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Irvin Kershner on Special Editions

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Proof

Many people have said that George has no right to change The Empire Strikes Back because he did not direct it. George Lucas asked Kershner permission to make the Special Editions even though he didn't have too. Kershner gave him his full blessings and in the above link stated he sees the Special Edition as the superior version of the movie. I think Lukes scream is the only one he didn't like which is why I believe it is gone in this DVD.
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very nice link...
but i still dont believe anyone is going to be honest in Hollywood about another's work...

everyone kisses everyone else's ass over there whether they're a bad actor or director...
if you've worked with them.. you always have something nice to say..
TRUST ME!
"Never. I'll never turn to the darkside. You've failed your highness. I am a jedi, like my father before me."
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When it comes to Hollywood, I am reminded of William Goldman's words of wisdom on the subject: Nobody knows anything.

Princess Leia: I happen to like nice men.
Han Solo: I'm a nice man.

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lol
who's William Goldman?

name sounds strangly familiar
"Never. I'll never turn to the darkside. You've failed your highness. I am a jedi, like my father before me."
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William Goldman is one of the modern screenwriting gurus alongside Robert McKee and Syd Field.

He has written a couple of books about his many decades as a Hollywood screenwriter: "Adventures in the Screen Trade" and "Which Lie Did I Tell?".

Both books are very informative and I would recommend them to writers in ANY field.

I also recommend Syd FieldText's books beginning with "Screenplay".

Above all you MUST read Robert McKee's "STORY" as it is the quintessential tome on narrative, both cinematic and other.

Plus anything by Joseph Campbell is a must.

William Goldman works as a professional screenwriter and screenplay doctor he also wrote "The Princess Bride".

Another great site of information is Ted Elliott and Terry Rossio's WordPlay.

That's if you're interested.
"The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." - Goering.

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it." - Goebbels.

"In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." - Orwell.
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long time browser, first time poster...

First time I saw Star Wars was back when it was just called Star Wars, on its initial release. Doubt you'd have to think very hard to guess which version I'd like to have the chance to share with my kid.

Two things I find telling from that link that is posted above by Jimbo

One: That it's not just people that post on this forum that care if the Original versions get released.

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First off, we got a three-person panel consisting of Rick Dean (the THX technical director), John Lowry (the head film restoration expert), and Van Ling (the DVD producer and menu designer). Jim Ward also contributed some insights. The hottest issue of the day revolved around the ever-controversial "special edition vs. original edition" topic, as the first question to come from the audience had to do with how Lucas could justify releasing an altered version of Star Wars when he'd publicly excoriated the colorization of the original black-and-white Three Stooges films. Jim Ward took up the reply here, pointing out that Lucas felt very strongly in the artist's right to choose the presentation of his own material, and that while the Stooges weren't around to give the OK to colorization, Lucas himself, as the artist, had every right to decide which version of the Star Wars films to release. After several other pointed questions from the audience on the topic of the special editions (clearly everyone in the audience would have preferred the originals), Ward simply stressed that George Lucas had made it very clear that the special editions of the films represent most closely what he really wanted to do with the films, and wasn't able to do on the first pass due to budgetary and technical limitations.



and Two: For all the time we waited for these films to be released on dvd, George felt that one day for each 4 minutes was all it was worth for the clean up process.

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It was amusingly clear that Lowry is a total perfectionist, as he mentioned that his team had only 30 days to spend on each film, and he would have wanted to spend even more time restoring them. He dryly commented that "We don't usually have to deal with a living director," and added that doing so was "a pain in the ass."



I bet when they rework these films again for the next medium, that once again they will be shocked at the condition the masters are in, and will again have to 'repair' them. I cant help but be reminded of 'restorations' in the past , particularly on paintings, buildings and ancient objects ( Eqyptian treasures for instance), and how the attempts to preserve, no matter how well meaning, sometimes caused more damage than good. With George's way of thinking that each new version is the version to be built upon the next time a format changes, it seems each time a little bit more of what I watched and enjoyed ( yep, boxes around the spaceships and all ) when it was released , will be gone.




