors that we can take with a grain of salt.  We all knew where the PT was going to end, so we just speculated on how it would happen?  Now we are speculating on who, how, where, why, etc...  I love the fact that I have no idea what is going to happen in Episode 7 other then the fact that Luke, Leia, Han, Chewy, and R2 & C3PO are back. 

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I would like to see some of the better elements and concepts from the EU used along with new stories.

I am what all Jedi fear to become, and what all Sith wish to be. A GOD!

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TheBoost said:

Darth Lars said:

I think that a decision to rub out the existence of Mara Jade, Jacen, Jaina, Anakin Solo and Ben Skywalker would be a giant middle-finger to the Star Wars fan community.

 Making a movie that is based on stories millions and millions and millions of people have never read could be seen as a 'giant middle-finger' to the lovers of Star Wars moives.

OR we could just say it's a creative choice to try and make the best movie, and accept that nothing will please everyone.

CO said:

TheBoost said:


OR we could just say it's a creative choice to try and make the best movie, and accept that nothing will please everyone.

 Or to give us the first suspensful SW movie since 1983.  If they followed alot of the EU, then many fans would know the story (I believe Mara tried to kill Luke in the Thrawn Books?). 

The great thing about the ST is we know NOTHING, other then some rumors that we can take with a grain of salt.  We all knew where the PT was going to end, so we just speculated on how it would happen?  Now we are speculating on who, how, where, why, etc...  I love the fact that I have no idea what is going to happen in Episode 7 other then the fact that Luke, Leia, Han, Chewy, and R2 & C3PO are back. 

 /thread

If Plagueis shows up in the ST, not only will I refuse to watch the movies, but I won't so much as watch the trailers, either. - DuracellEnergizer

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CO said:

I think the fanbases you are talking about is the other way around.  Out of all of my friends who love SW, only 1 really has read the EU novels, as he has kinda filled me in through the years of the characters like Mara Jade, Han/Leia's twins, etc.

I know several fans who have floor-to-ceiling bookcases full of Star Wars books... There is a huge amount of books that share a continuity, starting with the Thrawn trilogy in 1992 (which introduced Mara Jade and set the EU going) up until only a year or two ago, right before Lucasfilms "Legends" announcement. That's twenty years of books! And it is not only books, but also video games, comic books and collectible figures within the same major continuity.

When I say "fan", I am talking about people who are real fans, not just people who like Star Wars. Practically everyone likes Star Wars, but not everyone is a fan. The fan community is so much larger than the OT-diehards on this forum who see Star Wars as being only the three original movies.

Every person that I know personally who I would classify as being a Star Wars fan has read at least one book in the post-ROTJ EU continuity. People know and like these characters. For example, in my local 501st Garrison alone, there is soon to be a third Mara Jade costumer.

Star Wars fans tend to buy not only books but a whole lot of other merchandise, and that has provided for a a significant portion of Lucasfilm's revenue in-between the movies.
That is why I say that I think that Lucasfilm would be disrespectful to the fans if they just ditched the post-ROTJ EU continuity outright.

TheBoost said:

 Making a movie that is based on stories millions and millions and millions of people have never read could be seen as a 'giant middle-finger' to the lovers of Star Wars moives.

Making a good movie for those who have not read any books and respecting the broad strokes of the post-ROTJ EU are not mutually exclusive.

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Darth Lars said:

I.e. people who are real Star Wars fans, not just people who think that the The Holy Original Trinitylogy rules all and bitch and moan about how everything else that is Star Wars isn't like the Star Wars of their childhood.

Don't you think you took things a little too far here? Couldn't you make your point without trying to insult the users of this forum?

"I'm a bigger Star Wars fan than you are!"-type pissing contests are pathetic, don't you think?

Here's how I feel about Star Wars:

    1. http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/ROTJ-is-the-best-Star-Wars-film-discuss/post/637326/#TopicPost637326

    2. http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/ROTJ-is-the-best-Star-Wars-film-discuss/post/637329/#TopicPost637329

My opinion hasn't changed and I have significantly less respect for the PT and EU. Do you want to rip me apart next? :-P

A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.

I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!

—Teams Jetrell Fo 1, Jetrell Fo 2, and Jetrell Fo 3