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Help Wanted: A little audio help for/from those making fan-edit DVDs...

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 (Edited)

I got through watching the trilogy on DVD today (yes, I know BLASPHEMY!), but I quickly dove into it and worked on some editing. To do so, I had to break the AC3 Dolby Digital sound down into individual mono WAVS. Well, I have done all my editing and I’m ready to recompile the WAVS into an AC3 until I realized, I don’t have the foggest how to.

I thought I could simply use the program I already had and re-encode, but that doesn’t do it. So now I’m turning to you fans out there who have done anything in the realm of digital video editing. Especially MagnoliaFan. All of your edits have been in Dolby Surround, and I assumed you used an AC3 file or something of that effect for your audio.

I also open this thread up to others to post questions or tips about other ‘fan-editing’ techniques. Hopefully if one question is answered it can help someone along the way.

So…

The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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Hey Hardcore

I am afraid I am no help on how to get the 6 wavs back to an AC3 file.

I was wondering if you could tell me how you went about converting the original AC3 file into the 6 separate wavs? I have successfully ripped an AC3 from a DVD but cannot break it apart into the 6 wavs! I have tried using Besweet but I get 4 wavs with complete silence and 2 wavs with all the sounds!

It sounds like we are both attempting to do the same thing, you are just a step ahead of me in the process!

How did you do it?!!

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Well, I am not sure why you recieved the messed up files. However, use BeSweetGUI. It is much simpler to navigate. You select the AC3 and where you want the WAVS to go. Hit the AC3 to WAV button, sit back and watch.

I figured out how to recompress the files, unfortunately now they sound like the chipmunks. So, I'm tinkering with that.
The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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"I thought I could simply use the program I already had and re-encode, but that doesn't do it. So now I'm turning to you fans out there who have done anything in the realm of digital video editing. Especially MagnoliaFan. All of your edits have been in Dolby Surround, and I assumed you used an AC3 file or something of that effect for your audio."

Actually, you might want to ask me, since I currently have the best known remastered 5.1 SW soundtrack.

Sony Vegas does it quite easily.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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Sony Vegas does it quite easily.

Thank you, I will look into that.

I might as well not make it a secret, basically I am trying to re-insert John Williams wonderful score into the film. The film has never been shown with the original score, which if you listen to it is quite remarkable.
The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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Originally posted by: Hardcore Legend
Well, I am not sure why you recieved the messed up files. However, use BeSweetGUI. It is much simpler to navigate. You select the AC3 and where you want the WAVS to go. Hit the AC3 to WAV button, sit back and watch.

I figured out how to recompress the files, unfortunately now they sound like the chipmunks. So, I'm tinkering with that.


Thanks man. Yeah I do use Besweet Gui. It lets you set the input and output. For the input I set the AC3 and for the output I select "6 separate wavs". Is this what you did? When I do this, I get 6 wavs alright, but 4 of them are 700mb worth of silence while the other 2 tracks contain all the sounds. I've definitely ripped the 6 channel AC3 and not the 2 channel file too. Its really frustrating me!
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If you have the original score (for all three films), I may help you out. I'd love to make a soundtrack for my DVD that only has the score. (Geez, a fourth soundtrack. Will the madness ever end? LOL)
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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Thanks man. Yeah I do use Besweet Gui. It lets you set the input and output. For the input I set the AC3 and for the output I select "6 separate wavs". Is this what you did? When I do this, I get 6 wavs alright, but 4 of them are 700mb worth of silence while the other 2 tracks contain all the sounds. I've definitely ripped the 6 channel AC3 and not the 2 channel file too. Its really frustrating me!


I've never gotten a wav file that was 700 mb. Of course, I like to do the films in sections, so that may be why. I'm not sure why you are getting that, unless your original source isn't 5.1 If it isn't, then yes, you will get those silent files. Other than that, I can't figure out why you are having problems. Check Doom9 for all the filters and plugins, and hopefully that will resolve your problem.

