logo Sign In

If you had your choice, would you have wanted George Lucas to stop after 1977?

Author
Time

Since the BluRay announcement of the SE's only last week, many of us here have just put our hands up at Star Wars.  Being a SW fan is the ultimate catch-22.   If you buy the Bluray SE cause you want to still somewhat enjoy the movies, you are funding Lucas and his hatred for the originals.  If you don't buy them and stick with Non-Anamorphic, you are sacrificing yourself to watching a crappy transfer of the movies you love.

So if anyone had the ultimate choice:  If you could go back and time and convince George Lucas to stop making movies after 1977, would you do it?  Now you are giving up Empire and Jedi for all you OT fans, so this is not an easy question.

But we would essentially be getting a BluRay Star Wars movie next year like one of Lawrence of Arabia, Citizen Kane, or Wizard of Oz.  A single classic movie with a great transfer to the original version, with loads of interviews in the context of 1977, remember Vader is not Lukes father now, and no Lucas revisionism.  We wouldn't be arguing about the SE, the PT, is Jedi the start of the downfall of Star Wars?  It would just be the Classic Star Wars that we would all buy, and not think twice about.

 

Author
Time

I wish he had given up Star Wars to other people after ESB and had concentrated on other things.

He could have stayed around as an advisory voice but his total control over Star Wars has been to the detriment of both Star Wars and his general artistic career.

If you look at his documentary work and his early editing flare it was a loss to art.

Though he has made a lot of money and pushed technology along he has become a bit of a Caligula.

Author
Time

TV's Frink said:

No way I would give up ESB.

 Agreed, i just couldnt forget about the greatest movie ever made .

Author
Time

Bingowings said:

I wish he had given up Star Wars to other people after ESB and had concentrated on other things.

That is more or less how I feel.  He should have left ROTJ - and any potential prequels - in the hands of Kurtz and others.

Author
Time

Bingowings said:

I wish he had given up Star Wars to other people after ESB and had concentrated on other things.

He could have stayed around as an advisory voice but his total control over Star Wars has been to the detriment of both Star Wars and his general artistic career.

If you look at his documentary work and his early editing flare it was a loss to art.

Though he has made a lot of money and pushed technology along he has become a bit of a Caligula.

What he said ^

Author
Time
 (Edited)

I wish he'd given up after 1983. No way would I sacrifice ESB and ROTJ (or Raiders).

Author
Time

In this hypothetical he'd still have made like a gazillion dollars on Star Wars right?

With that kind of money comes power and he'd still be terribly dissatisfied with the half finished film he made. And if the same film is still incredibly popular with the public they'd still be numerous re-releases and an opportunity for George to update it to satisfy its shortcomings. So things wouldn't be all that different.

Although with only one film to concentrate on you'd think Fox would give it the Blade Runner/ Close Encounters/ Alien treatment when it comes to a dvd/ blu-ray release.

 

"Well here's a big bag of rock salt" - Patton Oswalt

Author
Time

I would have wanted him to stop after 1989, as I love all three original SW movies and all three original Indy movies.

I know ROTJ was a worse movie than SW or Empire, but it was the first movie I ever saw, and I can tell you that the excuse Lucas sometimes gives us, that the "movies are made for kids" really works on ROTJ. As a child some of my favorite bits were the Ewok stealing the speeder bike, Wicket hitting himself, the Ewok with the stormtrooper blaster, Jabba knocking 3PO, etc, basically all the stuff adults hate about ROTJ. It's a wonderful children's movie really and some of the more "adult" stuff, like the Emperor scenes are also really well done.

Author
Time

The first two weren't made for kids though, they were made for family viewing (everyone).

ROTJ exists in pretty much the same realm as the PT (Star Wars with clowns and a puppet show).

The first two were exciting and had humour but had none of the fart and poop jokes that little kids are meant to love and very little OTT slapstick.

This allowed the dark scenes to fit into the story instead of sticking out like a sore thumb.

Look at the beginning of ROTS with the comedy droid antics it doesn't sit with Anakin being horribly burned alive in the same way as Luke and Han being chased by Stormtroopers fits with the charred corpses of Owen and Beru or the sliced arm on the cantina floor.

