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STAR WARS: EP V "REVISITED EDITION"ADYWAN - 12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW — Page 9

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What if Dagobah was crawling with guys named Yoda?
Yoda the butcher, Yoda the baker, Yoda the candlestick maker . . . Yoda the English teacher
Would that change your interpretation of "Yoda the JM" ?
Is Bob the only builder?

However, in practice you must take into account the “fuckwit factor”. Just talk to Darth Mallwalker…
-Moth3r

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you could just alter the pause so instead of

there you will learn from yoda ... the jedi master who instructed me

you'd have

there you will learn from yoda the jedi master ... who instructed me

or even just

there you will learn from yoda ... the jedi master.
skive hard, play hard
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Originally posted by: Erikstormtrooper
I'm gonna have to stick with Chrille on this one. As a bonafide grammar Nazi, I think changing it to "a Jedi Master" is preferable, if it can be done.


I too must agree.

For example, if I were to say Mr. Jones is the English teacher at such-and-such high school, it would seem I was saying he is the only one. If Mr. Jones was one of a few English teachers that taught at this particular school, it would be appropriate for me to say he was one of the English teachers that taught there rather the English teacher that taught there. The fact of the matter is that this is very often considered a "plot hole" in the saga. Even if we are content to stretch our imaginations and say that he was not technically claiming Yoda was the only one that had instructed him (and come on, it is pretty obvious George had originally intended Yoda to be THE instructor of Obi, I surely hope nobody still believes that ol' boy George had had Qui-gon planned to be the true master all along), the fact that so many people regard this as a plot hole seems like enough reason for the change without a second thought.

Also, you would think that if anyone were to be considered "THE Jedi master who instructed" Obi-Wan, it would be Qui-gon, since he was Obi-Wan's master. Yoda was more of a Jedi kindergarden teacher. The whole Yoda teaches the youngling thing really felt like it was a "quick fix" to the problem of "oh, crap, I totally forgot that Yoda was suppose to be Obi-Wan's master. Hmm, what it the best way to resolove that... these fans are a lot smarter than I thought... ah, I got it!" (don't think it is possible for George to forget such an important detail? What about when they had to go back and film a scene of Obi-Wan picking up Anakin's lightsaber because "they kinda forgot he gave it to Luke in A New Hope", that was a pretty important detail they managed to forget. How about Leia remembering her mother? I think it is pretty safe to say George didn't bother rewatching the Star Wars trilogy before setting out to write the PT).

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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Originally posted by: C3PX
Originally posted by: Erikstormtrooper
I'm gonna have to stick with Chrille on this one. As a bonafide grammar Nazi, I think changing it to "a Jedi Master" is preferable, if it can be done.


Also, you would think that if anyone were to be considered "THE Jedi master who instructed" Obi-Wan, it would be Qui-gon, since he was Obi-Wan's master. Yoda was more of a Jedi kindergarden teacher. The whole Yoda teaches the youngling thing really felt like it was a "quick fix" to the problem of "oh, crap, I totally forgot that Yoda was suppose to be Obi-Wan's master. Hmm, what it the best way to resolove that... these fans are a lot smarter than I thought... ah, I got it!" (don't think it is possible for George to forget such an important detail? What about when they had to go back and film a scene of Obi-Wan picking up Anakin's lightsaber because "they kinda forgot he gave it to Luke in A New Hope", that was a pretty important detail they managed to forget. How about Leia remembering her mother? I think it is pretty safe to say George didn't bother rewatching the Star Wars trilogy before setting out to write the PT).


You expose some very valid points there C3PX, and in light of that reasoning, indeed George went for a couple of quick fixes in Ep3 to avoid more continuity problems, in the end EP3 was the movie to supposedly end all continuity problems, I remember hearing/reading that the movie was for the fans because of this. I could go either way on this, if Adywan has enough time and is not too much I guess it could be fixed. I would rather be more interested in more AT-AT's, the window stormtrooper fix and the Emperor's holo-conversation part....hehe

"For over a thousand generations, the Jedi Knights were the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic. Before the dark times... before the Empire." - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"Now the Jedi are all but extinct" - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"I hate old times" - Batman to John Stewart, A Better World
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Originally posted by: professa skiving at work
you could just alter the pause so instead of

there you will learn from yoda ... the jedi master who instructed me

you'd have

there you will learn from yoda the jedi master ... who instructed me

or even just

there you will learn from yoda ... the jedi master.