MeBeJedi,
What I have are the SE re-releases of the OT soundtracks. On them are included stereo recordings of the original soundtracks, with the included never before used tracks. Also included are alternate cues, such as the alternate Binary Sun theme, as opposed to the reuse of Obi-Wan's.

The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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Originally posted by: Hardcore Legend
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Thanks man. Yeah I do use Besweet Gui. It lets you set the input and output. For the input I set the AC3 and for the output I select "6 separate wavs". Is this what you did? When I do this, I get 6 wavs alright, but 4 of them are 700mb worth of silence while the other 2 tracks contain all the sounds. I've definitely ripped the 6 channel AC3 and not the 2 channel file too. Its really frustrating me!


I've never gotten a wav file that was 700 mb. Of course, I like to do the films in sections, so that may be why. I'm not sure why you are getting that, unless your original source isn't 5.1 If it isn't, then yes, you will get those silent files. Other than that, I can't figure out why you are having problems. Check Doom9 for all the filters and plugins, and hopefully that will resolve your problem.


Thanks man, I'll try Doom9. Can you tell me what settings you used for Besweet?
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"When I do this, I get 6 wavs alright, but 4 of them are 700mb worth of silence while the other 2 tracks contain all the sounds. I've definitely ripped the 6 channel AC3 and not the 2 channel file too. Its really frustrating me!"

In the process of creating my 5.1 soundtrack, I took the PCM stereo soundtrack and processed it through a program imitating a Pro-logic II decoder. This created a 6-channel wav, which I used BeSweet to split into 6 individual waves (the fifth LFL/.1 channel had nothing.) so I know the program works in that aspect. When I get home, I'll give you my settings, and we'll see if we can lick this thing.

"What I have are the SE re-releases of the OT soundtracks. On them are included stereo recordings of the original soundtracks, with the included never before used tracks. Also included are alternate cues, such as the alternate Binary Sun theme, as opposed to the reuse of Obi-Wan's."

Well, it's better than nothing. Know anyone who might have the OT soundtrack as well? I have ANH on a two LP set, but I don't have a functioning record player.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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Can you tell me what settings you used for Besweet?

On the top row, where you choose 'Use AC3 Decoder', that option was the only one I checked. All others on that row are turned off, and everywhere else for that matter.
The only other options selected are under 'Log File' and 'General - > Color all supported switches'.

Hope that helps. I am still getting the sped up version of my AC3. Sony Vegas is a $600 program and I'm not really too enthusiastic to spend that kind of money on a program that I'll only use 15-20 times a year. I'll probably give it one more try and then give up.
The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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Well, it's better than nothing. Know anyone who might have the OT soundtrack as well? I have ANH on a two LP set, but I don't have a functioning record player.



I don't know if I was clear, but the SE soundtrack isn't edited. I mean, it has the extra music added (ie ROTJ Rock) but the original music is all there.
The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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In the process of creating my 5.1 soundtrack, I took the PCM stereo soundtrack and processed it through a program imitating a Pro-logic II decoder. This created a 6-channel wav, which I used BeSweet to split into 6 individual waves (the fifth LFL/.1 channel had nothing.) so I know the program works in that aspect. When I get home, I'll give you my settings, and we'll see if we can lick this thing.

That would be cool mate cheers.

On the top row, where you choose 'Use AC3 Decoder', that option was the only one I checked. All others on that row are turned off, and everywhere else for that matter.

What about selected Output though? On this same row on the right. Its a drop down menu. What did you have here?
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What about selected Output though? On this same row on the right. Its a drop down menu. What did you have here?

Six Waves.


The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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Cool, no probs, I'll try again tonight and see what happens.
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You know, with the similar avatars, it's getting confusing to figure out who I'm responding to.

"Hope that helps. I am still getting the sped up version of my AC3."

HL, do you have a Hex editor? I know than when I've turned my 2-channel recording into a 6-channel recording, I have to go in and change the WAV header. It sounds to me like the header information might be messed up.