It's not quite as bad  in ROTJ but the slapstick, the Tarzan call, the comedy droid torture, the burp jokes really don't fit what we learned was the Star Wars universe from the first two superior films.

A family film is not the same as spicing a children's film with an adults film.

Author
Time

I'm not saying ROTJ doesn't have its flaws, and I know I'm biased cause I loved it as a child.

However, putting it together with the prequels is too harsh. ROTJ has heart. ROTJ has some emotions, something the prequels completely lack. The duel, when Vader is taunting Luke that maybe Leia might join the dark side and Luke loses it, is one of the most powerful moments in the trilogy, no scene in the prequels can even come close.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Diego said:

I'm not saying ROTJ doesn't have its flaws, and I know I'm biased cause I loved it as a child.

However, putting it together with the prequels is too harsh. ROTJ has heart. ROTJ has some emotions, something the prequels completely lack. The duel, when Vader is taunting Luke that maybe Leia might join the dark side and Luke loses it, is one of the most powerful moments in the trilogy, no scene in the prequels can even come close.

 I have to respectfully disagree.   The reason many of us here give Jedi a pass and not the PT, simply because it has Luke, leia and Han, and we were invested in those characters.  Jedi has alot of the same problems the prequels do with editing, kiddy tone, and sense of malaise in certain parts of the movie that it seems like it is going through the motions just to get to 2 hours. 

I have always said that the biggest failing of the PT is that I personally don't give a rats ass about the characters.  How can you care about a movie if you don't care about the characters???  So what happens is the only reason you are following the movie, or the trilogy, is simply because it is an extension, or prelude to the OT story we all fell in love with. 

Author
Time

Wow, a new thread by CO... what is this place coming to?  :)

To go along with the crowd here, I don't think SW would have the impact without at least ESB and probably also RotJ.  For my personal tastes, I'm glad to have the trilogy.  I do wish RotJ was a little more inline with ANH and ESB, but I'm happy to have it as is if the alternative is not having it at all.

I may only like it because it's about Luke & Co. (not to be confused with Luke and CO), but I think the action is exciting all around-

We watched chapter 28 of AotCs last night because I got some new sound equipment this weekend I wanted to check out.  I enjoy the soundscape of the scene and find it to have a good dynamic worthy of checking out my sound.  Anyways, at the point where SPOILER Jango shoots his magic missile at Obi-Wan... you remember the one, the missing that takes 90 degree turns at 100 MPH and effortlessly navigates the asteroid field pursuing Obi-Wan?  There's a shot in this scene where Ben's fighter is bobbing up and down, left and right to  dodge the asteroids.  It's much too fast and it looks, not due to the quality of the visuals, but due to the artistic direction of the animation, like a cartoon.  We're talking Looney Tunes style animation here.  At that point in time, my mind/spirit disengage from the action on the screen and it just becomes pretty colours.  And a nice guitar chord. 

And don't get me started on "Buzz Droids."

RotJ, with all of its faults, presents some exciting space combat and some thrilling ground combat.  And the duel at the end I still feel is top notch.  The prequels, in my esteemed opinion, can't compete at that level at all.

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

Author
Time

No, just no. That is film revisionism to the extreme and, completely against what we've been fighting for. Regaurdless of any oppinion I hold on any film he's made none of them should cease to exist just becuase, he refuses to release the original version in 480p or, 1080p. To go through the extreme of altering the space time continuum to erase films from existense is just becoming the beast himself. This is George's dream.


http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/7405/cooly.gif

http://twister111.tumblr.com
Previous Signature preservation link

Author
Time

Would have been fine with me if he had stopped after Star Wars. I didn't need to know what came before or after - and I certainly didn't need all the mystery and vastness of the universe taken away.

That said; I enjoyed Empire when it first came out - minus the Vader\Father angle.  However, after I saw - and nearly walked out on - Return, I started saying goodbye to all but 1977. I gave them both another chance about 15 years ago, but I just couldn't get back on board.  Lucas had shrunk the universe and morphed the whole ordeal into a child's bedtime story.  It was a leap I wasn't able to make.

Forum Moderator
Author
Time

Ah, I knew you'd pipe in here eventually, Anchorhead.  You're the only one I could think of that would be a definite 'yes' for this thread.

