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Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo — Page 865

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Mrebo said:

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

Possessed said:

Warbler said:

Mrebo said:

dahmage said:

Mrebo said:

Frank your Majesty said:

Mrebo said:

For whatever reason people are misunderstanding the Warb. It wasn’t just that a woman leads a show. He didn’t like that a sociopolitical agenda was, at least in part, deciding the future of the show. And to be sure such an agenda was partly behind the gender switch. He’s been thus far happy the show isn’t making a big deal about it. Although, not making a fuss about it easily falls into the category of feminist agenda. Also, the show has been dominated by sociopolitical agendas for awhile now, so it’s rather late to complain overmuch about it.

To answer Frank seriously, if a long-established show returned to the air with committed Christian showrunners and they announced the star character was going to convert to Christianity, I bet you many people would be offended by the pereceived Christian agenda.

There is still a difference between making the protagonist a devoted Christian and making them a person that appeals to Christians (i.e. having strong family values). Likewise, having a female lead is something that appeals to feminists, but that doesn’t mean the main character has to be overly feminist.

Sure, and Warb has recognized the distinction you draw. It was that recognition by him that led to the current discussion.

Constructing an apt and non-controversial analogy is nigh impossible, but there are choices Christian showrunners could make that would create consternation depending on the previous characterization of a protagonist. Having a Christian character is no guarantee the show will portray Christian values either.

I agree that a woman doctor is not the sine qua non of a feminist agenda and as I said the show has already displayed a feminist agenda.

are you warbs spokesperson?

Thank you for your interest. Here at Warb Inc., we strive to provide excellent customer service and effective communications strategies. While your resume shows you have participated in communication campaigns in the past we are looking for someone who can generate original content. We wish you the best in your future endeavors.

Warb Inc.? I do not recall opening a company by that name. I do remember having a company by the name of WARBLER.,INC.™©®, but that company has long since closed.

Warbler did you just make a wisecrack? There might be some hope for you yet!

I too was impressed!!

Except you can’t copyright a name.

There’s an opening in the legal department, welcome. In addition to your previously demonstrated skill, we require only that you occasionally use proper capitalization/ punctuation and conceal boatloads of money.

hell no bro

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CatBus said:

Ultimately this doesn’t matter at all. It merely proves that an old family story (which are often untrue) turns out to be supported by evidence in this particular case. Or at least as much as it can be with today’s genetics testing. And not a cheap 23andme genetics-mill test either, but a genuine blind test by an expert at Stanford.

But it is interesting in this context:

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2018/07/05/trump_offers_1_million_for_pocahontas_elizabeth_warren_to_take_dna_test.html

Trump’s response? “I didn’t say that. You better read it again.”

Here’s what he literally said: “I will give you a million dollars to your favorite charity, paid for by Trump, if you take the test and it shows you’re an Indian.” And here’s how you can parse those words to avoid payment – the test merely proved that the genetic evidence is consistent with everything Warren’s parents told her. But it does not prove she’s genetically 100% from the geographic area currently comprised of India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh – to the contrary, there’s no evidence of East Indian background at all. So there, he doesn’t have to pay, nyaa nyaa and so on. That’s some expert-level reneging there.

But maybe he’ll sent a crack team of investigators to Hawaii, because I hear that’s an effective way to counter this sort of thing. Oh, and I’m absolutely certain people will continue to make fun of her heritage, because it was always about her politics and making fun of Native Americans and was never really about the truth of the story her parents told her.

This strikes me as a huge miscalculation on Warren’s part. You can’t win against Trump by playing his game.

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Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

Mrebo said:
To answer Frank seriously, if a long-established show returned to the air with committed Christian showrunners and they announced the star character was going to convert to Christianity, I bet you many people would be offended by the pereceived Christian agenda.

That is a terrible analogy. Being Christian is a philosophical choice. Being a female isn’t. Thus, having the doctor convert to Christianity would mean the show was making a social statement, by associating the wise sage with Christianity. By contrast, for decades many Who fans have mused whether it might be fun/interesting if the doctor were a woman. Totally different scenario.

