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Less Offensive Midichlorians

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At work today, I began to have a thought.  In fact, I might have mentioned this here in the past, but I just don't remember, so I decided I might as well start a topic about it, just to be on the safe side.  Alright, here goes:

Everybody here hates midichlorians.  That pretty much goes without saying.  I've heard interviews (and commentary) where George explains that part of the reason he used the concept in Phantom Menace (besides a desire to make the Force scientific...sadly, we can't get around that) was so that there would be an objective assessment that would cause the Jedi Council to take Anakin seriously and to help prove his Chosen One status.  I'm perfectly fine with that idea and that concept.  I just feel he could have done it in a way that didn't seem to trivialize the Force.  Okay, so it's established that midichlorians live in your blood, and the more you have, the more in tune with the Force you are.  I think it would have had the same function in the story without being so difficult for us to swallow had the concept been reversed.  Rather than midichlorians being microscopic being that channel the Force, let them be microscopic beings that are attracted to the Force.  Timothy Zahn did something similar with the ysalimiri:  creatures who repel the Force.  Anyway, the more in tune with the Force a person is, the more midichlorians he/she would attract.  Therefore, midichlorians could still be used to gauge Force potential but be a result of the Force rather than the source of it.

Any other opinions?  And, once again, sorry if I've posted this before, but I guess even if I have, there are newer users who might get a kick out of this...

There is no lingerie in space...

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don't exist... then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks... and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming... Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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That would have been a lot better.

Really if Lucas wanted to give the Jedi council a reason to take Anakin seriously, and to help prove his Chosen One status, they could have just have had him display an amazing ability to use the force. It would have made even more sense and been much more effective had Qui-gon put Anakin through some sort of test (sense things through meditation, move objects with your mind, etc.) to check how intune with the force he was, and had him display the abilities of an advanced student of the force, far beyond that of any potential Padawans who had been tested in the past, even master Yoda.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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Wouldn't it have been enough for Qui-Gon (and later Yoda) to just say "man, the force is stronger in this little kid than any Jedi I know." 

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Yeah, both of you make sense, and both of your ideas are probably better than what was in the movie.  I personally think that his line about needing an objective way to measure was simply his rationalization for wanting to add science to the Force and a defense against those of us who didn't like it.  I just like to argue that, if he really wanted them that badly, there was a better way to do it. 

Then again, I guess you could say this whole thing started in ROTJ with all these references to the Force running in one's family.  Of course, at the time, I always thought about it as more of a coincidence than any kind of serious genetic trait. 

There is no lingerie in space...

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don't exist... then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks... and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming... Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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I like how the phantom editor did it - he didn't make midichlorians behind the force, but he mentioned them.  He cut the explanation of midichlorians, but not the test.

Or, you know, the fact that he was able to podrace at such a young age could have been a huge clue. :p

A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em

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Gaffer Tape said:

At work today, I began to have a thought.  In fact, I might have mentioned this here in the past, but I just don't remember, so I decided I might as well start a topic about it, just to be on the safe side.  Alright, here goes:

Everybody here hates midichlorians.  That pretty much goes without saying.  I've heard interviews (and commentary) where George explains that part of the reason he used the concept in Phantom Menace (besides a desire to make the Force scientific...sadly, we can't get around that) was so that there would be an objective assessment that would cause the Jedi Council to take Anakin seriously and to help prove his Chosen One status.  I'm perfectly fine with that idea and that concept.  I just feel he could have done it in a way that didn't seem to trivialize the Force.  Okay, so it's established that midichlorians live in your blood, and the more you have, the more in tune with the Force you are.  I think it would have had the same function in the story without being so difficult for us to swallow had the concept been reversed.  Rather than midichlorians being microscopic being that channel the Force, let them be microscopic beings that are attracted to the Force.  Timothy Zahn did something similar with the ysalimiri:  creatures who repel the Force.  Anyway, the more in tune with the Force a person is, the more midichlorians he/she would attract.  Therefore, midichlorians could still be used to gauge Force potential but be a result of the Force rather than the source of it.

Any other opinions?  And, once again, sorry if I've posted this before, but I guess even if I have, there are newer users who might get a kick out of this...

I have no problems with Midichlorians. So no, not everyone here has a problem with them.

 

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Midichlorians may be worst idea of the entire prequel trilogy, although the whole vader turning to the darkside because of love could beat it out since that destroys the entire Anakin->Vader->Anakin story ark.

