Sign In

Revenge of the Sith (The New Canon Cut) [DRAFT AVAILABLE] — Page 18

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Should I just make two versions for that change?

Would be easier if more people hated it.

Author
Time

I like all the extra dialogue in the opening scenes (apart from the added laugh when R2 appears during the ray shield trap). Having watched most of TCW very recently the two of them never shut up 😄, it’s constant banter in almost any situation. That fit well when you did your edit of the opening as if it were a TCW episode.

I’m ambivalent towards any of the Kashyyk stuff. If it wasn’t necessary for Yoda I wouldn’t even notice if it was dropped from the film. I’ve always felt it breaks the tone of the film up a bit too much.

By the point Anakin arrives late to the briefing wouldn’t Ahsoka already have captured Maul rather than just having arrived on Mandalore?

Leave out ‘What have I done?’, I think it’s right that the different voice can be interpreted as internal thoughts.

The added dialogue of ‘Luke’s Father Wanted Him To Have This, When He Was Old Enough’ is still quite difficult to hear. I can make most of it out but the transition from ‘how old were you when…’ to ‘I want to have our baby…’ is quite abrupt as the second line is much louder.

You already know my thoughts on Mustafar, any additions or removals you can make to make Padmé a character with agency and her own agenda is welcome.

I don’t know how much you want to be influenced by TCW episodes that never made it to production but series 6 and 7 and deleted arcs involving Yoda and the Bad Batch on Kashyyk so would indicate a Republic presence even before Kai-Adi and MAce agree they need to send an attack group there (maybe add ‘another’ attack group), the other was Padmé returning to Man Cala where she was basically working with the Quarren senator to act against Palpatine, leading into her Rise of the Rebellion’ stuff in your version of RotS. She’s already made her childhood friend Palps into an enemy which puts Anakin, retroactively, being pulled between Palps, Padmé, and the Jedi, meaning both Obi-Wan and Padmé are working off slightly different angles on Mustafar.

On the fence about: Fully removing the scene with Mace/Yoda/Obi-Wan.
I say don’t. The fact Yoda and Mace are happy to create a council within a council is reminiscent of Ahsoka’s trial where it was done with only 5 members and not the full lot, and also they are the main three who are following the whole Sidious and the origins of the clone army plot from TCW series 6.

On the fence about: Leaning towards keeping original “Don’t lecture me Obi-Wan” because I can definitely see how “You weren’t there” doesn’t work seamlessly.
I like both. The former plays into Anakins insecurities about not being a master and being Obi-Wan’s padawan and not his friend, but he latter works towards how isolated Anakin is feeling.

As for the colour grade, RotS has always been one of the best looking SW films that never got damaged as much as it got transferred between mediums. It has some issues where whites look tan and greys look blue and a lot of busy elements in places. I don’t think a full regrade would work for RotS, I think it’d have to be taken scene by scene to sort out. Comparer how blue the interior of the Invisible Hand is in RotS to the CIS ships in TCW and how busy the bridge looks compared to the ones in TCW.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Artan42 said:
By the point Anakin arrives late to the briefing wouldn’t Ahsoka already have captured Maul rather than just having arrived on Mandalore?

I don’t think so, she hadn’t even had her second confrontation with Maul by the time Anakin had gotten his assignment and Obi-Wan was departing for Utapau. Remember, she and Obi-Wan are interrupted by the attack where Maul captures Jesse.

Leave out ‘What have I done?’, I think it’s right that the different voice can be interpreted as internal thoughts.

In this WIP clip, I toyed with idea of Hayden’s “What have I done?” as something Yoda hears. Rogue was right in saying that it’s fun to see instances of the film in TCW and vice versa, so maybe this is a way to have the line still happen in both; Yoda and Ahsoka both hear his internal doubt, but it’s nothing Anakin says out loud, or anything he feels early on in his decision.

The added dialogue of ‘Luke’s Father Wanted Him To Have This, When He Was Old Enough’ is still quite difficult to hear. I can make most of it out but the transition from ‘how old were you when…’ to ‘I want to have our baby…’ is quite abrupt as the second line is much louder.

Hm, this is another one that’s difficult for me. Not only do the new lines sound about at level with the theatrical lines (or at least quieter than them in the way they should be) to me, the waveforms are working out as well, and no one else is telling me this. (which, pls step forward if it does).

