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Indiana Jones IV — Page 6

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IJ and the KOCS. It's much easier and much, MUCH funnier.

Chalk it to more of Lucas' hit-you-over-the-head exposition. If the Lucas of today made the original three, they would have been titled:

Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark of the Covenant
Indiana Jones and the Temple of the Sankara Stone-Worshipping Khali Cult
Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade to Recover The Holy Grail of Christ's Last Supper

Consider how much cooler the following two titles could be for the new film:
Indiana Jones and the Lost Kingdom
Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull

Either one flows better, is more concise, and doesn't smack of a bloated old hack fucking up his best work.
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kingdom of the crystal skull? I now know it's going to be monumentally horrible.
Shia LeBouf- the next Jar Jar, Jake Lloyd, or even Hayden Christensen.
There's no need to debate wheter the movie's going to be good or not, it will absolutely be in the same vein as the PT.
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Originally posted by: generalfrevious
kingdom of the crystal skull? I now know it's going to be monumentally horrible.
Shia LeBouf- the next Jar Jar, Jake Lloyd, or even Hayden Christensen.
There's no need to debate wheter the movie's going to be good or not, it will absolutely be in the same vein as the PT.


See, I don't think Spielberg will let it get to PT-depths, but I think by using LeBouf is Spielberg/Lucas's way of appealing to the younger demographic, and that could be a huge problem.

The characters in most action movies today are very one dimensional and very forgettable. When was the last character that came out of a summer blockbuster like Indiana Jones that you just thought was cool as shit? I believe the young actors today are not as talented and are picked solely on looks and less on ability (aka Hayden Christenson.)

If you watch movies like Armageddon, Independence Day, Transformers, etc, they all have one dimensional lame characters that crack goofy jokes throughout the movie, and when you watch that movie years later, it comes off as laughable. Now watch a movie like Star Wars, Terminator, Raiders, Back to the Future, the characters stand the test of time, Marty McFly is still cool today, Han Solo is still cool today. Those movies hold up so much more better then the summer blockbuster of the present day.

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Originally posted by: ADigitalMan
IJ and the KOCS. It's much easier and much, MUCH funnier.

Chalk it to more of Lucas' hit-you-over-the-head exposition. If the Lucas of today made the original three, they would have been titled:

Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark of the Covenant
Indiana Jones and the Temple of the Sankara Stone-Worshipping Khali Cult
Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade to Recover The Holy Grail of Christ's Last Supper

Aside from ToD, I'd bet anybody with just a little knowledge of Christianity would've got the other two references just fine (Ark and Crusade being pretty clear references).

FYI, Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull does sound cooler, but it makes me think of House 2 where they found the crystal skull. And I think Indiana Jone and the Lost Kingdom sounds like it's missing something.

Originally posted by: CO
If you watch movies like Armageddon, Independence Day, Transformers, etc, they all have one dimensional lame characters that crack goofy jokes throughout the movie, and when you watch that movie years later, it comes off as laughable. Now watch a movie like Star Wars, Terminator, Raiders, Back to the Future, the characters stand the test of time, Marty McFly is still cool today, Han Solo is still cool today. Those movies hold up so much more better then the summer blockbuster of the present day.


While I agree with everything else you said, IMO John McClane (sp?) is still cool today.

You can't really blame Hollywood though. They wouldn't be doing it if it didn't make money. Blame the people that go to these movies. I'm pretty sure everybody knew Transformers would be nothing but an effects feast, yet they still went and saw it.
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Time-tested characters like Bond and all the superheroes not withstanding, we've only seen three new franchises in the past decade with really great characters. Harry Potter, The Matrix, and Pirates of the Carribean. While the latter two both spawned flawed sequels, the originals had characters and situations that most of the population just couldn't get enough of. And of course, HP was based on written material that was already immensely popular. I can't make any other "new" franchise come to mind. Pathetic. But who needs character when you can make movies based on 80s toys, right?
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Originally posted by: ADigitalMan
Time-tested characters like Bond and all the superheroes not withstanding, we've only seen three new franchises in the past decade with really great characters. Harry Potter, The Matrix, and Pirates of the Carribean. While the latter two both spawned flawed sequels, the originals had characters and situations that most of the population just couldn't get enough of. And of course, HP was based on written material that was already immensely popular. I can't make any other "new" franchise come to mind. Pathetic. But who needs character when you can make movies based on 80s toys, right?