In the OT, the force was mysterious and beautiful... "For my ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is. Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you; here, between you, me, the tree, the rock, everywhere."

In the PT the force was turned into just a tool that those who were genetically predispositioned used. It's as if Lucas wanted to suck out all of the wonder from the SW universe.  Hey everyone apperently the force is an STD.

 

Ultimately I think they should have gone with Baronlando's "they could just sense it".  It was already esatblished int he OT that Jedi could sense one another.

 

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Midiclorians never bothered me, probably cause there were other plot points that drove me more crazy:)  But Midiclorians are a symbol for the PT:  Lucas didn't trust the audience, so he dumbed it down.  There are so many things in the PT that just cries for, "OK I am going to tell you exactly what is going on because you may not figure this out in the movie!"  When Anakin fights Dooku in ROTS he says, "My powers have doubled since we last me Dooku!"  compared to ROTJ when Vader sees that Luke has built his own lightsaber, "Indeed you are powerful as the Emperor senses!"  What is the difference?  The PT put a number on Anakins power just so the audience knows he is DOUBLE the strength he was in AOTC, compared to the OT where the audience could figure in the first 20 minutes when Lukes kicks everyones ass on the sailbarge that he is a powerful jedi.  I could go on and on about the Cave Scene and how that doesn't explain anything and lets the viewer rationalize what just happens as Yoda says, "Remember your failure at the cave."  In the PT, Yoda would have said WHY Luke failed but Lucas/Kershner/Kasdan trusted the audience in 1980.  Midiclorians are just more of the same, putting a number on a plot point just so the audience gets that Anakin is one of the most powerful Jedi in the galaxy. 

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Never mind.  My apologies to sunday for lumping him in with the rest of us.

There is no lingerie in space...

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don't exist... then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks... and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming... Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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sunday256 said:

I have no problems with Midichlorians. So no, not everyone here has a problem with them.

 

 

 Damn, there goes my 'Everybody Hates Jar Jar' Thread:)

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CO said:
sunday256 said:

I have no problems with Midichlorians. So no, not everyone here has a problem with them.

 

 

 Damn, there goes my 'Everybody Hates Jar Jar' Thread:)

That's quite true. If there were no Jar Jar, there'd be no character to make so much fun of. I love Jar Jar in that respect. He's the butt of so many jokes.

 

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i don't want to make it sound like i liked jar jar,

but 'from a certain point of view'...

 

i thought it was pretty cool from a cgi perspective what could be

done with a cg character.....(not a whole heck of a lot)... but still

coming from a computer graphics background, i found the whole

character fascinating to watch, but not so much to listen to.

 

and no, i don't think the midicholorian subplot ruined what the force was

for me either, i guess most people just ignore most of the EU, and other

stuff, because i kept reading them for the longest time, and there were

a lot of other crazy ideas in those books also, so why would one more

make any difference? (just to stay on topic)..

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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Would you care to elaborate?  Over the past week or so, I've had a desire to read more EU, so I picked up Splinter of the Mind's Eye and the first book in the X-Wing series.  I've also read Shadows of the Empire, the Thrawn trilogy, The Courtship of Princess Leia, and The Han Solo Adventures.  I don't recall seeing anything weird about The Force in those books.  So I take it these references are in books I haven't read.  So I can't really answer your question until I can put it in a common frame of reference.

There is no lingerie in space...

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don't exist... then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks... and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming... Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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The weirdest thing about the Force I have read in the EU would be the ysalamiri (sp?). Which really didn't bother me at all when I first read about it, though now I am not so sure how I feel about it. Other than that, it has always pretty much followed the OT's explanation of the Force. Although, long before the TPM, the EU has also expressed the idea that some are intune with the Force, and others are not, thus a Jedi is not something just anybody came become, but only those who possess an ability to use the Force, which the EU often seemed to indicate was passed on genetically.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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well, i wouldn't want to point out stuff that you haven't read and spoil it.

 

out of those books, only 'splinter of a minds eye'

had some interesting points:

--------------------------------------------

splinter of a minds eye - a crystal that can enhance the power of the force?

and how does this fit in with anything about the force from the movies?

-------------------------------------------

Proportionally according to size and density, the Force's power was magnified a thousandfold;while a

single shard would give off a minor jolt, the entire crystal gave off such a feeling of power and

clarity of the Force that the possessor's entire being would course with the energy. The full crystal

was also able to channel the Force into a method of healing; Luke Skywalker used this inherent power,

along with his limited connection to the Force, to bring both himself and Leia Organa from death.

