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Info: Terminator 2 - in search of the theatrical sound mix... — Page 4

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dvdmike said:

Most CDS mixes were 4.0 or 4.1, I hope the guy with the cam, replies to me so we can put it to rest. 

Please correct me if I'm wrong but I'm under the impression the 35mm print that was being screened in that YouTube link you posted would be using the original Dolby track and not the CDS track. It seems to replay the CDS track, or to even get a hold of it, would take equipment that would be pretty scarce to come by nowadays?

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Yes but it is an original release print and it will show the original mix no matter the format including the original foley effects 

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PDB said:

dvdmike said:

The same in every version? The SE had a full near field remix for home video starting with the LD release so there are at least two mixes not including the digital / analogue mixes 

I meant the sound effects not the mix. Rydstorm says he didn't change the effects in the interview.

 this is what I need to prove one way or the other 

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I doubt that the Dolby SR and CDS theatrical tracks had different sound effects - correct me if I'm wrong, but by 1991, just before the advent of digital 5.1, was there really that much difference between matrixed and discrete mixes other than dynamic range and separation and maybe some extra LFE?

We weren't getting vastly different mixes like in the late 70s, if the silenced gunshots do show up on the theatrical Dolby SR track, they'd have probably have been on the theatrical CDS mix too...right?

Also, you said Rydstrom's near-field remix was done for the SE - wouldn't that mean the pre-2000 theatrical cut releases, or at least the pre-SE ones, weren't remixed for near-field?

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PDB said:

He indicated that the CDS was created using a Dolby Stereo encoder/decoder to create a surround channel. That means that the CDS would most likely have mono surrounds. That's important to note because even though CDS supports full 5.1, Terminator 2's CDS track would be 4.1

I may be misunderstanding what you're saying, but he specifically said "for the music".

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drngr said:

PDB said:

He indicated that the CDS was created using a Dolby Stereo encoder/decoder to create a surround channel. That means that the CDS would most likely have mono surrounds. That's important to note because even though CDS supports full 5.1, Terminator 2's CDS track would be 4.1

I may be misunderstanding what you're saying, but he specifically said "for the music".

 Very true but then he talks about stereo-izing the effects from the re-mix so it implies mono surrounds for music and effects. And dvdmike is right, most CDS are 4.0/4.1 (like Edward Scissorhands). Also the Live DVD is 4.1 so that is either from the theatrical 4.1 master or someone up-mix a Dolby Stereo mix.

At the end of the day I'm all for getting a print if someone can swing it. Changes or not I always love to hear the pure theatrical sound.

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TServo2049 said:

I doubt that the Dolby SR and CDS theatrical tracks had different sound effects - correct me if I'm wrong, but by 1991, just before the advent of digital 5.1, was there really that much difference between matrixed and discrete mixes other than dynamic range and separation and maybe some extra LFE?

We weren't getting vastly different mixes like in the late 70s, if the silenced gunshots do show up on the theatrical Dolby SR track, they'd have probably have been on the theatrical CDS mix too...right?

Also, you said Rydstrom's near-field remix was done for the SE - wouldn't that mean the pre-2000 theatrical cut releases, or at least the pre-SE ones, weren't remixed for near-field?

 all home mixes could have changed is the point, and a few of the 70mm mixes have changes foley effects 

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I also wanted to ask about the picture quality that Disclord mentioned:

My partner saw T2 in CDS and says the Blu-ray finally gets the colors right, unlike the earlier discs. Of course, only the first DVD of T2 from Artisan used the 5.1 channel CDS mix - all other releases use the massively changed 6.1 mixes. So I have to sync the original DVD with the theatrical cut on the Blu-ray to get the CDS 70mm experience.

Which BD is he referencing that got the color timing correct - the first theatrical release from 2006? If that is the case then I am all for trying to sync the '98 Live 5.1 mix to the '06 BD picture but I have read that it is a nightmare to sync. I have not tried to verify if the same mix is used for the '06 theatrical BD but that would be interesting if it was because it would be at a much higher bitrate than what is on the Live DVD.

Also since the 5.1 Live mix allocates the surround mono channel from the original mix to both left and right you could simply join them back to 1 mono channel to recreate the original 4.1 mix. Am I wrong in thinking that?

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Hmm...I've listened to some of the early DVD with this mix and LOVE how they the Dolby Surround PCM on the extended CLV LD sounds. I'm interested to see what we turn up.

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If anybody has a copy of the first DVD release and wants to extract the AC3 track and send it to me, I will be glad to perform a detailed analysis of it and find all the specific ways it differs from the remixed version.  As those who have followed my work on the Star Wars preservations know, I am rather good at doing that.  ;)

I will post all observations in this thread so we can lay it all out clearly, rather than relying on rumor and speculation.

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THere is an extracted version floating about, we synced it with the (UGH) skynet edition if its still not about I will rip it later on 

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Would the MUSE LD have a different mix though?

Has anyone investigated the HD DVD that came out only in Europe?

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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SilverWook said:

Would the MUSE LD have a different mix though?

Has anyone investigated the HD DVD that came out only in Europe?

 The MUSE LD looks to have a Dolby Surround track and was released in '93 so it's definitely worth looking in to: http://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/00274/PILH-1001/Terminator-2:-Judgment-Day-(1991)

From what I'm reading the European HD-DVDs all seem to have DTS mixes so I can't imagine them being original.

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Sad news :( 

There are two squeeze discs also 

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The MUSE LD has also a MUSE 4 channel audio track; as I have the right audio decoder, if someone would like to buy and send me both the MUSE decoder and T2 LD, I'm ready to capture the latter! (^^,)

The ResolveR ultimate restoration workstation | [Fundamental Collection] thread | blog.spoRv.com | fan preservation forum: fanres.com |

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Don't you need a MUSE LD player to as well?

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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Wow! Lucky!

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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Yeah, but you have the Rolls Royce of LD players. I'm envious. ;)

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?