Has anyone caught this article?
http://makingstarwars.net/2014/07/star-wars-iv-vi-converted-4k-16-bit-resolution/
I wonder what that means, and what versions were scanned. Hmmmm....
It’s really sad when the “creative minds” behind something we hold dear are also guilty of its destruction.
Nearsighted Scrappile said:
Has anyone caught this article?
http://makingstarwars.net/2014/07/star-wars-iv-vi-converted-4k-16-bit-resolution/
I wonder what that means, and what versions were scanned. Hmmmm....
http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/4K-restoration-on-Star-Wars-Official/topic/16857/
“In the future it will become even easier for old negatives to become lost and be “replaced” by new altered negatives. This would be a great loss to our society. Our cultural history must not be allowed to be rewritten.” - George Lucas
Hey everyone,
has anybody already mentioned the small tilt that the background gets in the scene where Leia is holding the blaster on the Tantive IV (around the 6:21 mark)? I noticed it when I was comparing the 720p to 1080p upscaling render output of the VLC default renderer with MPC+madVR (which results you can see here if you want).
The tilt can be seen in the fourth frame of the gif animation, look at the grey circle for example, but it's basically across the whole frame:
(reload linked page to restart animation... sorry)
http://www.directupload.net/file/d/3688/gobh5naa_gif.htm
Greetings
Darth Id on ‘Why “Ben”?’:
And while we’re at it, we need to figure out why they kept calling Mark Hamill’s character “Luke Skywalker,” since it’s my subjective opinion that his name is actually Schnarzle Shnuzzle. It just doesn’t make sense!
Damn you George Lucas for never explaining why they all keep calling Schnarzle “Luke”!
Damn You!!!
Yeah, just a bit of wapring - not much one can do about it without risk of introducing even more problems, plus it's barely noticeable.
As to the VLC vs. MPC+MadVR - that is why I use MPC+MadVR. Lots of people who use MPC use EVR Custom Presenter, which has much worse results. Plus, in MadVR, you can turn on an anti-banding filter, which works miracles for compressed gradients and it has a great full-screen exclusive mode, which helps those with slower computers to run MadVR (which is a bit more CPU heavy) smoothly.
Yeah, it's not really noticable. That's why I pointed it out, but you probably know every pixel of every frame with so much work put into it ;).
I just recently read about MPC+madVR (I followed this tutorial), was using VLC all the time before because it's so easy and plays nearly everything.
I wondered if you can use madVR to yield even better results for upscaling the GOUT as a source of the Despecialized?
Greetings
Darth Id on ‘Why “Ben”?’:
And while we’re at it, we need to figure out why they kept calling Mark Hamill’s character “Luke Skywalker,” since it’s my subjective opinion that his name is actually Schnarzle Shnuzzle. It just doesn’t make sense!
Damn you George Lucas for never explaining why they all keep calling Schnarzle “Luke”!
Damn You!!!
Doubt it, they (Team Blu) upscaled the source in Avisynth using QTGMC, apparently on placebo to deinterlace (address the aliasing). QTGMC is very slow - it also has the unfortunate ability to create ghosting and destroy fine movement when used on progressive material so you have to be careful with the progressive settings ... this can be done this way for instance: repair(QTGMC(Preset="Fast",InputType=2),last).
[ Scanning stuff since 2015 ]
I've been using madVR for some years now and I remember looking at my room-mate's monitor when he was watching HD films and thinking they looked horrible - like DNR was applied to them or something (I told him as much but he didn't care) I put it down to his monitor doing it, because he was using MPC-HC, just like me but then one day I installed MPC-HC on the new computer and suddenly videos looked exactly like on my friend's computer, so I started digging and found out, that I accidentally left EVR as the renderer and when I switched to madVR, the difference was night and day - I actually took these screenshots back then to show my friend to convince him to let me switch his settings to madVR too :-)
how do i burn these to to dvd's ? the link provided dosent work anymore
Do you have the AVCHD version?
chyron just put a big Ric pic in your sig and be done with it.
Harmy said:
I've been using madVR for some years now and I remember looking at my room-mate's monitor when he was watching HD films and thinking they looked horrible - like DNR was applied to them or something (I told him as much but he didn't care) I put it down to his monitor doing it, because he was using MPC-HC, just like me but then one day I installed MPC-HC on the new computer and suddenly videos looked exactly like on my friend's computer, so I started digging and found out, that I accidentally left EVR as the renderer and when I switched to madVR, the difference was night and day - I actually took these screenshots back then to show my friend to convince him to let me switch his settings to madVR too :-)
I'm pretty sure your difference is not caused by EVR but additional filtering from the graphics card driver. I know this because I had the same problem, once I updated both ffdshow and graphics driver and immediately noticed worse picture quality, which really bothered me.
Few days later after searching I found out that gpu driver has options like de-noise, edge enhancement, mosquito noise reduction, deblocking, and dynamic contrast all turned on by default in video options of the driver. I turned off all of those except gpu deinterlacing and the picture quality was again like before. My card is amd but if you have nvidia it probably has something similar.
