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Idea: MY phantom edit

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so I’ve often wondered what I would do in an edit of TPM.

Change the crawl, thats for sure. Nix the second sea monster, put back in some of the better deleted scenes… but what else.

I fall into the catagorey of fans that dislike AOTC more then TPM. Not that TPM is perfect, but I’ve always felt the issues with it were mostly conceptual, and not editorial. Anakin should of been older. Naboo should of been Alderaan, Obi-wan should of filled Qui-gon’s role, etc.

Still though, having recently completed edits of AOTC and ROTS, the temptation was there to do something with TPM. Both my other two prequel edits were greatly shortened, AotC down to 1h 45m, rots to 1h 50m. TPM could actually end up being longer, with the deleted scenes added and no Major sequences deleted from the movie. Watching it again recently, it did strike me how slow a movie it is, so adding running time does not seem advantagious.

But what to remove?

Simply cutting all of Jar jar’s dialogue does not seem logical to me, as many people have done in the past. Although he will have some trims here and there.

So then it hit me…

Delete all of darth sidious’ scenes.

I know I know, this seems absolutely ridiculous. and those scenes were to many the high points of the movie. But still, I always like to be contraversial, and and if I’m going to do an edit, I want to do something substancial.

The way I see it, if Palpatine appears, but sidious does not, this perserves the darklord’s identity all the way up to the end of AotC. ANd though it makes TPM a much less dark film, that sort of fits in a way as the first episode. So darth Maul would be the only darker element in the film.

I’m sure this will leave me open to critism, and I’m all for it. I’d like to get people’s thoughts on this before I go ahead with it.

And I dance. And I sing.
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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So many edits are much improved versions, but still kind of drag on a bit. I'd like to see a bare bones version where the prequels are only like 1 - 1 1/2 hours long. I don't mind the originals in length simply because they are character based. George got away from that and just went for the visual... Just a thought.

Galatians 2: 20: I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

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Thats how I see it as well, and thats why both my other prequel edits are well under 2hours.

DO IT !!! I'D LIKE TO SEE SOMETHING DIFFERENT.


DIfferent is always what I aim for
And I dance. And I sing.
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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Wanna do something controversial? Take out all of the cool parts and make it like a G rated kids movie.... all Jar-Jar er something!

Galatians 2: 20: I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

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Lose the whole sea monster bit. It was crap. They should just get in the sub and cut to them surfacing in Naboo City.

War does not make one great.

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I like the first bit with the monster attacking them and the bigger fish eatting it. But then there's a lot of things I like in TPM that most people hate

Wanna do something controversial? Take out all of the cool parts and make it like a G rated kids movie.... all Jar-Jar er something!


actually thats kind of the way I'm leaning
And I dance. And I sing.
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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Originally posted by: Rebel Scumb
I fall into the catagorey of fans that dislike AOTC more then TPM. Not that TPM is perfect, but I've always felt the issues with it were mostly conceptual, and not editorial. Anakin should of been older. Naboo should of been Alderaan, Obi-wan should of filled Qui-gon's role, etc.

Agreed, which is unfortunate when you consider how much can be improved through the power of editing these days. I'd totally encourage you to edit TPM and complete your trilogy of prequel edits. From what I've read yours seem to change the most overall plot, and while I'm not yet sure if it's for better or worse, like PSYCHO_DAYV said it's always nice to see something different.

As far as specifics go, without Sidious instagating most of the plot things might be rather confusing. For instance, the actions of the Trade Federation, and purpose of Darth Maul. Of course when you look at it this way the story would seem to be from the heros point of view, as they have no clear answers to those question either.
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Combine Eps 1 and 2, then you will be a man. It'll be called "Attack of the Phantom" and start with the jedi running out of gas and needing to stop on tatooine with the queen's ship. The back-story of why they're in this situation need not be given since it's pretty clear they're just running away from some assassin. We didn't need so much boring stuff to establish this. They find anakin, bla bla bla, everything goes almost exactly the same until we get to the end "Your apprentice, Skywalker will be." Use the new cgi yoda for this, though. The original looks like yoda's grandfather. Blank screen, blue letters, ten years later in a galaxy, far far away.... The queen's ship comes in for a landing on coruscant as usual, all hell happens, the jedi police are called. Whatever your ep 2 edit is could probably fit in here and that's all.

Yes, this could be epic, like the first 3 hour star wars movie. Take this pony and ride it, man.
He big in nothing important in good elephant.

"Miss you, I will, Original Trilogy..."

