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Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles) — Page 63

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Most of these translations started as direct OCR’s of official foreign DVD or Blu-ray releases, but many of them have gotten corrections since then and are now significantly different. Some started off as custom translations, like Indonesian and Vietnamese (there never was an official translation in some markets), and some started off as an official translation, but that was completely thrown out and re-done from scratch, like Finnish. But I’d say most are still some mix of official and custom translation.

All the translation work is outsourced to unpaid volunteers, and I pass on the savings to you! I’d say the point where we went over the line into crazyville was Operation Eyestrain (the descent into madness starts right about here). I’m not sure poor Feallan will ever recover. Next to that, it’s really just been incremental changes and an exercise in patience. The first release – six years ago! – was honestly pretty crappy in hindsight, but lots of little changes over time make a big difference.

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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We are about to have 4K releases, but putting that on a disc is going to take a lot of work to figure out, so you have some time.

Why do the subs take that long to render? And do you ever think you will have the tooling to a place where anyone can just generate the graphical subs, meaning you don’t need to distribute them?

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Actually anyone can generate graphical subs right now – Project Threepio is more than just the subs, it’s the whole subtitling toolkit I use to create them. Creating the graphical subs does require some technical expertise, computing power, and patience, however. So I do a basic batch that should cover most needs. But there’s utilities in there to re-time them to Puggo and do all kinds of crazy extra things that aren’t provided out of the box. Check out the README, it’s actually pretty comprehensive.

As for speed, well, graphical subtitles are just images, so compare rendering them to rendering a movie (as in rendering images from scratch like Pixar, not processing existing images like applying color correction to an existing image). So a full set of subtitles for all films in all languages is approximately 150,000 images, and right now I render them at 1080p. That’s approximately rendering a full feature-length film of 1080p images, albeit simple ones and not taking up the whole frame. But there’s more to it than that. The software I use to render the text has some quirks I need to work around (I chose it because other software had quirks I could not work around). To avoid aliasing, I actually render the text at 4K, then resize it to 1080p (which means for 4K, I’d render at 8K… yeesh!). Then it attempts this subpixel antialiasing thing which results in a colorful fringe around all the letters (would be good if it aligned to actual subpixels, but it doesn’t), so I convert everything to grayscale and back to erase that. Then there’s the more obvious post-processing – drop shadows and such. And some weird stuff I do for custom line spacing and text justification, and so on. The code is… convoluted. Anyway, it all adds up, and also I’m fully willing to believe I didn’t write the world’s most efficient code. And that maybe my computer is also not a technical marvel of modern computing power. But it’s actually a pretty complicated process.

And compared to how things used to be, it’s great. I used to have to click through every subtitle file in a piece of software, render it, and move on to the next one (I didn’t do as many languages back then). When I slept, nothing got rendered until I woke up again and started clicking through it. Now, I just kick off the process one day, leave the computer alone for eight days, come back, and it’s done. If you just want to render one language instead of all of them, as most people would, it’s actually not bad at all.

But as for 4K, I’m glad to hear we can afford to wait a while at least. I’ll get ready for it, but I can’t say I’m really looking forward to it. 😕

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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Well, it’ll be a while before a 4K BR disc is feasible, but a 4K MKV is very doable right now. But I’m sure regular SRT subs will be sufficient for that.

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ChainsawAsh said:

Well, it’ll be a while before a 4K BR disc is feasible, but a 4K MKV is very doable right now. But I’m sure regular SRT subs will be sufficient for that.

SRT files are never sufficient IMO, but I believe 1080p graphical SUP subs would work in that scenario. It’s a little player-dependent, though, so I’m hesitant to make a blanket statement that this will definitely work.

If people start reporting problems with 1080p subtitles with 4k video, I may accelerate this conversion process.

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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Hmmm… As soon as my current encode is complete I’ll try some tests using
1080p Sup files with a 4K Image, I’ve been wondering the same thing,
will it work? How will it look? I’ll post some images here.

I thought I recognized your foul stench when I entered this forum!

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Sure, I’d be interested to see those.

I’ve also got a pretty good workaround brewing. The next Project Threepio will at the very least include instructions for how to create 2160p SUP files from the existing 1080p subtitles. They will still be upscaled of course (not as sharp, but for subtitles that’s not as relevant), but then they’ll be native 4K and less likely to have player compatibility issues.

Eventually the plan will be to have native 4K subtitles with everything derived from them, rather than everything being derived from 1080p, as it is now. Honestly I think Project Threepio went through a transition like this before when it was originally 720p-native and the 1080p subs were just upscales.

Another wrinkle in this plan is the 35mm English “alien” subs, which are graphical subs of the Greedo/Jabba lines, literally Photoshopped out of a 35mm scan. As they stand right now, they are 1080p-native. Before Project Threepio could be truly 4K-native, I would really need those in 4K too. We’d need both a completed 4K Star Wars and Jedi 35mm scan for that.

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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I’m using your English native 1080p .sup file in these examples.