As for the colour grade, RotS has always been one of the best looking SW films that never got damaged as much as it got transferred between mediums. It has some issues where whites look tan and greys look blue and a lot of busy elements in places. I don’t think a full regrade would work for RotS, I think it’d have to be taken scene by scene to sort out. Comparer how blue the interior of the Invisible Hand is in RotS to the CIS ships in TCW and how busy the bridge looks compared to the ones in TCW.

I think ultimately I’m leaning towards not even grading it. I always say I’m going to get around to putting effort into one real grade with the final cut to work with, but I’ve been putting off finalizing anything forever. So most people already liking how the theatrical looks takes some of the stress off honestly; I don’t have to do anything.

Personally, it does and doesn’t work for me. It does look better than the other prequels, especially as far as BD transfer goes - but it’s still that look, if you know what I mean. My efforts to grade it were in pursuit of how I remember it looking as TV Spots I recorded on VHS in excitement. The pre-release stills in storybooks or released online… This warmer early 2000’s look that just feels right - more cinematic - to the kid in me.

I know that doesn’t mean anything as far as tying it into The Clone Wars (which is why I won’t do it anymore), but we all edit under hypothetical circumstances don’t we? The Clone Wars would still have been released after this in my mind palace/alternate reality, so the show’s nature as primarily a kids cartoon was what would have given the show its more neutered look and feel. Initially, I did feel like TCW could be a more childish take on the prequels, and I wanted the film to feel like an elevation of that material. Not just in storyline, but execution. The humanity Ani/Obi don’t even go all the way in showing in the show as more prevalent, the look more cinematic, etc.

Siege of Mandalore blows this out of the water any way you look at it though, so I don’t quite agree with that sentiment anymore.


Since I posted this in Delpheas’s thread, here’s Dooku’s beheading.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

How has your ideas for the ordering of the edit changed (if they’ve changed at all) since all four parts of the Clone Wars finale have been released?

Author
Time

Aside from tweaking the Yoda/Obi-Wan/Mace deleted scene, no.

Author
Time

I’d second the volume in the lightsaber-baby conversation. Those lines sound quieter to me than the rest of the conversation, but not by too much.

Also, this is a minor thing, but I still hear a bit of the Tusken Raiders’ cries during Anakin and Palpatine’s talk after Dooku’s death.

Author
Time

The Clone Wars finale does have me wondering if it’s worth it to alter Ayla Secura’s death somehow? Her’s has always felt the weakest of the ones in the montage, and with Ahsoka’s Order 66 survival in the canon now, Ayla’s death feels even worse now. It would probably throw off the rythm of the music, but if her death could happen even faster with less time for her to realise what was going on, it might help.

PT: CoD/TAS/TCW/FotR(NCC)
OT: Reimagined/Revisited/…
ST: Starlight/Rekindled/Resurgence

Author
Time

Have you done anything with Grevious’ line, “You fool! I’ve been trained in your ‘Jedi arts’ by Count Dooku!” given that he and Obi-Wan had many duels prior their fight on Utapau?

Author
Time

I think that I’d the one that now goes “Kenobi? Not Skywalker? How disappointing.”

PT: CoD/TAS/TCW/FotR(NCC)
OT: Reimagined/Revisited/…
ST: Starlight/Rekindled/Resurgence

Author
Time

Watched this for the first time the other night and wanted to say how impressed I was with it and give a couple of suggestions to help it get even better.

Like another poster, I had a couple audio issues related to the Anakin/Padme scene discussing the lightsaber. I love the new dialogue, but it seems significantly quieter than the rest of the scene. Same goes for much of the added comm chatter in the opening battle. All great additions, but at times difficult to understand.

Basically everything that relates to Padme in this is fantastic. Padme’s story in ROTS never sat right with me. She was so assertive in the previous two films, but in III she seemed to take a back seat as all most of her scenes were removed from the final cut. Anakin and Padme felt more like themselves with your edits. Great work. Even the cringey dialogue about love blinding Anakin actually feels kind of cute when it is preceded by them joking around with. That being said, in your “anger management” edit, Anakin’s response is too quick. If possible, there should be more of a beat between Padme’s question and Anakin’s ‘It’s nothing.’

Additional time to breath could be useful throughout the edit actually. Many transitions feel a bit too rushed. I’m not sure if its a stylistic choice or a necessary by-product of the way you have had to cut certain scenes, but it was a bit jarring at times. For example, in the original cut of the film there is a far longer shot of the cityscape before we narrow in on Anakin and Padme on the balcony. In your cut the transition from Kashyyk into this scene removes most of that shot, but I think adding it back in would help the film feel less crowded. Speaking of transitions though, your fade to black after the opera scene was superb. It’s a great dramatic pause.

