Ripped it again just to make sure I didn’t have the wrong version on my machine. Here are screenshots that look identical with a photo of my blu-ray. Peter Pan has only had one blu-ray release as far as I can find so it’s definitely the diamond edition.
Ripped it again just to make sure I didn’t have the wrong version on my machine. Here are screenshots that look identical with a photo of my blu-ray. Peter Pan has only had one blu-ray release as far as I can find so it’s definitely the diamond edition.
Wow. You are right. I took a closer look, and there are some differences, but that’s disgustingly close to the Platinum Edition… except HD.
Edit: Okay, compiled everything you guys have linked, posted, etc. with my previous PP comparison sheet.
Here is an updated version showing everything up to the Diamond Edition: (see below)
Edit 2: I’ve been thinking about Disney’s trend in color changes and I’m starting to think this is the visual equivalent of Disney Enhanced Home Theater Mix soundtracks.
It’s just possible that the colors are intentionally wrong. The logic being that most people are using their TV’s default settings which tend to be over bright and with a cold color temperature.
It would explain the dingy whites, washing out of blues and a general tint towards gold.
That or Disney’s restoration people are dimwits that are using uncalibrated monitors.
Edit 3: Updated version giving proper credit for BD images: http://www.mediafire.com/download/xcbdcebef7r7z9d/Peter_Pan_v2.7.html
Btw, unfortunately all images are compressed jpg (with some being re-compressed). The software I was using was ill equipped for the job. It was this or a 25mb version which seemed ridiculous. The quality doesn’t seem to be perceptibly altered.
Dr. M
Thanks for the full Peter Pan releases comparison, guys! I wish we had even more of these (great preliminary info for possible projects). If not much trouble, maybe goofydylan8 could grab the remaining Blu-ray shots missing from the latest comparison?
I was happy with what goofydylan8 provided since they covered all the Platinum Edition screenshots.
There’s a more subtle difference between the BD and the PE DVD than the previous releases.
Dr. M
Here’s a convenient, side-by-side view of the Doctor M/goofydylan8 Disney’s Peter Pan versions (see previous posts). The snapshots should be looked at only for coloring, as they all have been HTML-page pixel-downsized to fit across the page.
Very nice works Spaced Ranger.
Dr. M
Thanks. And thanks to us all for the co-operative efforts! (And a great thread.)
Without knowing how the Disney animators colored this movie, and whether it was compensated to what cinema projection was supposed to be, and if the screen-grabs (analogue sources) were neutrally captured … I think the 1990 laserdisc appears as one would expect of a Disney animation. Has poita ever chimed in on this particular movie, from quality print(s) and/or Disney research? Or from similarly dated ones that he knows for sure?
We do know that the Blu-rays are color timed based on the cells, not what the film or projector would cause it to look like. So we can rule those out.
When the Platinum Edition came out, most experts were appalled by the color changes. They are considered the most wrong.
The 1990 edition is thought to be the most correct by many.
If you want digital, the 2002 DVD is my second choice.
Dr. M
More Peter Pan… I know, I know, but I came across some digital footage of the 1990 transfer.
Here is a slightly edited clip of Tinker Bell landing on the hand mirror. I used the three sources of most interest for comparison. The 1990 transfer that was used for the LD/VHS but from a DVD, the 2002 SE and of course the Diamond Edition BD.
So now that I’ve seen those splotches on Tink’s dress in motion, I no longer believe they were intended to be pixie dust hand prints or something.
They look more like a flaw than intentional effects. Thoughts?
Dr. M
Doctor M said:
They look more like a flaw than intentional effects.
Definitely agree.
I would rule out the standard procedure of washing and reusing animation cels (a cost saving measure) being involved in such an anomaly. If so, it would affect other colors. However, I don’t see it on the adjoining skin. More likely there was some other-color reside (or too much water) still on the brush or in the paint container to affect green painting across a group of cels.
Does anything show immediately before or after this shot, but nowhere else, for just this color?
Doctor M said:
They look more like a flaw than intentional effects.Definitely agree.
I would rule out the standard procedure of washing and reusing animation cels (a cost saving measure) being involved in such an anomaly. If so, it would affect other colors. However, I don’t see it on the adjoining skin. More likely there was some other-color reside (or too much water) still on the brush or in the paint container to affect green painting across a group of cels.
Does anything show immediately before or after this shot, but nowhere else, for just this color?
I’m not sure I understand your question. I’ve never seen the 1990 release in its entirety so I don’t know if that splotchy appearance occurs anywhere else.
I still can’t help but think it has something to do with an optical effect used to create Tink’s glow… but the 2002 SE isn’t supposed to be a restoration, so you’d think if that were in the master it would still be visible.
Maybe it’s from the transfer itself?