If encoded with the ‘black bars’ in a 16:9 aspect ratio I get this:
16:9

If encoded to a 2.40:1 ratio:
2.40:1

note: I’m still using ver. 9.2 here, still haven’t acquired your most recent version.

Edit: The above example were using Cyberlink PowerDVD 16, which I was using because
VLC is quite choppy playing 4K video but, VLC does display subtitles normally:

16:9 with VLC:
16:9 - VLC

I thought I recognized your foul stench when I entered this forum!

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Okay, I’m going to make the call. We have a new 4K preservation released out there and I want the current version of this project to support it better, even if not in a 4K-native form.

By this, I mean that the project won’t yet include 2160p subtitles, but it will include instructions for upscaling the 1080p subtitles to 2160p, which will give them their intended look on any 4k player.

So if anyone out there is working on translations, they will not make the cutoff for version 10.1 unless they’re done within about a week!

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I guess I’ll hold off on downloading v10 and see what you come up with!
After 2 years what’s a few more days? LOL

I thought I recognized your foul stench when I entered this forum!

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Heh, with 10.1 you’re mostly getting a new font. As for 4K, there will be utilities for upscaling 1080p to 4K for sure, maybe even for rendering your own 4K-native subs if you’re brave. I may even make a separate download package for pre-upscaled 4K subs, but that could be both complicated and enormous. Pre-included 4K-native subs will not be until the version after that, at the earliest.

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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CatBus said:

Okay, I’m going to make the call. We have a new 4K preservation released out there and I want the current version of this project to support it better, even if not in a 4K-native form.

By this, I mean that the project won’t yet include 2160p subtitles, but it will include instructions for upscaling the 1080p subtitles to 2160p, which will give them their intended look on any 4k player.

So if anyone out there is working on translations, they will not make the cutoff for version 10.1 unless they’re done within about a week!

From what I’ve been able to determine from ripping my own UHD discs, they do not seem to use 2160p PGS streams. They’re 1080p like standard Blu Ray.

If I had some gum, I’d chew a hole into the sun…

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You are correct! UHD is still 1080p for subtitles, so maybe the urgency isn’t really there. Faithwyn did discover what must be a bug in Cyberlink PowerDVD 16 with 1080p subs on 4K video though.

So maybe 4K subs aren’t actually needed at all (it is just text after all). Nevertheless it’ll be nice to have the capability, should there be a need. I’m thinking there may actually be a use for some of the 35mm theatrical alien subs in native 4K (I’m in the process of grabbing some new ones from 4K77 now). Not so sure about the others except to have them in the Super Awesomest High Resolution for MKV’s. Cause they really do look pretty sharp, when your eyeball is right up against the screen.

But I’ve also been sitting on changes to this project for going on two years, and the changes are certainly significant enough to warrant a release. So a newer version is well overdue, even if the 4K business isn’t really a thing.

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Project files have been updated to version 10.1 (codename: “Just Say Noto!”), first post has been updated, please PM me for temporary download links until the files are available at some more permanent locations.

Nearly two years in the making*, Project Threepio 10.1 most noticeably features big cosmetic changes, but it also includes major and minor underlying improvements in several languages. We’re also seeing some payoff from things implemented long ago. The extensive scripting allowed me to swap out fonts with relative ease. Then there’s Operation Eyestrain, which for our newer readers was a painful procedure circa 2014 where volunteers went through images and OCR’d text in Chinese, Japanese, Thai, etc, and manually corrected the text character-by-character – usually without knowing anything at all about the language they were working with. The idea behind it was that if we did a good enough job, we’d attract people who actually knew the languages, and who could then provide further corrections, or even better translations. And sure enough, Project Threepio now has some entirely new translations in both Hebrew and Arabic!

Rough summary of changes from 10.0 to 10.1:

  • Fonts for all graphical subtitles (except matching subs) have been changed to use the Noto family of fonts – decreasing the size, but increasing the weight, which I hope improves readability and visual consistency, while also giving a more polished, professional feel.
  • More improvements to Brazilian Portuguese subtitles (thanks to lucaslslopes)
  • Some Spanish typos fixed (thanks to carlosmon)
  • All-new Arabic translations (ESB and ROTJ only, thanks to RashadShehadeh)
  • All-new Hebrew translations (thanks to ZIPC)
  • Added Turkish “titles” subs to accompany the Turkish dub. These subtitles are designed to work with the complete audio tracks, and the Turkish dub of Empire is still incomplete at the moment, so the section that isn’t dubbed due to missing source material is not subtitled
  • Lots of minor timing adjustments. For example, there were a few places with awkward subtitle breaks, due to me using a “same timing for most languages” approach. German and Indonesian are wordy and require extra subtitle breaks, but most of the other languages needlessly got those same subtitle breaks too. I relaxed this rule a little to make a few subtitles less awkward for the other languages.
  • SDH subtitles have been overhauled and now contain many more “atmospheric” cues – no longer merely those necessary to understand the film. The solid black SDH background has also been replaced with a semitransparent dark background, which is designed to be more inobtrusive without compromising readability. This semitransparency is not available on DVD downscales due to format limitations, so these still use the opaque black background.
  • Scripts, utilities, and instructions have been updated to support 4K projects. Please note that UHD (4K) Blu-rays still use 1080p subtitles, so while I have added instructions about how to burn UHD Blu-rays, you will still need to use 1080p subtitles with them. However, you can now upscale 1080p subtitles to 2160p if needed for some other purpose.
  • The HELP_WANTED file now asks for help with creating a descriptive audio track for the visually impaired. It’s not technically part of Project Threepio, but it is the biggest gap in our overall objective of making these historic films as accessible as possible. We have scripts, we have soundtracks, we have audio editors standing by – what we don’t yet have is the voice talent. Applicants please send me a PM, and also while you’re at it, please be Mark Hamill.

