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Michael Arndt heavily involved in writing the new SW trilogy — Page 4

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That is a reboot, and very cleverly done, touches on all aspects of humanity.....but you are talking of resurrecting a poorly written character which we already know her back story (no surprises) just because you think Star Wars has had the Paternal theme....Now it's the Maternal theme.....instant audience turn-off.

J

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Tyrphanax said:

xhonzi said:

Bingowings said:

If there is a sharp disconnect to appeal to one group it will be as divisive as what George did with the SE and the PT.

I don't think so.

The ways that the OT already doesn't jive with the PT are more likely to continue than not.

What I mean is, Luke isn't asked to become Obi-Wan's padiwan, so Luke has never heard that term, so he isn't likely to use it.  Why would he?*

Luke was not instructed to grow a rat tail upon starting his journey to become a Jedi knight, so how would he know of that tradition?  Why would he start it again?*

Luke's never heard of midichlorians.*

Luke's never heard of the Jedi Council.*

Luke's never seen two jedi break-dance-fight.*

No one in the OT mentions that stormtroopers were/are clones.*

No one mentions Naboo, Mustachefar, or the Genesis Planet.*

No one mentions the rule of two.*

No one told Luke that Jedi can't get married.*

No one told Luke that the prequels sucked.*

Why would any of that come up in the SWST?

 

*yet

 

Obviously in his quest to rebuild the Jedi Order, he would find vast repositories of this information that was once being hidden by the now-defunct Empire.

Hidden or destroyed?

Look, I guess you can say Luke found all of that stuff if you want to.

All I'm saying is- it won't be missed if it's not in there.  It's already not in the OT, so it's natural to leave it out of the SWST too.  It won't feel like an intentional slight if it's not there- they have every excuse to cut out the crappy bits and still have continuity on their side.

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

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Practically the same fan group though.

Same as anything by Joss Whedon (minus Alien 4 probably).

The same group probably like Ripley though.

This isn't the seventies, men have gotten better at accepting women in well written roles without metal bras on.

Sadly George didn't know how to write them.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6Dp2OfIT_M

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Eh, that whole "this is the skywalker family saga" is revisionist stuff from the PT.  This is about Luke and Vader, sure, but to pretend it isn't also about Han and Chewie and Leia and the droids is silly, and missing the point.  Enough with the Jedi being the focus; get back to the rest of the universe which was the fun stuff in the first two movies.

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Also, I think Jaitea's right. Disney already has plenty of girl properties. They specifically went after Marvel and LFL to get "boy" properties.

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Hey I wouldn't mind if they shook things up and we got a kick-ass daughter or apprentice of Luke and she became the main star and it was her trilogy, honestly.....but connecting the weak PT to the ST just to give the girlies a turn?

J

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The weak PT is already connected to the ST via the connecting tissue of the beloved OT.

I really do think avoiding it will make it more conspicuous.

It would be better to try and re-jig your memory of the past for the better while running the new present.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6Dp2OfIT_M

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Bingowings said:

Imrahil said:

Also, I think Jaitea's right. Disney already has plenty of girl properties. They specifically went after Marvel and LFL to get "boy" properties.

Oh that's so cutely retro.

I'm sorry it's so offensive to you (?), but they talked about this explicitly in that shareholder's meeting that they had about the property right after the deal got announced. It's all there in corporate-speak; they wanted a property they could market to boys.  Stories about ghost moms or oedipal complexes isn't going to do it.

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Bingowings said:

The weak PT is already connected to the ST via the connecting tissue of the beloved OT.

I really do think avoiding it will make it more conspicuous.

It would be better to try and re-jig your memory of the past for the better while running the new present.

 

I think you're wrong, and that most people will breathe a huge sigh of relief at leaving the prequels behind.

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xhonzi said:

Tyrphanax said:

xhonzi said:

Bingowings said:

If there is a sharp disconnect to appeal to one group it will be as divisive as what George did with the SE and the PT.

I don't think so.

The ways that the OT already doesn't jive with the PT are more likely to continue than not.

