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Info & Help: Looking for... Raiders Of The Lost Ark - on HDTV

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 (Edited)

Apparently Raiders aired once on Paramount’s HDTV channel, and, as the screen grab below attests to, it looks stunning and well above the resolution of the standard DVD release.

Does anyone have this? Supposedly it was floating around on Usenet.

Screenshot

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Sweet zombie Jesus

The Secret History of Star Wars -- now available on Amazon.com!

"When George went back and put new creatures into the original Star Wars, I find that disturbing. It’s a revision of history. That bothers me."

--James Cameron, Entertainment Weekly, April 2010

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That's it. That's the one. Thanks guys.

Now, not really sure what to do with this once DL is complete, but it's awesome looking.

Something interesting about it though, is that it was aired pre-DVD, so I'm assuming it doesn't have any of the enhancements Lowry Digital & ILM did to it. Also, the soundmix is 2.0.

Can you imagine this thing with the theatrical mix (reportedly identical to current DVD mix) with a picture of this quality, without the digital cleanups. Mana from heaven, I tells you.
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As cool as this is, and as much as I'd like to have a DVD version of it, why is this even allowed? I don't understand why a higher res version of a widely available commercial release is ok, and an original cut of an asian film that is difficult to obtain is not?
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Originally posted by: TR47
As cool as this is, and as much as I'd like to have a DVD version of it, why is this even allowed? I don't understand why a higher res version of a widely available commercial release is ok, and an original cut of an asian film that is difficult to obtain is not?


Yes, you're right in theory. I guess you culd argue that if it is free of the alterations (although) minimal, that Lowry & ILM made to Raiders, that this constitutes a "different" version. I know it's a fine line, though...
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It would have the old title, would it not? None of this "Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark" stuff. Is this enough of a difference to justify it as a preservation project?

And I got to say I'm digging the Oakland Raiders ad on this page. Go Raiders!
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Well, the Indiana Jones part was only added to the Raiders title when the accursed YIJC television series was released - part of Lucas' cohesiveness obsession.

The actual film was not changed, the titles remain as they were in 1981, rather the packaging was altered on VHS (?) and DVD.

There is probably nothing to make it a candidate for a fan preservation project, unless it turns out that the snake reflection, boulder guide track etc... are still there. The content of the film, edit, picture, sound etc. are still as they always were in the 2003 DVD's, but since this broadcast predates the DVD, it may have none of the digital enhancements levied for the release - in which case, would make a dandy hi-def 25th Anniversary theatrical preservation project. Or I could be splitting hairs...I just want to see this thing.
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Originally posted by: TR47
As cool as this is, and as much as I'd like to have a DVD version of it, why is this even allowed? I don't understand why a higher res version of a widely available commercial release is ok, and an original cut of an asian film that is difficult to obtain is not?
I have to agree with TR47 on this - I'm a little in shock just seeing this thread...
Some were not blessed with brains.
<blockquote>Originally posted by: BadAssKeith

You are passing up on a great opportunity to makes lots of money,
make Lucas lose a lot of his money
and make him look bad to the entire world
and you could be well known and liked

None of us here like Lucas or Lucasfilm.
I have death wishes on Lucas and Macullum.
we could all probably get 10s of thousands of dollars!
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Well, it started as a request to see if anyone had a copy of it. Deal.
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Originally posted by: TheCassidy
Well, it started as a request to see if anyone had a copy of it. Deal.
I feel better already. ... and I still agree with TR47. Though I don't know what asian film he's talking about... how old are you Cassidy?
Some were not blessed with brains.
<blockquote>Originally posted by: BadAssKeith

You are passing up on a great opportunity to makes lots of money,
make Lucas lose a lot of his money
and make him look bad to the entire world
and you could be well known and liked

None of us here like Lucas or Lucasfilm.
I have death wishes on Lucas and Macullum.
we could all probably get 10s of thousands of dollars!
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Time
Considering the title is not available for retail in HD I'd say this falls into the same category as fan-preservation.

The Secret History of Star Wars -- now available on Amazon.com!

"When George went back and put new creatures into the original Star Wars, I find that disturbing. It’s a revision of history. That bothers me."

