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Lucas on the Prequels - "It is a kids’ movie. It’s always been a kids’ movie."

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Lucas defended his Star Wars prequel films against the haters, arguing that critics have forgotten that Star Wars was never meant to be a grown-up movie. “It was supposed to be a kid’s movie for 12-year-olds that were going through puberty, who don’t know what they’re doing, and are asking all the big questions: What should I be worried about? What’s important in life?” he said. “And Star Wars has all those things in there. They’re buried in there but you definitely get it, especially if you’re young.”
The negative response to his Star Wars prequels, Lucas argued, came from “critics and fans who had been 10 years old when they saw the first one” and didn’t want to watch a children’s film. The public trashing of Jar Jar Binks — one of the first figures to be canceled on the then-nascent internet — reminded Lucas of the original response to C-3PO. “Everybody said the same thing about 3-PO, that he was irritating and we should get rid of him,” said Lucas. “When I did the third one it was the Ewoks: ‘Those are little teddy bears. This is a kid’s movie, we don’t want to see a kids’ movie. I said: ‘It is a kids’ movie. It’s always been a kids’ movie.'”

Source: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/george-lucas-cannes-honor-star-wars-films-1235907998/

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“The simultaneous existence of opposite virtues in the soul — like pincers to catch hold of God.”

― Simone Weil

“Reality is the original Rorschach.”

― Malaclypse the Younger

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Lucas is back at it…blaming fans for any of his weaknesses in writing or directing. 🤷‍♂️

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 (Edited)

Fan_edit_fan said:

Lucas is back at it…blaming fans for any of his weaknesses in writing or directing. ???

He still can’t keep his stories straight, either.

• George Lucas on TPM: “It is a kids’ movie. It’s always been a kids’ movie.”

• Also George Lucas on why he made the Prequels, in 2019: “I decided that it would be important to finish it off and do the backstory [the Prequels] because things that I thought would be self-evident about the story, the audience didn’t get. Over the 10 years after Return of the Jedi, I realized people misunderstood a lot – such as where Anakin came from. So it was a way of finishing the whole thing off.”

So George says he made the Prequels as the Original Trilogy “audience didn’t get” things in the years after ROTJ was released, but then made it for kids, many of which weren’t even born at the time in the 10 years after ROTJ? Sounds right!

• Even George admits himself. in 2005, that he wasn’t aware that the six Star Wars “form the biography of Vader” “until 1998”.
 

• Also:

Question: You’ve often said that Star Wars movies are primarily meant for children, but The Phantom Menace was always going to be a film that was going to be significant for twenty/thirtysomethings. How did you address this problem?

George Lucas: “Basically I didn’t. I kept it as it was originally intended. You can’t play too much to the marketplace. It’s the same thing with the fans. The fans’ expectations had gotten way high and they wanted a film that was going to change their lives and be the Second Coming. You know, I can’t do that, it’s just a movie. And I can’t say, now I gotta market it to a whole different audience.

Yet Lucas hyped, marketed and promoted TPM and the coming Prequels like no other franchise before, for that older audience. Only when there was criticism of TPM, did the “It is a kids’ movie. It’s always been a kids’ movie” attempt of a poor excuse occur.

This is despite George also previously stating things like Star Wars “is for forever - for all generations” in promotional spiel:

img

 
It appears George really does not take or accept any kind of valid or reasoned criticism well at all.

And quite a stretch to full on straw-clutching with George trying to equate a minority of fans’ dislike of Threepio in the OT, to Jar Jar in the PT. Maybe George forgets that some kids and youngsters also didn’t like Jar Jar, TPM, and the PT.

That adults can also critique any film aimed “for kids”, and it doesn’t invalidate any criticism because of that.

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We can spend all day analyzing Lucas quotes from the last 40 years, but we can’t avoid the obvious fact that significant parts of The Phantom Menace are just obviously tonally different than the OT. Specifically, TPM relies heavily on slapstick humor for comedy relief. Whereas, comedy in the OT was derived mostly through character interactions and dialogue, like Han Solo bickering with C3PO or Leia, C3PO bickering with R2, etc.

