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Episode IX: The Rise Of Skywalker - Discussion * SPOILER THREAD * — Page 104

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I, like many others online, am thinking Dark Rey is a clone.

My theory is Rey and her clones are the result of Palpatine’s experiments, which began long ago. Getting cloning tech access, and perfecting it to use on Force wielders (whether for an army or vessels for Palpatine’s spirit, tbd) were the Clone Wars’ other purpose beyond exterminating the Jedi - tying everything together from the beginning.

Also would explain why Rey sees reflections of herself in the cave on Ahch-To when she asks to see her parents, as others have mentioned.

I really think this might be it. It gives an even larger scale to Palpatine’s schemes from TPM through the Clone Wars and beyond.

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So the Empire spends almost 20 years developing the first Death Star, another 4 years to have a partial but functioning 2nd Death Star, and then 30 years have passed and there is a reminant of the Empire and they have continued developing similar weapons (Starkiller Base) and have adapted the Death Star weapon to a smaller scale (TLJ battering ram cannon) and we shouldn’t expect to see that technology used in some way in TROS? Seriously? That is kind of a ridiculous expectation.

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Maybe they realized these devices have a tendency of getting blown up at the weak point by x-wings.


Currently, there is a “leaked plot” running around the internet. I haven’t read it, but people on reddit and discord are acting like it’s real and to be avoided if you don’t want to be spoiled. Is this going to be discussed here? If so, I’ll be jumping off the spoiler thread earlier than usual.

Maul- A Star Wars Story

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Did I see a mothball fleet of OT star destroyers?

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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SilverWook said:

Did I see a mothball fleet of OT star destroyers?

I did too… I also heard Vader breathing right before the final shot. Probably just referring to Anakin’s turn to the dark side but maybe not just that?

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The Special Look was really nice. The new stuff we go from Episode IX looks great. The Dark Side Rey could possibly be some Force vision that Ben has of what would happen if Palpatine made her his apprentice. However, even though I don’t think this will happen, does anyone here remember a fan theory that went around online when The Force Awakens was released? The theory was that at the end of the trilogy, Ben would be redeemed as a Jedi, and Rey would fall to the Dark Side.

Noah Lawson

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It could just be a force vision. Imagine if this shot had been in the ESB trailer.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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SilverWook said:

It could just be a force vision. Imagine if this shot had been in the ESB trailer.

Let’s also not forget that the trailers for The Force Awakens showed us the shots of Kylo Ren and the Knights of Ren in the rain, which was seen in Rey’s Force vision. Not saying it’s true, but I do believe that seeing Rey on the Dark Side is very possibly a vision that Ben sees of her as Palpatine’s apprentice.

Noah Lawson

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No matter the context, I’m happy to see that the film will be engaging with the idea in some way.

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DominicCobb said:

No matter the context, I’m happy to see that the film will be engaging with the idea in some way.

It’ll be cool. I just don’t understand why fans really want cloning to be brought back into the franchise. The cloning stories that the old expanded universe told involving Palpatine, Luke and Starkiller were just so ridiculous and I would go as far to say they were awful. It just felt like fan service at a ridiculous new height and power. I do believe that J.J. Abrams, Kathleen Kennedy and everyone else at Lucasfilm are way too smart to think of and include an idea of Rey fighting a Dark Side clone of herself. I honestly don’t know why fans would want to see something as bonkers and nonsensical as this idea sounds to me.

Noah Lawson

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nl0428 said:

DominicCobb said:

No matter the context, I’m happy to see that the film will be engaging with the idea in some way.

It’ll be cool. I just don’t understand why fans really want cloning to be brought back into the franchise. The cloning stories that the old expanded universe told involving Palpatine, Luke and Starkiller were just so ridiculous and I would go as far to say they were awful. It just felt like fan service at a ridiculous new height and power. I do believe that J.J. Abrams, Kathleen Kennedy and everyone else at Lucasfilm are way too smart to think of and include an idea of Rey fighting a Dark Side clone of herself. I honestly don’t know why fans would want to see something as bonkers and nonsensical as this idea sounds to me.

Yeah that’d be hard not to be dumb.

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Yeah, think I’ll bow out of this thread now just to be safe. It’s going to be a long (almost) four months.

I feel like the inevitable final trailer in (probably) October will tide me over, and in the meantime there’s been just enough info put out there to keep me guessing how this all will end.

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Mocata said:

The scene with a hundred OT Star Destroyers is weird. Is that also a vision?

I think it’d be awesome if ghost Palpatine created a ghost fleet of Star Destroyers. Don’t know how that would fit into the movie, but whatever.

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We see the Falcon and other Rebel ships come out of Hyperspace in a similar misty area and Finn in the Falcon’s cockpit seems to be looking at the ghost fleet based on what little we see outside the window behind him. And I just now noticed Y-Wings and B-Wings in that shot!

It may just be a reserve of ships long forgotten after the Empire fell, as those who knew about it were probably dead or didn’t know it’s exact location. Space being really big and all. Maybe I’ll get to see an SD with a rebel logo painted on the hull after all!

Rey and Kylo are definitely battling on the wreckage of the DS. You can see a laser turret on the left side of the shot.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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SilverWook said:

It could just be a force vision. Imagine if this shot had been in the ESB trailer.