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Good post Ozkeeper and welcome.

Spread the word.

The resistance must grow strong if we are to do battle with the the evil Lucas Empre.

(It's late and I've had waaaay too much coffee.)
"The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." - Goering.

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it." - Goebbels.

"In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." - Orwell.
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Jim Ward took up the reply here, pointing out that Lucas felt very strongly in the artist's right to choose the presentation of his own material, and that while the Stooges weren't around to give the OK to colorization, Lucas himself, as the artist, had every right to decide which version of the Star Wars films to release.


Meanwhile, Curly is in heaven, screaming: "Oh, I want my movies colorized now! Woo woo woo woo! Iac Iac Iac!"

Before episode 3, there will be a short movie by the stooges with full color, techno music and CGI backgrounds.
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Originally posted by: ricarleite
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Jim Ward took up the reply here, pointing out that Lucas felt very strongly in the artist's right to choose the presentation of his own material, and that while the Stooges weren't around to give the OK to colorization, Lucas himself, as the artist, had every right to decide which version of the Star Wars films to release.


Meanwhile, Curly is in heaven, screaming: "Oh, I want my movies colorized now! Woo woo woo woo! Iac Iac Iac!"

Before episode 3, there will be a short movie by the stooges with full color, techno music and CGI backgrounds.


HAH!!

Too funny.
"The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." - Goering.

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it." - Goebbels.

"In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." - Orwell.
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Where exactly in that link does it say that Kershner considers the SE superior?
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Originally posted by: JediKiller
Where exactly in that link does it say that Kershner considers the SE superior?


"Next up was Irvin Kershner, the director of The Empire Strikes Back, with some interesting comments about his role in making the second Star Wars film. The first question had to do with his opinion on the changes made for the special edition (yes, this crowd definitely favored the originals!), to which Kershner replied that he really didn't feel that the film was changed at all: there was just the added snow monster, the new window views in the city, and enhanced color and sound. From his point of view, it was clearly perfectly fine and nothing to even consider as significant. "

A little more than halfway down. He doesn't really say they're superior, he just says the changes aren't significent.

Gentlemen, you can’t fight in here, this is the war room!

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"Next up was Irvin Kershner, the director of The Empire Strikes Back, with some interesting comments about his role in making the second Star Wars film. The first question had to do with his opinion on the changes made for the special edition (yes, this crowd definitely favored the originals!), to which Kershner replied that he really didn't feel that the film was changed at all: there was just the added snow monster, the new window views in the city, and enhanced color and sound. From his point of view, it was clearly perfectly fine and nothing to even consider as significant. "

what we didnt hear...

Lucas' voice from an earpiece in Kershner during that statement

GL: don't worry, your doing fine... just stick to the script and nothing happens.... thats right big smiles.... everybody's happy... just ignore the sniper who has you in his sight...
"Never. I'll never turn to the darkside. You've failed your highness. I am a jedi, like my father before me."
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GL in Kirschener's earpiece :- just remember, as we rehearsed, or we'll start the same rumours about you as we did for Marquand.
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Kershner: Well I belive George Lucas is really improving his creative vision, and the changes made on the movies really made then better and closer not only to his original vision, but to mine as well. He is truly an artistic genius.

(as Kershner leaves to the back, he removes his rubber mask: it's GL)

GL: Woo, it was hot in this thing...

(goes to his car, opens his trunk, Kershner is there)

GL: Have you seen Goodfellas, Irvin? Well then you know what expects you... (cocks the gun)
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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(as Kershner leaves to the back, he removes his rubber mask: it's GL)


lol
reminds me of scooby doo

Luke: "look its old man Lucas from the haunted amusement park!"

Lucas: "and i would have gotten away with it too if it wasnt for you darn kids!"
"Never. I'll never turn to the darkside. You've failed your highness. I am a jedi, like my father before me."
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I know I am reviving this thread after 18 years, but is there any other evidence of him liking the special edition.

