Originally posted by: jack Spencer Jr
Lucas took the easy way out with the prequels. He basically made up a list of events that he figured people wanted to see: (when Obi-wan met Anakin, when Anakin met Luke's mom, when Anakin turned to the dark side, when Luke and Leia were born, etc) and made a vulgar checklist so that he could give people what they wanted, or he thought they wanted, and then just filled in the blanks. However, this made the prequels function piss-poorly as the first three installments of a six-part series.
That's most likely an exact description of George Lucas' motivation for creating the stupid plot points we all payed to sit through.
Originally posted by: jack Spencer Jr
They should never have shown Anakin becoming Darth Vader. Vader's identity should have been hidden somehow. In fact, it should have looked like what Obi Wan said in ANH, that Darth Vader was a pupil of Obi Wan's who turned evil and betrayed and murdered Anakin. Now how to do that when they are both the same person is difficult, but not impossible.
Yeah, that would be hard but not too hard. For a quick and messy example: Give Obiwan multiple pupils and have a number of them disappear along with Obiwan at some point, then have Obiwan return just as some masked villain appears, calling himself Darth Vader, hunting down the Jedi in some fashion. Then you have Obiwan state that he knows who the evil man behind the mask is, but never actually openly declare his identity onscreen.
Originally posted by: CO
Lukes rescue in Jabba's palace, I still dont know what the plan was? Leia saves Han as Jabba and his boys sit behind a curtain, why would they let her get Han out and then reveal themselves? Yoda telling Luke the only way he can become a jedi is by confronting Vader, yet thats the reason he wouldn't let him leave in ESB? Vader wanted to take out The Emperor in ESB, but now is loyal to him when he first meets Luke? Leia says after Luke tells her he is her brother, "Somehow I always knew." You did Leia, then why did you kiss him in ESB? And then ObiWan, "From a point of view" That was a cop out, and could have been written so much better, like it is ObiWan who is feeling so much guilt for everything that happened that Luke is the only hope.
Heh, yeah, the “plan” at Jabba's Palace always made me scratch my head, even at a very young age. Jabba's trap for Lea also seemed a tad implausible and silly. And yeah, the "certain point of view" line by Obiwan was somewhat lame (though fun to quote with my friend). Obiwan could have admitted that he wanted to manipulate Luke and still have been cool.
Otherwise, Yoda didn't want Luke to leave in ESB because Luke was too inexperienced with the force. The "failure at the cave" was Luke using the force to attack Darth Vader and destroy him. Since the force is never meant for attacking, Luke was being seduced by the dark side at that point and becoming that same as his enemy. That made Yoda greatly worry if Luke was ready or not. When Yoda sent Luke off in RotJ he told him to "confront" Vader, not necessarily kill him, and certainly not using the force to accomplish the actual attack, which would have been of the dark side.
And as for Lea kissing Luke in ESB, that is really awkward when you think of them as brother/sister, but you could say Lea was acting wildly because Han's advances made her very uncomfortable. Still, the brother/sister revelation was always far-fetched. A high degree of credulity on my part was never needed for the second Death Star compared with that revelation. Lucas should have devised a more meaningful way for the Luke/Lea relationship to grow in RotJ and that would have given Han more ways to be explored as a character. But, even then, it was very moving to have them as brother and sister, so I can forgive the choice (and pretend that the force fated them to be reunited).
Lastly, the "rule the galaxy as father and son" statement from Vader was hard to believe even within ESB. First, the level of devotion Vader displayed to the Emperor was too high for us to take his statement seriously. Plus, what about all of the work Vader went through to capture Luke in a way that he could bring him before the Emperor unharmed? Thirdly, who's to say that Vader truly wished he could have taken on the emperor but that in practicality his enslavement was too great? There are many ways that vader could have been lying to Luke to some degree, and bad guys do tell lies. Fourthly, perhaps Vader's ambition had no available options to use Luke in RotJ.Originally posted by: CO
I always ask the PT gushers the big question, why didn't Anakin question Palpatine about how this trick of saving people once? Why doesn't he atleast explore if this is true before going off and killing a bunch of jedi kids and choking his wife. He doesn't ask once, "So how do you do this, because I am about to turn on every Jedi I have been friends with since 10 years old." That to me is just plain stupid, and makes the greatest villain Darth Vader, look like a complete moron.