However, when Darth Vader was in close proximity to the presence of the Kaiburr, the residual effects

of the Force caused the Dark Lord's affinity with the dark side of the Force to expand greater. As a

result, Vader found himself losing what self-control he possessed, fighting his own son

and—unbeknownst to him or Skywalker—his daughter against his will, as he had intended to capture them

alive. Furthermore, the crystal granted Vader the ability to cast Force lightning, normally

impossible due to Vader's bionic limbs and life-support systems.

for more info : http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Kaiburr_crystal

-------------------------------------------

you're going to have to read a lot more books, and stories

if you want more details...there's just way too many to go into..

which is probably why i gave up years ago..

 

anyways.. information about the force in general (collectively):

------------------------------

Within the Star Wars expanded universe, a number of other powers have been demonstrated, those

include the ability to heal or drain the life-force of others, increase resistance to attack,

dissipate energy attacks and warp space.

examples of force powers in the EU, but not always seen in the movies (from wookipedia)

Alter Environment
Animal Friendship
Battlemind
Combustion
Cure Disease
Cure Poison
Dissipate Energy
Droid Disable
Electric Judgment
Force Absorb
Force Armor
Force Blinding
Force Enlightenment
Force Healing
Force Light
Force Meld
Force Persuasion
Force Projection
Force Protection
Force Stun
Force Stasis
Force Valor
Hibernation Trance
Malacia
Mind trick
Morichro
Plant Surge
Protection Bubble
Ray
Revitalize
Sever Force
Shatterpoint
Wall Of Light
 

Ashla was the name given to the light side of the Force in early drafts of Star Wars and was

established as canon in the Expanded Universe by the Power of the Jedi Sourcebook. It was also said

to be what the ancient Jedi and Sith called the light side in Darth Bane: Rule of Two.
 

The Power of the Jedi Sourcebook states that the Potentium (the view that the Force is one, and its

sides are just a matter of choice of Force powers) is a corrupt, misguided philosophy, thus being the

first source to establish from the official perspective that the Jedi Orthodox philosophy reflects

the true nature of the Force.
 

(for more info go here :  http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Light_side

when it comes to the dark side, there's interesting stuff there also..

for example : machines that use the dark side..

-------------------------------------------------------------

At any rate, they lost their abilities to use the Force as well as their Force-powered machines, such

as the Star Forge. The Star Forge was a superweapon and manufacturing facility capable of creating

nearly anything by drawing on both the power of a star and the dark side of the Force. During the

Jedi Civil War, Revan and Malak recovered the Star Forge and used it to create a massive fleet for

their Sith Empire. Later reverse-engineering of Infinite Empire technology imbued with the dark side

created the basis of other technologies such as the hyperdrive

 

animals that have the dark side in them

---------------------------------------------------

The effects of the Sith Empires could be seen upon and within the planets Korriban and Ziost, which

were filled with energies from the dark side of the Force. Animals such as the terentateks, distorted

from the powerful presence of the dark side, roamed the caverns and caves feeding on the

Force-sensitives that came across them. There was also the Valley of the Dark Lords, a graveyard that

reverberated with dark side energy and was full of caverns and tombs, which once possessed powerful

Sith artifacts. There the Sith even appeared as apparitions on occasion; Ajunta Pall inhabited his

tomb as a ghost until he was set to rest by the relocation of a sword imbued with the dark side of

the Force.

 

for a lot more information go here : http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_side_of_the_Force

 

i hope this gives you some idea of the enormity of what is out there about the

force..

 

the basic view from the first 3 movies barely scratches the surface, and

is pretty lacking..

 

later

-1

 

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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I always thought of The Force as a sort of psychic ability that ran in the Skywalker family. 

Making it a kind of blood disorder totally ruins it. ;-)

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Negative 1 when Splinter of the Mind's Eye was released in 1978 Luke Skywalker was not Leia's brother or darth vaders son.  Darth Vader was the man who murdered luke's father and Leia was a love interest.

 

Lucas states an inaccuracy when he says Vader was always Luke's Father, the story was always about the downfall and redemption of anakin skywalker etc.

 

An author is allowed to change his mind mid stream about where a story should go but don't fabricate this great mythology over vader that never existed prior to Return of the Jedi or the prequels.

 

The concept of twins did exist in an earlier draft but Luke Had a brother Deak Starkiller not Leia, also the Leia of the films may be like the female Luke in one of the drafts.