Which means that Luke sees himself in Vader. The Darth Rey shot of the new trailer is featuring a look and a weapon Rey has no reason to imagine (ie if it was a Dagobah sequence, she would picture herself as Ren, not as something new).

“I have to say that I felt George’s group of six films had more innovative visual imagination, and this film was more of a retrenchment to things you had seen before and characters you had seen before, and it took a few baby steps forward with new characters.” - James Cameron about Episode VII.

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nl0428 said:

The theory was that at the end of the trilogy, Ben would be redeemed as a Jedi, and Rey would fall to the Dark Side.

One complete trilogy to tell that, it would be seriously lacking interest… which is sadly the case of the new trilogy so far 😕 i’m not hyped by the new trailer: repurposed ideas, Mad Max 3 vibe, and many shots which look cheap (the darth Rey shot is terrible, looks fake with a catchy weapon, it’s ridiculous).

“I have to say that I felt George’s group of six films had more innovative visual imagination, and this film was more of a retrenchment to things you had seen before and characters you had seen before, and it took a few baby steps forward with new characters.” - James Cameron about Episode VII.

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nl0428 said:

I just don’t understand why fans really want cloning to be brought back into the franchise. The cloning stories that the old expanded universe told involving Palpatine, Luke and Starkiller were just so ridiculous and I would go as far to say they were awful. It just felt like fan service at a ridiculous new height and power. I do believe that J.J. Abrams, Kathleen Kennedy and everyone else at Lucasfilm are way too smart to think of and include an idea of Rey fighting a Dark Side clone of herself. I honestly don’t know why fans would want to see something as bonkers and nonsensical as this idea sounds to me.

Why would cloning be so weird? There was a galaxy-spanning clone war, so why is it so silly that a Sith obsessed with eternal life would dabble in cloning. That’s not to say I think Rey should be a clone (I think that would be unnecessary), but I don’t get why its inclusion in the EU is often perceived so negatively.

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MalàStrana said:

SilverWook said:

It could just be a force vision. Imagine if this shot had been in the ESB trailer.

Which means that Luke sees himself in Vader. The Darth Rey shot of the new trailer is featuring a look and a weapon Rey has no reason to imagine (ie if it was a Dagobah sequence, she would picture herself as Ren, not as something new).

She saw places in her TFA Force vision she’d never been to let alone seen before, why is this different? I don’t think the rules on Force visions are written on stone tablets anywhere.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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Wait a second… why would protocol droids be built with red light bulbs in the eyes? Is it like the X-Box Red Ring of Death? Or are they taking a leaf from those Auralnauts skits?

Yub Nub for life

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Threepio never updated his anti-virus software. 😉

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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I liked a few things, namely the scope. Felt like that grandeur has been missing after all the emphasis on real sets and practical effects, I want the huge CGI festival or whatever that was, make the worlds big and spectacular again it’s 2019 nobody cares anymore as long as it’s not cg faces. If TRoS is to be a grand finale I want it to be big.

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act on instinct said:

I liked a few things, namely the scope. Felt like that grandeur has been missing after all the emphasis on real sets and practical effects, I want the huge CGI festival or whatever that was, make the worlds big and spectacular again it’s 2019 nobody cares anymore as long as it’s not cg faces. If TRoS is to be a grand finale I want it to be big.

I care. Bigger is not necessarily better. In my opinion, the simple imagery of the single Star Destroyer flyover at the beginning of Star Wars is grander and more intimidating that 100 Star Destroyers in a lightning storm.

Obviously it’s going to be a big finale, but the overuse of big bombastic effects whether CGI or otherwise becomes boring really quickly.

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In my opinion the most exciting part of the trailer were, I am not kidding, 3POs red eyes.
I am sure, that 3PO symbolises Anakin/Ben. The red eyes must have a symbolic meaning.

“You want to sell me Death sticks” -Obi-Vod Kanobi

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ZkinandBonez said:

nl0428 said:

I just don’t understand why fans really want cloning to be brought back into the franchise. The cloning stories that the old expanded universe told involving Palpatine, Luke and Starkiller were just so ridiculous and I would go as far to say they were awful. It just felt like fan service at a ridiculous new height and power. I do believe that J.J. Abrams, Kathleen Kennedy and everyone else at Lucasfilm are way too smart to think of and include an idea of Rey fighting a Dark Side clone of herself. I honestly don’t know why fans would want to see something as bonkers and nonsensical as this idea sounds to me.

Why would cloning be so weird? There was a galaxy-spanning clone war, so why is it so silly that a Sith obsessed with eternal life would dabble in cloning. That’s not to say I think Rey should be a clone (I think that would be unnecessary), but I don’t get why its inclusion in the EU is often perceived so negatively.

It’s because the ideas and usages of cloning became so far fetched and crazy to the point where writers were using it because they may have thought it would’ve been cool. Almost like something a kid would do when playing with their toys. To me, the usages of cloning that was done in the old expanded universe was really silly and didn’t feel like Star Wars.

As for the Clone Wars, it made sense for that considering how Palpatine was in control of the facility and the war. Plus, there’s a reason why it was called the Clone Wars. But I do think that involving Jango and Boba Fett within the cloning in the Prequels was quite unnecessary, but that’s a whole other discussion.

Noah Lawson