Info Wanted: ANH.....Revisited or Purist??? — Page 5

@ Crygor64......you say that you dont mean to flame or piss people off when you come and say things like that....but heres the problem with that statement: You come into a thread with an arrogant attitude, proclaim your opinion as higher than everyone else's and then proceed to deride anyone when they disagree with you. You put words in people's mouths.....you tell them what they are thinking in their own heads....and you insult them openly by saying they are as bad as the person that they are here speaking out against........and all of it (and heres the best part)....all of it is done in a thread, and in a section of this website, that you disagree with....therefore you MUST know that the people found within will NOT agree with you, but you choose to come and say it anyways. Basically you just walked into a kid's birthday party and told the parents you don't like the color of balloons they chose. I'm all for open discussion, but it really seems like all you were trying to do was cause trouble and piss people off.

Crygor64 said:

Sorry folks, while I know my harsh words may have ruffled a few feathers, and I'm glad some of you took the time to write detailed responses (which I read but did not agree with), my point is still entirely valid.

Some of us don't feel the original trilogy needs "improvement." If you condemn George for making changes and yet you support Adywan and his "Extra Special Editions" you are a total hypocrite. There's no denying that truth. I'm not saying this to flame or to cause trouble, its just the truth. And someone needs to say this. Its loooong overdue.

This forum has roughly 60,000 posts. 30,000 of those posts are in two topics related to Adywan's "Extra Special Editions." If George has seen this is must make him laugh.

For once, it looks like he finally got the last laugh.

Aside from the massive amounts of hyperbole and extremism, I generally think Cygor is right.  If half the amount of creative energy that go into the discussion of how to make the Star Wars movies more enjoyable through new matte paintings went into preservation efforts, we might have near perfect OOT fan preservations by now.

That said, I ultimately blame Lucas for the fan-edit phenomenon.  If he hadn't thrown out all the rules by making the classic trilogy into his own fan-edit, it wouldn't have given fans the green-light to make their own.  And if he would have made the prequels as lousy as they were, we wouldn't have to make fan-edits to make them watchable.

If George felt that the classic trilogy needed a facelift, Adywan masterfully cleaned up George's botched surgery.  Would I rather watch the originals in blu-ray quality?  Of course.  But Adywan's edit is a fun alternative.  

That said, all these threads of how to further change A New Hope do get me a little irritated.  As well as the numerous sycophants on the boards.

But...

Really, between my love/hate relationship with these edits, it boils down to  two things for me.

"Take it easy, kid.  It's only a movie." - Ham Salad from Hardware Wars

"It's fun to watch Star Wars." -Bill Moyers

As long as I keep those in mind, Star Wars stays fun.  Yeah, it takes the use of blinders to ignore a lot of the extraneous junk (see my When Did Star Wars stop being fun thread), and I might one day just bag the whole internet and only do my Star Wars enjoyment alone, but so far, Star Wars stays fun if you don't worry about it (and this applies to both sides - those who want to change thousands of details and those who view any tampering as blasphemous sacrilege).

You, Star Wars fan on the internet who may happen to read this, can enjoy your fandom how ever you would like.  Just don't tell me how to enjoy mine.  

Actually, you, Star Wars fan on the internet who may happen to read this, you should go outside and spend time with loved ones.

I'm getting off the computer for a while.  The dishes need washing.

I wish he would just post some nice pictures of floating Bespin spas.

Crygor64 said: If you condemn George for making changes and yet you support Adywan and his "Extra Special Editions" you are a total hypocrite. There's no denying that truth.

If people condemn Lucas just for making changes but wish to make changes of their own, then the charge of hypocrisy would be valid; however, I do not think that many people here do condemn Lucas just for the changes made to the Special Editions.  I certainly do not.  What people do condemn him for is failing to preserve the original versions in high quality and wishing to erase a part of cinema history.

As I said before, Adywan wants both his versions and the original versions to be available to people, which is completely different from Lucas, who only wants the 2004 Special Editions to be available to people.  I cannot see why anyone would deny the logic of this.

Moreover, I have yet to hear Adywan calling for the 2004 Special Editions to be erased from history or deny that Lucas should have made them.  He even restored the 1997 Special Edition of ESB that Lucas has not released.  In fact, a number of preservations of the 1997 Special Editions have been made by members of this forum, and these have generated a fair amount of interest.  This should be enough to show that we are not all Lucas-hating zealots who only like the theatrical versions.

With respect guys, I am not saying this isn't a valid discussion.  It is, and I would love to see a thread about it in the General SW Forum (or even a separate thread in the Fanedit Forum).  But it just doesn't belong in this thread.

The thread is for discussion of adywan's Purist vs. Revisted edits, and thoughts about a hybrid version of the two.  It's not about the relative merits of fanedits.

Also, you can empathize with Crygor64's dislike of fanedits, but to claim that faneditors are worse than Lucas is ludicrous.  Faneditors don't force you to watch their edits, but more importantly, they don't bury the original versions in an attempt to erase them from history.

I agree with Frink.  It seems people have been nettled by Crygor64's remarks and felt the need to respond straight away.  We really should move this to a separate thread in a more relevant section.