 

MidiClorians is a too much Like a Regression Back to the third draft where they had the Kiber Crystal to explain and quanitify the force, and use it as a throw way mcguffin.

It was a very lazy ripoff of the one ring of power from the lord of the rings the so called "numinous" object. It was also ripped off of the lens from the lensman novels.

Instead at Gary Kurtz suggestion Lucas made the force more mysterious and ethereal, and quasi spirtual. 

 

Nevermind that the force is probably a reference to Jack Kirby's New Gods The Source, LOL.

 

I have always understood that the Jedi were always meant to be demigods, I mean the Name Luke Skywalker literally "the one who walks the sky"  sounds Like myth to me.

Lucas must have known that all the heroes of greek and roman mythology were demi gods.  Thus you had Perseus the son of Zeus and the Gorgon Slayer, Hercules the strongest man on earth and also the son of  Zeus, and Theseus the son of poseidon  the Giant slayer and minotaur killer.

From the story synopsis for The Star Wars

"After the ceremony is over, and the festivities have ended, the drunken bureaucrats stagger down an empty street arm in arm realizing that they have been adventuring with demigods."

 

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

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negative1 said:

...

Within the Star Wars expanded universe, a number of other powers have been demonstrated, those

include the ability to heal or drain the life-force of others, increase resistance to attack,

dissipate energy attacks and warp space.

examples of force powers in the EU, but not always seen in the movies (from wookipedia)

Alter Environment
Animal Friendship
Battlemind
Combustion
Cure Disease
Cure Poison
Dissipate Energy
Droid Disable
Electric Judgment
Force Absorb
Force Armor
Force Blinding
Force Enlightenment
Force Healing
Force Light
Force Meld
Force Persuasion
Force Projection
Force Protection
Force Stun
Force Stasis
Force Valor
Hibernation Trance
Malacia
Mind trick
Morichro
Plant Surge
Protection Bubble
Ray
Revitalize
Sever Force
Shatterpoint
Wall Of Light
 

...

i hope this gives you some idea of the enormity of what is out there about the

force..

 

the basic view from the first 3 movies barely scratches the surface, and

is pretty lacking..

 

later

-1

 

 

 Ugh.  This is why I hate the EU.  There are so many contributers to the EU.  Everyone from the novel writers to the video game creators just end up trampling the simplicity that used to be Star Wars.  There are too many cooks in the kitchen.

Remember when the force was an energy field created by all living things?  When did the force become power-ups in a video game?  Is "extra man" a force ability? 

-1, I respectly disagree, but the basic view from the first three movies is hardly lacking.  It is deep, rich and inspires the imagination.  It is only when everyone confines the force with 'can do this and can't do that's' that the force becomes ugly.  I've said it before and I'll say it again.  Sometimes less is more.

I posted my thoughts on the force a few years ago on a different forum if anyone cares to read them:

http://www.galacticsenate.com/showthread.php?t=16678&page=6

 

 

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^^ I agree with Sluggo. I even read that post you linked to, good job.

The Force to me is like a linked network of what you'd call a living beings chi or aura. As far as tapping into the Force, add in one's third eye and some telepathy and I think that's a pretty accurate description based on the 3 films '77-'83 not counting drafts and novels (which is pretty much Star Wars to me). All that EU can die a horrible death as far as I'm concerned.

As Patton Oswalt says "I don't give a shit where the stuff I love comes from! I just love the stuff I love!"

 

"Well here's a big bag of rock salt" - Patton Oswalt

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Heh, I love how the Star Wars wiki tries to retcon Vader's desire to kill Luke in Splinter.  Oh, no, of course it wasn't because it hadn't been invented that Luke was Vader's son!  It was simply because the crystal made him lose control!

Yeah... That's the impression I got from reading it.  ^_~

There is no lingerie in space...

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don't exist... then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks... and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming... Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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don't you all think its fair to say,

that you can (and do) interpret the 'force' to be whatever you

want it be anyways? (despite what Lucas, the EU, or other definitions

for it exist)....

 

if its simple for you, fine keep it simple....and don't mess with the midichlorians..

if you want something a little deeper, absorb the scientific aspects into the force...

if want it really complicated, then the EU fleshes that out...

 

why does any one version of it have to be 'wrong'?

 

and i guess the point of this thread is, why do you (some people) keep insisting

it was wrong for Lucas to embellish, add, and explain something he felt like

he wanted to explain anyways?