Or:
There you will learn from yoda ... who instructed me
which sounds more like something you'd actually say ^^
(or you could rearrange the whole thing into [There you will learn from][the jedi master][Yoda][who instructed me])

But personally I don't think this line should be changed, you could try to make the "the" into an "a", but I doubt it can be done so easily (remember 'your father <-> I')

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Like I said, Lucas gave himself some wiggle room, if Kenobi had said "The only" there'd be more of a problem.
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One of my beefs with ESB was the giant wind vane in the center of Cloud City, or the window on the vane to be precise. After Luke gets blown out the window we see a wide angle exterior shot of the vane. It shows the window that Luke just got blown out of near the very top of the vane. This suggests that the entire carbon freezing facility is within the top of this thin vane. To me that seems both impractical from an engineering perspective and not believable visually. The carbon freezing chamber should be inside the city, not the vane. I would suggest moving the window and the balcony farther down on the vane so that they're both at a parallel level with the support arm which attaches the vane to the interior wall. The lighted tubular tunnel, that Luke walks through before he confronts Vader in front of the big window inside the vane, could be explained as the inside of that support arm.
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My biggest complaint about the ESB:SE is the new Vader/Emperor scene that Lucas fucked with, it doesn’t make sense anymore. I didn't mind replacing the old monkey/woman hologram with one of Ian McDiarmid or replacing Clive Revell's voice with McDiarmid's but I take great exception to the altered dialogue, it sucks. I believe I’ve figured out a way to fix this scene in ESB with minimal editing that preserves the original integrity it once had.

I’ve watched the entire Vader/Emperor scene in ESB very carefully, shot for shot, and below I’ve listed the differences in dialogue and camera angles between the original 1980 version and the 2004 DVD version. I’ve also listed my own recommended changes to the scene which I believe would make this part of the movie look much better and not look so ridiculous as it does at present.

Vader
-1980: What is thy bidding my master? (camera side view of Vader and Emperor)
-2004: dialogue and camera view unchanged

Emperor
-1980: There is a great disturbance in the force. (camera front view of Emperor)
-2004: dialogue and camera view unchanged

Vader
-1980: I have felt it. (camera front view of Vader kneeling)
-2004: dialogue unchanged (camera front view of Emperor)

Emperor
-1980: We have a new enemy, Luke Skywalker (camera front view of Vader kneeling)
-2004: We have a new enemy, (camera front view of Emperor) the young rebel who destroyed the Death Star. (camera front view of Vader from the shoulders up) I have no doubt this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker. (camera front view of Emperor)

Recommended Changes: Delete the underlined dialogue and camera views. These new lines add nothing and are just stupid. Vader and the Emperor obviously already know who Luke is. Use a camera view that’s facing Vader for the entire shot while the Emperor is speaking so we don’t notice the cuts.

Vader
-1980: Yes, my master. (camera side view of Vader and Emperor)
-2004: How is that possible? (camera view unchanged)

Recommended Changes: Delete the underlined dialogue and restore the original dialogue from 1980. Again this new line is just retarded. Vader definitely knows Luke is his son and even speaks Luke’s name at the start of the film when the Empire finds the Rebel base on Hoth.

Emperor
-1980: He could destroy us. (camera side view of Vader and Emperor)
-2004: Search your feelings, Lord (camera side view of Vader and Emperor) Vader, you will know it to be true. (camera front view of Vader kneeling) He could destroy us. (camera front view of Emperor)

Recommended Changes: Delete the underlined dialogue and camera views. Same explanation as before, the new lines are unnecessary and don’t make any sense.

Vader
-1980: He’s just a boy. Obi-Wan can no longer help him. (camera front view of Vader kneeling)
-2004: dialogue unchanged (camera front view of Vader from the shoulders up)

Emperor
-1980: The force is strong with him. The son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi. (camera front view of Emperor)
-2004: dialogue and camera view unchanged

Vader
-1980: If he could be turned, he would become a powerful ally. (camera front view of Vader from the shoulders up)
-2004: dialogue and camera view unchanged

Emperor
-1980: Yes (camera front view of Vader from the shoulders up), yes, he would be a great asset (camera front view of Emperor). Can it be done? (camera side view of Vader and Emperor)
-2004: Yes (camera front view of Vader from the shoulders up) , yes, he would be a great asset. (camera view unchanged) Can it be done? (camera view unchanged)

Recommended Changes: Add the underlined dialogue and camera view so this shot more resembles the original. I'm sure McDiarmid has said 'yes' several times throughout the saga.