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!

 

Author
Time

xhonzi said:

Ah, I knew you'd pipe in here eventually, Anchorhead. 

If I didn't know any better, I'd say that had a hint of "where's that kook from the 70s" in it.

 

xhonzi said:

You're the only one I could think of that would be a definite 'yes' for this thread.

Definite is a strong word (maybe). There are three scenes in Empire that I think are fantastic.

Asteroid field chase.
Falcon's approach to Cloud City.
Luke hanging below Cloud City. - By far, my favorite moment from the entire film.

 

Forum Moderator
Author
Time
 (Edited)

If Lucas had retired in 1977, there's no guarantee he wouldn't be doing the exact same thing now with regards to suppressing the originals. In fact, I think a main part of that reason is because he hasn't been able to move beyond Star Wars, it's become his whole existance and so he obsesses over perfecting in his 60s a film he made in his 30s. Retiring in 1977 might have just exaggerated this. All he would have had is THX, Graffiti and Star Wars and he'd probably have tweaked all three to even greater levels than their respective Special Editions currently exist as.

The cure is really the scenario where Lucas followed through on his promise to make other kinds of films. When he started  saying that again in 2005 I thought maybe he was serious this time and it would be the antidote to the Star Wars Spell that has enslaved him, but sadly he was too afraid to try it. It's too bad, because I think Lucas' real talents don't get seen very often, like Coppola said "Star Wars robbed America of one of its most challenging filmmakers." I think the current loss of the Star Wars That Once Was is equally sad as loss of the George Lucas That Never Was.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

CO said:

Since the BluRay announcement of the SE's only last week, many of us here have just put our hands up at Star Wars.  Being a SW fan is the ultimate catch-22.   If you buy the Bluray SE cause you want to still somewhat enjoy the movies, you are funding Lucas and his hatred for the originals.  If you don't buy them and stick with Non-Anamorphic, you are sacrificing yourself to watching a crappy transfer of the movies you love.

So if anyone had the ultimate choice:  If you could go back and time and convince George Lucas to stop making movies after 1977, would you do it?  Now you are giving up Empire and Jedi for all you OT fans, so this is not an easy question.

But we would essentially be getting a BluRay Star Wars movie next year like one of Lawrence of Arabia, Citizen Kane, or Wizard of Oz.  A single classic movie with a great transfer to the original version, with loads of interviews in the context of 1977, remember Vader is not Lukes father now, and no Lucas revisionism.  We wouldn't be arguing about the SE, the PT, is Jedi the start of the downfall of Star Wars?  It would just be the Classic Star Wars that we would all buy, and not think twice about.

 

Actually i wish he stopped making films after 1989.  Then we would not have made those terrible prequel movies and crystal numbskull.

In terms of film  fans what is worse than being a Lucas fan.  Watching 2 of your favorite film franchises destroyed in a 9 year span of time.

If that was not bad enough he has erased the original versions of his films from existence, from when he made good films.  If that was not bad enough he replaced them with versions with mickey mouse cgi in them, might as well take a crayon to a classic painting.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

Author
Time

skyjedi2005 said:


...crystal numbskull.

Ah, the post I was waiting for...

Author
Time

Not only is ESB a contender for greatest film of all time, ROTJ is not beyond redemption.  Gamorrean Guards alone make it worth it, and it's got some peerless action scenes: Rancor Pit battle; Sand Barge battle; Speederbike battle; Final Luke-Vader showdown.

I even love the Ewoks.  The only really offensive bits are the burp jokes and Death Star 2.

 

And The Last Crusade was pretty great too, so maybe Lucas should have quit after '89?

Author
Time

As tempting as it would be to say yes to CO's question, I'm gonna say no.

A big part of my childhood (for better or worse) was filled with my Star Wars toys and my imagination. In spite of Lucas' many lame moments, the Star Wars universe has been a pretty fun ride over the years.

You know of the rebellion against the Empire?

Author
Time

IIRC, no one has mentioned another problem with Lucas stopping in 1977...

...no OT.com.

Author
Time

And no NNRRPPB.... :(

IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!

"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005

"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM

"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.

Rewrite the Prequels!