Do the individual wav files sound okay by themselves? Do you have a Hex editor? After you edited your files, did you save them at 44Khz or 48 Khz?

"I've definitely ripped the 6 channel AC3 and not the 2 channel file too. Its really frustrating me!"

What program are you using to rip the AC3 track?

Hardcore Legend, please turn on your PMs.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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What program are you using to rip the AC3 track?

I used Smart Ripper, I tried it with DVD Decrypter too but couldn't get a final AC3 file.

I'm going to try DVD Decrypter again, maybe Smart Ripper didn't rip the 5.1 channels into the AC3 file or something.
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That would certainly explain why you got 2 channels instead of 6. It seems to be too obvious an answer.

If that doesn't work, try using DVDShrink/Vobrator. It's a little more time and work, but you get exactly what you want.

(BTW, thanks for changing your avatar. LOL )
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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Originally posted by: MeBeJedi[/i
"Hope that helps. I am still getting the sped up version of my AC3."

HL, do you have a Hex editor? I know than when I've turned my 2-channel recording into a 6-channel recording, I have to go in and change the WAV header. It sounds to me like the header information might be messed up.

Do the individual wav files sound okay by themselves? Do you have a Hex editor? After you edited your files, did you save them at 44Khz or 48 Khz?

Hardcore Legend, please turn on your PMs.


Yes, each individual WAV plays fine.

No, I don't have a hex editor, and even if I did I am not fimiliar with the process. The source for the 5.1 audio comes straight from the new dvds released today. When I encoded the wavs, I matched the bitrate and quality from the soundtrack to the dvd files as to not have problems when I mixed the two files into 1 mono wav. The files are at 48000 khz, 768 kbps and 16 bit mono. Two problems I have run into are not being able to remux them into an AC3 and then when accomplishing it through a batch, it is sped up and only at 300 someodd kbps. I want to preserve the quality for the audio and video. I made no conversions or re-encodes and kept everything at the dvds standards.

I had Adobe Premiere 6.0, but it turned into more of a hassle than a help. Video quality constantly had to be re-encoded down for it to handle it, the audio output leaves something to be desired. However, the transitions and filters are nice.

My PMs are now on. I thought I had switched them on before. Probably explains why I never got PMs back EVER from people I sent them to.
The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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No worries, I'll try again and report back in a day or two! Watch this space!
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Originally posted by: Figrin__Dan
What program are you using to rip the AC3 track?

I used Smart Ripper, I tried it with DVD Decrypter too but couldn't get a final AC3 file.

I'm going to try DVD Decrypter again, maybe Smart Ripper didn't rip the 5.1 channels into the AC3 file or something.



Yeah, DVD Decrypter is the best way to go. Be sure to remove the French, Spanish and English 2.0 tracks through Stream processing. I left all the subtitles on, simply because I felt like it, but you could take them off too.
The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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H;, what program are you using to re-encode the wav's into ac3's?
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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Hey fellas

Good news! I was ripping the wrong AC3 file! I managed to successfully get 6 separate 5.1 wavs!

Hey Hardcore, how are you going about editing wavs that have both dialogue and music in them? Eg, I've discovered that pretty much all the channels aren't exclusive to just dialogue or music. The centre wav will have say music and dialogue making it difficult to make a cut between certain scenes because you can't isolate the music and dialogue exclusively. The first example I came across was editing Jar Jar out of EP2 just after Obi and Anakin enter Padme's office in the first few scenes. His voice is on all tracks/channels, making it very hard to cut him out! Even on the music channel you can hear him very faintly in the background.

How are you getting around it?
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That's a good question. More than likely you would either a) have to lose the surround, create new wavs using the score and the new voices. Go through 'phases' to quiet the dialogue to place in each channel for that scene, and replace all the sound effects by editing them out and then back in. b) well, there is no b, because I don't know of another way.
The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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Hmmm interesting.

What are the extent of your edits? What scenes did you cut and edit seemlessly? Just so I can get a feel for what is easily editable and what isn't.