Vader
-1980: He will join us or die (camera side view of Vader and Emperor) master. (camera front view of Vader bowing)
-2004: dialogue and camera views unchanged

These are just my opinions of course, but I think most will agree this greatly improves the screwup that Lucas did to this part of ESB.
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You have almost got it word for word with what i will be doing with that scene. The only thing really different is this line:
-2004: We have a new enemy, (camera front view of Emperor) the young rebel who destroyed the Death Star. (camera front view of Vader from the shoulders up) I have no doubt this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker. (camera front view of Emperor)

I will be changing this line to just "young Skywalker". I would have preferred it to be "Luke Skywalker" but no where in the saga does the Emperor say "Luke"

As for the vane it is a bit of a design flaw. I think that Luke was supposed to have reached there through the long tunnel but they put the support pole in the wrong position on the matte which caused confusion. A small tweak to the matte should be able to fix this.

The Obi-Wan line about Yoda i would prefer to keep this as it is. I don't want to have to changed much in the OT just because of the mess that the POT caused. I have some plans to fix this error in the PT and not have OBi-Wan as Qui-Gon's padawan but instead have Yopa call Obi-Wan his padawan in some instances in TPM or maybe just omit the whole padawan thing with Obi-Wan altogether

ANH:REVISITED
ESB:REVISITED

DONATIONS TOWARDS MATERIALS FOR THE REVISITED SAGA

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I'm glad to hear that you've already made the changes, Adywan, thanks for listening. I'm also glad your leaving Kenobi's dialogue alone. I'm constantly dumbfounded how many people want to make drastic changes to the OT so it's more in line with the PT. The PT is the fucked up trilogy, not the OT. If drastic changes are going to be made to the story, they should be made to the PT so it flows more evenly with the OT.
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Originally posted by: adywan

As for the vane it is a bit of a design flaw. I think that Luke was supposed to have reached there through the long tunnel but they put the support pole in the wrong position on the matte which caused confusion. A small tweak to the matte should be able to fix this.


The OT is full of design flaws, just look at the Falcon and you'll see what I mean, the door doesn't add up, besides it has 2 boarding docking doors at each side which are never used, and the Tantive IV is another example...but we have learned to live with it

I have some plans to fix this error in the PT and not have OBi-Wan as Qui-Gon's padawan but instead have Yopa call Obi-Wan his padawan in some instances in TPM or maybe just omit the whole padawan thing with Obi-Wan altogether


Wow, I never thought someone else though about that, I always thought that Obi-Wan should have been a knight/master at the start of TPM and Qui-Gon either be a friend he went to Naboo with or ran into at the temple and make the story of Obi-wan in the PT flow more accurately with what he says in RoTJ: "when I first knew him he was already a great pilot.....I took it upon myself to train him as a Jedi" if we picture this line disregarding the PT, it would appear that Obi-wan met a young hot-shot pilot (18 or 20 years old) in one of his adventures and and was impressed with Anakin's ability and Force attunement, and he "took it upon himself" to train him disregarding what Yoda said, which in turn makes him more like Qui-Gon in certain ways. If we follow this train of thought the rebelious "hot shot" attitude of *that* Anakin would make him more suitable to the phrase "Vader was seduced by the dark side" as in Anakin would exhibit rebelious and adventure-seeking behavior and be seduced by the promise of more power. This scenario makes it difficult for Padme to appear as well as other things in the current PT, but makes the whole saga flow as a whole, without white lies and racionalizations.

Anyway, sorry for being sidetracked, Adywan I dunno the full extent of the changes you are trying to improve on TPM, and how hard would they be...I can only take EP4 as a proof that you could do them without problem, best of luck.

"For over a thousand generations, the Jedi Knights were the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic. Before the dark times... before the Empire." - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"Now the Jedi are all but extinct" - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"I hate old times" - Batman to John Stewart, A Better World
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Originally posted by: adywan

The Obi-Wan line about Yoda i would prefer to keep this as it is. I don't want to have to changed much in the OT just because of the mess that the POT caused. I have some plans to fix this error in the PT and not have OBi-Wan as Qui-Gon's padawan but instead have Yopa call Obi-Wan his padawan in some instances in TPM or maybe just omit the whole padawan thing with Obi-Wan altogether


Awesome! Tweaks to the PT are always preferable over tweaks to the OT, glad to hear this little issue is going to be addressed in the over all scheme of things.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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I'm glad to hear that you've already made the changes, Adywan, thanks for listening. I'm also glad your leaving Kenobi's dialogue alone. I'm constantly dumbfounded how many people want to make drastic changes to the OT so it's more in line with the PT. The PT is the fucked up trilogy, not the OT. If drastic changes are going to be made to the story, they should be made to the PT so it flows more evenly with the OT.