What I mean is, Luke isn't asked to become Obi-Wan's padiwan, so Luke has never heard that term, so he isn't likely to use it.  Why would he?*

Luke was not instructed to grow a rat tail upon starting his journey to become a Jedi knight, so how would he know of that tradition?  Why would he start it again?*

Luke's never heard of midichlorians.*

Luke's never heard of the Jedi Council.*

Luke's never seen two jedi break-dance-fight.*

No one in the OT mentions that stormtroopers were/are clones.*

No one mentions Naboo, Mustachefar, or the Genesis Planet.*

No one mentions the rule of two.*

No one told Luke that Jedi can't get married.*

No one told Luke that the prequels sucked.*

Why would any of that come up in the SWST?

 

*yet

 

Obviously in his quest to rebuild the Jedi Order, he would find vast repositories of this information that was once being hidden by the now-defunct Empire.

Hidden or destroyed?

Look, I guess you can say Luke found all of that stuff if you want to.

All I'm saying is- it won't be missed if it's not in there.  It's already not in the OT, so it's natural to leave it out of the SWST too.  It won't feel like an intentional slight if it's not there- they have every excuse to cut out the crappy bits and still have continuity on their side.

I'm just saying that's the route they took in the EU and likely the route they'd take in the ST (Bingo, your acronym caught on pretty quick) in order to explain all of that new stuff they added after the fact.

Keep Circulating the Tapes.

END OF LINE

(It hasn’t happened yet)

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Now that time has passed, I think its well established that the Prequels weren't any good (apart from what Frink has done with them), the biggest let down in film history, they were full of inconsistencies between the Classic films, they have in fact contaminated the OT across that connective thread, a good business person or a good surgeon would advise to cut the source of the infection off....its the only way to be sure!

J

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Imrahil said:

Eh, that whole "this is the skywalker family saga" is revisionist stuff from the PT.  This is about Luke and Vader, sure, but to pretend it isn't also about Han and Chewie and Leia and the droids is silly, and missing the point.  Enough with the Jedi being the focus; get back to the rest of the universe which was the fun stuff in the first two movies.

This.  A thousand times this.

EDIT to add: I'm sure I'm in a very small minority of SW fans on this, but I am honestly sick of the Jedi.  I have lightsaber fatigue.

Anyone remember different camera angles from ROTJ?

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SpilkaBilka said:

 I'm sure I'm in a very small minority of SW fans on this, but I am honestly sick of the Jedi.  I have lightsaber fatigue.

No youre not alone with that, my favourite character was Han....his type of character (or any type of characters) was sorely missed in the PT

J

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You really need to wait for a spin off because all the Star Wars films are Jedi centred that's what they are.

The smuggler stuff has always been on the side and that's probably why it's so highly regarded because Lucas was too busy making space ninja telekenetic monks with laser swords boring to really screw up that side of the universe.

"Pass on what you have learned", is basically the set up for the ST I would not be shocked if Leia turning bad is too but you can forget forgetting the Jedi stuff.

The toys and games that sell the most are Jedi and starfighter based, the Kenner Falcon was cool but did you try pretending to fight space battles with a heavy plastic tray in two hands?

And all the kids in my street have lightsabers not laser guns, this is eight years after the last Star Wars movie (one of the crap ones I may add).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6Dp2OfIT_M

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As much as I am in support of more well written characters who are female in the Star Wars films I have to say Padme isn't the way to go. At all. I'm fine if she's in the next films a little bit, like a pic on the wall or Luke or Leia going through old archive footage for a bit. Basing an entire trilogy on her though? No. It'll just contrive things into convolution. Wasting chunks of time to explain the hows and whys she either becomes a force ghost or came back from the dead. Her story is a dead end, literally, she's dead get over it.

Though I appreciate the hilarity of the potential irony that she could become a character able to get slashed up by a building sized creature on her back, survive a fall from a high flying vehicle afterwards, and become a force ghost while other lifelong force users were unable to. Yet the thing that killed her was that she just didn't give a fuck anymore and wanted to die.

"She's lost the will to live"
Padme - "Damn straight, I just don't give a fuck anymore. See you later as a blue transparent ghost thingy! Bye!"
Obi-wan - "Wait! What blue ghost thingy?????"
Yoda - "I'll tell you after she gives birth. Oh wait forgot I did that you me telling about things has to be messed up. *clears throat* Ahem, she will give birth afterwards I'll tell you."

Anyways yeah just create some new female characters without all the baggage of trying to contrive ways that she just happens to be showing up now of all times.


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Bingowings said:

You really need to wait for a spin off because all the Star Wars films are Jedi centred that's what they are.

The OT wasn't. It was character-centered. One of them just happened to be a Jedi-in-training.  Luke was a hero on a journey, but his wasn't the only story going on.

