How would you restructure Anakin's turn to the dark side in the Prequels? — Page 3

Darth Tremor said:

Though I still like the idea of Palpatine using lightning on Vader to make him submit to the dark side, it would add gravitas to Vader’s line, “you don’t know the power of the dark side! I must obey my master.” You would then understand Vader to basically be saying, “I obey or die,” that he lives under tyranny.

However that is something that could be achieved, or at least hinted at, through fan editing. There is a moment after Anakin’s turn, before Palpatine tells him to rise, where we cut away to Yoda feeling the catastrophe through the force. One could add Palatine raising his hands and shooting Anakin with lightning just before the cut, continuing the sound effect through Yoda’s moment, add an evil laugh for the atmosphere and return to palatines office, where Anakin thanks his new master. This would retexture the function of force lightning, not just as a weapon but as a tool for control and dominion, essentially like a burn sign. It would show how Anakin is broken after his betrayal. He is paralyzed by his dependence on Palpatine, induced by his fear of loss. Furthermore he might very well want the punishment as a mean to numb his conscience, after all he just unleashed the ultimate horror on the galaxy.

I think something like that could serve the function of reinforcing Vader’s line in episode six, unless I misread your meaning here.

On an unrelated note. It just occurred to me, that Anakin’s redemption, which is essentially tied to the birth of the twins is ultimately dependent on Obi-Wan winning their duel on Mustafar.
That does not fit with an redemption arc, because it is no conscious decision to do good, which would signify hope for him. Instead it is his overconfidence to get the jump on his former master, which allows Obi-Wan, the droids, Padmé and by extension the twins to escape.

Peter Pan said:

Darth Tremor said:

Though I still like the idea of Palpatine using lightning on Vader to make him submit to the dark side, it would add gravitas to Vader’s line, “you don’t know the power of the dark side! I must obey my master.” You would then understand Vader to basically be saying, “I obey or die,” that he lives under tyranny.

However that is something that could be achieved, or at least hinted at, through fan editing. There is a moment after Anakin’s turn, before Palpatine tells him to rise, where we cut away to Yoda feeling the catastrophe through the force. One could add Palatine raising his hands and shooting Anakin with lightning just before the cut, continuing the sound effect through Yoda’s moment, add an evil laugh for the atmosphere and return to palatines office, where Anakin thanks his new master. This would retexture the function of force lightning, not just as a weapon but as a tool for control and dominion, essentially like a burn sign. It would show how Anakin is broken after his betrayal. He is paralyzed by his dependence on Palpatine, induced by his fear of loss. Furthermore he might very well want the punishment as a mean to numb his conscience, after all he just unleashed the ultimate horror on the galaxy.

I think something like that could serve the function of reinforcing Vader’s line in episode six, unless I misread your meaning here.

On an unrelated note. It just occurred to me, that Anakin’s redemption, which is essentially tied to the birth of the twins is ultimately dependent on Obi-Wan winning their duel on Mustafar.
That does not fit with an redemption arc, because it is no conscious decision to do good, which would signify hope for him. Instead it is his overconfidence to get the jump on his former master, which allows Obi-Wan, the droids, Padmé and by extension the twins to escape.

The Force Lightning burning would also nicely harken to when The Dark Lord Marko Ragnos burned the foreheads of Exar Kun and Ulic Qel Droma; showing it as a form of annointing.

Darth Vader should not be a helpless victim of Palpatine. He should be a villain with his own agency and responsibility. Doing so would be a complete betrayal of his terrifying and powerful portrayal in Empire Strikes Back.

He boasts the power of the dark side and even makes sadistic jokes about the people he kills. He chose it.

Servii said:

I really like your version of events. Especially how Anakin dabbles with Sith knowledge for a while before fully committing to it. It fits better with the idea of Anakin being seduced by the Dark Side rather than just being duped into it.

For a while, I considered cutting out Anakin’s discovery by the Jedi altogether, and just having him start as a padawan or knight at the beginning of Episode I. But I decided it is still important to show Obi-Wan meeting him for the first time, so I’ll have their meeting occur very early in the movie. And midway through, Anakin will already be Obi-Wan’s padawan, at least in an informal sense. Anakin will be nineteen, and an indentured servant living on Tatooine, when Obi-Wan meets him. Anakin ends up saving the day at the end of the movie, and is celebrated on Coruscant as a hero of the Republic.

Anakin can be knighted early in Episode II. Make it clear that a lot of people look up to him, but that the pressure of that is starting to get to him. He tries to put up this front of a stoic, selfless hero, but privately, he’s wracked by self doubt and PTSD. He tries to hide his problems, but the stress of the Clone Wars and all the death he’s surrounded by is keeping him up at night. Despite that, the soldiers under his command have great respect for him, and Anakin is shown to have a stern, commanding presence and a strong tactical mind.

Anakin’s mother dies near the end of Episode II, in a way that Anakin narrowly fails to prevent. Anakin goes into a whirlwind of emotion, and almost massacres the people responsible, but is stopped and calmed down by Obi-Wan.

Either at the end of II or the beginning of III, Coruscant is attacked and large swathes of the city are destroyed. Anakin and Padme work to rally the planet’s defenders, but Padme is then injured in the attack and is bedridden in a hospital. This throws Anakin further off balance. Anakin fights Darth Maul in the Chancellor’s office, and Maul taunts Anakin about how everything the Jedi have fought for is crumbling around him. Maul then senses Anakin’s distress about his wife, and taunts him about how she will be dead soon. This causes Anakin to finally snap and overpower Maul in a fit of rage, killing him as he begs for mercy.

