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Idea: Integrating the two trilogies thread — Page 4

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When fighting, it's wisest to stand defensively, and then make a quick offensive strike where your opponent is vulnerable.  They leave their whole front side open with their blades in a position where it would in reality take too long to safely parry an attack.

TPM does have the worst pacing, but it still somehow does carry a closer to OT feel than the other two.  That frustrates me.  I'd love to see someone pull off the all-amazing-awe-inspiring-Antimatter trick of actually erasing Jar Jar from the picture.  That would begin to work some wonders.  Some dubbing would go a long way too.

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I auctually think that the main reason AOTC sucks is because it has the worst pacing of all of them.

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darth_ender said:

When fighting, it's wisest to stand defensively, and then make a quick offensive strike where your opponent is vulnerable.  They leave their whole front side open with their blades in a position where it would in reality take too long to safely parry an attack.

TPM does have the worst pacing, but it still somehow does carry a closer to OT feel than the other two.  That frustrates me.  I'd love to see someone pull off the all-amazing-awe-inspiring-Antimatter trick of actually erasing Jar Jar from the picture.  That would begin to work some wonders.  Some dubbing would go a long way too.

Yeah, but they're Jedi. If they're quick enough to block laser blasts, then I think they'd be quick enough to defend themselves in any position during a fight. Not to say you don't have a valid point, but to me, it just doesn't seem like a big deal.

Jar-Jar's actually an easily fixed problem once you dub him with an alien language, or another voice, or something of the like.

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DominicCobb said:

I auctually think that the main reason AOTC sucks is because it has the worst pacing of all of them.

AOTC sucks because it has a terrible mystery plot, and a terrible romantic plot. The pacing itself however, is easily worked around (Taking out the Yoda/Younglings scene, and the Dex's Diner scene is a good example as to how) TPM however, always seems to have terrible pacing no matter how it's edited. 

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MrInsaneA said:

DominicCobb said:

I auctually think that the main reason AOTC sucks is because it has the worst pacing of all of them.

AOTC sucks because it has a terrible mystery plot, and a terrible romantic plot. The pacing itself however, is easily worked around (Taking out the Yoda/Younglings scene, and the Dex's Diner scene is a good example as to how) TPM however, always seems to have terrible pacing no matter how it's edited. 

Ah, I see what you mean. I thought we were just talking about the original films. In terms of edits, yes, I have noticed that TPM's pacing is unfixable while AOTC's isn't.

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DominicCobb said:

MrInsaneA said:

DominicCobb said:

I auctually think that the main reason AOTC sucks is because it has the worst pacing of all of them.

AOTC sucks because it has a terrible mystery plot, and a terrible romantic plot. The pacing itself however, is easily worked around (Taking out the Yoda/Younglings scene, and the Dex's Diner scene is a good example as to how) TPM however, always seems to have terrible pacing no matter how it's edited. 

Ah, I see what you mean. I thought we were just talking about the original films. In terms of edits, yes, I have noticed that TPM's pacing is unfixable while AOTC's isn't.

L8Wrtr's edit is basically a blueprint for perfect pacing as far as AOTC goes.

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MrInsaneA said:

DominicCobb said:

MrInsaneA said:

DominicCobb said:

I auctually think that the main reason AOTC sucks is because it has the worst pacing of all of them.

AOTC sucks because it has a terrible mystery plot, and a terrible romantic plot. The pacing itself however, is easily worked around (Taking out the Yoda/Younglings scene, and the Dex's Diner scene is a good example as to how) TPM however, always seems to have terrible pacing no matter how it's edited. 

Ah, I see what you mean. I thought we were just talking about the original films. In terms of edits, yes, I have noticed that TPM's pacing is unfixable while AOTC's isn't.

L8Wrtr's edit is basically a blueprint for perfect pacing as far as AOTC goes.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing.

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aalenfae said:

Argh, I've been dying to watch L8Wrtr's edit, but I can't find the time! *Goes and watches anyways*



Oh, and a little late, but here's some insight on Anakin and Dooku's stances in AotC:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jodan-no-kamae

AHA! It's an actual fighting stance. 

And I suggest watching L8wrtr's edit ASAP. His edit is, so far, the best version of AOTC that I've seen. Very well done.

