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General Star Wars Random Thoughts Thread — Page 460

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Lazy references and recycled images are not clever or interesting though.

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Mocata said:

Lazy references and recycled images are not clever or interesting though.

They’re interesting to at least two people, including me.

“Remember, the Force will be with you. Always.”

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I think most people prefer imaginative creativity though.

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Mocata said:

I think most people prefer imaginative creativity though.

well yeah, I do as well, and recycled imagery is a pretty poor substitute for this. But ideally, both at once are interesting - it’s not a matter of one or the other. Star Wars can break new ground and expand horizons while still containing plenty of callbacks to what’s come before.

I don’t think the execution of the prequels is the best, but I do think the era is very imaginative.

“Remember, the Force will be with you. Always.”

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Mocata said:

I think most people prefer imaginative creativity though.

I’d say this is very imaginative. It’s been around for centuries through different important books such as the Bible and Torah, and then Richard Wagner introduced it to music. He was the first to give characters, objects, or ideas a reoccurring theme musically. George started using this idea with his roots in filmmaking visually and then musically over his six films at the suggestion of John Williams if I recall correctly. Although to be fair you can see it within American Graffiti and THX 1138. It shows up in not just the visuals and music but within the narrative of his films. Most notably with Anakin and Luke’s paralleled but different journeys. Similar to THX and Curt. With Star Wars though it goes beyond that as if you look closely Luke is more his mother’s son, while Leia is more her father’s daughter. Yet they have their own motives and sense of self. It’s more complicated and difficult than it looks to pull off. There’s layers and layers of depth within his six films. This is only tipping the iceberg. There’s also historical references and old cinema callbacks to name but two. I think it’s taken for granted just how much the stories connect to each other because of some “clunky” dialogue but Star Wars has always been that way.

Here’s one of my favourite videos that addresses his approach to dialogue:

https://youtu.be/S5E-eSdRjXs

There’s so much visual imagination in his films but not without layers. Mustafar symbolises Hell and Coruscant grows more and more commercial as the story goes along to show the decline of society to name but two examples.

There’s a reason Star Wars connects to so many different people and I think it’s because in part how imaginative it is in blending together so many art forms and cultural heritages together.

"Pleasure’s fun. It’s great, but you can’t keep it going forever; just accept the fact that it’s here and it’s gone, and maybe then again, it will come back, and you’ll get to do it again. Joy lasts forever. Pleasure is purely self-centered. It’s all about your pleasure: it’s about you. It’s a selfish, self-centered emotion, that is created by a self-centered motive of greed. Joy is compassion. Joy is giving yourself to somebody else, or something else. And it’s a kind of thing that is, in its subtlety and lowness, much more powerful than pleasure. You get hung up on pleasure; you’re doomed. If you pursue joy; you will find everlasting happiness.” - George Lucas

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Sola: A Star Wars Story

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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In the song Bicycle Race (NSFW video!), released in 1978 by the band Queen, there is this line:

You say “shark”, I say “Hey man,
Jaws was never my scene
And I don’t like Star Wars!”

First ever Star Wars reference in a pop song?

Han: Hey Lando! You kept your promise, right? Not a scratch?
Lando: Well, what’s left of her isn’t scratched. All the scratched parts got knocked off along the way.
Han (exasperated): Knocked off?!

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The line “I don’t like Star Wars” is intended as a joke, as Freddie Mercury was fact a fan of the movie.

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I’m not sure if it’s the first but I know George had to personally ask Freddie to stop riding on Darth Vader’s shoulders during concerts in the 80’s and Queen’s music video for Calling All Girls is a parody based on THX-1138.

https://youtu.be/2TnjmIMyG1M

"Pleasure’s fun. It’s great, but you can’t keep it going forever; just accept the fact that it’s here and it’s gone, and maybe then again, it will come back, and you’ll get to do it again. Joy lasts forever. Pleasure is purely self-centered. It’s all about your pleasure: it’s about you. It’s a selfish, self-centered emotion, that is created by a self-centered motive of greed. Joy is compassion. Joy is giving yourself to somebody else, or something else. And it’s a kind of thing that is, in its subtlety and lowness, much more powerful than pleasure. You get hung up on pleasure; you’re doomed. If you pursue joy; you will find everlasting happiness.” - George Lucas

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Somewhere there must be footage of that.

I haven’t heard about George having an issue with the Vader lookalike before, but I recall that some other 70’s band had Jawa type creatures cavorting on stage in their concerts and Fox made rude legal noises about it.

I’m surprised Fox apparently never had issues over the undead dwarves in Phantasm.

P.S. In Frink’s AOTC edit, Dooku listens to Bicycle Race as he flees on his speeder bike. 😄

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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I couldn’t find anything but I did find this with Superman!

https://youtu.be/DgNRw-MmNMg

Here’s an article I found. I got some of my information crossed.

https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/what-george-lucas-did-when-queen-used-darth-vader-in-their-concerts.html/

My only off hand guess as to why is that Star Wars was more of cash cow comparably speaking. I can’t recall the figures but in Empire of Dreams it was said that Fox’s profits after the release were the highest the studio had ever experienced. So they probably wanted to make sure nobody else could profit off it as they’d lose that money coming in.

