OFFICIAL: Library of Congress had original prints replaced with 1997 SE — Page 3

Wow, this article was a disturbing read. Can ANYTHING be done at this point?

I feel tempted to write Martin Scorsese via that "Ask the Director"-feature on the site of the Film Foundation, but at the same time, it seems this is primarily a job for American citizens as they actually have a say in the matter of preserving the country's cultural heritage.

Wait, I think I know how to fix this. I was looking over the blue prints of Skywalker Ranch a few days ago and noticed that they have a small thermal exhaust port right below the main port.

 

It's only two meters wide though...

That's no thermal exhaust port. That's the drain for Lucas' toilet. He had it installed in 1997, when he suddenly got obsessed by the idea of unleashing his shit onto the unsuspecting world.

I am not surprised. Lucas has done everything to keep the OT from resurfacing. But as Puggo said, we have excellent de-specialized versions, fanedits and preservations.

But what could the LoC have done? Take the film by force? All they can do is ask Lucas for the prints and I admire their balls to decline the offer of the SE.

Lucas is a mastermind for covering all of his tracks. But sooner or later, something will happen that he didn't think of and the OT will be made available, one way or another. I hope he is still alive when that happens to see his plan fail.

Reading this made me feel numb inside. At this point, the only thing that comes to mind when thinking about George Lucas, is this.

I really don't know what to say about this. Granted, the article is a little confusing but the underlying message is abundantly clear. There would seem to be no limits to Lucas' chicanery. He's a madman.

Absolutely sickening! This is culturally & historically so wrong! Surely the laws need to be changed now to protect works of filmic art. What if Lucas gets worse years from now and REALLY tried to screw up the trilogy, or decides to replace it altogether - by replacing large chunks of it with CGI - will he be able to get away with it? At the moment - yes!

Honestly, if people like Rick McCallum and others who work for Lucas have a SHRED of integrity left - and realise the importance of preserving all films as they originally were seen - they should stand up to the man, and just walk out now!

Enough is enough now - the man has turned into a true megalomaniac!

The only way around this is by changing the law - how do we proceed with that?...

As english is not my language I had some trouble to follow the article.

From what I understand:

The LoC have old 35mm prints of at least SW and ESB, but in very poor condition (scratches, faded colors). They asked for new prints to Lucasfilm, who proposed the 97 SE "instead". LoC would also like to preserv the 97 SE, indeed, but it was not what they were asking, so they declined the offer.

So the old, poor and unexploitable prints are all the LoC have.

Am I right?

TMBTM said:

As english is not my language I had some trouble to follow the article.

From what I understand:

The LoC have old 35mm prints of at least SW and ESB, but in very poor condition (scratches, faded colors). They asked for new prints to Lucasfilm, who proposed the 97 SE "instead". LoC would also like to preserv the 97 SE, indeed, but it was not what they were asking, so they declined the offer.

So the old, poor and unexploitable prints are all the LoC have.

Am I right?

That was my understanding of it. If this is the case, it's basically a win-win scenario for Lucas as the original prints would seem to not be available for public screening. I still find his behaviour baffling and, frankly, unacceptable. He's wheezed on about 'they're my movies' for so long the Lucas fanboys have accepted this as a mantra and refuse to acknowledge that he's fucking around with something that had a huge cultural impact simply because they're either too young to have seen the original versions in cinemas or, more probably, that they just want a 'quick fix' and be able to look at their SW BD box on their shelf and think 'right, that's that done...'

Unfortunately, the opinion here that the OOT should be preserved and released along with his subsequent atrocities would seem to be in the minority, which is a shame.

Enough is enough with all this nonsense from Lucas. He's acting like a petulant little child with these films, and damaging film history too. He's also setting a bad precedent for present/future directors to treat their films in exactly the same way. Imagine if everyone was this selfish - they'd be no original films to archive!!!

I'm desperately thinking of ways to swings things around to our favour again. The only way I can think of is to create a comprehensive list of ALL the people whose work has been changed/altered/deleted in the trilogy. A real thorough list with screen caps/comparisons. Try to find their addresses, or their agents, and send them a petition to sign stating that these films NEED to be preserved, along with the valuable work you guys did to them.

We also need to get some celebrities batting for us too - Simon Pegg would be an obvious contender, and I'm sure there are others who would be all to pleased to aid in breaking Lucas' stranglehold on the original films.  Phil Tippett is also not impressed by Lucas' tinkering with the films - I'm sure he'd be another valuable voice.

Perhaps someone could put together a youtube video CLEARLY showing the nonsense as it's happened over the years. Like 1997 - and show the shite Jabba. Show Greedo shooting first. Then 2004 - the slightly better but still fake looking Jabba. Revised Greedo shooting. Then the 2011 re-re-revision. 2011 R2 rocks. Oh the rocks have disappeared. etc etc. Something to really hammer home how random & badly done all these changes are. Perhaps add in Lucas's voice over about preserving films too whilst all these changes are being shown...

This could be part of the Save Star Wars button/sticker campaign - we need to get coverage on this. At the end of the day the more people that know about this, and understand the issues, the more people we have on our side... and that's half the battle!