Dr. M
I was suggesting (without knowing the pedigree of the various releases) it could’ve been on the actual cels.
Notice that particular marks, in any single frame, show up all over the green dress only (and not the wings, for example). Many times you can see it as if painted up to the color border, as a painter would do. A scan anomaly would violate all those constraints.
If true, then any later release sourced from film would have those marks, too, unless a “restoration” corrected them.
It disappears in the 1998 transfer and I don’t think Disney was doing any real restorations until the Platinum Editions.
Dr. M
Hmmm … well, I quickly searched (ended up on Amazon) and read some reviews that mentioned old extras (The Making Of Peter Pan, et al) were carried over to the newer releases. Would it be correct to assume that such extras wouldn’t necessarily be “fixed-up” even if the movie was? And does this shot-in-question show anywhere in one of these extras? Not retouched?
Perhaps the 1998, and after, releases actually corrected such an egregious flaw as this, along with their color adjustments to the movie. If not (too hard to do if it’s not digital?), then I’m out of ideas.
That’s exactly where the clip came from. All clips from the movie in “The Making of Peter Pan” in the 2002 DVD is footage from the 1990 transfer.
The colors and the light splotches on Tink’s dress are the give away.
It’s not uncommon for even new bonus features to use old transfers for clips rather than the restored version on the disc with it.
But yeah, as far as I know, there was no digital clean up until the Platinum Edition. I’m no expert though.
Dr. M
Of the Fantasia video releases, how are the transitions from live action to animation handled? On the print I have, the frame opens and closes accordingly in relation to the proposed widescreen projection. The fades will likely have been digitally altered. Am I correct?
Ol’ George has the GOUT, I see.
Alright, so Corey Burton’s impression of Deems Taylor isn’t… too bad. Honestly, it’s all we have, at least at this point. Still - a vocal artist voicing a real person, does anyone else do that?..
Ol’ George has the GOUT, I see.
Alright, so Corey Burton’s impression of Deems Taylor isn’t… too bad. Honestly, it’s all we have, at least at this point. Still - a vocal artist voicing a real person, does anyone else do that?..
Rich Little voicing David Niven in ‘Trail of the Pink Panther’.
Dr. M
Oh? Under the same circumstances?
Ol’ George has the GOUT, I see.
Oh? Under the same circumstances?
Not from the film being lost, but from the actor being in poor health.
From Wikipedia:
Little’s talent for impersonation has been used in movies, when an actor’s dialogue was impaired by poor health. When David Niven proved too ill for his voice to be used in his appearances in Trail of the Pink Panther (1982) and Curse of the Pink Panther (1983), Little provided the overdub in Niven’s voice. He performed similar duties to dub James Cagney’s stroke-impaired voice in the 1984 TV movie Terrible Joe Moran, and in the 1991 TV special Christmas at the Movies by providing an uncredited dub for actor/dancer Gene Kelly who had lost his voice.
Dr. M
It was ridiculous to replace the portions of Taylor’s narration that aren’t lost. (They could at least have provided them via seamless branching.) And the lost portions are like bad movie trailers that give the entire plot away. No wonder they were cut back in the day.
Where were you in '77?
Can someone let me know what shots had their colours altered on the Blu-ray?
Ol’ George has the GOUT, I see.
Does anyone know if the 1080p iTunes & Amazon versions of The Black Cauldron are any good?
Okay, looked into it on Blu-Ray.com and the new Snow White Blu-Ray is basically the same master as the Diamond Edition. Which, given your recommendation of the Diamond Edition as an acceptable alternative DoctorM, seems like a “must-buy” for me. Been wanting Snow White back in my collection of Disney movies for awhile. Had the VHS (really it was a good restoration for its medium, dunno why they decided to continually monkey with it for future releases) and now I’ll probably have the Signature Collection Blu-Ray. Hopefully that stupid DMR-exclusive bonus feature is still there.
BJ
EDIT: Would have been nice had I enclosed a link. http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Snow-White-and-the-Seven-Dwarfs-Blu-ray/144704/#Review
Okay, looked into it on Blu-Ray.com and the new Snow White Blu-Ray is basically the same master as the Diamond Edition. Which, given your recommendation of the Diamond Edition as an acceptable alternative DoctorM, seems like a “must-buy” for me. Been wanting Snow White back in my collection of Disney movies for awhile. Had the VHS (really it was a good restoration for its medium, dunno why they decided to continually monkey with it for future releases) and now I’ll probably have the Signature Collection Blu-Ray. Hopefully that stupid DMR-exclusive bonus feature is still there.
BJ
EDIT: Would have been nice had I enclosed a link. http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Snow-White-and-the-Seven-Dwarfs-Blu-ray/144704/#Review
Snow White is a problem because there really is no know original version outside of some film prints. Disney ‘restored’ this film early.
Dr. M