--James Cameron, Entertainment Weekly, April 2010

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Originally posted by: boris
Originally posted by: TheCassidy
Well, it started as a request to see if anyone had a copy of it. Deal.
I feel better already. ... and I still agree with TR47. Though I don't know what asian film he's talking about... how old are you Cassidy?


It's not the years...it's the mileage.

Look, I wasn't trying to start something if that's what you're implying. I'm old enough to have seen 'Raiders' a dozen times or so during its' original release, and I was more than a little upset that Lucas couldn't keep his damned infernal tinkering paws off of it when it was released on DVD.

This has come up here before, and I have no desire to rehash or start a flame war, but suffice to say I want an unaltered version of 'Raiders' with warts and all. If this doesn't fall under the purvue of this site, than so be it. I saw no harm in asking if anyone had this, or had seen it.
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Originally posted by: zombie84
Considering the title is not available for retail in HD I'd say this falls into the same category as fan-preservation.


My own "preservation" effort was Ong-Bak, and my thread discussing it was locked. I fail to see the difference between better video and better audio (as well as being the original cut) in judging what is acceptable. There is nothing fundamentally different between this proposition and mine. I don't want to be self indulgent here, but my concerns were just shelved by the management, and it's frustrating. To be honest, I'd like to see this come to fruition, but if the rules aren't obeyed by everyone, they're meaningless.
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This thread can continue as a general discussion of the HD source. No-one is distributing any DVDs here.

I've removed the posts stating where the HDTV version can be obtained from.

Guidelines for post content and general behaviour: read announcement here

Max. allowable image sizes in signatures: reminder here

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Originally posted by: TheCassidy
This has come up here before, and I have no desire to rehash or start a flame war, but suffice to say I want an unaltered version of 'Raiders' with warts and all. If this doesn't fall under the purvue of this site, than so be it. I saw no harm in asking if anyone had this, or had seen it. Yes, but the question is then, is the HDTV version actually the "un-tweaked" version? Where the blue screen effects still look dated and such I know what you mean - but I think you're crossing a line if you're just talking about a version that's no different to the retail disc except that it's higher quality... I mean come on... all I'm saying is that I was quite shocked in seeing this post... it just about made my skin crawl. The last (SD) TV version that I saw was the tweaked version. I can kind of understand where you're coming from if you're genuinely wanting to preserve the movie before it's "tweaks" for DVD ... but it sounded like you were just trying to rip off the movie and get yourself a hi-res version, see:

"Apparently Raiders aired once on Paramount's HDTV channel, and, as the screen grab below attests to, it looks stunning and well above the resolution of the standard DVD release.

Does anyone have this? Supposedly it was floating around on Usenet."

I mean to me yes it's a bit like colourizing a B&W film to have those "tweaks" in it (isn't that the quote that used to be on the front page of this site?). I guess what I'm thinking, is that I don't want to start a war - and although I know the indy movies have some minor tweaks in it, i don't feel it's as bad as star wars... that is to say that if Lucas released the "OOT" without the orange blob under Luke's speeder like he did indy without the plexiglass reflection... well i wouldn't be happy about it, but I'd be happier then if he never released the OOT. I really don't know why they felt they should make digital cosmetic changes to Indy, but as a result it's a release I won't be purchasing. But as I said, last time I saw indy on telle it was the digitally altered version... I could tell after indy jumps out of the plane and they're on the raft - it used to be an obvious blue-screen effect, now it's been "fixed".Originally posted by: zombie84
Considering the title is not available for retail in HD I'd say this falls into the same category as fan-preservation.
You are welcome to your opinion, and I do sincerely hope that that line of reasoning is unique to you. I think i'll stick to the other preservation forum ...
Some were not blessed with brains.
<blockquote>Originally posted by: BadAssKeith

You are passing up on a great opportunity to makes lots of money,
make Lucas lose a lot of his money
and make him look bad to the entire world
and you could be well known and liked

None of us here like Lucas or Lucasfilm.
I have death wishes on Lucas and Macullum.
we could all probably get 10s of thousands of dollars!
Author
Time
If someone can confirm upon review of the material that it's the original unaltered film without digital "corrections", it qualifies as preservation and the discussion will be permitted to continue.

