Should Han have died in RotJ?

Han dying probably would have hurt the movie a little, I’d argue. Even though Han has little utility outside of the first act, he does very much earn his happy ending with Leia. Han dying would make the end a little too dark for my tastes. Having Han die in between ROTJ and TFA would have been acceptable, with Harrison only making a cameo in either a flashback or Kylo’s visions.

My bigger complaint (and one that actually hurts the movie) is that Vader’s redemption is kind of rushed. It comes off as just a brief rumination, followed by a split-second decision to save his son. Drawing his internal debate out a bit more would make it feel more earned at the end. It’s also why splitting ROTJ into two movies might have improved the overall narrative (movie one being Jabba’s Palace and movie two being Endor), as there would be more time to explore Vader’s redemption.

I think Han instead of being Frozen he should have die in ESB being killed by Boba Fett his character would have closed in a good way but the problem is if Han died Vader redemption would be more difficult because Luke and Leia would not have forgiven that Han had died at the hands of the Empire if Han died i think we would not have seen Vader turn to the light side and he would have been still a Villain until Luke defeated him

Yes. Han’s death could have been the catalyst for Luke’s wailing on Vader (ie Luke sensing Han sacrificing himself during the final battle) - this would eliminate the need for a) Leia being the sister (which was ridiculous) and b) Lucas introducing Jedi ‘mind-reading’ (which was also ridiculous).

No. Killing people doesn’t automatically make the stakes that much higher. No member of the Fellowship dies in either Two Towers or Return of the King, but you’d have to be crazy to call those stories low stakes. Not to mention, the happy ending makes a lot of sense with the fairy tale thing Lucas was going for. There are other ways to improve ROTJ.

No that would be tonally wrong. There some issues in the movie, but I don’t think all of the darker ideas that were proposed would solve them.

Shopping Maul said:

Yes. Han’s death could have been the catalyst for Luke’s wailing on Vader (ie Luke sensing Han sacrificing himself during the final battle) - this would eliminate the need for a) Leia being the sister (which was ridiculous) and b) Lucas introducing Jedi ‘mind-reading’ (which was also ridiculous).

I do like that idea Han’s death could have been the catalyst for Luke’s wailing on Vader, definitely sits better with me too as a concept.

Sensing that Han had been lost in the battle could have made Luke’s turn to anger more “in the moment” and given more peril for other Rebels in that space fight.

I don’t think Han should have died in ROTJ.

The problem is that it was difficult to figure out what to do with his character after the rescue. They decided to throw him with the Endor ground team, but it often feels like he’s just along for the ride. But then, I guess the same could be said about Leia. The problem is, unlike the first two movies, post-Jabba ROTJ is the first time in Star Wars where the main characters’ involvement in the unfolding plot doesn’t exactly seem necessary. Like, why are Han and Leia specifically leading the Endor ground team? It could really be any senior Rebel doing this, and neither Han nor Leia have been established as “Seal Team Six” types. Luke, on the other hand, ends up doing something that only he specifically can do: confronting Vader.

This is unlike ANH and ESB, where each character is doing things specific to that character’s ongoing arc. In ANH, Han is a smuggler/criminal caught up in larger events, and Leia is a Senator secretly leading a Rebellion. In ESB Leia continues leading the Rebellion and Han is split between his old life and his new responsibilities. But in ROTJ, we’re just suddenly presented with some mission parameters by the Rebellion’s top brass, and for arbitrary reasons our beloved main characters are assigned arbitrary roles. (Why is Lando - who we’ve only found out even joined the Rebellion a few seconds ago - given a leading role in this critical mission? Something about the Battle of Taneb?)

A more natural use of the characters, given their previous history, would be for Leia to replace the role of Mon Mothma or Ackbar, for Han to lead the attack in the Falcon, and for Luke to lead the Endor ground team. Alternatively, it would also make sense for Luke to lead Rogue Squadron in the Endor space battle. But the problem is that it’s simply not feasible to write the story this way, because this would effectively remove Leia from most of the onscreen action, and it would separate the main cast even further. Plus, whatever role Luke is assigned, he needs to abandon at some point in order to go confront Vader. So it’s pretty difficult to find a way to satisfactorily position all the main cast given the parameters of the Battle of Endor, in a way that feels completely natural in-Universe but is also dramatically effective.

I think to really make it all work, the parameters of the Battle of Endor themselves would need to be reworked in some way. I feel like Han really should be in the Falcon, but then we need something for Lando to do. Maybe an entirely new subplot is required, like having Lando recruit a secondary fleet of smugglers or whatever. (Oh god that sounds like Rise of Skywalker, nevermind.)

Good points! And especially with Lando. It seems like Lando went off to Tatooine right at the end of ESB, so it makes you think he has been focused on rescuing Han this whole time. I think legends explained the Battle of Taanab being a battle between pirates and a planetary defense fleet that Lando led, unrelated to the rebellion. And his reputation from that battle gave the rebellion confidence in his leadership abilities. It may have made more sense if Lando’s role was deemphasized during the briefing, and he was just leading one fighter groups and not the entire fighter attack. Or don’t have him be labeled a “leader” at all for the attack, and Lando just falls into that roll as the battle plays out.

They could’ve emphasized that Han was using his smuggling skills to sneak the ground team onto the Endor moon. They could have even explained that Han himself paid for the clearance codes, using his criminal connections to procure them. And I do think having Han let Lando fly the Falcon also contributes to his character growth as well.

And I think Leia’s role could’ve been given more purpose if part of the rebels’ plan was to make contact with the natives, and they assigned Leia to that mission because of her diplomacy skills. Would’ve been the perfect role for her, especially since she has a universal translator as a companion. I already had the idea of having Leia be the one to save the gang from being eaten by the Ewoks rather than Luke using their superstitions to trick them. It could be interesting if the rebel briefing could be changed to establish that idea, rather than everyone just volunteering for what is arguably the most important mission of the entire war (being a little facetious about that of course!)

RogueLeader said:

They could’ve emphasized that Han was using his smuggling skills to sneak the ground team onto the Endor moon. They could have even explained that Han himself paid for the clearance codes, using his criminal connections to procure them. And I do think having Han let Lando fly the Falcon also contributes to his character growth as well.

Yeah, and this suggests all sorts of enticing possibilities if only there was more time or more movies. I mean, you could have an entire subplot about Han and Lando going on a mission to get those clearance codes from like Black Sun or whatever, which could easily fill half a movie. And I think this highlights another issue with ROTJ: it was hampered from the start, because it had the monumental task of satisfactorily wrapping up the whole saga, which includes rescuing Han, resolving the conflict with Vader, revealing the “other”, and overthrowing the Empire, all in about 2 hours! And Empire Strikes Back didn’t exactly leave us off with the sense that some final showdown between the Empire and Rebellion was immanent. Considering all this, it’s really a miracle ROTJ turned out as good as it did.

It would have been better treatment then he eventually got. At least he wouldn’t have regressed and spared us the indignancy of him losing the falcon.