Changing "the" to "a" it not a drastic change. It's just one word.

But I know what you mean otherwise. When possible, the PT should be altered instead of the OT. Of course, in this case changing TPM instead will mean one hell of a lot more of work for adywan than just changing one word. But if he's cool with that, I'm fine either way.

Wow, I never thought someone else though about that, I always thought that Obi-Wan should have been a knight/master at the start of TPM and Qui-Gon either be a friend he went to Naboo with or ran into at the temple and make the story of Obi-wan in the PT flow more accurately with what he says in RoTJ: "when I first knew him he was already a great pilot.....I took it upon myself to train him as a Jedi" if we picture this line disregarding the PT, it would appear that Obi-wan met a young hot-shot pilot (18 or 20 years old) in one of his adventures and and was impressed with Anakin's ability and Force attunement, and he "took it upon himself" to train him disregarding what Yoda said, which in turn makes him more like Qui-Gon in certain ways. If we follow this train of thought the rebelious "hot shot" attitude of *that* Anakin would make him more suitable to the phrase "Vader was seduced by the dark side" as in Anakin would exhibit rebelious and adventure-seeking behavior and be seduced by the promise of more power. This scenario makes it difficult for Padme to appear as well as other things in the current PT, but makes the whole saga flow as a whole, without white lies and racionalizations.


Anakin couldn't have been 18-20, because Luke was roughtly that age in ESB according to Yoda, and Yoda called him "too old to begin the training". That means that even in the OT, Jedi were envisoned to start their traning at a fearly young age. Probably no older than 15 at the very least.

Lucas's first story ideas for The Phantom Menace included Obi-Wan finding Anakin on Tatooine. Qui-Gon was a Jedi friend that Obi-Wan met later at Coruscant. Lucas apparantly disregarded this plot idea because he didn't want the young Anakin to se Obi-Wan as a father figure, since they are more like brothers. Qui-Gon then stepped in to become Anakin's "father" for a brief period.

Even though I like the idea of Qui-Gon finding Anakin, I must say that I would prefer if Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan were friends in TPM rather than Master/Padawan. It could be sort of like Obi-Wan and Anakin's friendship in ROTS.

But ady has a lot of work to do if he wants to do this. All refernces to Obi-Wan being a padawan, getting knighted by Yoda, every single time he calls Qui-Gon "master" (which is a lot) needs to be edited out of the movie for this idea to work. But I must admit it is very interesting.

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Originally posted by: adywan
You have almost got it word for word with what i will be doing with that scene. The only thing really different is this line:
-2004: We have a new enemy, (camera front view of Emperor) the young rebel who destroyed the Death Star. (camera front view of Vader from the shoulders up) I have no doubt this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker. (camera front view of Emperor)

I will be changing this line to just "young Skywalker". I would have preferred it to be "Luke Skywalker" but no where in the saga does the Emperor say "Luke"


I have a vague recollection that in one of the exclusive bonus disc (The music of Star Wars or something like that) Ian McDermaid did say Luke Skywalker in one of the segue dialogs. I may be wrong, but a friend of mine had the disc and I only say it one. Plus the tone and inclination of that particular "Luke" might not work. But maybe its something to check into.
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Originally posted by: Gorilla
One of my beefs with ESB was the giant wind vane in the center of Cloud City, or the window on the vane to be precise. After Luke gets blown out the window we see a wide angle exterior shot of the vane. It shows the window that Luke just got blown out of near the very top of the vane. This suggests that the entire carbon freezing facility is within the top of this thin vane. To me that seems both impractical from an engineering perspective and not believable visually. The carbon freezing chamber should be inside the city, not the vane. I would suggest moving the window and the balcony farther down on the vane so that they're both at a parallel level with the support arm which attaches the vane to the interior wall. The lighted tubular tunnel, that Luke walks through before he confronts Vader in front of the big window inside the vane, could be explained as the inside of that support arm.


Apparently you don't have or seen the INSIDE THE WORLDS of SW book (COMPLETE LOCATIONS), which has cut-aways of this very place and it lines up well with what is seen in the movie!


And I also don't get what you guys have against Papatine's hologram saying "Anakin Skywalker" .
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Anakin couldn't have been 18-20, because Luke was roughtly that age in ESB according to Yoda, and Yoda called him "too old to begin the training". That means that even in the OT, Jedi were envisoned to start their traning at a fearly young age. Probably no older than 15 at the very least.

