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ILM - Disney+ 6 part documentary series

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Think all (or at least most) shots are OUT!! They seem rescanned!! Oh my!!

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I noticed that as well. Most shots still have the older proper effects in the trailer.

One day we will have properly restored versions of the Original Unaltered Trilogy (OUT); or 1977, 1980, 1983 Theatrical released versions (Like 4K77,4K80 and 4K83); including Prequels. So that future generations can enjoy these historic films that changed cinema forever.

Yoda: Try not, do or do not, there is no try.

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@doubleofive I know you have seen these frames many times.

One day we will have properly restored versions of the Original Unaltered Trilogy (OUT); or 1977, 1980, 1983 Theatrical released versions (Like 4K77,4K80 and 4K83); including Prequels. So that future generations can enjoy these historic films that changed cinema forever.

Yoda: Try not, do or do not, there is no try.

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 (Edited)

Don’t get too excited. None of the film footage is newly scanned. It looks like they’ve used Topaz Video Enhance to upscale the footage because its got a huge tell tale sign of any bright image bleeding into the next frame causing artefacts. As you can see in this one, the laser in the previous frame is visible in the top right of the image. The same happens with every laser in that one shot in this video. That’s a dead giveaway that this type of software was used.

There’s also the old DNR smearing going on in some of the footage

But at least it does look like we are going to get some BTS footage from the OT that we haven’t seen before

ANH:REVISITED
ESB:REVISITED

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At around 59 seconds, the remote has matte lines. Something the SE omitted during recompositing.

One day we will have properly restored versions of the Original Unaltered Trilogy (OUT); or 1977, 1980, 1983 Theatrical released versions (Like 4K77,4K80 and 4K83); including Prequels. So that future generations can enjoy these historic films that changed cinema forever.

Yoda: Try not, do or do not, there is no try.

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 (Edited)

adywan said:

Don’t get too excited. None of the film footage is newly scanned. It looks like they’ve used Topaz Video Enhance to upscale the footage because its got a huge tell tale sign of any bright image bleeding into the next frame causing artefacts. As you can see in this one, the laser in the previous frame is visible in the top right of the image. The same happens with every laser in that one shot in this video. That’s a dead giveaway that this type of software was used.

There’s also the old DNR smearing going on in some of the footage

But at least it does look like we are going to get some BTS footage from the OT that we haven’t seen before

So sad they did that when they could have used any number of fan scans that are out there… 😉 That would’ve been a true kick in the balls, though.

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But… what is this scan, then? It’s sure as hell not the GOUT.

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adywan said:

Don’t get too excited. None of the film footage is newly scanned. It looks like they’ve used Topaz Video Enhance to upscale the footage because its got a huge tell tale sign of any bright image bleeding into the next frame causing artefacts. As you can see in this one, the laser in the previous frame is visible in the top right of the image. The same happens with every laser in that one shot in this video. That’s a dead giveaway that this type of software was used.

There’s also the old DNR smearing going on in some of the footage

But at least it does look like we are going to get some BTS footage from the OT that we haven’t seen before

What I meant to post earlier. Some members on TSWT have found that these might be upscaled from a different source that is mot GOUT

Hot Noodles posted:

hot noodles:

“LexX said:
So they upscaled… GOUT? I don’t think so, the colors look nothing like it and to my knowledge there hasn’t been other official OOT sources available for decades. The footage they show is quite rough and doesn’t look like remastered or final product, I don’t care if it’s upscaled or not. Still the scans look new from anything we’ve seen before, which basically is the GOUT for the past 30 years. And by new I don’t mean recent, but new as in not used before.”

Agreed. I think this is an unseen scan instead of an upscale of something we already have access to. As mentioned you can see dirt and scratches that would never have been visible in GOUT. (white specs on Han for instance)

Trailer | GOUT

https://forums.thestarwarstrilogy.com/attachments/han-jpg.9646/
https://forums.thestarwarstrilogy.com/attachments/han_gout-jpg.9648/
It also has blemishes not an any of the prints we have (so not on the negative), nor are they in GOUT. (black spots on right and bottom)

Trailer | GOUT
https://forums.thestarwarstrilogy.com/attachments/falcon-jpg.9647/
https://forums.thestarwarstrilogy.com/attachments/falcon_gout-jpg.9649/

"DarthPyro52

Yeah if it’s an upscale, it’s definitely not of GOUT. I’ve used Topaz to upscale them myself a few different times, with different models, etc. and they never looked even remotely this good.