Finally, the final duel between Anakin and Obi-Wan felt far too silent. I know my opinion on this probably differs from most because I have come to love the silliness of the dialogue in ROTS, but I really missed having Anakin reply to Obi Wan with “I should have known the Jedi were plotting to take over.” Having Anakin just stand there silently as Obi Wan speaks to him felt awkward. Without his replies to keep momentum going, the segment just goes on too long. But moreover, because of the edits you’ve made I actually think this line makes more sense than it does in the original cut. Originally Anakin’s “point of view” sounds totally absurd, but with the changes you have made to his motivations and the extra context of the clone wars, I think Anakin’s conclusion that the Jedi were attempting to overthrow the chancellor makes sense. The line is made far less silly when your edit shows Mace, Yoda, and Obi Wan explicitly consider arresting the chancellor.

Anyway, these were just a couple of my thoughts. I really enjoy what you have done with this film. It’s amazing how much Hayden’s performance can be improved with the addition of just a few giggles. Can’t wait to see how this project develops in the wake of the Clone Wars finale.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

I’m absolutely loving this edit! I just have a few issues.
Watching some of the clips again, I think Anakin’s “Whoa-hoho!” line (during the Battle of Coruscant scene when him and Obi-Wan are evading a group of missiles) felt weird. I don’t know if it was Matt Lanter’s voice, but all I know is that it didn’t sound like Hayden Christensen, so I couldn’t tell who exclaimed that line when I first watched the clip.
I know you’re trying to blend Matt with Hayden in more ways than one, but I just don’t think it works here.

I can’t seem to figure out what Anakin says after he jumps back into the elevator. (The line before Obi-Wan says, “Oh, it’s you!”) I guess you could either up the volume on it, or just cut it entirely. If you do the latter, I think the scene would be completely fine without it. You already have lots of good Obi and Anakin banter edited in, so getting rid of the line wouldn’t affect what you’re shooting for at all.

If you added laughter when R2 zooms into the hallway where Obi, Anakin, and the Chancellor are stuck in the ray shield, I can’t completely tell if it’s laughter upon first watching the scene. Since R2’s scream is so loud, and the fact that the whole banter/bit about patience is already being played for laughs (some people may chuckle and not even hear the added laugter) and the banter is akin to Anakin acting like a brother to Obi-Wan (essentially saying “Bro. R2 knows what he’s doing. Just trust him. He’ll be here in no time to set us free.”), I think the laughter should just be removed. The laughter doesn’t really add anything and almost just feels like a laugh track (and frankly, the laughter doesn’t make much sense in the moment since Anakin is being semi-serious towards Obi.) Just my opinion.

Anakin’s “Show’s over!” line when he fetches his lightsaber from Grevious could use a slight increase in volume.

Again, great stuff. I’d love to show this to a friend in place of the original Revenge of the Sith when I finish showing him all of Clone Wars!

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Heard, on the baby talk. I’ll tweak it.

Delpheas said:

I think that I’d the one that now goes “Kenobi? Not Skywalker? How disappointing.”

Nah, that’s earlier. What they’re referring to, I just straight up cut out everything after “You fool…”

Y3ldarb said:
Watching some of the clips again, I think Anakin’s “Whoa-hoho!” line (during the Battle of Coruscant scene when him and Obi-Wan are evading a group of missiles) felt weird. I don’t know if it was Matt Lanter’s voice, but all I know is that it didn’t sound like Hayden Christensen, so I couldn’t tell who exclaimed that line when I first watched the clip.

It’s actually Hayden himself. xP

Also, I can’t seem to figure out what Anakin says after he jumps back into the elevator. (The line before Obi-Wan says, “Oh, it’s you!”) I guess you could either up the volume on it, or just cut it entirely. If you’d do the latter, I think the scene would be completely fine without it. You already have lots of good Obi and Anakin banter edited in, so getting rid of the line wouldn’t affect what you’re shooting for at all.

“Good view from up there.”

I know I overdo it sometimes, so I’m still trying to find a balance - but Ani/Obi in TCW almost never shut up together lmao. Maybe it was just me, but I found that keeping Hayden mostly quiet in any scene during this opening subconsciously brought me back to the original portrayal. Anakin is a confident outgoing jock in The Clone Wars, while Hayden naturally has this more reserved, sullen edge that comes through when he isn’t speaking. I gave him a lot of extra one-liners and laughter to facilitate the change in personality. Overcompensating so that he feels the way he does in TCW every time he needs to.