The toys and games that sell the most are Jedi and starfighter based, the Kenner Falcon was cool but did you try pretending to fight space battles with a heavy plastic tray in two hands?

Based on what, exactly, are you making this claim?  The Lego stuff sells huge, and that's a LOT of spaceships and vehicles.  There are jedi characters, but it's not giant lightsabers that people are building.

And all the kids in my street have lightsabers not laser guns, this is eight years after the last Star Wars movie (one of the crap ones I may add).

Yep, the Clone Wars is popular with little kids; that sells lightsabers. When I was a kid we all had the plastic lightsaber toy and never played with it. But you should've seen how beat up our Han and Stormtrooper blasters were.

You make a movie that's about non-Jedi, and guess what? People are interested in playing with non-Jedi toys.  Your argument (and it is an argument, an opinion, not fact--despite how you present it) is based on a flawed concept: "It is the way it is now because it always has been."  That's patently untrue.

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Luke, Yoda, Ben, Palpatine and Vader are all Jedish (the implication is that Leia is too).

The bulk of the good guys are Force devotees even when they aren't Jedi.

I always present my case as opinion because it's a discussion board ergo my lack of IMHO.

Your opinion is an opinion as well but it's not one that holds up to much scrutiny.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6Dp2OfIT_M

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twister111 said:

As much as I am in support of more well written characters who are female in the Star Wars films I have to say Padme isn't the way to go. At all. I'm fine if she's in the next films a little bit, like a pic on the wall or Luke or Leia going through old archive footage for a bit. Basing an entire trilogy on her though? No. It'll just contrive things into convolution. Wasting chunks of time to explain the hows and whys she either becomes a force ghost or came back from the dead. Her story is a dead end, literally, she's dead get over it.

Though I appreciate the hilarity of the potential irony that she could become a character able to get slashed up by a building sized creature on her back, survive a fall from a high flying vehicle afterwards, and become a force ghost while other lifelong force users were unable to. Yet the thing that killed her was that she just didn't give a fuck anymore and wanted to die.

"She's lost the will to live"
Padme - "Damn straight, I just don't give a fuck anymore. See you later as a blue transparent ghost thingy! Bye!"
Obi-wan - "Wait! What blue ghost thingy?????"
Yoda - "I'll tell you after she gives birth. Oh wait forgot I did that you me telling about things has to be messed up. *clears throat* Ahem, she will give birth afterwards I'll tell you."

Anyways yeah just create some new female characters without all the baggage of trying to contrive ways that she just happens to be showing up now of all times.


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I wasn't necessarily talking a full on character revival.

One of the reasons why the PT is such a let down is Anakin is a real git from the get go so in a sense he is always Vader.

If Leia is prompted by some recordings or writings of her mother's which present her in a new light or to make decisions which effect the new characters particularly the female ones it would be a way of extending the story from what we have rather than shooting up from somewhere else which is the sort of thing that's fun in a spin off but not in the next episode in the series.

I find myself having to defend an abstract potential story idea from all sides which is strange seeing as I'm not writing episode VII to your relief.

But I am beginning to get a feeling for why the forum sometimes gets a funny rap.

As much as we would have preferred the PT to be different it happened.

They are episodes 1 to 3.

Get over it! 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6Dp2OfIT_M

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Bingowings said:

I'm not writing episode VII to your relief.

Well considering how passionate you seem to be about this idea. I'd actually be interested in just how you would do a film like the one you're describing while maintaining the Star Wars feel. I actually feel it's a bit of a shame that we can't just have a theoretical peek into an alternate universe where you did make that film. Afterall we can only imagine how your passion behind this idea would translate to the screen and that is a shame.

Bingowings said:

If Leia is prompted by some recordings or writings of her mother's which present her in a new light or to make decisions which effect the new characters particularly the female ones it would be a way of extending the story from what we have rather than shooting up from somewhere else which is the sort of thing that's fun in a spin off but not in the next episode in the series.

That's interesting not sure it would entirely fit with the Star Wars feel. It's at least better than just having to contrive some reason for her to be a force ghost, or a zombie....

Bingowings said:

But I am beginning to get a feeling for why the forum sometimes gets a funny rap.

As much as we would have preferred the PT to be different it happened.

They are episodes 1 to 3.

Get over it! 

