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Raiders of the Lost Ark - 35 mm regrade — Page 8

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Papai2013 said:

DrDre said:

Papai2013 said:

Both Jurassic Park 3D and Raiders BD has the same colour grading with a red tint. This is because they wanted to match the projected image of a 35mm release print and the original warm photochemical timing. However, I think they went overboard with the red tone. The HDTV source if it’s warmed slightly and shifted a bit to the green side will perhaps closely match the print colours, based on the 35mm stills I saw here. Again, the colours on a print look different when projected with the proper bulb brightness. So, I don’t think it’d have looked as red as the BD has it.

The thing is that the bluray is shifted towards orange on the whole, but the bar fight scenes take the red shift to a whole other level, that cannot be explained by a slightly warmer tone. This probably is a delibirate artistic choice, and it clearly contradicts the statements by Paramount, that claim the bluray has the theatrical color timing, which in fact has more of a red shift in this scene than the WOWOW.

HDTV sources are not reliable for colour timing from what I have seen. Look at Jurassic Park’s HDTV colours, it’s shifted towards blue, so is the 2D BD, and both of them have been sourced from the same master file. The original film cells available in the internet clearly show the original timing was warmer (green-yellow-orange). Not as warm as the 3D BD, but not as awfully blue as the HDTV or the 2D BD. So, I guess something less reddish than the current BDs would be the ideal colouring.

Neither the bluray nor the HDTV broadcast are reliable in the case of Raiders of the Lost Ark. The HDTV broadcast is sourced from the same master as the 2003 DVD release. Both have a red shifted bar sequence, although the bluray is worse, while the evidence seems to show the theatrical version has no red shift at all. The bluray’s colors are warmer than the HDTV version, but they’re also orange and teal, which seems more in line with the current trend in color grading, than any desire to reproduce the theatrical color timing.

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DrDre said:
It’s no longer going to be a 35 mm regrade per se, since I would need a 35 mm print for that

Didn’t you have a 35mm print at one point?

Ol’ George has the GOUT, I see.

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No I’m using a number of oversaturated 35 mm frames posted by Harmy as a comparison for my efforts. At that point I wanted to regrade the bluray using a single frame reference, but the bar fight sequence, and 35 mm trailers, convinced me that the regrade should be done on a shot by shot basis, using an original unfaded reference source from the 1980s, preferably a 35 mm print.

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Forgive my intrusion to this thread, I was once a regular on a forum about Indiana Jones gear and one of the biggest issues discussed in that forum (and for “biggest” I mean that there was actual fights, down to verbal abuse, as you know it happens in forums) was about the correct color of Indy’s “grey hat”. I’m talking about the hat that Ford wears when he boards the clipper plane. For a long time some people said it was just the same hat, just in a different light, the other (honestly larger) faction was convinced that it was a proper grey hat.
It has long been confirmed that it was indeed a grey hat in that scene (and it’s the same hat that one of the nazi spies wears in the Cairo chase), still, it would be nice to see that hat in a “color-corrected” scene.

Oh, and if it can be of any interest, I do own the same cigar box that you see in Marion’s bar in Nepal, however, due to different lighting on the set and color correction in post production it’s hard to use these props as reference even if you own one with the same colors.

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thxita said:

Forgive my intrusion to this thread, I was once a regular on a forum about Indiana Jones gear and one of the biggest issues discussed in that forum (and for “biggest” I mean that there was actual fights, down to verbal abuse, as you know it happens in forums) was about the correct color of Indy’s “grey hat”. I’m talking about the hat that Ford wears when he boards the clipper plane. For a long time some people said it was just the same hat, just in a different light, the other (honestly larger) faction was convinced that it was a proper grey hat.
It has long been confirmed that it was indeed a grey hat in that scene (and it’s the same hat that one of the nazi spies wears in the Cairo chase), still, it would be nice to see that hat in a “color-corrected” scene.

Oh, and if it can be of any interest, I do own the same cigar box that you see in Marion’s bar in Nepal, however, due to different lighting on the set and color correction in post production it’s hard to use these props as reference even if you own one with the same colors.

That’s very interesting indeed! There are a couple of things happening in the background, that may result in a much better reference for a theatrical regrade of Raiders of the Lost Ark, including the scene you are referencing, but more about that hopefully in the near future.

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Swazzy said:

Fantastic work, Dre. How exactly did you use the CC tool to revert only the gamma and contrast back to the WOWOW?

You should match the grayscale frames, and use that model to correct the frame you want to correct. You do have to make sure the grayscale frame is in the rgb color space.

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DrDre, have you tried magic bullet looks software? It has excellent tools for colour correction. I’m just thinking of ways to help you fine-tune your work to the look you want to achieve - which isn’t to say what you are doing currently is bad - just something else to think about/try if you want to.

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Any news on this. This is gonna be great if it’s finished, and I am very greatful to you, Dr Dre, and everyone else involved, because Raiders is my favorite adventure film, and I’ve longed for the chance to watch it with proper colors.