Well, aside from Star Wars and Indiana Jones, I can't think of any lasting franchises. I suppose you could include Back to the Future and Ghostbusters in there, but that's still only one extra franchise.

So what was the point?
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Not much more than agreeing with you ... there isn't a lot of originality in Hollywood, and even less that sticks around. Only a few lasting characters have come to mind. That's just pathetic, considering the amount of celluloid Hollywood has churned out in the past 10 years.

I think Captain Jack may be around for a while though. If they can get past the high-mindedness of the last two Pirates films and just make some damn fun swashbuckling adventures that yet don't descend into complete drivel, then he may be a very fun character who will come back time and time again.
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LaBeouf could be joking...I mean, you'd think he would get in trouble for revealing the title, so why would he do it? It is a pretty bad title. It has no ring to it like the other three, and it's just too long. I guess it's not technically longer than the others, but it just sound long.
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It's an awful name period.
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See, I don't think Spielberg will let it get to PT-depths

We have George Lucas there, and that will automatically create a PT-like environment. Spielberg has directed rather lousy films such as 1941, The Lost World: Jurassic Park, and War of the Worlds. And Spielberg is working with a revisionist-era dictator (Lucas again), so we could see at least 50-75 different continuity errors within the already established IJ trilogy with the relase of the Kingdom of the crystal skull (KOTCS). This could end up to film historians in the future as the worst film Spielberg has directed. It's just as exactly as we speculated about ROTS in 2004: we hoped it would be good because it was to be closer to the OOT. Now three years later, we discovered we recieved the worst of the worst of the PT, and we have destroyed film history. With KOTCS, we could have something more or less worse than ROTs itself.
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Originally posted by: lordjedi


Well, aside from Star Wars and Indiana Jones, I can't think of any lasting franchises. I suppose you could include Back to the Future and Ghostbusters in there, but that's still only one extra franchise.

So what was the point?


I think the Terminator movies, 1 & 2 have stood the test of time, as they have real characters you can identify with. I think Superman I & II with Christopher Reeve and Margot Kidder really made those movies better then they should be, considering they were a comic book movie. Of course as you stated BTTF, as Marty McFly & Doc Brown were classic characters with chemistry.

There just wasn't as many summer blockbusters back in 1981 as there are now, as usually there were 1 or 2, and they kinda ruled the summer mostly cause nobody could get them on DVD 5 months later. Movies like SW, Raiders, ET, Back to the Future stayed in theaters after Labor Day, as now a movie has one huge opening weekend, a second pretty good weekend, and by week #3 people are on to the next summer special effects flavor of the month.

My whole point is that will anyone be talking about these summer movies 20 years from now like we are talking about Raiders, SW, and Back to the Future? Now a classic is a classic, so I can't name 20 films from the 80's growing up that were great, but movies like Transformers, POTC 3, Spiderman 3 will not even be talked about years from now, the same way nobody cares about Independence Day 10 years after that was the must see movie of 1996. The Reason: The characters are one dimensional and lame, and when you watch them years later, the movies are utterly laughable cause the special effects are not mindblowing anymore.

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I'm pretty sure Shia will be in sewer with Corey Haim and Edward Furnlog in a few years.
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Originally posted by: ADigitalMan
Consider how much cooler the following two titles could be for the new film:
Indiana Jones and the Lost Kingdom
Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull

Either one flows better, is more concise, and doesn't smack of a bloated old hack fucking up his best work.


I concur wholeheartedly.

How about going back to the model of the title of the original and calling it something like just "Marauders Of The Crystal Skull" or "Marauders Of The Lost Kingdom?" Take out Indiana Jones entirely. This will likely be the last movie anyway, so it would be nice to bookend the quadrilogy with similar titles.
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This pisses me off too. I would have preferred Short Round be in this film rather than introduce what Shia's character is rumored to be.

I completely envisioned a tasteful rehash of the opening scene from Raiders, and when the man with the Fedora steps out of the shadows to reveal his face, it's Short Round, all grown up who says "Dr. Jones, over here." Then whip-pan to Indy. It would have played for good (not cheap) laughs AND set a new tone for the character all at the same time. Clearly he would have grown up to follow in Indy's footsteps and all the typical Spielberg father-son issues could be put between these two established characters.