I never used madVR but for EVR-CP I'm sure that in my case it renders video with fine grain correctly and it looks nothing like your screenshots. Why madVR is outputting video without filtering from the gpu I don't know, it probably works differently than other renderers.
Oh, btw thanks for you wonderful work, few days ago I was lucky enough to watch Star Wars for the first time :) and it was your version so I consider myself lucky that my SW experience was not ruined with Special Editions ha ha.
JediKnightAwesomeFace said:
how do i burn these to to dvd's ? the link provided dosent work anymore
1. Obtain the AVCHD version.
2. Install ImgBurn if you don't already have it.
3. Obtain a high-quality dual-layer write-able DVD (either DVD+R DL or DVD-R DL). Don't get cheap media. This was my problem when I initially tried to burn the AVCHD.
4. Run ImgBurn, select Burn Image to Disc, choose the .mds file co-located with the .iso for the AVCHD and then burn away.
I've always wondered if using a high end Upscaling player with a PC capture card would yeild better results for the GOUT. Running 1080p from a Toshiba XA2 or an Oppo seems it could be a better option than software upscaling.
Preferred Saga:
1/2: Hal9000
3: L8wrtr
4/5: Adywan
6-9: Hal9000
nightstalkerpoet said:
I've always wondered if using a high end Upscaling player with a PC capture card would yeild better results for the GOUT. Running 1080p from a Toshiba XA2 or an Oppo seems it could be a better option than software upscaling.
I've looked into this and you'd be surprised by how well FOSS solutions hold up. The algorithms used by many proprietary upscaling chips have to cut a lot of corners in order to produce results in near-real-time. They can't afford to do what, e.g., NNEDI3 does.
A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.
I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!
—Teams Jetrell Fo 1, Jetrell Fo 2, and Jetrell Fo 3
Also keep in mind how much of Team Blu's GOUT treatment goes beyond simply scaling--there's image stabilization, image repair, and fixing IVTC cadence interruption issues. Hardware players can't match any of that in an automated fashion at realtime speeds.
Harmy said:
I've been using madVR for some years now and I remember looking at my room-mate's monitor when he was watching HD films and thinking they looked horrible - like DNR was applied to them or something (I told him as much but he didn't care) I put it down to his monitor doing it, because he was using MPC-HC, just like me but then one day I installed MPC-HC on the new computer and suddenly videos looked exactly like on my friend's computer, so I started digging and found out, that I accidentally left EVR as the renderer and when I switched to madVR, the difference was night and day - I actually took these screenshots back then to show my friend to convince him to let me switch his settings to madVR too :-)
Hi, Harmy. Since the 35mm stereo mix was finished before the 70mm stereo mix and the mono mix, the 35mm stereo mix is technically the "original mix", and thus the original version of the original 1977 theatrical release of Star Wars. Is it still possible to see an original 1977 print of Star Wars with the "original mix", or is your Despecialized Edition and Team Blu's edit the only way we can see and hear Star Wars in the same way that people saw it with the "original mix"?
There has never been an official home video release of Star Wars with both the theatrical video and theatrical audio (I think even the 35mm print at the Library of Congress has the altered 1981 crawl), so fan preservations are all there is for most people, and the ones you mentioned are the ones worth mentioning.
I'd say your definition of "original" is a bit weird--Star Wars was shown theatrically with three different mixes, all of which could be considered original. The order in which the mixes were completed is more of a production footnote. Does the movie Clue only have one original ending because it was the one completed first? No, some films simply have multiple original versions. Depending on when and where you saw it, you got a slightly different version. There are also those who argue that the mono mix is the "true" original mix because it was completed last (so obviously more care went into it than the others).
CatBus said:
I'd say your definition of "original" is a bit weird--Star Wars was shown theatrically with three different mixes, all of which could be considered original. The order in which the mixes were completed is more of a production footnote. Does the movie Clue only have one original ending because it was the one completed first?
Well technically, yes. Because if Clue had an original ending completed first, it combines with the rest of the film to make the first completed version of the film. And being the first means being the original.
For Star Wars, at least, "first" is peculiar because movies weren't opened nationwide then. Some towns didn't get it until weeks after others, and few ever got the surround mix. My hometown probably only ever showed the mono version so for me that's very arguably my "original" version. I'd have had to drive several hours to find a copy in surround (and pre-internet likely wouldn't have known to).
In the scene where Han is leaving and Luke confronts him ( the "take care of yourself, its what your best at" scene) is it just me or do their faces look a little discolored? Are they are just wearing a ton of make up or something?
The 35mm stereo mix was most likely the first to be completed, since it contains the least number of sound effects compared to other versions, and may have required the most testing in order to ensure its technical compatibility. However, it and the 70mm six-track would have been created at virtually the same time, since the actual original mix was not the stereo version itself, but a four-track master from which both the stereo and 70mm mixes were derived.