Other examples (similar to the doctor being a woman) would be if the doctor were: black, Asian, overweight, blind, some other non-humanoid species, etc.

Other examples (like yours) would be if the doctor were: Democrat, Republican, Nazi, Jewish, Pastaferian, etc.

See the difference? That’s why screaming “feminist agenda!” every time someone brings up something good about a woman gets tiresome after a while. It ascribes philosophical choice to something that is a simple biological trait for half of the human population.

Puggo, that ignores the particular nature of the character at issue here: perpetually a man. It’s not just that some lead character in some show is a woman. Obviously that is not Warb’s objection. He was concerned that the precedent breaking choice to make the Doc a woman was motivated by, and heralded, a feminist agenda. I certainly think making the Doc a woman was partly based on a feminist view. I don’t know why recognition of that is so controversial.

The blue elephant in the room.

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Although I’m a very liberal democrat who generally supports Warren’s views, I find her ongoing claim of having Native American heritage to be an embarrassment at best, and outright fraud at worst. Six-to-ten generations back? Give me a break! Nearly everyone who has ancestors in North America can make that claim WITH substantiation from Ancestry.com. It sounds like she has LESS N.A. blood than the average American. She needs to drop it and apologize. Efforts towards equal opportunity are severely damaged when people - especially those for whom they were not intended - lie and abuse them.

The fact that she is digging in her heels over this has caused her to lose my vote. And seeing left-leaning media outlets still defending her on this is equally disturbing. Actual native Americans must be rolling their eyes.

"Close the blast doors!"
Puggo’s website | Rescuing Star Wars

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TV’s Frink said:

Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

The fact that she is digging in her heels over this has caused her to lose my vote. And seeing left-leaning media outlets still defending her on this is equally disturbing. Actual native Americans must be rolling their eyes.

Which vote of yours did she lose?

Unless he lives in Massachusetts, I don’t know. Personally I think it’s embarrassing to not vote for one of the few anti-corruption Democrats over something this pointless and irrelevant.

The Person in Question

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Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

TV’s Frink said:

Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

The fact that she is digging in her heels over this has caused her to lose my vote. And seeing left-leaning media outlets still defending her on this is equally disturbing. Actual native Americans must be rolling their eyes.

Which vote of yours did she lose?

Assuming she runs for president, that one.

So the primary? Or the general?

Episode I: The Ridiculous Menace / Episode II: Attack Of The Ridiculousness / Episode III: Revenge of the Ridiculousness

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Elizabeth Warren is a genuine progressive. She doesn’t go as far as I would prefer, but she goes far enough for me to support her. Unless she changes those principles to ones that I don’t like, I will support her. I don’t care about a stupid scandal like this, especially since it doesn’t affect her policies at all.

Unless it comes out that she firebombed a children’s hospital, then I see no reason to not vote for her just because of her personal life.

The Person in Question

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moviefreakedmind said:
Personally I think it’s embarrassing to not vote for one of the few anti-corruption Democrats over something this pointless and irrelevant.

I don’t consider it irrelevant. Right now, the Republicans are systematically removing many native Americans from being able to vote. Identifying protected classes, collecting data, securing funding, and then helping those who have been disadvantaged by their demographic is a hallmark of democratic ideals, and takes decades of effort. Warren has made a mockery of it, or at least minimized it and made it a target, by her actions.

I suspect that this whole thing started some time when she was very young. Growing up, my grandmother used to tell me that her grandmother was a squaw named “Hawk”. I thought that was kinda cool (plus my dad and I were in the “Indian Guides”), so I could imagine some 8th grader filling out a demographic questionnaire for the first time, and deciding to be proud of such a “heritage”, and marking the bubble for “native american”. In her case, it seems to have taken on a life of its own. Maybe at some point she got some perk from it? I don’t know, but if she were to become a candidate, the right will make her AND such programs a laughing stock over it. Or, worse yet, that this is an example of the broader democrat hypocrisy and lies.