Meh I am over it. Been over it for a long time. I just don't really consider them the actual Star Wars story. I know my personal canon of Star Wars, Empire Strikes Back, and Return of the Jedi original theatrical versions don't mesh with the official canon. I don't care. It's just fun to make jokes with the official canon stuff.

In essence official canon Luke and Leia's Grandma got down with some bacteria to make their Father. My personal canon Luke and Leia's grandparents aren't shown so I can imagine whatever the hell I want about them.

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Bingowings said:

Luke, Yoda, Ben, Palpatine and Vader are all Jedish (the implication is that Leia is too).

The bulk of the good guys are Force devotees even when they aren't Jedi.

I always present my case as opinion because it's a discussion board ergo my lack of IMHO.

Your opinion is an opinion as well but it's not one that holds up to much scrutiny.

I'd hardly call Yoda and Palpatine main characters. They're essentially story prompts.  So is Ben really; his "jedish" nature is less important than his role as a guardian and mentor for Luke.  Palpatine is a cartoon, not a character.

I'm not saying the force and jedi didn't exist in the OT (as you seem to be straw manning). I'm saying that there are tons of important characters who get a lot more development who have nothing to do with it.  Leia may be "implied" to be in one of their number, but it never materializes and thus isn't a part of her character.

Your opinion seems angry, arrogant, and pushy. Maybe I'm misreading you.

I know the prequels happened. So what? That's like saying, "You know, all war movies MUST have references to the Crimean War in them. That HAPPENED, whether you like it or not."  The prequels will be 60 years in the past of these new movies, if the rumors are to be believed--80 years for the first one.  Why would the events in them still have to be constantly referenced?  Do you constantly find references to 1932 in your everyday life?

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I can settle this. Which trilogy is more popular?

The trilogy that features a retired Jedi in one film (Kenobi), and an instructor Jedi in another film (Yoda), and basically no Jedi in the third film (Kenobi and Yoda dead, Luke not a Jedi until the end)?

OR

The trilogy that features hundreds of Jedi, often all onscreen at once (Clone Wars), with many of the main characters being Jedi or Padawans in the Official Jed Training Program (Mace Windu, Kenobi, Anakin, Yoda, Ki-Adi-Mundi, Qui Gon Jin, and many others in supporting roles), where one of the re-appearing locations is the Jedi Temple, and where issues surrounding the Jedi order and how it operates and it's future are constantly being discussed?

There is actually an inverse relationship to the popularity of the Star Wars trilogies and how much Jedi figure into them. The original trilogy wasn't much about Jedi, and everyone loves it and wants to see more of it. The prequel trilogy was almost exclusively about Jedi, in almost every scene, and it sucked and no one wants to see any more of that. If anyone is excited for the sequel trilogy it's because it's a sequel to the original trilogy, not because it's connected to the prequels in any way. And there is no reason why they need to be. I expect them to reference the prequels once in a while and perhaps include some things introduced there, I guess; but there is no reason why they have to be similar to them or heavily connected to them, especially when they aren't popular.

Part of the lesson of the 6-episode series that we have is that the Jedi were idiots and were corrupted, and Luke succeeds because he DOESN'T follow their tradition. He rejects a lot of their fundamentals, like being older, being attached to people, etc. and becomes the greatest Jedi because he focuses on his attachment and that love is what saves him and heals the galaxy. He stands poised as a reformer who can re-shape the new Jedi order to be different than the flawed one of the past and break with their silly rules and traditions, so it makes sense from a story point of view that the prequel influence not be felt strongly.

The Secret History of Star Wars -- now available on Amazon.com!

"When George went back and put new creatures into the original Star Wars, I find that disturbing. It’s a revision of history. That bothers me."

--James Cameron, Entertainment Weekly, April 2010

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zombie84 said:

Part of the lesson of the 6-episode series that we have is that the Jedi were idiots and were corrupted, and Luke succeeds because he DOESN'T follow their tradition. He rejects a lot of their fundamentals, like being older, being attached to people, etc. and becomes the greatest Jedi because he focuses on his attachment and that love is what saves him and heals the galaxy. He stands poised as a reformer who can re-shape the new Jedi order to be different than the flawed one of the past and break with their silly rules and traditions, so it makes sense from a story point of view that the prequel influence not be felt strongly.

Basically this is my theory as well.

Keep Circulating the Tapes.

END OF LINE

(It hasn’t happened yet)