"Your midichlorians are weak, Old man." -Darth Vader 2007 super deluxe extra special dipped in chocolate sauce edition.

http://prequelsstink.ytmnd.com/
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Originally posted by: Commander Courage
Originally posted by: Rebel Scumb
I fall into the catagorey of fans that dislike AOTC more then TPM. Not that TPM is perfect, but I've always felt the issues with it were mostly conceptual, and not editorial. Anakin should of been older. Naboo should of been Alderaan, Obi-wan should of filled Qui-gon's role, etc.

Agreed, which is unfortunate when you consider how much can be improved through the power of editing these days. I'd totally encourage you to edit TPM and complete your trilogy of prequel edits. From what I've read yours seem to change the most overall plot, and while I'm not yet sure if it's for better or worse, like PSYCHO_DAYV said it's always nice to see something different.

As far as specifics go, without Sidious instagating most of the plot things might be rather confusing. For instance, the actions of the Trade Federation, and purpose of Darth Maul. Of course when you look at it this way the story would seem to be from the heros point of view, as they have no clear answers to those question either.


YOU DIDN'T REALLY KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE EMPIRE WHEN YOU SAW VADER APPEAR. THE SAME COULD BE SAID ABOUT MAUL AND THE TRADE FEDERATION. IT WOULD ALMOST MAKE IT LOOK LIKE THE TRADE IS THE PRECURSOR OF THE EMPIRE. THE BAD GUYS ALWAYS HAVE A SITH LORD IN TOW.

"I'VE GROWN TIRED OF ASKING, SO THIS WILL BE THE LAST TIME..."
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I'm in the same boat as the other TPM fans-- it's better than AOTC for me, mostly because of Liam Neeson, the pod race, and the incredible duel in the end.

I never once considered the idea proposed here -- but I have to say I LOVE IT!!

Yes, it probably will cause continuity problems-- but the mystery of what the Trade Federation is doing and where Darth Maul comes from will vastly improve the FEELING of that story. Being stuck in the Jedi's shoes, not knowing what the hell is going on is EXACTLY how the story should have been told. I can't believe I never saw this before.

What will need to happen is that the Trade Federation will have to appear stronger, more self-reliant, smart and vast. Darth Maul will be their assistant, provided by a secret sponsor (Sidious) whom is only referred to in passing. Then, Qui Gon's funeral will be full of suspense -- "What the hell was that? A Sith? What the F*** is going on!?" Then we pan over to Palpatine... Excellent.

The other issue to address possibly is making Anakin's final space-ship battle connect with the death of Qui Gon-- I wish someone could use editing to make it seem Anakin feels Qui Gon's death and that he CUTS LOOSE with the torpedoes in an act of wrath and fury over this feeling in the Force.

Do these two things and make the aliens talk alien (which will sure help cover the loss of Sidious) and you may have the best Episode I yet!!

Great idea!!

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I don't think alien dubbing and subtitling is one of Rebel Scumb's methods, and if he does it it 1 he'd have to go back to his 2 and 3 edits and do it there as well.

Also, you know I am in complete agreement with your stance on the Anakin/Qui-Gon connection at the end of Episode 1. Rest assured if no one else gets around to making those alterations, Trooperman is definitely going to address it when it comes time for his edit 2 years from now.
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Commander Courage: "Rest assured if no one else gets around to making those alterations, Trooperman is definitely going to address it when it comes time for his edit 2 years from now."

***

AHHH! Who can wait?

Well-- Rebel Scumb has really bitten off a challenge by limiting the footage and dialogue to what's available. Perhaps there's a way to cover continuity-- but the slovenly, cowardly Trade Federation will always sound weak, I'm afraid.

Still-- Onward! I love this idea!

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I actually really like the Nemodians and how weak and foolish they are. Its one of the few things I think Lucas got bang on for the prequels, I love nute as a character.

I have changed subtitles in ep2 to change some plot stuff around, and even to do some foreshadowing to general grievous for ep3.

Glad to see all the support in this thread, I was actually expecting a lot more skeptism. Makes me eager to get to work on it.

Though my obligation to the my own film that I am cutting together at the moment must always come first, I do enjoy doing these fan edits a plenty. I'm still eager to do my Katie Holmesless version of BATMAN BEGINS, and the epic task of making one good movie out of Matrix 2 and 3

and then there's always my custom edit of the LOTR trilogy. That will be an epic undertaking in and of itself.
And I dance. And I sing.
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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Originally posted by: Rebel Scumb
I'm still eager to do my Katie Holmesless version of BATMAN BEGINS, and the epic task of making one good movie out of Matrix 2 and 3.