It’s possible they are experimenting with AI DNR, as opposed to AI upscaling.

One day we will have properly restored versions of the Original Unaltered Trilogy (OUT); or 1977, 1980, 1983 Theatrical released versions (Like 4K77,4K80 and 4K83); including Prequels. So that future generations can enjoy these historic films that changed cinema forever.

Yoda: Try not, do or do not, there is no try.

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I didn’t say that they used the GOUT source. I was replying to these posts which seemed to suggest they were thinking these are new scans, as if they have recently scanned the whole unaltered films in HD.

Omni said:

Think all (or at least most) shots are OUT!! They seem rescanned!! Oh my!!

digitalfreaknyc said:

Omni said:

Think all (or at least most) shots are OUT!! They seem rescanned!! Oh my!!

This is what I’m sayin!!

pat man said:

I noticed that as well. Most shots still have the older proper effects in the trailer.

To me, these clips seem more likely they are taken from older scans of trailers/ docs etc that they already had digitised and processed through AI software. This shot is a dead giveaway that they are not using a new scan from the actual movie to show the original effects shots but alternate sources

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Pretty laughable to be complaining about quality and claiming it’s an upscale if you’re solely comparing it to a YT upload; if there’s a trailer on D+ I’m unaware of, that’s a different story. Y’all do have more technical know-how than I do, but that seems like a stretch.

That being said, check out the shot of Han at 2:02–wonder where that source came from. I don’t think the GOUT has the damage evidenced in those frames. It might not be a new HD scan, but it’s definitely different footage than what we’re used to from Disney.

A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em

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In defense of Adywan, he never said that these are from GOUT. And others are clarifying it’s not GOUT.
However still upscaled from a different source.

One day we will have properly restored versions of the Original Unaltered Trilogy (OUT); or 1977, 1980, 1983 Theatrical released versions (Like 4K77,4K80 and 4K83); including Prequels. So that future generations can enjoy these historic films that changed cinema forever.

Yoda: Try not, do or do not, there is no try.

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 (Edited)

bkev said:

Pretty laughable to be complaining about quality and claiming it’s an upscale if you’re solely comparing it to a YT upload; if there’s a trailer on D+ I’m unaware of, that’s a different story. Y’all do have more technical know-how than I do, but that seems like a stretch.

That being said, check out the shot of Han at 2:02–wonder where that source came from. I don’t think the GOUT has the damage evidenced in those frames. It might not be a new HD scan, but it’s definitely different footage than what we’re used to from Disney.

Why the hell is it laughable? I didn’t even mention quality for a start. I know that it’s compressed footage but there are tell tale signs in the footage that an AI program, like Topaz, was used. There’s even old style DNR smearing going on in one of the shots and another cropped where you can see that the source was indeed already cropped, like it was scanned from a trailer.

And why does everyone keep going back to the GOUT to “prove” that the footage is not upscaled or that it is all new? You really think that is the only source they have? Have you checked all the supplementary material over the years? But it’s also pretty obvious to see that, even with the lower quality compressed youtube vid, that all the film footage is lower quality than even some of the 16mm BTS footage they are showing in the trailer. It looks like older scanned footage they had already scanned from prints and not negatives.

OK, i have just found proof that they are using footage of the OT from trailers.

This is the snapshot from the doc trailer:

And this is a snapshot of the exact same frame from this trailer: https://youtu.be/h6aVWMb3J5M (at about 0.58)

So why, if they have a new scan, would they use trailer footage for that one shot?

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My guess is that it’s trailer, damaged interpositive footage, or press kit footage, scanned in 1080p. The fact that the footage has damage we’ve not seen in any of the period release prints (including 4K77 or 4K78) or on 1985 IP-derived transfers (e.g., GOUT and JSC) leads me to believe it’s an additional source.

I know it doesn’t have the slight color fringing present on IB techs of the time, but could the source be the mythical Lucas-owned IB Tech?

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adywan said:

OK, i have just found proof that they are using footage of the OT from trailers.

I guess the other question is: does that Han *yahoo" shot show up in any trailer with the same blemishes in the print on his face? That would confirm everything.

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adywan said:

digitalfreaknyc said:

adywan said:

OK, i have just found proof that they are using footage of the OT from trailers.

I guess the other question is: does that Han *yahoo" shot show up in any trailer with the same blemishes in the print on his face? That would confirm everything.