A long time ago she should have said ok, I did that when I was younger, sorry, and dropped it before it became a thing. She could have even used these test results to say sorry, I was mistaken. That she apparently can’t, is not a great personal trait. But then again, maybe it is… the Donald insists that “deny, deny” is the best strategy, and it seems to work for him.

"Close the blast doors!"
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What about a DNA test to prove Trumpy’s not an Oompa Loompa? How can any normal person be that orange? I thought my tv was out of whack the other day! 😛

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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To follow-up… I can certainly understand someone deciding it’s no big deal (Warren’s questionable claims of NA heritage). But I REALLY don’t understand certain media outlets heralding that these latest DNA results prove that she was right, because they most certainly do not. Quite the contrary.

I hate left-leaning fake stuff even worse than right-leaning fake stuff, because I would like to think that the left holds itself to a higher standard.

"Close the blast doors!"
Puggo’s website | Rescuing Star Wars

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I agree this isn’t something to oppose her for. Doing this DNA thing and supporting a Native casino are silly/craven/ugly political maneuvers but she wants to get this story behind her and show she’s a fighter. That’s not going to play with everyone, but you got to do different things for different constituencies.

I’ve watched Republicans eat their own too and it’s frustrating. On the other side of the coin is engaging in apologetics and ignoring bad and stupid things done by favored politicians. Hard line to walk and not appear hypocritical.

There are many good reasons to oppose Warren, including her feminist agenda, if you know what I mean.

The blue elephant in the room.

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My only opposition to Warren is the fact that she’s not radical enough.

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TV’s Frink said:

Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

TV’s Frink said:

Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

The fact that she is digging in her heels over this has caused her to lose my vote. And seeing left-leaning media outlets still defending her on this is equally disturbing. Actual native Americans must be rolling their eyes.

Which vote of yours did she lose?

Assuming she runs for president, that one.

So the primary? Or the general?

I am hopeful that the dems will come up with some decent alternatives, so I was thinking of the primary. As for the general - if it’s her versus the Donald, then I guess I’d have to admit that I’d have to vote for her. But wouldn’t it be nice if the dems could find someone that people didn’t have to reluctantly vote for - as was the case for many people who voted for Hillary Clinton?

"Close the blast doors!"
Puggo’s website | Rescuing Star Wars

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Comparing Warren to Hillary is really a bad comparison, in my opinion. Warren’s NA scandal is nothing compared to hideous flaws of Hillary Clinton.

The Person in Question

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Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

TV’s Frink said:

Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

TV’s Frink said:

Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

The fact that she is digging in her heels over this has caused her to lose my vote. And seeing left-leaning media outlets still defending her on this is equally disturbing. Actual native Americans must be rolling their eyes.

Which vote of yours did she lose?

Assuming she runs for president, that one.

So the primary? Or the general?

I am hopeful that the dems will come up with some decent alternatives, so I was thinking of the primary. As for the general - if it’s her versus the Donald, then I guess I’d have to admit that I’d have to vote for her. But wouldn’t it be nice if the dems could find someone that people didn’t have to reluctantly vote for - as was the case for many people who voted for Hillary Clinton?

We can only vote for the choices we are given. Forget Trump, would you really vote for someone like Paul Ryan over her?

“Wouldn’t it be nice” isn’t very practical in politics.

Episode I: The Ridiculous Menace / Episode II: Attack Of The Ridiculousness / Episode III: Revenge of the Ridiculousness

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I have no problem with not voting for the lesser of the two evils if that candidate is not in line with the agenda you want enacted, but to not vote for an otherwise progressive candidate based on something that pointless doesn’t jive with me.

The Person in Question

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Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

To follow-up… I can certainly understand someone deciding it’s no big deal (Warren’s questionable claims of NA heritage). But I REALLY don’t understand certain media outlets heralding that these latest DNA results prove that she was right, because they most certainly do not. Quite the contrary.

