Info Wanted: anyone done a TPM and AOTC colour correction? — Page 2

@Jetrell Fo: As far as I know, we don't have access to the true theatrical versions of these films. At least in full HD I mean.

What I think could be done to the ones we have is basically:

Episode 1: Use a combination of normal blur and the avisynth plugin BlindDeHalo to get rid of some edge enhancement. Do a basic color correction to get rid of the pink tint.

Episode 2: Use the chroma from the HDTV version and merge it with the luma of the blu-ray. If they match, that is. Were any scenes altered in this release?

I know there are film versions available....it's a matter of money really.  This is why it probably won't happen any time soon.  Believe you me, if I could afford it I'd be buying the prints so they could get scanned.  I would do the same for the 1997 SE in the same circumstance.

I still can't figure out if the LD for TPM is cropped like the DVD or not cropped like the theatrical release and the Blu-ray.  It's so confusing sometimes....LOL.

Episode 1 should be quite "simple" - all we need is to take the official BluRay, replace the scenes with Yoda with the colour-corrected HDTV capture, cut out all added scenes, and re-create the transitions using an upscale of the TB capture. The original 5.1 DTS track was released on some LD in Japan if I remember correctly. But I'm not sure about the cropping

Episode 2 would be more hard to do - the main problem is that we don't have (or "I" don't have) any good quality version of the changed scenes. When I did my theatrical version of E2 on DVD, I used an upscale of the VHS, and it looked stupid even in DVD resolution. Does anybody know a better source for the scenes than my old VHS ?

Episode 3 is the easiest to do, if the "experts" are correct it would be enough to mux the video from the BD with the audio from the DVD

pittrek said:

Episode 1 should be quite "simple" - all we need is to take the official BluRay, replace the scenes with Yoda with the colour-corrected HDTV capture, cut out all added scenes, and re-create the transitions using an upscale of the TB capture. The original 5.1 DTS track was released on some LD in Japan if I remember correctly. But I'm not sure about the cropping.

I found this.....

Dolby Digital EX 6.1 Sound, THX Certified, Widescreen

Star Wars: The Phantom Menace

 

(Catalog Number: PILF-2830)(THX)(2.35:1)(3 Sides)(CLV)(CC)(NTSC)

LaserDisc: Special Features

• The Best Version on LaserDisc
• One of 3 Japan Only Dolby Digital EX 6.1 Releases
• The Last THX LaserDisc Manufactured
• Pressed in Limited Quantities on the 4th of July 2000
• Set of 4 Collector's Cards
• English Language with Japanese Subtitles Outside the Picture
• Presented in the Original Theatrical Aspect Ratio of 2.35:1
• Original Theatrical Trailer

 

Episode 2 would be more hard to do - the main problem is that we don't have (or "I" don't have) any good quality version of the changed scenes. When I did my theatrical version of E2 on DVD, I used an upscale of the VHS, and it looked stupid even in DVD resolution. Does anybody know a better source for the scenes than my old VHS?

Unless there is a well captured HD-TV broadcast out there, I don't know of any other than the DVD and Blu-ray...unless one would have the film reels for the theatrical release.

 

Episode 3 is the easiest to do, if the "experts" are correct it would be enough to mux the video from the BD with the audio from the DVD.

I'd guess if we could access the DTS Theatrical audio it might well be the same simple fix.

The only HDTV broadcast which I know about is the same version as the DVD, the ONLY source "I" have for the original theatrical scenes is the official VHS + some theatrical preservation.

Is a capture of the LD of Episode 1 "available" somewhere ?

pittrek said:

Episode 1 should be quite "simple" - all we need is to take the official BluRay, replace the scenes with Yoda with the colour-corrected HDTV capture, cut out all added scenes, and re-create the transitions using an upscale of the TB capture. The original 5.1 DTS track was released on some LD in Japan if I remember correctly. But I'm not sure about the cropping

The blu-ray has lots of DVNR, but of course, the HDTV version has lots of edge enhancement and both are bad in different ways. The best would of course be a scan of a theatrical print.

But for creating a theatrical version in HD, I would not choose the blu-ray as a source. With that blu-ray like with all other Star Wars films, Lucas has usually made some small changes here and there that people find much later.

Take this shot from DVDactive's comparison for example:

When you first look at it you think "Oh, they fixed some of the pink tint and it's less cropped too!" but then if you look closely at the path in the middle:

See how they made this little part brighter?

Those small changes are enough of a reason to not use the blu-ray for a theatrical HD version.

Sorry to be the know-nothing pest to poke in here, but I don't have the VHS of AOTC.  Is the VHS the same as the theatrical?  Were the changes made specifically for the DVD release?  Or does one need a bootleg to see the theatrical version?

http://www.dvdactive.com/editorial/articles/star-wars-the-changes-part-four.html

Dolby Digital EX 6.1 Sound, THX Certified, Widescreen

( Catalog Number PILF2830 ) (THX) (2.35:1) (3 Sides) (CLV) (CC) (NTSC)

This is info I have seen for the Laserdisc of TPM.  I have it captured.  Each LD side has it's own DVD5.  MPEG2, 9.0Mbps, DD 2.0.

