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Return of the Jedi: Radical Re-Edit (Released) — Page 3

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daneditor said:

Nice! I'd love to see what you come up with.

Here's a peak of a work-in-progress matte painting I'm working on for the scene...

Luke's walking under his x-Wing in the scene with Ben so I needed this shot ^ to show he's actually walking under 'Shuttle Tydirium' (Notice I've used the same X-wing under-carriage light for continuity).

 

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Mightily impressive work. Are you using After Effects to do this?

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 (Edited)

Ryan McAvoy said:

daneditor said:

I could add the Obi Wan scene to the Ewok village before Luke surrenders.

^ This idea has caught my imagination. I'm working on it now.

 

My thoughts on Ben's ghost are that if the scene has to be in it should set up something big (bigger than just Vader pulling his son's strings).

That's why I suggested having it on Tatooine.

Leia has rushed into rescuing Han while Luke is training with Yoda.

He comes to the rendezvous spot in Ben's old hut but she's gone... rushed off like he did in ESB.

Ben then tells Luke about Leia in the spot Luke started his journey because Leia is about to start hers.

That way the revelation hangs over the whole film and colours every move Luke makes.

It also makes the shambles at Jabba's Palace make more sense if it's two rescue plans not one and the first one is an almighty cock-up fueled by attachment unbecoming of a Jedi.

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daneditor said:

Mightily impressive work. Are you using After Effects to do this?

No, I'm just cutting, pasting and blending in shop lol. Be nice to get a copy of After Effects at some point and have a play to see if I've got any skills in that department

Gonna add a subtle slow zoom to add movement.

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Bingowings said:

Ryan McAvoy said:

daneditor said:

I could add the Obi Wan scene to the Ewok village before Luke surrenders.

^ This idea has caught my imagination. I'm working on it now.

 

My thoughts on Ben's ghost are that if the scene has to be in it should set up something big (bigger than just Vader pulling his son's strings).

That's why I suggested having it on Tatooine.

Leia has rushed into rescuing Han while Luke is training with Yoda.

He comes to the rendezvous spot in Ben's old hut but she's gone... rushed off like he did in ESB.

Ben then tells Luke about Leia in the spot Luke started his journey because Leia is about to start hers.

That way the revelation hangs over the whole film and colours every move Luke makes.

It also makes the shambles at Jabba's Palace make more sense if it's two rescue plans not one and the first one is an almighty cock-up fueled by attachment unbecoming of a Jedi.

I like the idea but it's beyond my ability to do. Maybe Adywan will use it.

The best way to make the Han rescue logical is do what TMBTM did in War of the Stars 2, but it'll make the film about 20 minutes shorter, and wreck the pacing.

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 (Edited)

It's done. Some of the music probably needs rebuilding if you're gonna use it. R2 was beeping all over bits of it, limiting the bits of the soundtrack that I could use.

FYI: I uploaded the whole nightime on Endor sequence but only the first 5 mins are re-edited.

Click below to watch...

I'm thinking about a second more 'Radical' (In this spirit of this thread) version. Goes like this:

- Vader calls for his shuttle

- Threepio tells story and Luke leaves

- Vader's shuttle lands on endor

- Vader calls to Luke using the force across the forest night

- Luke hears then talks to Ben

- Luke talks to Leia then leaves

- Luke surrenders to Vader

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 (Edited)

Nice work with the day for night matte of the shuttle (obviously removing the X-wing guns is a tidy up job for later) but it doesn't quite work in my opinion.

Luke is called by Vader, bumps into Obi-Wan's ghost and then has natter to Leia?

I assume the shuttle is a fair distance from the village so it must have been a bit of a jog.

It's bit of a shame that Luke is at Threepio's story hour. It would possibly work better if he has isolated himself from the others for the night and is on his own at the shuttle.

That way Ben's story telling could intercut with Threepio's (he runs through the plot of two and a half films too quickly so intercutting would allow him some space to embellish the Ewok's introduction to the Star Wars universe).

I don't think you need Vader to prompt Luke to surrender. It makes him stronger if he just decides to do it for the safety of the task force.

Another thing that always bugged me about ROTJ was how Ben's ghost interacted with the environment.

In ANH he is just a voice prompting Luke.

He does this for most of ESB and only actually appears twice were he seems to float in the air.

It would be cool if someone could get a clean shot of Ben with his hood up from ANH and put the ROTJ face into Ben in a standing position and have him fade in and out to make him more of a ghost and less of a transparent man sitting on a log but Mark's eyeline then becomes an issue.

Love the graphical button, how do you do that?

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 (Edited)

Bingowings said:

I assume the shuttle is a fair distance from the village so it must have been a bit of a jog.