I hate left-leaning fake stuff even worse than right-leaning fake stuff, because I would like to think that the left holds itself to a higher standard.

Good to have agreement and hope others might recognize this non-partisan view. As for news outlets parroting the story, they might claim ignorance. So many erroneous law and science stories, for example, have been printed based on little more than one person’s statement or misreading of it. News outlets don’t demonstrate critical thinking skills.

I also think it’s a story many outlets want to believe for partisan reasons.

The blue elephant in the room.

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Mrebo said:

https://www.businessinsider.com/young-voters-dont-know-where-to-buy-stamps-for-absentee-ballots-2018-9

I know people love to say that people who say “kids today are lazy” are out-of-touch… but… this is just a Google search away. And you can buy them everywhere. And you can ask literally anybody. I never had a problem figuring this out with my absentee-ballot.

“After a time, you may find that having, is not so pleasing a thing after all, as wanting. It is not logical, but it is often true.” - Spock

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TV’s Frink said:

I mean either way, it’s no wonder we can’t win shit in elections. We eat our own over things like this.

You’ve summed up the entirety of the modern left and its identity politics platform in two sentences.

Democrats would have to run an as-yet-unnamed rock star in 2020 for me to give them my vote. Hillary was the last pity vote they’re getting from me. They need another beating at the ballot box and some more soul-searching.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/politics/2018/10/15/warren-addresses-native-american-issue/YEUaGzsefB0gPBe2AbmSVO/story.html

But the generational range based on the ancestor that the report identified suggests she’s between 1/64th and 1/1,024th Native American.

[Trump] also offered to provide $1 million to her charity of choice if she takes the test.

Trump should call her bluff and donate $15,625 to her favorite charity and tell her he’s giving her the benefit of the doubt at 1/64th if he really wants to humiliate her.

originaltrilogy.com Administrator

The things you pwn end up pwning you.

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Handman said:

Mrebo said:

https://www.businessinsider.com/young-voters-dont-know-where-to-buy-stamps-for-absentee-ballots-2018-9

I know people love to say that people who say “kids today are lazy” are out-of-touch… but… this is just a Google search away. And you can buy them everywhere. And you can ask literally anybody. I never had a problem figuring this out with my absentee-ballot.

I’m surprised requiring a stamp is tolerated. I’d expect shrieking about poll taxes and racism. Would think postage would be prepaid, but I’ve only ever voted in person.

The blue elephant in the room.

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TV’s Frink said:

Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

TV’s Frink said:

Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

TV’s Frink said:

Puggo - Jar Jar’s Yoda said:

The fact that she is digging in her heels over this has caused her to lose my vote. And seeing left-leaning media outlets still defending her on this is equally disturbing. Actual native Americans must be rolling their eyes.

Which vote of yours did she lose?

Assuming she runs for president, that one.

So the primary? Or the general?

I am hopeful that the dems will come up with some decent alternatives, so I was thinking of the primary. As for the general - if it’s her versus the Donald, then I guess I’d have to admit that I’d have to vote for her. But wouldn’t it be nice if the dems could find someone that people didn’t have to reluctantly vote for - as was the case for many people who voted for Hillary Clinton?

We can only vote for the choices we are given. Forget Trump, would you really vote for someone like Paul Ryan over her?

Hmm, you’re not making this easy. Time might temper my views. We’ll see what plays out going forwards, and whether this is an isolated thing. At this moment I find it embarrassing and wrong.

Not that they are necessarily related, but in Rachel Dolezal’s case, it appears to have been a part of a much larger pattern of fraudulent behaviors.

On the flip side, there was a famous singer for Duke Ellington named Herb Jeffries who was white, but passed as black and claimed to be one-half black. He even accepted movie roles in westerns as the “bronze buckaroo”. I played in a backup band for him in one festival about 25 years ago - really nice guy, and later in life he admitted that he was 100% white.

"Close the blast doors!"
Puggo’s website | Rescuing Star Wars