Lastly, if you added laughter when R2 zooms into the hallway where Obi, Anakin, and the Chancellor are stuck in the ray shield, I can’t completely tell if it’s laughter. Since R2’s scream is so loud, and the fact that the whole banter/bit about patience is already being played for laughs (some people may chuckle and not even hear the added laugter) and the banter is akin to Anakin acting like a brother to Obi-Wan (essentially saying “Bro. R2 knows what he’s doing. Just trust him. He’ll be here in no time to set us free.”), I think the laughter should just be removed. The laughter doesn’t really add anything (and frankly, doesn’t make much sense in the moment since Anakin is being semi-serious towards Obi.) Just my opinion.

And this is another example of how I’m compensating for Hayden v Lanter.

I actually agree that the comedic scenario in which Obi-Wan is unconvinced and Anakin isn’t is already kinda funny, but I deliberately sacrificed it to portray Obi-Wan as trusting of Anakin and his judgement. The original leaned too close to Obi-Wan’s chiding of him in AotC; I felt having them laugh together is a contrast to that.

This could all be a personal issue on my part, though.

PierreDelec2 said:
Finally, the final duel between Anakin and Obi-Wan felt far too silent. I know my opinion on this probably differs from most because I have come to love the silliness of the dialogue in ROTS, but I really missed having Anakin reply to Obi Wan with “I should have known the Jedi were plotting to take over.” Having Anakin just stand there silently as Obi Wan speaks to him felt awkward. Without his replies to keep momentum going, the segment just goes on too long. But moreover, because of the edits you’ve made I actually think this line makes more sense than it does in the original cut. Originally Anakin’s “point of view” sounds totally absurd, but with the changes you have made to his motivations and the extra context of the clone wars, I think Anakin’s conclusion that the Jedi were attempting to overthrow the chancellor makes sense. The line is made far less silly when your edit shows Mace, Yoda, and Obi Wan explicitly consider arresting the chancellor.

Anyway, these were just a couple of my thoughts. I really enjoy what you have done with this film. It’s amazing how much Hayden’s performance can be improved with the addition of just a few giggles. Can’t wait to see how this project develops in the wake of the Clone Wars finale.

This was actually a change I was going to try and put on whatever I release next, or the final version. But I was going to remove “I should have known…” and “From my point of view…” so that they’re more firm stances Anakin is taking. It feels more stubborn and in that sense, more grasping for justification, than a misguided sense of enlightenment.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

It’s actually Hayden himself. xP

Oh wow. Haha. Did you get that line from another movie of his? I don’t know why it sounds just a tad bit off. I think it’s the quality of it and the fact it’s literally played right after another line of his. So you end up hearing the difference. And I think it sounds like the line fades in a little bit at the very beginning.
There’s something about it and I can’t put my finger on it. Don’t get me wrong… it’s a great line and honestly I changed my mind and love that you put it in the movie. It just sounds… different.

Anyways, do you have a link for the full cut so I can download it? Even if it’s a rough cut / not final at the moment.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Some more experimentation.

Tried some alternate dialogue instead of silent nodding to replace Yoda’s reused lines in the Windu/Obi/Yoda deleted scene
Not super sure about this but I prefer lines there to nothing. Anything to justify why we saw that minute long piece of a conversation.

Testing an alternate exchange in pre-duel sequence
As sure about this one as I was with “You weren’t there,” which isn’t much (probably more) - but I actually like the context this one creates more than that one - technical stuff aside. ¯\(ツ)/¯ (again, Padme shot credited to the wonderful snooker)

Author
Time

Secret meeting:

I think the silent nodding in the workprint is fine as is, though this isn’t bad either.

If you weren’t trying to keep this scene and the war council from being redundant/contradicting clone wars, what would you keep or change?

Pre-Duel:

This is really nice. I think you’re right, it makes the context stronger. If you can make it work without the echo it’ll be real nice.

PT: CoD/TAS/TCW/FotR(NCC)
OT: Reimagined/Revisited/…
ST: Starlight/Rekindled/Resurgence

Author
Time

NFBisms said:

Some more experimentation.

Tried some alternate dialogue instead of silent nodding to replace Yoda’s reused lines in the Windu/Obi/Yoda deleted scene
Not super sure about this but I prefer lines there to nothing. Anything to justify why we saw that minute long piece of a conversation.