Zoran Sinobad said: "While both STAR WARS (1977) and THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK (1980) are on the National Film Registry, the Library has not yet acquired new prints of either one."

New prints? Does that imply they have old prints of SW and ESB?

Zoran Sinobad said: "When the request was made for STAR WARS, Lucasfilm offered us the Special Edition version. The offer was declined as this was obviously not the version that had been selected for the Registry. We have not yet requested a print of THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK, added to the Registry late last year."

So the only film, they requested a new print for so far, was SW. Alas, they were only offered the Special Edition of SW, which they declined.

Zoran Sinobad said: "The Library of Congress does hold the original release versions of STAR WARS, THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK and RETURN OF THE JEDI, but these 35mm prints were acquired as copyright deposits in March 1978, October 1980, and June 1983 respectively. All three are classified as archival masters and as such cannot be accessed for viewing/research."

So they additionally have a 35mm print of SW, ESB and ROTJ. Only problem being that those are declared archival masters, which basically means these must not be accessed for viewing/research.

Zoran Sinobad said: "The existing condition reports for STAR WARS and THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK (there is no report for RETURN OF THE JEDI) indicate that the former has minor scratches but is in good shape overall, while the latter has extreme color fading."

I presume this refers to the state of the copyright deposits, which have status of archival masters (as mentioned just above).

Zoran Sinobad said: "We also have an additional 35mm print of the original STAR WARS (received June 1979) with English subtitles for the deaf."

Then there seems to be yet another 35mm print of SW with english subtitles for the deaf (what status does this one have? also archival master?). These probably wouldn't be very useful for a restoration, since I assume the subtitles for the deaf are on the print. On the other hand, the sound could still be used.

So, by my math this does result into:

1 old print of each SW and ESB as regular material on the national film registry. (Could they be allowed to be accessed for viewing/research?)

1 old print of each SW, ESB and ROTJ as copyright deposits, classified as archival masters (must not be accessed for viewing/research)

1 old print of SW for the hearing impaired, classification unknown.

zombie or someone with "insiders", is it worth reaching out to Robert Harris?

He's said on many occasions he knows of prints out there that are in great condition for a restoration.  Now this man is respected and well connected and has worked on some of the most important films.

Surely what he spoke of isn't these we speak of in this thread? I'm kind of hoping the ones he knows of are in private collectors we don't of, hence Fox and Lucas don't know of. Damn I wish I was loaded, I'd fund RAH to do the restoration secretly.

Asaki wrote: So it seems like everyone has been expecting much more from LoC than they are actually able/willing to do.

The LoC is doing what they were asked, to save the films to the best of their ability. The copyright deposit copies have an uncertain future. When copyright expires they maybe used to preserve. But copyright has to expire before that conversation begins in earnest.

They are under copyright control now, which explains the limited access. The LoC has probably set a very high standard for viewing/researching as the medium is known to degrade through use. (copyright deposit copies from this period of time, late 70s early 80s, tended to be prints which were used in theaters)

Bingowings wrote:

The British Library has to by law be given a copy of any publication with an ISBN number.

Something similar should happen here.

It has and all the films reside in multiple versions in the LoC. That's the LoC Copyright Deposit copies. (the hearing impaired ones are Copyright Desposits) Here are their specs:

1977 - Star Wars
http://lccn.loc.gov/96512247

1980 - Empire Strikes Back
http://lccn.loc.gov/96512208

1983 - Return of the Jedi
http://lccn.loc.gov/96501520

1997 - Star Wars A New Hope Special Edition
http://lccn.loc.gov/97510343

1997 - Empire Strikes Back Special Edition
http://lccn.loc.gov/98502262

1997 - Return of the Jedi Special Edition
http://lccn.loc.gov/2006642053

1999 - The Phantom Menace

http://lccn.loc.gov/99468631

2002 - Attack of the Clones
http://lccn.loc.gov/2002636427

2005 - Revenge of the Sith
http://lccn.loc.gov/2005644161

The second part of this story is the National Film Registry which is under the umbrella of the LoC.  Since most Copyright Desposit copies were given after significant theater use, the NFR went an additional step by asking for newly created prints.  The NFR requested SW in 1989 when the NFR was created. As the title of the article implies (replaced), I think Lucasfilm might have given a 1977 print then, and when SE work began they asked to borrow it. Then when given back, the SE print was slipped in. (don't have anything to confirm this)

Why would it take 10 years for Lucasfilm to give a print in the first place, that doesn't make sense. If Lucasfilm did wait 10 years, the story would have beeen that Lucasfilm doesn't believe in the NFR, and would have expected that story to already have been told. But weirder shit has happened. Hopefully the new article will drag out some people who are in the know, and more facts will emerge.

georgec wrote: I wonder what Katie Lucas' twitter looks like right now...

You should start a thread for your talk about her account. She is very far removed from this topic and will mostly likely never speak about it.

What would happen if the original trilogy actually became lost films? I might as well bring it up, since no one wants to contemplate this.

The problem with Lucas is sadly common with insane persons who have too much power: they bring out the worst in humanity. A filmmaker should not have this much power, which he uses the law to tell people which film to watch and without remorse destroy the other. I can no longer forgive the man.