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I abhor the "X undoes Y's accomplishments" criticism so much. — Page 5

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The more likely headcanon is that, after the death of his original body, Palpatine spent a considerable amount of time in a sort of “limbo”, as a powerless spirit barely clinging to the material world until he managed to eventually inhabit the clone body on Exegol. Sort of how Sauron’s fate is described after he first loses the One Ring in the backstory of LOTR: his body being actually slain only for his spirit to endure and (very) slowly recover his strengths until he could take a physical form again.

That way he does indeed die, fulfilling the prophecy and all the technicalities, yet despite his eventual return he’s incapable to intervene or take command of the Imperial remnant.

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I pointed out the distance between Exegol and Endor. It had to have been very long.

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He’d be a spirit, he wouldn’t have to abide by the laws of the corporeal world. The distance doesn’t really mean much when you have no physical form.

Death of the Author

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The Force doesn’t really seem to be constrained by distance. There’s a chapter of TCW where Sidious Force-chokes Count Dooku from Coruscant while the Count is on Serenno. And of course we have the Force ghosts who can appear wherever they wish.

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I’m referring to how Palps would get from Endor to Exegol. It isn’t like he could teleport there.

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Because otherwise the plot holes you guys talked about would exist. It can’t be the case.

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 (Edited)

I was more referring to yotsuya’s comment.

Also I think Palpatine’s spirit travelling a long distance works too.

EDIT: Wait a sec… where is the indication for any of your guys’ other explanations? Mine, at least, well… ugh… Palps simply transferred his consciousness into a clone, and my initial comment was there as a sort of rebuttal to the comment I referenced at the top of this one I typed everything in here.

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In TROS we see his Sith followers. It is more likely that after ROTJ they went to the ruins of the Death Star and were able to recover Palaptine. Not sure if it was his body, force ghost, or what. He may have taken over one of them for the voyage and once on Exogul they cloned his body, but after he transferred into it the clone body could not contain him and was dying. I feel certain that what we see in TROS is a clone. We know Snoke was a clone (of who or what we don’t know) and I think the tissue samples they took from Grogu in Mandelorian are going to fit in there somewhere. My guess is that what we just saw in the season 2 finale of Mandelorian is what starts the ST. I think that Palpatine was dead for all that time and only after that was found and taken to Exogol.

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TestingOutTheTest said:

What people don’t understand is that everything is temporary. What people think is that the victory of the OT only matters if it lasts forever.

That is true now for blockbusters where coherent writing and world building isn’t a thing, it wasn’t true before. Nor should it be true.

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@yotsuya I feel like your comment leans into headcanon territory. (My other explanation relies on rationalization and inferences, and tries not to lean into headcanon territory.)

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Wanderer_ said:

TestingOutTheTest said:

What people don’t understand is that everything is temporary. What people think is that the victory of the OT only matters if it lasts forever.

That is true now for blockbusters where coherent … world building isn’t a thing

I mean, not saying that the victory of the OT should or shouldn’t have lasted forever, but the victory of the OT not lasting forever is undeniably far more coherent worldbuilding.

Death of the Author

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The happy ending of ROTJ is only a thing with the OOT. Heir to the Empire is 5 years after Endor and the Rebels still haven’t beaten the Empire. The so called mopping up action lasted years until they officially ended the war with peace with the Empire and the New Republic. A New Republic itself which only lasted until it was replaced by the galactic alliance, and then that same galactic alliance was overthrown by the Sith. At least Luke’s Jedi Order in legends lasted over a hundred years until they were destroyed by the Sith.

The Sith kept returning, never mind the Vong and the second galactic civil war. The Galaxy never was at peace for any long period.

Now all that is now legends.

Disney decided Luke, Han and Leia weren’t all that important and to focus on their own characters. To pass the torch even if they botched it, and Luke, Han, Leia and Lando never shared a scene together. So the new trilogy being about Rey is fine, i mean Luke had his trilogy, and Anakin had his. Why not open the universe to new characters and new adventures. Its a shame they had to remake episodes IV-VI instead of doing something original or fresh.

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NeverarGreat said:

The difference is that those aren’t soft reboots that force the world and story to retread the same tired ground for the sake of nostalgia, and in fact those examples derive much of their impact from the accomplishments of the prior movies.

Except nothing they did ended up mattering in the slightest, either.

Nothing Thor, Heimdall, Loki or Hulk did in Ragnarok mattered, Thanos was just gonna kill the other Asgardians.

Getting the Avengers to team up didn’t matter either, they just broke up in Civil War.

Everything that happened in Future Past didn’t matter, either, all the other X-Men are dead and the Earth is basically an apocalypse now.

At least the OT’s accomplishments delayed Palpatine and the Empire, and gave our newest generation of heroes enough time and lessons and training and preparation and whatnot to stop them forever. The specific destruction of the NR was necessary to make the FO threat seem real and set up TLJ and to show that the Republic was inherently flawed and that the galaxy’s citizens and people needed to cooperate with each other. The specific destruction of the Jedi is there to make Luke feel guilty for failing Ben.

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Oh it’s this again, is it.

TestingOutTheTest said:

NeverarGreat said:

The difference is that those aren’t soft reboots that force the world and story to retread the same tired ground for the sake of nostalgia, and in fact those examples derive much of their impact from the accomplishments of the prior movies.

Except nothing they did ended up mattering in the slightest, either.

Nothing Thor, Heimdall, Loki or Hulk did in Ragnarok mattered, Thanos was just gonna kill the other Asgardians.

Except for the half he didn’t kill who formed New Asgard on Earth…

Getting the Avengers to team up didn’t matter either, they just broke up in Civil War.

Except when the Avengers saved the entire universe

Everything that happened in Future Past didn’t matter, either, all the other X-Men are dead and the Earth is basically an apocalypse now.

Ecept that Days of Future Past specifically averted an apocalypse and there’s no apocalypse in Logan despite your bizarre assertion that there is one. I genuinely wonder if you are hallucinating a different movie.

At least the OT’s accomplishments delayed Palpatine and the Empire, and gave our newest generation of heroes enough time and lessons and training and preparation and whatnot to stop them forever. The specific destruction of the NR was necessary to make the FO threat seem real and set up TLJ and to show that the Republic was inherently flawed and that the galaxy’s citizens and people needed to cooperate with each other. The specific destruction of the Jedi is there to make Luke feel guilty for failing Ben.

I’m not gonna bother rebutting each point because digging a hole in a river would be a better use of my time, suffice to say that nothing you say even comes close to even addressing the fact that the films are soft reboots that force the world and story to retread the same tired ground for the sake of nostalgia.

So why are you even bringing up this page 1 statement on page 5? That’s a rhetorical question, btw. I think we all know why.

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Episode 9 Rewrite, The Starlight Project (Workprint V4 Released!) and ANH Technicolor Project (Released!)