That’s so funny. I can’t help but picture Dracula riding off to his laboratory on a motorcycle now. Haha

"Pleasure’s fun. It’s great, but you can’t keep it going forever; just accept the fact that it’s here and it’s gone, and maybe then again, it will come back, and you’ll get to do it again. Joy lasts forever. Pleasure is purely self-centered. It’s all about your pleasure: it’s about you. It’s a selfish, self-centered emotion, that is created by a self-centered motive of greed. Joy is compassion. Joy is giving yourself to somebody else, or something else. And it’s a kind of thing that is, in its subtlety and lowness, much more powerful than pleasure. You get hung up on pleasure; you’re doomed. If you pursue joy; you will find everlasting happiness.” - George Lucas

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Meanwhile there were dodgy looking Vader costumes making personal appearances at malls all over the country. I personally saw one which IIRC, was a record store promotion tied the the release of the ESB soundtrack. Vader was accompanied by someone in the rattiest Chewbacca outfit I ever saw. The fur barely matched the Don Post Chewie mask they were wearing! In an era before cell phone cameras and internets, I imagine this flew well under the radar.

Fox went a tad overboard with the lawsuits. They thought they could own the concept of spaceships shooting beams at each other. They wanted to sue over Hardware Wars, but George liked it.

I doubt they could do anything about certain SW actors cashing in. 😉

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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I saw someone in a comments section say that they thought older James Earl Jones’ voice for Vader (in Rogue One and Rebels) was somehow even more intimidating than the original voice. It’s a take I’d never seen before. Does anyone else think this?

“Remember, the Force will be with you. Always.”

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SilverWook said:

ZkinandBonez said:

Does anyone have any ideas what this is? (Or rather what it would have been?)

Neat! Never seen this before!

A quick google search for the artist makes me think it was a Dark Horse comic that never happened for some reason.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Travis_Charest

http://travischarestart.com/

Apart from Luke looking a little bit wonky, I think the overall piece looks really cool and I love the retro sci-fi simplicity of “Space Pirates”. It reminds me of a book from the early 60’s I recently bought simply called “Space Vikings.” It’s the kind of pulpy sci-fi/fantasy I wish SW did more of nowadays, and now I really want to know what this comic would have been.


jedi_bendu said:

I saw someone in a comments section say that they thought older James Earl Jones’ voice for Vader (in Rogue One and Rebels) was somehow even more intimidating than the original voice. It’s a take I’d never seen before. Does anyone else think this?

I never really thought about it and just took it as a fact of life that Jones sounded older, but I can see the logic behind the argument. Jones’ voice isn’t as sharp and loud as it used to be, but in RO, and especially Rebels, it does have a very slow and gravelly quality to it that is a fair bit different to what we’ve gotten before. It has definitely given a subtly different quality to the more intelligent, scheming side of Vader, but I don’t think his angry or raging moments would work as well as the OT with Jones’ current voice. So I’m not sure if I’d personally go as far as saying its more intimidating, but I do think it still works really well and I disagree with the argument that Jones now sounds too old to properly play Vader.

Original Trilogy Documentaries/Making-Ofs (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Beyond the OT Documentaries/Making-Ofs (YouTube, Vimeo, etc. finds)
Star Wars is Surrealism, not Science Fiction (essay)
Amazon link to my first novel; Dawn of the Karabu.

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ZkinandBonez said:

I’m not sure if I’d personally go as far as saying its more intimidating, but I do think it still works really well and I disagree with the argument that Jones now sounds too old to properly play Vader.

I agree. As long as he’s able and wants to, Jones is the man for the job. Scott Lawrence from games like Tie Fighter and JFO also does a very good job.

“Remember, the Force will be with you. Always.”

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jedi_bendu said:

ZkinandBonez said:

I’m not sure if I’d personally go as far as saying its more intimidating, but I do think it still works really well and I disagree with the argument that Jones now sounds too old to properly play Vader.

I agree. As long as he’s able and wants to, Jones is the man for the job. Scott Lawrence from games like Tie Fighter and JFO also does a very good job.

The guy from Force Unleashed did a better job as an alt voice.

I’m just a simple man trying to make my way in the universe.

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SilverWook said:

Meanwhile there were dodgy looking Vader costumes making personal appearances at malls all over the country. I personally saw one which IIRC, was a record store promotion tied the the release of the ESB soundtrack. Vader was accompanied by someone in the rattiest Chewbacca outfit I ever saw. The fur barely matched the Don Post Chewie mask they were wearing! In an era before cell phone cameras and internets, I imagine this flew well under the radar.

Fox went a tad overboard with the lawsuits. They thought they could own the concept of spaceships shooting beams at each other. They wanted to sue over Hardware Wars, but George liked it.