 

there are several types of canon, if you want to go that route,

and which ones you believe, and acknowledge are totally up to you..

 

but don't go around telling the rest of us, that enjoy those sorts

of things, that we're wrong, and it's a dumb idea, and why was

it brought up in the first place?

 

unless anyone of you is a time-traveller, stop acting like these

events didn't happen, and try to wish them away, or retcon them..

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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Gaffer Tape said:

Heh, I love how the Star Wars wiki tries to retcon Vader's desire to kill Luke in Splinter.  Oh, no, of course it wasn't because it hadn't been invented that Luke was Vader's son!  It was simply because the crystal made him lose control!

Yeah... That's the impression I got from reading it.  ^_~

 

 much like i never trust WIKIPEDIA entirely, and just use it a starting point..

the same with WOOKIPEDIA,

you wanted examples,

i gave you examples...

i guess you have nothing to say about the other 90% of the message, or is it to easy

to pick on one small point?

 

you started this thread off with a false accusation about how 'everyone hates the midichlorian',

and went downwards from there.... if someone is refuting it, or showing otherwise, why

don't you comment on that instead?

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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Good Lord, man, I wasn't "picking" on you or your post in any way.  I was just making what I thought was a humorous observation about the way something was written.  I actually hadn't gotten around to addressing the information you presented to me yet, but that doesn't mean I wasn't going to do so at some point after I'd thought about the matter enough to say something that someone else hadn't already addressed.  I believe you assume too much.  Also, yes, I made a generalizing statement.  When sunday so "thoughtfully" called me out on it, I nearly explained myself then, but then decided it wasn't worth it.  But since you won't seem to let me get away with it, even though I already apologized, well, that's your problem.  Most of us here do dislike the concept of the midichlorians.  I thought it would be fun to explore alternative routes they could have been implemented.  Most people who have replied seem to think we would have been better off without them at all.  However, I proposed a possibility that might have been able to please Lucas and the fans.  Just for fun.  But apparently I don't need to explain to you the purpose of my thread because two posts ago, you already tried to tell us what the purpose of my thread was. 

Now, I still intend to talk about the examples you listed, and I thank you for going to the trouble of finding them.  If I presented myself in a manner that was anything less than grateful, I apologize, as that was not my intention.  I also apologize if it appears that I was trying to pick on your post.  But don't take it so personally.  Just because I was picking on something you quoted doesn't mean I was attacking you personally (unless you wrote that portion of the wiki, in which case I apologize for attacking you personally, although my opinion still stands that it was a humorous bit of rationalization). 

If you do find it pointless to discuss things like this, then there's no reason for you to be here, criticizing those of us who do.  But as it seems to me, you do enjoy presenting arguments about aspects of Star Wars, then I encourage you to continue voicing your opinions, despite the fact and, even more importantly, because of the fact that your opinion differs from most of ours.

There is no lingerie in space...

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don't exist... then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks... and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming... Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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"All" never literally means all, -1. Some people even like GW Bush.

 

if its simple for you, fine keep it simple....and don't mess with the midichlorians..

if you want something a little deeper, absorb the scientific aspects into the force...

if want it really complicated, then the EU fleshes that out...

 

why does any one version of it have to be 'wrong'?

 

Wrong? Well, that's a bit strong. But the midichlorians concept certainly clashes with the nebulous, inexact qualities the Force had in the OT. It's jarring to see something mystical turned into something quantifiable - or do you like to know how magic tricks are done before you see them?

Want to book yourself or a guest on THE VFP Show? PM me!

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Okay, even though negative 1 hasn't been back to this thread that I've seen, I'm going to start going through the exhaustive list he gathered for me.  But he did gather so much that I'm not even going to attempt to work on everything at once.  In fact, I think I'm just going to do one at a time because I know I have a lot to say about the first one.  So, just to be sure, I'm not ignoring all the work you did.  I'm just going to take it slow.

I'm going to start with Splinter of the Mind's Eye, seeing as how you listed it first, it's technically the first EU novel, and I just read it, so it's fresh in my mind.