From this point onward, even though Anakin isn’t technically a Sith yet, he’s already essentially on the Dark Side. When we see him again in III, he’s leading a bloody campaign of vengeance against those responsible for Coruscant. He’s soon expelled from the Jedi Order for committing war crimes and being driven by hate and revenge. Instead of Anakin becoming more unstable or fiery as he turns to the Dark Side, he becomes callous and cold. A ruthless general of the Republic/Empire.

It’s then that, per Palpatine’s subtle suggestion, he begins to dabble in Sith knowledge, looking for ways to destroy the enemy and end the war. He learns that Palpatine is planning to have the Jedi killed to solidify his power, and he decides that this is a necessary evil to restore order to the galaxy, and that the Jedi have become a liability, so he agrees to go along with it. When he confronts Obi-Wan on Mustafar, neither of them wants to kill the other. Obi-Wan begs Anakin to come back with him, while Anakin demands that Obi-Wan stand down. So with that impasse, they’re forced to fight. And you know the rest.

I agree, seduced by the dark side not duped. That is the problem with The Prequels, all the Jedi including Anakin are to quote Lord Malgus, “deceived.”

I recently had another idea to restructure Anakin’s fall, and my idea could be even accomplished by fanediting.

My idea is very simple.

According to George Lucas, Anakin never wanted to protect the people he loved for selfless reasons. He never wanted to prevent Padmé’s death for a selfless reason, but simply because he wanted to avoid feeling the pain of losing someone that he cared about. In other words, his fear of loss was never selfless, but was always selfish and always revolved around he himself. Although this is not entirely clear in the Prequels - and although I myself don’t think that these were Anakin’s reasons entirely - it’s still what George says, and therefore we have to take for granted that this is the official reason of why Anakin fell to the Dark Side. But… What if we completely cut out the selfishness from the equation? What if we cut out all the instances in which Anakin seems to be selfish or have selfish reasons for his fear of loss?

Maybe, we can say that he fears to lose the people he loves because he’s genuinely concerned about their well-being, and really doesn’t want them to suffer. We can turn him into the kind of person that doesn’t care about himself or his psyche, as long as the people he loves are well and safe. We can say that he’s not selfish, but really wants to do what he thinks is the best for the people he loves, and really puts their objective well-being above everything else. But he is completely blinded by his selfless desires, to the point that they ironically turn into their opposite. So, after he falls to the Dark Side and puts himself at the service of Palpatine, he basically becomes more and more corrupt until his selflessness disappears completely, and he starts to think exclusively about what he himself wants. Therefore, when we get to the dual on Mustafar he’s basically not selfless anymore, and really only cares about himself and about what he himself wants.

I think that this is perfectly accomplishable by fanediting. We just have to make him slightly less annoying, cut every instance in which he kills people before Revenge of the Sith (so he should not kill the sand people in Attack of the Clones), and cut out all the instances in which he seems to seek power and control over other people. That’s it. I personally think that this could be a great idea, and it could be a great case of “the road to hell is paved with good intentions”. Besides, it would show how the Dark Side corrupts people, so much so that it can turn a selfless person into a selfish person.

The fear of loss is the path to the dark side… and yet the Jedi feared the loss of their dominion via The Republic. Which raises the question, are not the Jedi bound by fear? They fear the fall of the Republic, they fear the Sith and their return, and they fear letting systems fall; are they not suppose to adopt “let go of all you fear to lose?” (Yoda, ROTS)

It seems a true Jedi has to step back from conflict completely because it leads to fear of loss, and “fear is the path to the dark side.” (Yoda, TPM). While the Sith in contrast use conquest and thrive via Conflict and fear.

Anakin being trained as a Jedi Knight doomed him to fall, the Clone Wars put the thirst for combat and power in him. It was inevitable he would become Darth Vader, because he was already conquest oriented thanks to the Clone Wars.

Palpatine did a stroke of genius, the Clone Wars transformed Jedi into potential inquisitors and made Anakin his disciple.

I woulda done away with the whole “fear of loss leads to evil” or whatever. Instead, I’d rather that Anakin have a god complex and think that he needs to inherit as much power as possible to maintain order across the galaxy. I think that aligns more with the Empire’s values anyways. I would also probably have Obi-Wan be the central character of the PT, rather than Anakin, and have Anakin’s downfall happen at the end of the second movie, and then the third movie is all about Obi-Wan coming to terms with things.

rocknroll41 said:

I woulda done away with the whole “fear of loss leads to evil” or whatever. Instead, I’d rather that Anakin have a god complex and think that he needs to inherit as much power as possible to maintain order across the galaxy. I think that aligns more with the Empire’s values anyways. I would also probably have Obi-Wan be the central character of the PT, rather than Anakin, and have Anakin’s downfall happen at the end of the second movie, and then the third movie is all about Obi-Wan coming to terms with things.

A god complex would be intriguing, there is a foundation for that in AOTC with Anakin conversation with Padme:

Padme: You are not all powerful Ani.
Anakin: Well I should be. Someday I will be. I will become the most powerful Jedi ever! I promise you. I will even learn how to stop people from dying.

In those lines Anakin says he wants omnipotence like a god, and to control death is god like too.