TR47, you took materials available at retail, mixed a few pieces together, and called it a fan edit. The discussion was shelved because I was busy with personal matters at the time and an Ong Bak DVD with a swapped soundtrack was #1000 on my list of priorities; this was explained to you. You were eventually provided with a response to your issue and a new term ("custom DVD") was coined to handle projects like your Ong Bak release.

There are many grey areas here and the final call is ours. The rules can flex and grow (as the "custom DVD" category shows) as new situations arise.
originaltrilogy.com Administrator

MTFBWY…A

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The digitally restoration of the Indy films were done at HD resolution - so the HD version will have the mistake fixes.
"I was a perfect idiot to listen to you!"
"Listen here, there ain't nothing in this world that's perfect!"

- from The Bank Dick
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Originally posted by: boris
Originally posted by: zombie84
Considering the title is not available for retail in HD I'd say this falls into the same category as fan-preservation.
You are welcome to your opinion, and I do sincerely hope that that line of reasoning is unique to you. I think i'll stick to the other preservation forum ...


I fail to see how "preserving" a star wars laserdisk is different than this.

The Secret History of Star Wars -- now available on Amazon.com!

"When George went back and put new creatures into the original Star Wars, I find that disturbing. It’s a revision of history. That bothers me."

--James Cameron, Entertainment Weekly, April 2010

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Originally posted by: OgOggilby
The digitally restoration of the Indy films were done at HD resolution - so the HD version will have the mistake fixes.


ABC aired Raiders in HD at 720p years ago, so there was definitely an HD master created at some point well before the DVD release. The HD master with digital tweaks created for the DVD release could be a second, newer master.
originaltrilogy.com Administrator

MTFBWY…A

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Well, I've been downloading the 1080i version for 26 hours now and I'm 48.9% done. This mother is huge but I'll be damned if I'm going to miss out on it.

Also, I want to be very clear in this thread - I never once postulated that it would be released as a DVD, I just figured like-minded folks here would either know something about it, or want it for themselves.

Thank you, Jay, for being the voice of reason yet again - and apologies to anyone who mistook my original intent.
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Some new info regarding 'Raiders.'

I can confirm that it is the US television edit, pre-2003 DVD remastering. So, in effect, it is a little bit different than the official release.

For example, after the Raven Bar fight scene, Marion says "I'm your NEW DAMN partner," as opposed to "God Damned partner" in the theatrical cut. This is consistent with the TV cut which featured much of the swearing removed (including German) and replaced by an alternate "clean" track.

Honestly, I'm a little bit dissappointed because despite the fact that this look brilliant, there are cuts for commercials and the edit conforms to TV.

The good news is that the ABC watermark logo isn't burned in like the 720p version, and the matte lines, boulder guide tracks and other "gaffes" are visible. So, in essence, this is close to the theatrical version with no digital alterations, but it is edited for TV.

I'm not sure if there is any of the violence removed, I seem to remember the Flying Wing sequence edited in the 80's TV version with the blood splatter gone after the German Mechanic gets hit by the prop. We'll see once the whole file is downloaded and I'll report back in with all of the changes.

I guess this qualifies for a fan preservation after all, eh?
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OK, I checked out a bit more. Just to be clear, here's what I noticed that is different.

-The swearing is either replaced by an overdub, or muted. Instead of Indy telling Belloq, "Son of a bitch," the word "bitch" is gone, just implied, as is the aforementioned "God damned partner" line by Marion.
-The effects and gaffes are all consistent with a pre-2003 DVD version.
-The violence is still...uh...violent. Yes, the German Mechanice blood splatter is still present.

So, as near as I can tell with an incomplete download, the only thing different from the DVD is the swearing, the 2.0 sound, and the occasional break for commercials. Hopefully they aren;t too jarring or have too many frames cut so it can be all edited together.

It looks absolutely gorgeous, though. The film grain is present, so it has a real vintage 1981 35mm look to it, but with HD clarity if that makes any sense at all...