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Can't watch the video at the moment, but I'll check when I can.  Okay, fine, it's a real stance.  I stand corrected.  It still seems weird to me, but I did admit I'm no fencing pro.  It was just an observation, and apparently a pretty ignorant one.  Apparently I'm good at making myself look dumb too.

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Just watched L8Wrtr's edit of AotC. I liked it a lot for the most part. There were a few moments where I didn't understand why he left stuff in/took stuff out, but for the most part, it was great.


I like the edit itself. 
But the music is a tad invasive, I think. Awesome points for Shadows of the Empire, though!

 

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darth_ender said:

Can't watch the video at the moment, but I'll check when I can.  Okay, fine, it's a real stance.  I stand corrected.  It still seems weird to me, but I did admit I'm no fencing pro.  It was just an observation, and apparently a pretty ignorant one.  Apparently I'm good at making myself look dumb too.

Don't beat yourself up, it's just an argument about fictional space people beating each other with glow sticks.

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aalenfae said:

Just watched L8Wrtr's edit of AotC. I liked it a lot for the most part. There were a few moments where I didn't understand why he left stuff in/took stuff out, but for the most part, it was great.


I like the edit itself. 
But the music is a tad invasive, I think. Awesome points for Shadows of the Empire, though!

 

Thanks! But what do you mean by "invasive?" 

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It just seems like the music isn't supposed to be there, I guess. 
It might just be because I'm used to how it is originally. 

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aalenfae said:

It just seems like the music isn't supposed to be there, I guess. 
It might just be because I'm used to how it is originally. 

You mean this particular piece of music, or any music at all? Because I honestly am not a fan of the whole "tribal drums" thing in this scene, in the absence of music.

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It might just be the volume, or the intensity. Maybe if it was a little slower and a little quieter? 

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aalenfae said:

It might just be the volume, or the intensity. Maybe if it was a little slower and a little quieter? 

Worth a shot. I'll see what I can do. 

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darth_ender said:

Can't watch the video at the moment, but I'll check when I can.  Okay, fine, it's a real stance.  I stand corrected.  It still seems weird to me, but I did admit I'm no fencing pro.  It was just an observation, and apparently a pretty ignorant one.  Apparently I'm good at making myself look dumb too.

It's a pretty standard stance for many forms of sword fighting to be honest (I've done a little bit of sword fighting in Aikido and tried out fencing and Kendo). I wouldn't feel dumb about it though, most people don't know much about sword fighting except for what they've seen in films, which are usually very unrealistic (Twilight Samurai and Kingdom of Heaven are two exceptions to that rule).

From my perspective as someone has tried out Sword Fighting (though I'm no expert) the OT fights are a lot more realistic, I posted a Kendo video elsewhere to prove this point. It's actually a lot closer to the Vader vs Obi Wan in ANH, but most people think thats the worst fight of the series.. I think this is more down to comparing sword fights to other films than an actual knowledge of sword fighting.However Star Wars is basically an escape movie, so the sword fights being unrealistic isn't make or break for me, and I think many prefer more fancy fights to the Obi-Wan - Vader one in ANH.

I don't have a great connection atm so can't go looking for another, but a quick "Kendo World Championships" search on youtube should prove example enough for what real sword fights look like. Guess it depends what your looking for, but a lot of the fighting stances in the PT are crap, and would get you butchered pretty quickly. As a side not, Dooku swings horizontally and Anakin's arm gets chopped vertically... How does that make sense?

Moving on, with regards integrating the two trilogies;

TPM; I'd prefer a much older Anakin on Tatooine. I think it would make for a much more realistic romance story, as well as him having an argument with his uncle over if he should join the Clone Wars (to match up with Obi-Wan saying in ANH "did't hold with your fathers ideal's thought he shouldn't of gotten involved". Would also have Obi-Wan as already a Jedi Knight instead of being a Padawan - which removes the whole "Yoda the Jedi Master who trained me" issue. Possibly have the invasion of Naboo as the beggining of the Clone Wars... Would like Anakin to deliberately destroy the droid control ship... L8rtr did do this in his excellent edit, but I think it would be better to remove the "ships overheated" and just have Anakin, skid in, shoot the reactor, then flyout.