Army of Darkness: The Medieval Deadit | The Terminator - Color Regrade | The Wrong Trousers - Audio Preservation
SONIC RACES THROUGH THE GREEN FIELDS.
THE SUN RACES THROUGH A BLUE SKY FILLED WITH WHITE CLOUDS.
THE WAYS OF HIS HEART ARE MUCH LIKE THE SUN. SONIC RUNS AND RESTS; THE SUN RISES AND SETS.
DON’T GIVE UP ON THE SUN. DON’T MAKE THE SUN LAUGH AT YOU.

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Dek Rollins said:

Any news on this. This is gonna be great if it’s finished, and I am very greatful to you, Dr Dre, and everyone else involved, because Raiders is my favorite adventure film, and I’ve longed for the chance to watch it with proper colors.

The project is happening. There are some interesting developments in the background, that I can’t discuss just yet, but I’m hopeful the final result will be amazing.

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I’m hopeful too. I also wish I was in a position to do my own color corrections.

EDIT: Though I understand that the laserdisc is the best source, and it’s going to be great, I think that the look of your second correction would be pretty much perfect (besides the bar scene).

Army of Darkness: The Medieval Deadit | The Terminator - Color Regrade | The Wrong Trousers - Audio Preservation
SONIC RACES THROUGH THE GREEN FIELDS.
THE SUN RACES THROUGH A BLUE SKY FILLED WITH WHITE CLOUDS.
THE WAYS OF HIS HEART ARE MUCH LIKE THE SUN. SONIC RUNS AND RESTS; THE SUN RISES AND SETS.
DON’T GIVE UP ON THE SUN. DON’T MAKE THE SUN LAUGH AT YOU.

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Oh my goodness! This is amazing! I really hope someone can get this thing scanned. And it’s times like these that I wish I had money to do it myself 😄.

Army of Darkness: The Medieval Deadit | The Terminator - Color Regrade | The Wrong Trousers - Audio Preservation
SONIC RACES THROUGH THE GREEN FIELDS.
THE SUN RACES THROUGH A BLUE SKY FILLED WITH WHITE CLOUDS.
THE WAYS OF HIS HEART ARE MUCH LIKE THE SUN. SONIC RUNS AND RESTS; THE SUN RISES AND SETS.
DON’T GIVE UP ON THE SUN. DON’T MAKE THE SUN LAUGH AT YOU.

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Holy bajeezus. ow I just need to find some money.

“You don’t really mean you’ll kill me, do you?” - Juror 8
“Silence, Earthling! My name is Darth Vader. I am an extra-terrestrial from the planet Vulcan!” - Calvin “Marty” Klein

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Damn, it looks like that auction got taken down by the seller.

Incidentally, I have a 35mm copy of the re-release trailer, if it would be useful at all. I sort of doubt it, since it has already been scanned in HD and is widely available online.

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Soo, is it the issue of purchasing this copy available or more of someone having the facilities to scan it? I would love to see this and possibly be willing to purchase the reels.

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Scanning can easily be arranged on these forums, the problem is always finding someone willing to actually buy the print in the first place.

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Laserschwert said:

Scanning can easily be arranged on these forums, the problem is always finding someone willing to actually buy the print in the first place.

If theres enough interest, and committment, I might be willing to purchase it if the price is right (of the reels I mean) and others with more knowledge than me can vouch for the quality of this particular print. I dont want to waste mine or anyones time if its not a good print.

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I’m quite useless to any projects, but I’d just like to say that I’m very interested in this print being scanned, preserved and cleaned up etc… 😄

Army of Darkness: The Medieval Deadit | The Terminator - Color Regrade | The Wrong Trousers - Audio Preservation
SONIC RACES THROUGH THE GREEN FIELDS.
THE SUN RACES THROUGH A BLUE SKY FILLED WITH WHITE CLOUDS.
THE WAYS OF HIS HEART ARE MUCH LIKE THE SUN. SONIC RUNS AND RESTS; THE SUN RISES AND SETS.
DON’T GIVE UP ON THE SUN. DON’T MAKE THE SUN LAUGH AT YOU.

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That’s assuming you win the auction, of course.

Ol’ George has the GOUT, I see.

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In case anyone was planning on doing something with this print, the auction ends in 21 hours. Bid has gone up to $1500.

Army of Darkness: The Medieval Deadit | The Terminator - Color Regrade | The Wrong Trousers - Audio Preservation
SONIC RACES THROUGH THE GREEN FIELDS.
THE SUN RACES THROUGH A BLUE SKY FILLED WITH WHITE CLOUDS.
THE WAYS OF HIS HEART ARE MUCH LIKE THE SUN. SONIC RUNS AND RESTS; THE SUN RISES AND SETS.
DON’T GIVE UP ON THE SUN. DON’T MAKE THE SUN LAUGH AT YOU.

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Is anyone planning on doing it?

Ol’ George has the GOUT, I see.