To be clear, I’m not saying the OT had zero slapstick comedy (examples of OT slapstick include C3PO kicking R2, the Sarlacc burping, Ewok antics in ROTJ, etc.), just that it had way less than the Prequels, to the extent that we can accurately describe OT comedy as mostly defined by character interactions and dialogue. In contrast, TPM had very little dialogue-based comedy (a few one-liners from Qui-Gon or Obi-Wan), but heavily featured slapstick Jar Jar antics, like stepping in Bantha shit, dropping things, getting electrocuted, basically the entire Gungan battle at the end, etc.

Slapstick comedy is generally considered more juvenile, and is often one of the main forms of comedy in children’s movies because children universally understand physical comedy. That’s why Phantom Menace seems more explicitly designed for children than the OT. So regardless of anything Lucas says, the fact is that Phantom Menace objectively relies way more on slapstick comedy than the OT does, making it a lot closer tonally to movies that everyone agrees are made for children (like Disney/Pixar cartoons).

There’s a scene in Watto’s shop where Jar Jar performs slapstick antics in the background (juggling, dropping things, getting kicked by a droid) for a good portion of the scene, and of course the ending Gungan battle heavily features Jar Jar slapstick. There’s simply nothing in the OT comparable to those Jar Jar scenes. At most you have an Ewok accidentally hitting himself in the face with a sling - a brief joke lasting about a second. At the same time, Phantom Menace has much less character-driven humor than the OT. Obi-Wan arguably has a few funny lines (“we picked up another pathetic lifeform”, etc.), but in general the characters in TPM behave so formally that character-driven humor is very rare.

OT humor was similar to the humor of Indiana Jones: mostly character-driven with a few instances of slapstick. And both featured some dark material. Also, while the MPAA rating system is often an inconsistent mess, in general PG rated movies (like Star Wars and Indiana Jones) have traditionally been considered to be designed for older kids, adolescents and adults, whereas movies made explicitly for 10 year olds and younger are more commonly rated G. So Lucas can claim Star Wars was always for children, but there’s a clear, qualitative tonal difference (especially in terms of humor) between movies like the OT and G-rated children’s movies (e.g. Disney/Pixar cartoons).

Phantom Menace is rated PG, but weirdly relies heavily on slapstick humor more often associated with G-rated children’s movies. This problem is compounded by the cartoonish voice and appearance of Jar Jar and the fact that TPM is the first Star Wars movie to feature a child actor main character. Not that children can’t star in more mature, adult-oriented films (just ask co-star Natalie Portman), but when they do they usually don’t go around acting like an exuberant “Leave it to Beaver” character half the time. If 10-year-old Anakin acted more like Indiana Jones’ side-kick Shortround or even a member of The Goonies, perhaps I would bitch slightly less.

Finally, I also question the historical accuracy of Lucas’ claim that fans complained about C3PO to anywhere near the same extent that they complained about Jar Jar. At least, those scenes in A New Hope heavily featuring C3PO certainly didn’t prevent Star Wars from becoming an unprecedented cultural phenomenon that inspired millions of people to wait in line to see the movie for a 20th time in 1977. Plus, C3PO functions as comic relief much differently than Jar Jar. Again, most jokes in the OT involving C3PO rely on dialogue, not slapstick, despite the occasional instance where C3PO kicks R2 or has his head on backwards or whatever.

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Superweapon VII said:

Star Wars doesn’t have to be Cocomelon to still be for kids. It can still have some level of maturity while not being on the same level of maturity as media made for adults.

Reading R + L ≠ J theories

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Fan_edit_fan said:

Lucas is back at it…blaming fans for any of his weaknesses in writing or directing. 🤷‍♂️

and

rocknroll41 said:

Fan_edit_fan said:

Lucas is back at it…blaming fans for any of his weaknesses in writing or directing. 🤷‍♂️

Some things never change…

He knows the media and many fans still give unquestioning credence to his every claim. That’s also a little sad, really.