Get to work on those as soon as possible!

Also Rebel Scumb, since massive story alterations seem to be an interest of yours, have you ever considered making Darth Maul and General Grevious one in the same?
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No i hadn't actually. Thats an intersting idea though.
And I dance. And I sing.
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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I've come up with a lot of scenarios to accomplish that; they're posted around in various fan edit threads. I can find them and re-post them here if you're interested.
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so how does that fit in with the rule of two? is that issue going to be addressed?
And I dance. And I sing.
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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Well I can't seem to find my posts on the subject, but no matter (it's no like I've forgotten it all).

First off let me address the concept of making General Grievous into a resurrected Darth Maul. Clone Wars Cartoons aside, GG is an incredibly lame plot device of a character. He comes out of nowhere in RotS and is treated like the end-all be-all of the Clone Wars. That would have been fine if he had been established beforehand (in a FILM, not a cartoon), but as it stands now his characters seems nothing more than an afterthought. Not only that, the annoying coughing and ridiculous cliche dialogue take away from what could have been a menacing villain. So GG was a definite weak link in the RotS chain. Much has been made of the PT suffering from a lack of consistent villains, outside of Palpatine of course, and it’s true. This attributed to the prequels not feeling much like a trilogy at all, especially not in the same sense as the originals. RotS tried to rectify things with several connections to TPM, and it was a valiant effort which they almost pulled off. But can you imagine the drama/hype that would have resulted if Darth Maul himself had returned in a cybernetic body commanding the Separatist forces? Great stuff. I can’t believe Lucas didn’t think of that angle when conceiving Grievous. The manner of Maul’s death makes it easy to believe what was left of him was transplanted into Grievous’ cyborg body. His yellow eyes tie things together nicely, as well as his lightsaber skills. His guards’ double bladed vibroblades also contribute to the theory, a throwback to Maul’s original double bladed lightsaber. So that’s the concept.

Now onto the logistics. I know that RS’ plan is to remove Sidious from TPM, but assuming it wasn’t, replacing his mentions of “Maul” with “Grievous” would set things up perfectly. I prefer the name Darth Maul to Darth Grievous, but taking RotS into consideration there’s really no other way to get around it if you want them to have the same name (which I think they should). As for RotS, dubbing over GG in a deep, mechanically altered voice shouldn’t be too difficult. That’s the beauty of his lack of a mouth. The coughing would have to be eliminated as well, if for nothing else than the annoyance factor. Dialogue would obviously have to be altered, making references to his defeat by Kenobi, and having that serve as a character motivation. I’m sure someone could come up with some applicable dialogue. Either way it would be impossible for the Jedi to know this was the same Sith who they encountered in TPM, so Grievous would need to reveal this to Obi-Wan in their duel. The close ups on their eyes would be the ideal spot, as new Obi-Wan dialogue would need to be inserted as well. This just adds so much to the Obi-Wan/Grievous confrontation as Kenobi is again facing the man who killed his master, and on Grievous’ end, a chance for revenge on the Jedi who crippled him. Also the parallel of Obi-Wan hanging off the edge of the platform gets a lot more parallel when it’s once again facing Maul. I think Grievous’ lightsabers should all be red, since he would be an official Sith, but I know it would be a pain to rotoscope. I like the concept of him collecting lightsabers but now that he’s Maul that aspect wouldn’t fit (he obviously doesn’t keep them as he kicked Obi-Wan’s down the reactor shaft on Naboo). The conversation with Sidious in RotS would have to be reworked considerably, addressing him as “Lord Grievous,” but I don’t know how to approach his mention of making Anakin his new apprentice. Maybe a mention of destroying Obi-Wan as one of GG’s objectives, as Sidious trys to get rid of him (and thus his positive influence on Anakin) for most of the film. As for the rule of 2, you could always go the MagnoliaFan route and make Dooku a rogue Jedi with no affiliation with the Sith. That wouldn’t explain the three villains’ connection in RotS though. Cutting Yoda’s line down to, “Always two there are, a master and an apprentice,” would do away with the “rule” and make it more of a concept; it’s assumed that if there are more than 2 of them, the Sith will try to kill each other. This would all tie in nicely with the situation we have in the OT: “He would be a great asset,” “He will join us or die,” etc. Sidious has no problem with taking on more than once underling if it suits his purposes and he remains in charge. This dies beg the question though, what’s Maul up to in AotC? Working some Grievous into Episode 2 in some capacity would be great, but that’s something I’ve yet to come up with. One other point, in regards to everyone addressing him as “General” instead of “Darth,” Obi-Wan is also a general (add that to the Maul/Kenobi parallel list), and is called as such. Also, the Republic at large might not even know Grievous is a Sith, and as I noted before there’s certainly no way for them to know he’s the same Sith from Episode 1.