Testing an alternate exchange in pre-duel sequence
As sure about this one as I was with “You weren’t there,” which isn’t much (probably more) - but I actually like the context this one creates more than that one - technical stuff aside. ¯\(ツ)/¯ (again, Padme shot credited to the wonderful snooker)

For the first one I think I preferred the nodding. Sometimes words aren’t needed. Both human actors have good enough body language that you can buy their contemplation of the treason they’re suggesting.

For the second one, I’d say it’s near perfect. The volume balancing of the new lines is good, the dialogue flows nicely, and it builds up to a lightsabres drawn fight, rather than starting off with Anakin massively aggressive.

One thing that I have an issue with in the original is Obi-Wan’s line ‘You have allowed this dark lord to twist your mind until now, until now you have become the very thing you swore to destroy’. I think the second ‘until now’ is overly theatrical and not really in keeping with how short the other dialogue is. Even in the original, the phrases are short and to the point, but that line is just a bit over the top.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

I enjoy the new exchange and I agree that “What did you tell her?” fits much better in tone than “YOU WEREN’T THERE” did previously. I didn’t notice last time that you VFX’d Obi-Wan so his saber ignites second; it’s nice and subtly done.

Author
Time

When Yoda says “War” it sounds a bit overtly sentence-mixy. Not sure if there’s another take you could use.

I think the JAT line “Face up to what you’ve done” sticks out. Maybe you could pitch it down a bit or something?

Author
Time
 (Edited)

I gave that a shot, as well as maybe removing “Please”
I was always iffy on the JAT line myself, but it didn’t seem to matter to untrained ears which is how it made it this far. And so many choices I’ve made since have worked off of that line in particular working.

sade1212 said:
I didn’t notice last time that you VFX’d Obi-Wan so his saber ignites second; it’s nice and subtly done.

Yeah, I figured that was essential to really shifting everyone’s motivations. I was hoping someone would help me out with it, but I guess it’s fine as it is?

Author
Time
 (Edited)

The saber ignition switch seems natural, basically unnoticeable unless you’re looking for it.

And the JAT line does sound better pitched down and without the please. I also didn’t know it was a JAT line, I thought it was some Ewan line sourced from somewhere.

PT: CoD/TAS/TCW/FotR(NCC)
OT: Reimagined/Revisited/…
ST: Starlight/Rekindled/Resurgence

Author
Time
 (Edited)

The new JAT line might sound a little bit more natural with a shorter span between “Anakin” and “Face up…”, but I agree it’s already pretty good the way it is now.

Personally I could go either way regarding the secret council scene. I feel the silent Yoda ending flows better, but the added line justifies his support for the idea, making Yoda seem more reluctant about it.

Author
Time

Can you send me a link so I can watch?

Author
Time

I absolutely love the full edit. Especially the beginning scene. The added dialogue and laughing just makes it better and makes Anakin’s fall to the dark side more tragic.
I have a nitpick though: In the balcony scene, in one of the added lines, “I mean he’s gotta learn how to stand up for himself and not be pushed around.”, the word “around” sounds like it’s being spoken by Owen Wilson. I like the whole dialogue about giving their son a lightsaber since it’s like a fan-added easter egg, but the word “around” takes me out of it and makes me notice it’s a dubbed line.

Author
Time

NFBisms said:

I gave that a shot, as well as maybe removing “Please”
I was always iffy on the JAT line myself, but it didn’t seem to matter to untrained ears which is how it made it this far. And so many choices I’ve made since have worked off of that line in particular working.

sade1212 said:
I didn’t notice last time that you VFX’d Obi-Wan so his saber ignites second; it’s nice and subtly done.

This is a really fantastic change. The only thing I would prefer would be swapping the order of “Don’t you turn against me” and “Your anger and your lust for power have already done that.” the pause between Anakin’s accusation that Obi-wan turned Padme against him and the following line feels a little clunky. It may work better if the second line is an interjection following Obi-wan’s response.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

These clips are amazing.

Love the lightsaber discussion on the balcony, though I struggle to comprehend the first line.

Also, the slightly awkward “You’re beautiful because I’m so in love with you” scene could be cut to remove some clumsiness:
Anakin: “You’re so beautiful”
Padme: “So love has blinded you?”
Anakin: [Smiles with the wide, humorous smile and dismissive head shake before he originally says “No, no, it’s because I’m so in love with you”, but instead we just cut to-]
Padme: “It’s probably true.”
Anakin: [Gives the chuckle he gives before he originally says “That’s not exactly what I meant”]

This way it’s a genuine moment from Anakin, followed by a flirtatious but affectionate tease from Padme, which Anakin responds to with effectively “well you got me there!”