“Don’t tell anyone… but when ‘Star Wars’ first came out, I didn’t know where it was going either. The trick is to pretend you’ve planned the whole thing out in advance. Throw in some father issues and references to other stories - let’s call them homages - and you’ve got a series.” - George Lucas

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Hardened1337 said:

Lucas defended his Star Wars prequel films against the haters, arguing that critics have forgotten that Star Wars was never meant to be a grown-up movie. “It was supposed to be a kid’s movie for 12-year-olds that were going through puberty, who don’t know what they’re doing, and are asking all the big questions: What should I be worried about? What’s important in life?” he said. “And Star Wars has all those things in there. They’re buried in there but you definitely get it, especially if you’re young.”
The negative response to his Star Wars prequels, Lucas argued, came from “critics and fans who had been 10 years old when they saw the first one” and didn’t want to watch a children’s film. The public trashing of Jar Jar Binks — one of the first figures to be canceled on the then-nascent internet — reminded Lucas of the original response to C-3PO. “Everybody said the same thing about 3-PO, that he was irritating and we should get rid of him,” said Lucas. “When I did the third one it was the Ewoks: ‘Those are little teddy bears. This is a kid’s movie, we don’t want to see a kids’ movie. I said: ‘It is a kids’ movie. It’s always been a kids’ movie.'”

Source: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/george-lucas-cannes-honor-star-wars-films-1235907998/

Whenever George speaks, ii is time to get another pinch of salt, to then get the factchecker out, look for the false equivalencies, and then contrast his claims with the contradictory statements he’s previously made on the subject.

As Billy Dee Williams would say: “It works every time”. 😉

“Don’t tell anyone… but when ‘Star Wars’ first came out, I didn’t know where it was going either. The trick is to pretend you’ve planned the whole thing out in advance. Throw in some father issues and references to other stories - let’s call them homages - and you’ve got a series.” - George Lucas

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Channel72 said:

We can spend all day analyzing Lucas quotes from the last 40 years, but we can’t avoid the obvious fact that significant parts of The Phantom Menace are just obviously tonally different than the OT. Specifically, TPM relies heavily on slapstick humor for comedy relief. Whereas, comedy in the OT was derived mostly through character interactions and dialogue, like Han Solo bickering with C3PO or Leia, C3PO bickering with R2, etc.

To be clear, I’m not saying the OT had zero slapstick comedy (examples of OT slapstick include C3PO kicking R2, the Sarlacc burping, Ewok antics in ROTJ, etc.), just that it had way less than the Prequels, to the extent that we can accurately describe OT comedy as mostly defined by character interactions and dialogue. In contrast, TPM had very little dialogue-based comedy (a few one-liners from Qui-Gon or Obi-Wan), but heavily featured slapstick Jar Jar antics, like stepping in Bantha shit, dropping things, getting electrocuted, basically the entire Gungan battle at the end, etc.

Slapstick comedy is generally considered more juvenile, and is often one of the main forms of comedy in children’s movies because children universally understand physical comedy. That’s why Phantom Menace seems more explicitly designed for children than the OT. So regardless of anything Lucas says, the fact is that Phantom Menace objectively relies way more on slapstick comedy than the OT does, making it a lot closer tonally to movies that everyone agrees are made for children (like Disney/Pixar cartoons).

There’s a scene in Watto’s shop where Jar Jar performs slapstick antics in the background (juggling, dropping things, getting kicked by a droid) for a good portion of the scene, and of course the ending Gungan battle heavily features Jar Jar slapstick. There’s simply nothing in the OT comparable to those Jar Jar scenes. At most you have an Ewok accidentally hitting himself in the face with a sling - a brief joke lasting about a second. At the same time, Phantom Menace has much less character-driven humor than the OT. Obi-Wan arguably has a few funny lines (“we picked up another pathetic lifeform”, etc.), but in general the characters in TPM behave so formally that character-driven humor is very rare.

OT humor was similar to the humor of Indiana Jones: mostly character-driven with a few instances of slapstick. And both featured some dark material. Also, while the MPAA rating system is often an inconsistent mess, in general PG rated movies (like Star Wars and Indiana Jones) have traditionally been considered to be designed for older kids, adolescents and adults, whereas movies made explicitly for 10 year olds and younger are more commonly rated G. So Lucas can claim Star Wars was always for children, but there’s a clear, qualitative tonal difference (especially in terms of humor) between movies like the OT and G-rated children’s movies (e.g. Disney/Pixar cartoons).