It would certainly need some fixing but it may be better than a digital source to start with, IDK, it's just an idea.

pittrek said:

http://www.dvdactive.com/editorial/articles/star-wars-the-changes-part-four.html

You_Too has a link up for this ......

Was the vhs of AOTC the theatrical cut??? I thought it was the altered version just like the dvd. They were released on the same day.

It's not terribly clear to me from DVDActive.  I'm guessing it's the altered version, but it'd be nice to know for sure.  Where does one obtain the theatrical, if not on VHS?

LexX said:

Are you really saying that you'd rather leave more image out than that small change?

That was not my point. The point is who knows how many small changes here and there like that one are in the blu-ray release? Just take that little thing about the green clothes being changed to red in the Cantina scene in SW, which was pointed out just before Harmy released his version.

That's one reason why the blu-ray version probably shouldn't be used to create a theatrical version in HD. At least from a purist perspective.

But knowing the PT is not as old as the OT, there should be lots of unfaded prints out there which would look better than both the HDTV version and blu-ray.

You_Too said:

LexX said:

Are you really saying that you'd rather leave more image out than that small change?

That was not my point. The point is who knows how many small changes here and there like that one are in the blu-ray release? Just take that little thing about the green clothes being changed to red in the Cantina scene in SW, which was pointed out just before Harmy released his version.

That's one reason why the blu-ray version probably shouldn't be used to create a theatrical version in HD. At least from a purist perspective.

But knowing the PT is not as old as the OT, there should be lots of unfaded prints out there which would look better than both the HDTV version and blu-ray.

Agreed and agreed......  :)

You_Too said:

pittrek said:

Episode 1 should be quite "simple" - all we need is to take the official BluRay, replace the scenes with Yoda with the colour-corrected HDTV capture, cut out all added scenes, and re-create the transitions using an upscale of the TB capture. The original 5.1 DTS track was released on some LD in Japan if I remember correctly. But I'm not sure about the cropping

The blu-ray has lots of DVNR, but of course, the HDTV version has lots of edge enhancement and both are bad in different ways. The best would of course be a scan of a theatrical print.

But for creating a theatrical version in HD, I would not choose the blu-ray as a source. With that blu-ray like with all other Star Wars films, Lucas has usually made some small changes here and there that people find much later.

Take this shot from DVDactive's comparison for example:

When you first look at it you think "Oh, they fixed some of the pink tint and it's less cropped too!" but then if you look closely at the path in the middle:

See how they made this little part brighter?

Those small changes are enough of a reason to not use the blu-ray for a theatrical HD version.

I can at least confirm that the TPM VHS is cropped like the DVD, the Japan LD I have has the same cropping. 

:(

Alexrd said:

For those who are interested in an AotC preservation, which HDTV version will you use as a basis? I'm looking for one myself, but don't know what's the best version available (i.e: higher bitrate, etc...).

I don't know of any other different HDTV versions of AoTC.  Anything that's been compressed or re-compressed is going to look crappy anyways.

That dvdactive article keeps saying "in the digital and dvd versions" for several of those comparisons, but I don't think the extended version of Anakin's confession to Padme about the Tuskens was in either of the theatrical versions (35mm or digital). I'm pretty sure that particular change wasn't added until the dvd.

Alexrd said:

AotC teal shift was a very last minute change (like the humdinger glitch) since according to people who were at the Comic Con presentation and the press junket, AotC didn't have that teal tint at the time. Even the small clips of the movie shown in the extras look fine.

That's weird. But of course it's Lucasfilm we're talking about...

Looking at the comparison screenshots, it looks like blue has been shifted to teal, but the hue of yellow/red has been shifted to pink. This makes me think colors were shifted individually.

What I'd like to know is why they'd be shifting colors individually in the first place?  From my first impression of the Blu-ray set, everything they did was to prepare for the 3D presentation.  Unfortunately, most everything they did was still noticeable.....and not in a good way, far as I'm concerned.

Fang Zei said:

That dvdactive article keeps saying "in the digital and dvd versions" for several of those comparisons...

Yeah, this was my reason for suspecting that perhaps the VHS was different.  However I remembered that my parents own the VHS, and since they don't live too far away I borrowed it from them today.  Sadly, it looks like the same as the DVD version :(

You_Too said:

When you first look at it you think "Oh, they fixed some of the pink tint and it's less cropped too!" but then if you look closely at the path in the middle:

<img src="http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/970/55962776.png" width="114" height="90" />

See how they made this little part brighter?

Those small changes are enough of a reason to not use the blu-ray for a theatrical HD version.