So those are my not so brief suggestion on how to make Maul into Grievous, strengthening both characters and the prequel trilogy as a whole. I eagerly await your feedback.
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Originally posted by: Rebel Scumb
Not that TPM is perfect, but I've always felt the issues with it were mostly conceptual, and not editorial. Anakin should of been older. Naboo should of been Alderaan, Obi-wan should of filled Qui-gon's role, etc.
Yes, yes and yes. Unfortunately, conceptual issues are harder to deal with than editorial. The idea of cutting Sidious altogether is a good - that way his appearances in the PT will mirror those in the OT (i.e. none/a bit/a lot). However, preserving the surprise is a moot point, since everyone already knows. Even people who don't know who Ian McDiarmid is and missed that the OT Emperor's name is Palpatine can recognize the TPM Palpatine as the OT Emperor. Nevertheless, go ahead, it's a good idea and I'm sure a lot of fans would love to see it.
Originally posted by: Wesyeed
Combine Eps 1 and 2, then you will be a man.

I'm in some agreement with Wesyeed: the only real way to get around the major conceptual issues of TPM is to cut it drastically down to a kind of prologue. I believe Farsight suggested a one-movie PT in another thread and I think that, ultimately, is the way to go. In the meantime, I look forward to the completion of your personal trilogy.
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Originally posted by: Rebel Scumb
I actually really like the Nemodians and how weak and foolish they are. Its one of the few things I think Lucas got bang on for the prequels, I love nute as a character.

I have changed subtitles in ep2 to change some plot stuff around, and even to do some foreshadowing to general grievous for ep3.

Glad to see all the support in this thread, I was actually expecting a lot more skeptism. Makes me eager to get to work on it.

Though my obligation to the my own film that I am cutting together at the moment must always come first, I do enjoy doing these fan edits a plenty. I'm still eager to do my Katie Holmesless version of BATMAN BEGINS, and the epic task of making one good movie out of Matrix 2 and 3

and then there's always my custom edit of the LOTR trilogy. That will be an epic undertaking in and of itself.


I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A LIVE ACTION VERSION OF THE ANIMATED LOTR MOVIE. USE THE ANIMATED AS THE TEMPLATE, AND EDIT THE LIVE ACTION MOVIES TO MIRROR THE ANIMATED.

"I'VE GROWN TIRED OF ASKING, SO THIS WILL BE THE LAST TIME..."
The Mangler Bros. Psycho Dayv Armchaireviews Notes on Suicide

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great idea
And I dance. And I sing.
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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Originally posted by: Rebel Scumb
I'm still eager to do my Katie Holmesless version of BATMAN BEGINS


I'm really looking forward to any work on Begins-- it's begging to be Holmeless (or Holmesless). I also think the training sequence was way too long, but maybe that's just me.
We don't have enough road to get up to 88.
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Making Maul & Grievous the same character sounds like a bigger challenge than I'd want to undertake.

One thing that bothers me to no end are the Jedi rat tails, it would almost be worth it to me to eliminate them from every frame of TPM and AOTC...I don't know if this bothers the hell out of anyone else, but I could never stand the look.

I haven't watched TPM for awhile, but I wonder if there is a way to completely eliminate the Gungan battle scenes, removing any reference to it and doing it without without adding subtitles to Jar Jar, since I don't like any of the altered versions of Jar Jar's voice I've heard so far...there are already 3 other action sequences going on at the end of TPM, giving the axe to the Gungan battle would be my preference.
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Originally posted by: Tim Lehrbach
Making Maul & Grievous the same character sounds like a bigger challenge than I'd want to undertake.

There might be less extensive ways to go about it, but not as effective. It's no easy task to meld two characters into one, even if they are very similar to begin with. The devil is in the details.

As for removing the Gungan battle, unfortunately it's essential to the plotpoint of the Naboo and Gungans putting aside their differences and coming together to save their home. Then you've got problems with what is the point of the space battle if they aren't shutting down any droids, the Gungan's role in the film in general, not to mention losing Padme's reveal as Queen Amidala at the Gungan camp.