I don't think you need Vader to prompt Luke to surrender.

Another thing that always bugged me about ROTJ was how Ben's ghost interacted with the environment.

Love the graphical button, how do you do that?

I think it works really nicely when Luke leaves but less well when he comes back. Couldn't think of a good way to explain why he is suddenly back from the shuttle to the Ewok hut - I put in an iris transition to imply the passage of time. I think inserting a cut away here would help. Like cutting to Vader and/or Palpatine then back again. Maybe cut to Vader's shuttle arriving?

I wanted to get Vader in there early so Luke's flash of anger and "Why didn't you tell me?" line when he sees Ben is re-enforced. It felt mildly odd in the original Dagobah scene but feels even more random here. You understand why he says it but not why it is the first thing. If Vader had just spoken it would explain it nicely.

Would be great if it could be shown that Leia has sensed Luke's return. But there aren't any shots long enough of Carrie from the hut scene looking thoughtful that I possibly could dub an ethereal "Leia" over.

Anybody dig the new Ben intro I made? I thought it was pretty subtle so you might of missed it.

"Graphical button"?

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btw Some ambient Endor sound FX would help the Luke/Ben scene. Anybody know of a link to a clean soundtrack of this, from a SW game maybe?

The Endor version of Owls hooting and Crickets chiruping?

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Ryan, it's good, but I would change a few things:

If Luke left earlier during the storytelling (I have Luke leaving at the mention of Vader), 3PO carries on a bit, then you then cut to Luke and Ben, it helps explains the time gap of how he got to the shuttle. I'd also replace the music at the end of the Ben scene - IMO that music is too associated with the rebel fleet scene. And maybe also trim the Ben scene (the from a certain point of view bit always bugs me).

Here's something that will help you: http://www.mediafire.com/?5k3j50x2cd3157a

 

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Ryan McAvoy said:

"Graphical button"?

 I'm pretty sure he's talking about that "Endor experiment" picture that when you click on it (hence the 'button') sends you to your Vimeo video.

 

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Ooooh,

Just took a screenshot of the video and made the screenshot the link to the video.

Don't think you can properly embed on here.

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 (Edited)

I liked it that you cut the Ben scene entirely.  There is too much reiteration and not enough new information (the same is applicable to the Yoda scene and I appreciated the trims there as well)

I never minded the Luke/Leia brother/sister thing.  In my opinion you set it up very nicely for the "there is another line" from TESB to be resolved and explained during the saber fight at the end; instead of Yoda or Ben giving this revelation to Luke it could be played out as a simultaneous event for both father and brother. 

Just my two cents.

I really like your edit and hope that you don't abandon finessing it  In all honesty I find it a preferable watch to the original product (and it's various GL fanedits).

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regularjoe said:

I really like your edit and hope that you don't abandon finessing it  In all honesty I find it a preferable watch to the original product (and it's various GL fanedits).

I expect I'll keep editing it for a few more years, perhaps until the Boba Fett movie comes out - which will hopefully contain the footage I need to complete that storyline.

BTW I should have made more clear what the Mediafire file is a few posts up: it's a collection of audio files called "Sounds of ROTJ" and one of them is called "Endor Forest Sounds".

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Regularjoe gave me an idea. It would be pretty easy to remove all mention of Leia as Luke's sister from the movie, starting with the Ben scene:

"the other he spoke of is your twin sister."

"But I have no sister."

"To protect you both from the Emperor, you were hidden from your father when you were born. The Emperor knew, as I did, if Anakin were to have any offspring, they would be a threat to him. That is the reason that your sister remains safely anonymous."

Ben does not continue, and Luke processes this new information, then looks at Ben (from the final shot in the scene).

Ben continues: "Bury your feelings deep down, Luke. They do you credit, but they could be made to serve the Emperor."

Ben could be fading out throughout this scene, and his last line is only a voice in Luke's mind.

Then of course the talk of Leia as his sister is taken out of the Ewok village dialogue, and the throne room scene can stay as is. Leia's talk with Han  goes somewhat differently:

"You love him. Don't you?"

"It's not like that at all!"

This would require some careful cutting to feel genuine.

Or, it could be made to seem like Luke doesn't know who his sister is, and during the Ewok Village dialogue, he suspects that Leia may be his sister. However, he omits telling Leia about his suspicions.

It goes as in the movie until:

"He's my father."

"Your father?"

"There's more. The only hope for the Alliance, if I don't make it back..."

"Luke, don't talk that way."

"It won't be easy for you to hear it, but you must. The Force is strong in my family. My father has it. I have it. My sister has it. In time, my sister'll learn to use that power as I have."