Imagine having Marion, Shorty and Dr. Henry Sr. all in one film ... it would have tied the previous three together in a perfect little bow.

But once again, they didn't ask me.
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Yeah, I did always think it was weird that Shorty just disappeared from the story like that. Maybe it wouldn't have been convenient to have him tagging along all the time, but can you imagine how that broke his little heart when his beloved Dr. Jones just took off without him.

Or maybe back in America social services heard about all the dangerous situations Indy was putting his young ward in and said, "Uh-uh..."

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spileberg has always maintained that temple of doom is the worst of all three of the original indiana jones trilogy. he has said the only good thing that came out of that film was meeting his future wife.

so why would we get short round again when temple of doom has been dissavowed in the spielberg cannon, even though lucass still considers it cannon.

luca$h is a true miracle worker when he can kill two franchises with one stone, LOL

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Imagine having Marion, Shorty and Dr. Henry Sr. all in one film ... it would have tied the previous three together in a perfect little bow.

But once again, they didn't ask me.


now that's the indy film i wanna see.
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Not saying Shorty is supposed to be Indy's son on a genetic level, but he was more of an adoptive son, and Spielberg could have gone a dozen good directions with that. Instead we've now got: "Here's Indy's Kid. Accept it."

Kinda like General Grievous. "I'm the bad guy running the whole Droid Army. Accept it."

Or Padme: "Even though there is absolutely no possible attraction that has been foreshadowed, I truly deeply love you. Accept it."
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Originally posted by: ADigitalMan
Not saying Shorty is supposed to be Indy's son on a genetic level, but he was more of an adoptive son, and Spielberg could have gone a dozen good directions with that. Instead we've now got: "Here's Indy's Kid. Accept it."


Some of us don't see it that way though. I never saw Short Round as anything more than a sidekick. No more, no less. Believing Shia is Indy's son doesn't require that much suspension of disbelief. We're pretty sure Indy and Marion had a relationship of some sort (it's alluded to in one of her lines at the start of Raiders), so there's no reason to believe they couldn't have had a son out of that relationship. Hell, there's no reason a son couldn't have come out of their relationship between Raiders and Last Crusade. Maybe he went off on an adventure of some sort and just disappeared for a while, so she never bothered to tell him about their son. Even in the beginning of Raiders, she didn't seem like someone that wanted him around, so she'd have no reason to tell him.

The point is, shit happens all the time between people and they don't find out things they should until years later. Assuming Lucas isn't writing the script (is he?) we have no reason to believe the explanation will be as simple as Shia: "I'm your son" Indy: "Oh...ok...well, let's go get the bad guys"

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or indy says "i am your father" LOL

shia's character " thats not true. thats impossible!!!"

"well you see there was this one time when i did your mother on a submarine in between scenes in Raiders of the lost Ark because the movie was rated PG". LOL

then they can insert another vader or luke like noooooooooooooooo! moment, and the audience will say nooooooo! and cringe at how bad the movie is and leave the theater and demand a refund for lucas 4th turd since the prequels.

Kasden is not writing the script so it is not going to be as good as raiders.

the empire script and raiders scripts are good because of lawrence kasden. lucas could not write his way out of a wet paper bag.

the Huycks script for temple of doom was absolutely crap, just like their howard the duck. surprising that they gave grafffiti and star wars 77 the polish that made them good scripts.

Kasden did a quick rewrite and polish on jedi, though he told george having another death star was lame and the script lacked any emotional depth. rotj's semi success and mostly failure goes on lucas insistance to do everything his own way.

Lucas has unapologetically self labelled himself a Michiavellian. it is his dual nature it is his greatest strength as well as his weakness.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

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I want a scene where Indy has the kid count to twenty. In Greek.
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did anyone read the recent interview tvguide.com did with lucas.

affirmed just how much every time he opens his mouth how much more i can come to hate the man.

kingdom of the crystal skull happens to be the worst title ever for a indiana jones movie.

star wars was the better of the two series and since he has already ruined that i will not pay a dime to see indiana jones IV in the theater or buy the dvd. and will boycott any and all lucasfilm products including comics, videogames and the eu until lucas remasters the oot.

until then sorry george no sale, no more stealing the fans wallets as you slap them in the face at the same time.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.