* This doesn’t mean I’ve been busily working on this for two years, just that I made some of these changes a long time ago and you’re just now seeing them. Sorry about that – time flies!

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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Hi!

Greetings from Sweden! Could someone help me get the swedish subs for episode 5 and 6? I want to look at the movies with my daughter 😄

Regards
Mikael

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PM sent. This package is distributed with all films and all languages, in all formats, plus utility scripts, so it’s big!

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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CatBus said:

  • The HELP_WANTED file now asks for help with creating a descriptive audio track for the visually impaired. It’s not technically part of Project Threepio, but it is the biggest gap in our overall objective of making these historic films as accessible as possible. We have scripts, we have soundtracks, we have audio editors standing by – what we don’t yet have is the voice talent. Applicants please send me a PM, and also while you’re at it, please be Mark Hamill.

Have we had US forum members check their local library or library the blind for narrated VHS’s of Jedi and Empire? I checked mine, and they only had Star Wars (which we already have a copy of). A caveat: some libraries require you to be blind or disabled to get materials loaned to you, so don’t try and use the service if you aren’t.

Star Trek: The Motion Picture - Director’s Edition HD Recreation
Duel (1971) - The Hybrid Cut
The Phantom of the Opera - 1925 Version Reconstruction - Rare Scores Collection - Roy Budd Score

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Yes, we have all of those (some are SE), and that’s where our scripts came from, by and large. The trick is that the audio quality is actually pretty bad on all of them, and I’ve concluded it’s not worth despecializing them. If you’re watching an audio-only version of Star Wars, a subpar soundtrack seems kinda insulting. Also, some of the voiceovers get stuff just plain wrong or are SE-specific, and I just can’t tolerate that.

My plan? Record an all-new voiceover track (essentially mono), which could then be placed over any track you like. Probably a nice top-quality Laserdisc-based stereo track, but could also be the mono mix or even a 5.1 mix.

EDIT: The discussion on this topic is here for some more history & details.

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CatBus said:

Yes, we have all of those (some are SE), and that’s where our scripts came from, by and large. The trick is that the audio quality is actually pretty bad on all of them, and I’ve concluded it’s not worth despecializing them. If you’re watching an audio-only version of Star Wars, a subpar soundtrack seems kinda insulting. Also, some of the voiceovers get stuff just plain wrong or are SE-specific, and I just can’t tolerate that.

My plan? Record an all-new voiceover track (essentially mono), which could then be placed over any track you like. Probably a nice top-quality Laserdisc-based stereo track, but could also be the mono mix or even a 5.1 mix.

For Empire and Jedi, I remember only having muddy sounding 97 SE’s and 2011 ones, but for Star Wars we have a decent sounding one synced to the original release. Or does it have more issues? I figure they had to have made similar versions for Jedi and Empire, which would certainly be better than having nothing synced up. Of course, if we get a nice sounding voice actor, making a new one is a great idea.

Star Trek: The Motion Picture - Director’s Edition HD Recreation
Duel (1971) - The Hybrid Cut
The Phantom of the Opera - 1925 Version Reconstruction - Rare Scores Collection - Roy Budd Score

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Star Wars also has problems (and had at least one SE section as well if I recall, which is weird and I removed it, maybe someone patched it over?). None of them are audio showcases in the least, if you listen carefully and expect to be blown away by an awesome soundtrack. I’m willing to wait YEARS for voice talent so that we can make that happen. What’s a few more? But I don’t want to wait just because nobody knows we need the help.

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I thought of trying to get a sympathetic person from librivox (public domain audio-book recordings) to do it, but it might be tricky to advertise, because the project is very clear about not using copyrighted materials. We could try DM-ing people individually.

Another option, after searching around I found there are people who do audio books for fanfiction: https://archiveofourown.org/tags/Audio Book/works. We could find one with a decent voice and mic, and reach out to the person.

Star Trek: The Motion Picture - Director’s Edition HD Recreation
Duel (1971) - The Hybrid Cut
The Phantom of the Opera - 1925 Version Reconstruction - Rare Scores Collection - Roy Budd Score

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I looked through several scenes with the new 10.1 subtitles, and they look really nice! Thank you CatBus for all your great work!

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Hooray! I was afraid the font change would not go over well, but it seems people are liking it.

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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Heeey, over here! This guy wants to see the awesome new changes to the font as well! 😄