AotC; I'd like Anakin, just to have normal Jedi robes, as seen in the original RotJ ghost scene... It would reflect his darkening charachter in RotS that he then changes to the darker ones. Would also I think more sense of the force Ghost of him in RotJ with normal robes.

For RotS, I'd like Anakin to confront the Emporer/Sidious alone, and end with him being shot by Sidious lightning. "Do not underestimate the powers of the Emperor or suffer your fathers fate you will" This would be the last time we see Hayden as Anakin (thank God!) - Would be good if when Mace is about to Kill Sidious, Vader in suit chops his hand off, think that would be a great reveal moment, of Vader coming about. Would also love to see more of Vader hunting the Jedi down... Then have Vader invading the Jedi Temple in suit, then also fighting Obi-Wan on Mustafar with Vader in suit. Not sure if any of that is possible, but I can dream :-p. I think the former also solves the whole shock reveal thing of Vader being Anakin. No Padme dying either... For obvious reasons.

@MrinsaneA - it took an age, but watched your video, I actually quite like the music you integrated, certainly thought it was better than the original score.

"Love is the only reality and it is not a mere sentiment. It is the ultimate truth that lies at the heart of creation." - Rabindranath Tagore

"Many a doctrine is like a window pane. We see truth through it but it divides us from truth." - Kahlil Gibran

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I find your last idea in particular quite interesting with the force lightning.  It still leaves some room for confusion and uncertainty though, as we don't have any indication that Vader was ever Obi-Wan's apprentice, nor why he has a bitter hatred of him at the end fight.  Technically speaking it would take a very talented CGI man and some actor in a costume to pull it off, but it sounds promising.  I still feel that it would be nice to be able to watch the movies 1-6 and not have the Vader/Anakin surprise spoiled, but that may not be possible to pull off effectively.

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darth_ender said:

I find your last idea in particular quite interesting with the force lightning.  It still leaves some room for confusion and uncertainty though, as we don't have any indication that Vader was ever Obi-Wan's apprentice, nor why he has a bitter hatred of him at the end fight.  Technically speaking it would take a very talented CGI man and some actor in a costume to pull it off, but it sounds promising.  I still feel that it would be nice to be able to watch the movies 1-6 and not have the Vader/Anakin surprise spoiled, but that may not be possible to pull off effectively.

Hey, yeah it would require a lot of editing, not sure it will ever happen but suppose depends what Ady has up his sleeve for his prequel edits. It does seem a shame to me that the whole shock of "I am your father"is taken away if watched 1-6.  Before the PT, I had always imagined Anakin confronting the Emporer and getting his ass kicked from the aforementioned Yoda quote. I also think it would be much cooler if Mace is about to kill the Emporer and Vader deliberately and knowingly saves him.

One of my issues with the PT is the need to explain everything; i.e. do we really need to see the moment Anakin falls or becomes Vader? Anyway back to your point does Obi-Wan's comment about Darth Vader being his apprentice need to be explained in RotS? Tp me it's always seemed Obi-Wan is trying to spare Lukes feelings, and Obi-Wan knows who Vader is. With regards Vaders hate; what, if Vader (in suit) still had his arms and legs cut off and Obi-Wan leaves him on the shore of Mustafa; a lot of that dialogue I think needs to be cut in any case to make the father reveal later a shock.

"Love is the only reality and it is not a mere sentiment. It is the ultimate truth that lies at the heart of creation." - Rabindranath Tagore

"Many a doctrine is like a window pane. We see truth through it but it divides us from truth." - Kahlil Gibran

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I had a thought that I bet most will disagree with: Vader should refer to Palpatine as Master Sidious at least once in ROTJ.  There, I said it!

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darth_ender said:

I had a thought that I bet most will disagree with: Vader should refer to Palpatine as Master Sidious at least once in ROTJ.  There, I said it!

You're right.

I disagree with it. XD

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darth_ender said:

I had a thought that I bet most will disagree with: Vader should refer to Palpatine as Master Sidious at least once in ROTJ.  There, I said it!

I have mixed feelings about that. It would be good for the sake of continuity, I suppose, but I'm personally the type who thinks that we should try our best to make the PT fit the OT and not the other way around. That being said, I AM pretty big on continuity... perhaps it might be better, though, to remove all instances of the name "Darth Sidious" from the PT films and therefore remove any reason for Vader to refer to him as such.