First of all, I just want to say that, as a blanket statement, a lot of the stuff from this novel, in my opinion, gets something of a reprieve because it was written before The Force was really fully established, even in terms of just the original trilogy.  In fact, there were some things there that I was quite surprised to see and ended up being quite close to what would be in the sequels.  For example, Force-users in this book do a lot of object manipulations, ie, moving objects with The Force, a power that wasn't established in the movies until The Empire Strikes Back.  It makes me wonder how closely Alan Dean Foster worked with Lucas to write this book, if at all.  And also, it makes me wonder if object movement was something that Lucas had come up with and decided to let Foster use in his novel or something that Lucas borrowed from Foster for The Empire Strikes Back.  So, as I said, since Foster was probably only working under the first movie and whatever information Lucas might have imparted (which was obviously before Lucas invented many pivotal additions to the saga, including elements of The Force), he probably had to make a lot of assumptions about The Force and what it could do, but, in my opinion, not as many as you might think.

First of all, as I'm sure you probably know, the Kaiburr crystal was a Lucas idea.  It was the Macguffin in one of the drafts of the first movie, where Luke Starkiller had to return the Kaiburr crystal to his legendary father, The Starkiller.  He even had the crystal on board his snub fighter when Darth Vader was chasing him down at the end, and it was the Kaiburr crystal that Vader could sense emanating from it.  In fact, the leagues of the Sith could sense a disturbance in the Force emanating from the crystal from the other side of the galaxy.  And it pretty consisted of the basis of what you see in Splinter.  It's a crystal that magnifies the power of the Force in whoever uses it.  Granted, you asked how the crystal fits in with the way The Force is portrayed in the movies.  Since this plot point never made it to the movie, I guess you could argue that it might not have any place at all.  But since Lucas saw fit to use it in what might have been the theatrical sequel to Star Wars, it indicates that it was probably still connected to Lucas's concept of The Force circa 1977 which means that the original movie operates in a universe where a Kaiburr crystal is a legitimate companion to The Force.

As for its other powers, such as healing, well, like I said, Foster probably had to come up with Force powers on his own.  And I suppose you could say it doesn't necessarily contradict anything we later see from The Force if such a power is only capable through the crystal.  And if other sources do have Force-users portraying healing abilities... well, it makes even more sense that the Kaiburr crystal would be able to.

As for the rest of that stuff you quoted in the article... well, I've touched upon it already.  I still think it's silly, especially the assertion that Vader's intent was to capture Luke and Leia alive.  I never got the impression that he ever cared about bringing them in alive, even when he was miles away from the crystal.  It's just a pretty sloppy rationalization and makes quite a few assumptions.

But I actually have my own observation about what I consider to be a true anomaly in the concept of The Force as expressed in Splinter:  Size.

Towards the end of the book, Vader seems to prove to Luke that he is more adept at using the Force than Luke is by pointing out that the rock he levitated was much bigger than the rock Luke was able to levitate.  Of course, this completely flies in the face of Yoda's infamous, "Size matters not," monologue in The Empire Strikes Back.

And so, after just criticizing continuity-saving rationalizations... I'm gonna attempt to make up my own, just for fun.  While Yoda says that size doesn't matter, he immediately adds that it only makes a difference in one's mind.  And, despite Yoda's insistence in the theory that size doesn't matter, in practice it clearly does to Luke, as he is able to levitate stones but simply cannot raise his X-Wing, a much heavier object, out of the swamp.  So to one who is not as in tune with the Force or does not possess as much faith, size certainly is an obstacle. 

Anyway, that's all fine and dandy for Luke, but what about Vader, who should be competent enough to know better?  Well, I have three possible rationalizations for this.  I know, right?  The first is that Vader is simply pointing out what I said in the previous paragraph, just in a shorthand.  He knows that his faith in The Force is stronger than Luke's, therefore a larger object is possible for him to lift, while it isn't for Luke. 

The second and third rationalization depend on which version of Vader you're working with.  If you go with the version of Vader that this book was originally working with (ie. when Vader and Father Skywalker were two separate characters), it might be that Darth Vader abandoned his Jedi training before he was taught this tenet.  While not explicitly stated in the movie (although hinted at in the previous Kaiburr crystal draft), Vader left Obi-Wan before he mastered the Jedi Arts.  And then we can just assume that the whole size issue is not touched upon by Sith. 

Finally, if you go with the Father Vader version of the character... well, we'll just have to accept that Anakin must have been sick the day Obi-Wan was going to explain this, or that it was part of that basic Force education package that Anakin missed because he didn't train with Yoda as a... *shudders* Youngling.  Oh, yeah, and we also have to accept with this theory that the Sith don't care about size.

Well, I think that just about covers Splinter.  I'll try to address the others later.

^_^

There is no lingerie in space...

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don't exist... then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks... and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming... Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.