Lucas's first story ideas for The Phantom Menace included Obi-Wan finding Anakin on Tatooine. Qui-Gon was a Jedi friend that Obi-Wan met later at Coruscant. Lucas apparantly disregarded this plot idea because he didn't want the young Anakin to se Obi-Wan as a father figure, since they are more like brothers. Qui-Gon then stepped in to become Anakin's "father" for a brief period.

Even though I like the idea of Qui-Gon finding Anakin, I must say that I would prefer if Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan were friends in TPM rather than Master/Padawan. It could be sort of like Obi-Wan and Anakin's friendship in ROTS.


If we are in the field of hypothesis then maybe Yoda could've said "too old" since that mistake was taking a 18-20 year old Anakin and doesn't want the same thing to happen again with Luke. But while Jedi could have been like a school from what we hear in th OT, in the PT they are portrayed as *stealing* (or taking or asking) babies from their families in a much earlier age in a more religious manner. Obi-Wan is the quintessential father figure to Luke, it could have been like they are in AOTC or ROTS. As you say it would be interesting, but that level of editing I guess it would be PRETTY hard to accomplish....is almost like making a brand new movie.
"For over a thousand generations, the Jedi Knights were the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic. Before the dark times... before the Empire." - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"Now the Jedi are all but extinct" - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"I hate old times" - Batman to John Stewart, A Better World
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. As you say it would be interesting, but that level of editing I guess it would be PRETTY hard to accomplish....is almost like making a brand new movie.

I agree with the last part of this quote.....the making a brand new movie part.......hey I greatly respect all that Adywan is doing here, especially his intentions of not changing the movies, just fixing some issues tastefully, etc., and all of your opinions on how you wish the saga would have been created, with respect to OB-1/Yoda/Anakin.....but the fact of the matter is that Qui-gon was OB-1's immediate master.....not Yoda. This according to the final decisions made by Lucas.......so although many of you may dislike old George.......please......let's not start changing storylines just to fix some of the unclarity of the OT. All in all I know these edits are for you, and you alone Adywan, so do what you want, but I just wanted to express that I'm not a fan of changing the storyline. Just an opinion, and either way, I can't wait to have the OT revisited DVD's!! Peace
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People, One of the first lines spoken by Obi-Wan in EP1 was implying Yoda had taught Obi-Wan in the past. Remember "But Master Yoda said I should be mindful of the future." Just because He was apprentice to Qui-Gon for over a decade does not negate that Yoda had given training and instruction before, during and after Qui-Gon's death.
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http://www.mooncostumes.com/image/5376
Ok, who's ready to talk about lines from Star Wars!!!!


This thread is starting to embarass me.








OK, rant over.
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Originally posted by: Sluggo


This thread is starting to embarass me.


OK, rant over.


LOL! @ Sluggo...



I was wondering if my suggestion about lightcasting light sabers in ESB was doable.


http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/9039/5406906km1.jpg
Original casting no light.

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/9247/5406906copybn7.jpg
How it may look like with light sabers casting light.

Thanks.

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/7906/lando62copywu5.th.jpg

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Originally posted by: Sluggo

Ok, who's ready to talk about lines from Star Wars!!!!


I'd just as soon kiss a Wookie!

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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I really don't think there's anything wrong with the new SE emperor conversation. I think the line 'I doubt he is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker' really emphasizes the gap between the PT and the OT. About the 'young rebel that destroyed the death star' line, I think it should be changed to 'young padawan.' What they did know about Luke at the time is that he was a young padawan... I'm not sure how they managed to know what his name is yet. There is no reference to this... e.g. when Vader tells Luke that he is his father, how should he know Luke's name? Did he sense it with the force? It's confusing. I also think that the line 'the son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi' should be changed to 'the young padawan must not become a jedi,' since they still are not sure if Luke is Darth Vader's son at the time.
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Originally posted by: sgdelta1771
... I think the line 'I doubt he is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker' really emphasizes the gap between the PT and the OT. ...



I hate to be picky....well, actually, I love to be picky...but, the line is "I have no doubt this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker"

Star Wars Episode XXX: Erica Strikes Back

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I hate to be picky....well, actually, I love to be picky...but, the line is "I have no doubt this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker"

Umm... right.
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Some saber light could be nice for mood lighting. I think I'd like to see a clip in motion before I made up my mind.