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

TV's Frink said:

The thread is for discussion of adywan's Purist vs. Revisted edits, and thoughts about a hybrid version of the two.  It's not about the relative merits of fanedits.

But if you did want to discuss the relative merits of fan edits vs. preservations, wouldn't Adywan's two versions - one considered by many to be the best preservation, and the other considered by many to be the best fan edit, and both being built from basically the same elements, be an ideal centerpiece for such a discussion? After all, the title of the thread is asking for users to contrast a fan edit and a preservation! Crygor's response was a pretty direct answer to the question. His justification for his answer was just different than everyone else's, so it seemed out of place. But upon reflection, it doesn't seem off-topic to me.

Here's the problem: The Purist is not a preservation.  It is a fanedit.  The Purist removes some of the more radical changes in Revisited but most of the changes remain.  That is why the discussion is out of place here.

Also, you can empathize with Crygor64's dislike of fanedits, but to claim that faneditors are worse than Lucas is ludicrous.

I certainly never said anything of the sort, and I think that if Crygor did it was hyperbole.

Sorry, I didn't mean that you said it, but he did say that at the very beginning.  It's why I jumped down his throat.

Yeah, Puggo, you're misreading what the "purist edition" is.  It's "Revisited" - still a fan edit - but with some of the less really radical changes.

I would, however, say that the "ideal centerpiece for such a discussion" would be to discuss the relative merits of Adywan's Empire Strikes Back: Revisited, and his Empire Strikes Back theatrical restoration.  The problem there is, ESB:R isn't out yet.

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

ChainsawAsh said:

Yeah, Puggo, you're misreading what the "purist edition" is.  It's "Revisited" - still a fan edit - but with some of the less really radical changes.

Ok, I stand corrected on that count.  However, if I understand correctly, both the "Purist" and "Revisited" versions remove many of the SE changes, and the "Purist" version removes many of the "Revisited" changes as well.  So although they both are fan edits and contain changes made by Adywan, it could be said that "Revisited" is more of a fan edit than "Purist".  So by Crygor's standards, "Purist", being less of a fan edit (given his contention regarding the relative merits of fan edits) would be the preferred version by definition. Still seems relevant to the topic. Sorry to play devil's advocate :)

Here is the list of the changes that Ady made to the 2004 SE version Link

Some of the changes he made, he adjusted back to the style of the Original for the Purist Version for example: returning the order of Ben & Luke's conversation in Bens home, taking out Prequel music in the duel between Darth & Ben....just a few changes that people on the forum had problems with, so the Purist still contains over 140 changes. Both versions still contain most of the SE changes, bar the Jabba scene, Greedo shooting & the 'comedy' scenes when we arrive at Mos Eisley.

J

Right then.........now that everything's calmed down...it's Purist for me.

I do absolutely think Revisited is FANTASTIC, but I've just watched the Purist and I do prefer the original music in the film, I think this one is the one i'll watch from now on....

J

Jaitea said:

I do absolutely think Revisited is FANTASTIC, but I've just watched the Purist and I do prefer the original music in the film

 I definitely agree....but the reason I want to do a hybrid of the 2 is that I think C3PO's line about the princess and the edit of Ben's hut both make more sense in the Revisited version

So........before we were interrupted we were all discussing the Ben & Vader duel....is the purest version ok for the hybrid?.......if so it would be easier to insert 3PO's edited line & the re-order of Ben's hut into the purist version.

J

I think that would most likely be easiest yes. Any luck on menus and extras? (you had mentioned you were looking into it)

I use a Mac & there's nothing I can see to accomplish the VOB-swap with that........I do have a PC...which was in the attic....and have mucked about with IFOedit.........no real success yet, but I haven't given up.

J

Well, the "Revisited" version, being a DVD-9, has higher video quality, so I'd use that as a base and the "Purist" version for the things you want to take from it.  And if possible, such as for the duel, I'd use the audio alone from the Purist version, and keep the DVD-9 "Revisited" video for the superior quality.

If I were doing it (and I may still do so after the end of this semester in December), I'd also use Ady's AVCHD to replace the torture droid shot, 'cause I can't fucking stand that lightsaber-y thing in "Revisited."

ah, didn't realize there was a quality difference. But if we used Revisited for the edit, theres the problem of the slowdown of Ben's death.....picture wouldn't match sound. We'd also have to edit all the extended intro scenes (intro to the death star, intro to the tie fighters in the death star battle) as they are longer than the purist versions.

Jaitea said:

I use a Mac & there's nothing I can see to accomplish the VOB-swap with that........I do have a PC...which was in the attic....and have mucked about with IFOedit.........no real success yet, but I haven't given up.

J

 Ok, well lemme know...I would really love to have menu's and extras on this........and if that can't be done, at the very least, the anti piracy intro and adywans logo

That's why, for that part, you cut in the picture AND audio from the Purist version, until the two match up again, when you switch back to the "Revisited" version.

how great is the difference in quality?

Honestly, I don't know.  But it's essentially a 4GB movie vs. an 8GB movie.

The main titles weigh in at 6.45gb for Revisited & 4.05gb for the Purist

J

hmmm....quite different then..........so how about it Jaitea? Wanna do it from Revisited instead? Might turn out to be even easier at that point to keep all the menus and extras if we work from the material they were originally on to begin with