"Then Luke, run away, far away. If he can feel your presence, then leave this place! I wish I could go with you."

"No you don't. You've always been strong."

"But why must you confront him?"

"Because there is good in him, I've felt it. He won't turn me over to the Emperor, I can save him. I can turn him back...(Leia stares at him)...I have to try."

You probably don’t recognize me because of the red arm.
Episode 9 Rewrite, The Starlight Project (Released!) and ANH Technicolor Project (Released!)

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Up until this week Leia wasn't Luke's sister in this edit - the problem is, why does Luke finally attack Vader if it's not about Vader mentioning/threatening his sister?

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I agree that it gives Luke motivation to re-enter the battle.  I just think that this is a case of "less is more."  A lot of the Ben scene exists to tell you that Leia is Luke's sister but really, do we need to have it spelled out for us?   When I saw 5 when it came out the "there is another" was enough and I don't think that there was a Star Wars nut who didn't remember that line going into 6.  If one watches them 1-2-3-4-5-6 then one already knows about the twins.  

If you leave things as just 4-5-6- it provides a super payoff as the viewer goes all the way through 6 thinking, huh?  aren't they going to tie up this whole "there is another thing?"  Uh.....the end of the movie is coming up and they still haven't done anything with that.  BAM....your feelings for them are strong....especially for....sister.  A great payoff in my opinion and to make it the first time Luke hears this gives a bit more backbone to him losing his s*** for a bit.  It becomes a purely visceral reaction because he hasn't had time to digest the new information, he's already in fight or flight mode and this pushes his button just so.  A big part of the movie is the visual imagery, Luke in black, is he going to swing to the dark side or the light.  So Leia is threatened and he blows it and almost kills Vader and comes around when Palpy goads him.  It perpetuates playing up Luke being not entirely secure from the dark side right up to when he tosses his saber.

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daneditor said:

regularjoe said:

I really like your edit and hope that you don't abandon finessing it  In all honesty I find it a preferable watch to the original product (and it's various GL fanedits).

I expect I'll keep editing it for a few more years, perhaps until the Boba Fett movie comes out - which will hopefully contain the footage I need to complete that storyline.

BTW I should have made more clear what the Mediafire file is a few posts up: it's a collection of audio files called "Sounds of ROTJ" and one of them is called "Endor Forest Sounds".

Well I have not seen what you have done so far collectiviley but I would be very interested to see it so I do hope you do a release or a partly finished or even incomplete version....

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regularjoe said:

I agree that it gives Luke motivation to re-enter the battle.  I just think that this is a case of "less is more."  A lot of the Ben scene exists to tell you that Leia is Luke's sister but really, do we need to have it spelled out for us?   When I saw 5 when it came out the "there is another" was enough and I don't think that there was a Star Wars nut who didn't remember that line going into 6.  If one watches them 1-2-3-4-5-6 then one already knows about the twins.

No way will the Ben scene be put back in this edit. I'm with you - it's a bad exposition scene. Alec Guinness also looks so bored.

Whether or not that scene is needed for the sister plot to work... I don't honestly know. But that's the way my edit now plays, so we'll find out soon enough.

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Ronster said:

Well I have not seen what you have done so far collectiviley but I would be very interested to see it so I do hope you do a release or a partly finished or even incomplete version....

Ronster - hopefully the latest workprint will be online by Monday.

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Good to know...Look forward to it

I have been criticised  for suggesting this clip in another thread and then it actually dawned on me if it were used where it could go.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXcoIN6tqXY

When Vader Lands on Endor (shuttle landing platform) The shot of the leg touching down...And perhaps the ramp coming down... Don't know if you do after effects work or not but that is perhaps the best place for it and if the car that the leg goes through could be removed this might work quite well. But it all depends on the car and debris being removed.

Let me be clear about this clip as others got confused...  shot of the Shuttle leg touching down under belly only and perhaps the door coming down and even Vader but Bingowings noted the costume inconsistencies which is something I Really don't think about too much TBH.

It may fit because it's at night and Vader is departing the shuttle but without looking at the scene it may mess the music up and the car would have to be digitally  removed.

But It's really not a big deal just an idea

 

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I appreciate the thought but IMO the scene where Vader arrives on Endor doesn't need to be changed. It's one of the few scenes that I don't think needs to be altered/added to.

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Yeah no worries... It's one of those Ideas that is a lot of work for very little reward and as you say there is nothing wrong with it in the first place... Totally understand that. 

Keep me posted on the edit would be interested to see what you have done so far

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I'll PM you the download links... hopefully in the next 48 hours.