I doubt they could do anything about certain SW actors cashing in. 😉

That’s really fun stuff. Thank you for sharing it. 😄

"Pleasure’s fun. It’s great, but you can’t keep it going forever; just accept the fact that it’s here and it’s gone, and maybe then again, it will come back, and you’ll get to do it again. Joy lasts forever. Pleasure is purely self-centered. It’s all about your pleasure: it’s about you. It’s a selfish, self-centered emotion, that is created by a self-centered motive of greed. Joy is compassion. Joy is giving yourself to somebody else, or something else. And it’s a kind of thing that is, in its subtlety and lowness, much more powerful than pleasure. You get hung up on pleasure; you’re doomed. If you pursue joy; you will find everlasting happiness.” - George Lucas

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I was watching the original Tron movie yesterday and noticed that the solar sail in that movie bears a lot of similarities to Dooku’s Solar Sail in Attack Of The Clones …In Tron , the solar sail also passes by some towers that have a very similar design to structures seen in AOTC on Kamino . The similarities make me think this was intentional inspiration that influenced episode 2 .

https://screamsinthevoid.deviantart.com/

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screams in the void said:

I was watching the original Tron movie yesterday and noticed that the solar sail in that movie bears a lot of similarities to Dooku’s Solar Sail in Attack Of The Clones …In Tron , the solar sail also passes by some towers that have a very similar design to structures seen in AOTC on Kamino . The similarities make me think this was intentional inspiration that influenced episode 2 .

In Frink’s AOTC edit, the Tron score plays over those scenes. 😉

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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Just had a thought pop into my head and so I checked and yep… Yoda took his clothes with him.

Well done. I will disengage self-destruct initiative.

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screams in the void said:

I was watching the original Tron movie yesterday and noticed that the solar sail in that movie bears a lot of similarities to Dooku’s Solar Sail in Attack Of The Clones …In Tron , the solar sail also passes by some towers that have a very similar design to structures seen in AOTC on Kamino . The similarities make me think this was intentional inspiration that influenced episode 2 .

I’d say it’s likely since the character Rinzler is named after Jonathan Rinzler who wrote the Making Of books.

“Friends told me about the fact that there’s this character Rinzler in the new Tron movie,” says Rinzler. “So I went online to see if I could figure out where they got the name. But I couldn’t find anything. There aren’t many Rinzlers in the States and it’s not a name that means anything, as far as I know… Then when Joe Kosinski came as a guest speaker I was actually on my way to the event before I realized this might be a chance to ask him. So I waited till after the q-and-a, went down to the front, and said I had a strange question but had to ask where he got the name, or where the writers got the name. And he said that he was sitting with the two writers working, and there was a book on the table ‘a Making of’ he said… ‘Oh yeah, it was Making of Star Wars by someone named Rinzler.’ So I said ‘that’s me’, thanked him, shook his hand and said I had to go out and buy a few action figures — needless to say, my kids are thrilled.”

"Pleasure’s fun. It’s great, but you can’t keep it going forever; just accept the fact that it’s here and it’s gone, and maybe then again, it will come back, and you’ll get to do it again. Joy lasts forever. Pleasure is purely self-centered. It’s all about your pleasure: it’s about you. It’s a selfish, self-centered emotion, that is created by a self-centered motive of greed. Joy is compassion. Joy is giving yourself to somebody else, or something else. And it’s a kind of thing that is, in its subtlety and lowness, much more powerful than pleasure. You get hung up on pleasure; you’re doomed. If you pursue joy; you will find everlasting happiness.” - George Lucas

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^ I caught that in reference to Tron Legacy and always wondered about it , but it was the original Tron movie from 1982 where I noticed these things that I mentioned in my last post and how Attack Of The Clones was probably taking inspiration from Tron 82 .Both the original Tron movie and Attack Of The Clones came long before Rinzler’s making of Star Wars books .

https://screamsinthevoid.deviantart.com/

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screams in the void said:

^ I caught that in reference to Tron Legacy and always wondered about it , but it was the original Tron movie from 1982 where I noticed these things that I mentioned in my last post and how Attack Of The Clones was probably taking inspiration from Tron 82 .Both the original Tron movie and Attack Of The Clones came long before Rinzler’s making of Star Wars books .

My apologies! I only just now caught that you said original Tron. There’s also a Blade Runner spinner in The Phantom Menace after the original Blade Runner used the Falcon as a building design. It’s pretty cool discovering inspirations, easter eggs, and references.

"Pleasure’s fun. It’s great, but you can’t keep it going forever; just accept the fact that it’s here and it’s gone, and maybe then again, it will come back, and you’ll get to do it again. Joy lasts forever. Pleasure is purely self-centered. It’s all about your pleasure: it’s about you. It’s a selfish, self-centered emotion, that is created by a self-centered motive of greed. Joy is compassion. Joy is giving yourself to somebody else, or something else. And it’s a kind of thing that is, in its subtlety and lowness, much more powerful than pleasure. You get hung up on pleasure; you’re doomed. If you pursue joy; you will find everlasting happiness.” - George Lucas