The stereo would have been created by downmixing the four-track into a matrixed LtRt, with peak limiting applied to fit it into the reduced headroom of the optical format, and the panning width reduced somewhat to avoid excessive crosstalk between channels when upmixed again during playback. The 70mm version contained the four discrete channels but with unrestricted dynamic range, and with the addition of bass content in the other two channels generated by a subharmonic synthesizer in order to bolster the impact of explosions and spaceship flybys. A very small number of additional sound effects (four, by my count) were added to the 70mm that are not present in the 35mm stereo, but for all intents and purposes they are virtually the same mix, simply optimized for different presentation formats. Listening to either will serve you well, depending what kind of sound system you have.
hairy_hen said:
The 35mm stereo mix was most likely the first to be completed, since it contains the least number of sound effects compared to other versions, and may have required the most testing in order to ensure its technical compatibility. However, it and the 70mm six-track would have been created at virtually the same time, since the actual original mix was not the stereo version itself, but a four-track master from which both the stereo and 70mm mixes were derived.
The stereo would have been created by downmixing the four-track into a matrixed LtRt, with peak limiting applied to fit it into the reduced headroom of the optical format, and the panning width reduced somewhat to avoid excessive crosstalk between channels when upmixed again during playback. The 70mm version contained the four discrete channels but with unrestricted dynamic range, and with the addition of bass content in the other two channels generated by a subharmonic synthesizer in order to bolster the impact of explosions and spaceship flybys. A very small number of additional sound effects (four, by my count) were added to the 70mm that are not present in the 35mm stereo, but for all intents and purposes they are virtually the same mix, simply optimized for different presentation formats. Listening to either will serve you well, depending what kind of sound system you have.
....what he said. :)
“Evacuate ...in our moment of triumph? I think you overestimate their chances.”
Ebaillargeon82 said:
CatBus said:
I'd say your definition of "original" is a bit weird--Star Wars was shown theatrically with three different mixes, all of which could be considered original. The order in which the mixes were completed is more of a production footnote. Does the movie Clue only have one original ending because it was the one completed first?
Well technically, yes. Because if Clue had an original ending completed first, it combines with the rest of the film to make the first completed version of the film. And being the first means being the original.
I don't think you understand that during its initial theatrical release, there were three different versions of Clue being played simultaneously. By design, each of the three versions had a different ending. So on the first day of release, you conceivably could have gone to one theater and seen the version with Ending A, then gone across town to another theater that same day and seen the version with Ending B, and end your day by visiting a theater out of town to watch the version with Ending C. All three versions of the movie were released at the same time, but technically, prior to release in an editing suite somewhere, the footage for one of the three endings happened to be finalized first.
Does it really make sense to say that the ending the editor happened to complete first is the "original" version, even though all three versions were intended for simultaneous release? Tying this back to Star Wars sound mixes, as hairy_hen explains a couple of posts above mine, multiple sound mixes were made at the same time to account for different theater sound systems. It doesn't mean that any one theatrical sound mix from 1977 is more "original" than another simply for getting through the mixing process first.
Klasodeth said:
Ebaillargeon82 said:
CatBus said:
I'd say your definition of "original" is a bit weird--Star Wars was shown theatrically with three different mixes, all of which could be considered original. The order in which the mixes were completed is more of a production footnote. Does the movie Clue only have one original ending because it was the one completed first?
Well technically, yes. Because if Clue had an original ending completed first, it combines with the rest of the film to make the first completed version of the film. And being the first means being the original.
I don't think you understand that during its initial theatrical release, there were three different versions of Clue being played simultaneously. By design, each of the three versions had a different ending. So on the first day of release, you conceivably could have gone to one theater and seen the version with Ending A, then gone across town to another theater that same day and seen the version with Ending B, and end your day by visiting a theater out of town to watch the version with Ending C. All three versions of the movie were released at the same time, but technically, prior to release in an editing suite somewhere, the footage for one of the three endings happened to be finalized first.
Does it really make sense to say that the ending the editor happened to complete first is the "original" version, even though all three versions were intended for simultaneous release? Tying this back to Star Wars sound mixes, as hairy_hen explains a couple of posts above mine, multiple sound mixes were made at the same time to account for different theater sound systems. It doesn't mean that any one theatrical sound mix from 1977 is more "original" than another simply for getting through the mixing process first.
Well, the fact is, in the case of both Star Wars and Clue, the first completed version of the film was the only completed version prior to the other versions being completed. that's why I call the first completed version the original.
Star Wars was originally supposed to have the Jabba scene. If someone made the cut which has the Jabba scene and not Greedo one, would you call that version the original? And how many last minute changes were made in the editing room? Which one of their cuts would you consider original? The first one they created? Come on.
Fanrestore - Fan Restoration Forum: https://fanrestore.com
The original version of the film ought to be considered as the version that was first theatrically released. That means, in this case, that there are 3 original audio mixes. Neither one is more original than the other.
chyron just put a big Ric pic in your sig and be done with it.