I don’t think all the footage is from trailers.

Right. So then where does that Han shot come from? None of this makes much sense.

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digitalfreaknyc said:

adywan said:

digitalfreaknyc said:

adywan said:

OK, i have just found proof that they are using footage of the OT from trailers.

I guess the other question is: does that Han *yahoo" shot show up in any trailer with the same blemishes in the print on his face? That would confirm everything.

I don’t think all the footage is from trailers.

Right. So then where does that Han shot come from? None of this makes much sense.

Here are a few ideas I have:

  1. The Lucas-owned IB Technicolor print
  2. A surviving interpositive or a CRI-sourced print (like 4K78) that has damage unique to it - there’s too much detail for it to be a release print, even an AI-enhanced one
  3. Trailers for some, other print sources for Han
  4. IIRC, the shot of Han appeared in From Star Wars to Jedi, so maybe a scan of that?
  5. Press kit materials

Topaz was definitely used to process these scans, which makes me think something about them didn’t warrant a full 2K or 4K scan.

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BedeHistory731 said:

Here are a few ideas I have:

  1. The Lucas-owned IB Technicolor print
  2. A surviving interpositive or a CRI-sourced print (like 4K78) that has damage unique to it - there’s too much detail for it to be a release print, even an AI-enhanced one
  3. Trailers for some, other print sources for Han
  4. IIRC, the shot of Han appeared in From Star Wars to Jedi, so maybe a scan of that?
  5. Press kit materials

Topaz was definitely used to process these scans, which makes me think something about them didn’t warrant a full 2K or 4K scan.

Re: #4 - FSW2J was 4x3 so…no.
Re: #5 - I can’t imagine EPK footage would show a clip from the end of the movie, unless it was the SE. And I don’t think the SE would look like this.

Re: #3 - I’m not intimately familiar with all of the Star Wars trailers but did any of them have that shot?

Re: 1/2 - why would they scan that instead of something internally at Lucasfilm? Is it possible it’s a print from one of the ILM people?

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digitalfreaknyc said:

Re: 1/2 - why would they scan that instead of something internally at Lucasfilm? Is it possible it’s a print from one of the ILM people?

I would presume that #2 would be in the archives of Lucasfilm, along with the IB Tech print. IIRC, it’s that fabled IB Tech print that is the source for the '77 scroll in the GOUT and OOT footage for Empire of Dreams.

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adywan said:

And why does everyone keep going back to the GOUT to “prove” that the footage is not upscaled or that it is all new? You really think that is the only source they have? Have you checked all the supplementary material over the years? But it’s also pretty obvious to see that, even with the lower quality compressed youtube vid, that all the film footage is lower quality than even some of the 16mm BTS footage they are showing in the trailer. It looks like older scanned footage they had already scanned from prints and not negatives.

Because the GOUT is all we officially have. I don’t want to speak on behalf of others, but when talking about new scans it means they seem to be new to us. Who cares what year they have actually scanned it, you don’t know it, we don’t know it. I think the main point people are making is that these shots seem to be from different sources than anything before while LFL has been giving us all kinds of excuses not having the originals, not wanting to scan or release them, and just trying to oppress them. Who believes what is a different story of course. The only thing that comes to mind is that Gareth Edwards said he saw the original film at LFL over 5 years ago, was it a 4K scan or something.

And you answered to yourself in the last sentence. It seems that way, so it’s something different than has been before. As in new to us coming from LFL.

And in the time of greatest despair, there shall come a savior, and he shall be known as the Son of the Suns.

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The version Gareth Edwards saw was likely the current Disney+ version since it was in the works at the time.

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Wazzles said:

The version Gareth Edwards saw was likely the current Disney+ version since it was in the works at the time.

Almost certainly since he mentioned at the time they just completed a new 4K restoration.

Whatever the source of these clips I’m happy, that unlike the updated Empire of Dreams this documentary will acknowledge the OOT.

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DrDre said:

Wazzles said:

The version Gareth Edwards saw was likely the current Disney+ version since it was in the works at the time.

Almost certainly since he mentioned at the time they just completed a new 4K restoration.

I remember him mentioning/referring that it was the actual original version. Maybe my mind is playing tricks on me. If he didn’t then yes, it certainly would be the D+ version.

And in the time of greatest despair, there shall come a savior, and he shall be known as the Son of the Suns.