Phantom Menace is rated PG, but weirdly relies heavily on slapstick humor more often associated with G-rated children’s movies. This problem is compounded by the cartoonish voice and appearance of Jar Jar and the fact that TPM is the first Star Wars movie to feature a child actor main character. Not that children can’t star in more mature, adult-oriented films (just ask co-star Natalie Portman), but when they do they usually don’t go around acting like an exuberant “Leave it to Beaver” character half the time. If 10-year-old Anakin acted more like Indiana Jones’ side-kick Shortround or even a member of The Goonies, perhaps I would bitch slightly less.

Finally, I also question the historical accuracy of Lucas’ claim that fans complained about C3PO to anywhere near the same extent that they complained about Jar Jar. At least, those scenes in A New Hope heavily featuring C3PO certainly didn’t prevent Star Wars from becoming an unprecedented cultural phenomenon that inspired millions of people to wait in line to see the movie for a 20th time in 1977. Plus, C3PO functions as comic relief much differently than Jar Jar. Again, most jokes in the OT involving C3PO rely on dialogue, not slapstick, despite the occasional instance where C3PO kicks R2 or has his head on backwards or whatever.

Those are some excellent points, and also very well made.

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SparkySywer said:

Star Wars doesn’t have to be Cocomelon to still be for kids. It can still have some level of maturity while not being on the same level of maturity as media made for adults.

Yeah, I’m of the opinion that Star Wars was always made with kids in mind. We know for a fact that Lucas was heavily inspired by the Flash Gordon serials of his youth. The crucial difference is that the OT (and probably ROTS) were mature kids’ movies (that could also be enjoyed by adults), whereas TPM and AOTC were more lowbrow.

WRT Owen/Beru’s corpses specifically, keep in mind that kids’ media back in the day was less watered-down than the stuff nowadays. I imagine that shot would have overall been considered acceptable, especially since it’s short and a relatively insignificant part of the film.

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“I think kids are dumb, so I made it dumb intentionally”

That’s how I always hear his defense.

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I do not believe the original Star Wars movie was made for kids. It’s been stated multiple places it was an “escapism movie.” Just because it’s a fun story does not mean it had to be targeted at children. It was one of those rare movies no one wants to make anymore which was made “for everyone.” Sure there was a lot for kids to like in Star Wars, but the story and characters were interesting enough for it to appeal to adults. (Scenes like Uncle Owen and Aunt Beru’s corpses burning up would not be in a movie made for kids. Also see: Truth serum droid, violent shootings which were censored for SE, bloody severed arm in the cantina, etc.)
This was taken even further with Empire, as the character relationships get more complex, as does the drama. Jedi follows this balance more than most people give it credit for, though the line between the kid stuff and adult stuff is much more pronounced. The ewoks seem so much like kids fare, while the Emperor’s throne room sequences have heavy adult drama. (And actually when you think about it, sure they’re cute, but the ewoks kill a lot of people and even intend to roast the main characters alive. The fact that they’re cute offsets the darkness of them and adds to the bizarreness I feel.)
It was much later that George decided to say he always made the originals for kids. It really wasn’t until Jedi that kids were taken into a grand consideration.

You’ll laugh! You’ll cry! You’ll kiss three bucks goodbye!

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Here’s the thing… no movies are made for kids. Film makers (and their financiers) have to cater to paying adults whether they’re parents or not. Star Wars like almost everything else within the fantasy genre is a family film; occasionally scary or anxiety inducing, but generally suitable for viewers that can comprehend the plot. Toddlers without serious faculties shouldn’t be watching it. It’s a fine line that shouldn’t be crossed. You can’t just add things like extended scenes of clowning, toilet humour, and a bunch of stereotypical foreign accents and say that’s how it’s always been. You can’t try and refute criticism by saying only an adult would made those kind of comments.

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I think the Prequels and Phantom Menace in particular ended up with a significantly more juvenile tone than the OT because George Lucas (self-admittedly) isn’t good at writing dialogue, and since he didn’t have as much help writing and polishing the Prequels as he had with the OT, he resorted to mostly slap-stick humor because it’s just much easier to write.

I mean, in A New Hope, C3PO has some comedic lines that at least required some decent writing skills, like “Don’t you call me a mindless philosopher, you overweight glob of grease!”, or (scolding R2) “Just you reconsider playing that message for him! No, I don’t think he likes you at all. No, I don’t like you either.”