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Darth telly said:

I know I am reviving this thread after 18 years, but is there any other evidence of him liking the special edition.

He didn’t really consider the changes to be “changes” in the first place, if that makes sense.

Someone at the press conference for the dvd all the way back in 2004 (which included Mark Hamill, Irvin Kershner, Lucasfilm president Jim Ward and the Lowry guys) asked Kersh what he thought about the Special Edition and also his thoughts on ESB being the one with the least changes made to it.

The moderator kinda jokingly relays it to Kersh and kinda slowly says “he’s talking about … this idea (some laughs from the audience) that there’ve been changes made to the movie over the years.”

His response?

“Frankly I don’t know what he’s talking about. The sound was enhanced, the picture was enhanced, we added the snow monster. It’s the movie I made.”

Maybe he also mentioned Cloud City, I can’t remember now. Only reason I remember what I do now after more than 17 years is because I listened to the audio of it multiple times back in the day.

Kersh had this observation about making ESB that still sticks with me. He said he felt like he was working in the old Soviet system because it was like he was making two films: one for the censor, and one for the audience who would understand what he was trying to say.

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 (Edited)

Kersh was given final cut and Lucas had promised him it would be his movie. He went back on that with the Special Edition. Lucas made a similar promise to Marquand. But he was more amenable because he felt it was Lucas universe and he ought to make the film the way Lucas wanted. Of course he wasn’t alive to object to ROTJ Special Edition, but i doubt he would have minded. You are a director for hire when hired by Lucas, Lucas is the auteur. The only exception if Indiana Jones where it was co partnership with Spielberg, but it was never a suggestion that Lucas was backseat directing those, well at least the first 3, film 4 is arguable.

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Fang Zei said:

Darth telly said:

I know I am reviving this thread after 18 years, but is there any other evidence of him liking the special edition.

He didn’t really consider the changes to be “changes” in the first place, if that makes sense.

Someone at the press conference for the dvd all the way back in 2004 (which included Mark Hamill, Irvin Kershner, Lucasfilm president Jim Ward and the Lowry guys) asked Kersh what he thought about the Special Edition and also his thoughts on ESB being the one with the least changes made to it.

The moderator kinda jokingly relays it to Kersh and kinda slowly says “he’s talking about … this idea (some laughs from the audience) that there’ve been changes made to the movie over the years.”

His response?

“Frankly I don’t know what he’s talking about. The sound was enhanced, the picture was enhanced, we added the snow monster. It’s the movie I made.”

Maybe he also mentioned Cloud City, I can’t remember now. Only reason I remember what I do now after more than 17 years is because I listened to the audio of it multiple times back in the day.

Kersh had this observation about making ESB that still sticks with me. He said he felt like he was working in the old Soviet system because it was like he was making two films: one for the censor, and one for the audience who would understand what he was trying to say.

I find the “picture was enhanced” part interesting with the pink lightsabers and the other picture problems.

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Maybe he only watched the 1997 Special Edition on 35mm and never saw the incredibly awful 2004 DVD one can hope. Its worse it has that new Emperor scene and Boba Fett redubbed by Jango Fett. But the 97 still has worse replacement shots than the original lead up to cloud city, and alert my star destroyer to prepare for my arrival and Jerjerrod. Even if it had the Original Emperor and Jason Wingreen. If only they restored the picture did a cleaned up multi track digital mix, removed matte lines. Fix the Speeder transparency.

I even hate the zoomed in Falcon Cockpit shots. For every beautiful original effect cleaned up there is a nonsense cgi test shot that sticks out like a sore thumb.

They were using these as a place to learn new tools and create a toolbox to make the prequels. Its hideous to think they defaced the original. and even cut up the negative. And didn’t create a restored original first and the special edition second as an alternative cut.

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If the entire special edition enterprise never got any worse than the 1997 special edition of empire, we’d all be in pretty good shape.

I know I’ve made some very poor decisions recently.