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Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released) — Page 9

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As a small point worth considering, if even to chuck away immediately in disgust, what is the revelance of that little scene with Anakin and Padme?
If no-one can see the Force, is it really there?
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Hello all,
I joined this forum cause this thread struck me as funny. Here we are signing a petition to bring back the original theatrical release of the original movies to DVD. The reason most of are signing this petition is because we don't care for Lucas's new vision of SW, (well, some of us do, including me,) or we prefer Lucas's original vision. Yet, here we are encouaging someone to do exactly the same thing Lucas did to the original movies, somewhat of a double standard if you ask me.

So what if the acting is a little lame or weak, NEWS FLASH....the acting has been weak in all the movies. Lucas uses little known actors save one or two. These actors have little experiance taking on leading roles. What makes these movies great is that despite the acting, the action makes up for it. In my opinion, it wouldn't be Star Wars with out the bad dialogue, or acting.
http://www.kastechnology.com/storm.php
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Wow someone who's arguing, but doing so in a constructive manner. Good post.

Basically, people who love Star Wars have their own individual vision about it. A perfect example would be all of the Extended Universe books that have been made over the years.

That being said, a lot of people don't like the remakes of the OT, or the prequels. And some of these people that feel this way have made re-edits for the first two prequels to sort of put in the image the way they thought it should have been. I think it's a pretty cool of people who do that myself, because the endeavor they go through doesn't earn them anything other than a 'thanks' since they cannot recieve money for their troubles.

As far as your comparison, it all comes down to choice. If someone likes one of the re-edits that Magnolia Fan has done (which I do ), or the one Trooperman is working on, they can ask for it and have that choice. But if they like the unedited prequel the way it came out in theatres, they can go to a store and buy it. However the same can't be said about the Original Trilogy. There are only the 97 Special Editions and the 2004 DVD Editions, not the originals. Were the originals avaiable to the public readily, I doubt this board would be half as populated as it is now.
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Originally posted by: Anakin's Mannequin
Wow someone who's arguing, but doing so in a constructive manner. Good post.

Basically, people who love Star Wars have their own individual vision about it. A perfect example would be all of the Extended Universe books that have been made over the years.

That being said, a lot of people don't like the remakes of the OT, or the prequels. And some of these people that feel this way have made re-edits for the first two prequels to sort of put in the image the way they thought it should have been. I think it's a pretty cool of people who do that myself, because the endeavor they go through doesn't earn them anything other than a 'thanks' since they cannot recieve money for their troubles.

As far as your comparison, it all comes down to choice. If someone likes one of the re-edits that Magnolia Fan has done (which I do ), or the one Trooperman is working on, they can ask for it and have that choice. But if they like the unedited prequel the way it came out in theatres, they can go to a store and buy it. However the same can't be said about the Original Trilogy. There are only the 97 Special Editions and the 2004 DVD Editions, not the originals. Were the originals avaiable to the public readily, I doubt this board would be half as populated as it is now.


Well stated as usual, A.M.

It all boils down to choice. GL is indeed entitled to make as many changes to his own property as he likes (of course) and I can't remember anyone here saying he didn't have the right to. All I (we) ask is to have the option of having the originals treaty with the dignity that they deserve.

I don't feel that is too much to ask. And if we didn't love them in the first place, we wouldn't ask at all.
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In response to Darth Belan, I ask him to read the very good post above by Anakin’s Mannequin.

Imagine this: a boxed DVD set of the original trilogy. In each case comes three discs: one of the original version, one of the 1997 version, and one of the 2004 version.

I would be very happy with that. He does have the right to edit his movies.

So think of this as though it was an “SE” of the prequel, available alongside the original version. The primary difference is that I believe that this will far surpass the original version (like George did, only I think he was wrong). Part of this editing is to age the film, the opposite goal of the SE.

So I think the point is that although some of us on this board may hate the SE, we don’t have a problem with the fact that it exists and that it is available. Our problem is that the OOT is not.

But the semi-original prequels ARE available, so I don’t see a problem with my edit. I admit that I’m getting a lot more creative in the editing than George ever did, but then again, I never criticized his editing specifically, if we weren’t stuck with it forever.

That being said, a lot of people don't like the remakes of the OT, or the prequels. And some of these people that feel this way have made re-edits for the first two prequels to sort of put in the image the way they thought it should have been.

Right.

So what if the acting is a little lame or weak, NEWS FLASH....the acting has been weak in all the movies.

But not anywhere near this weak. Compare romantic scenes between Han/Leia and Anakin/Padme. You can't tell me that they were anywhere close to being on the same acting level. So what? I started this edit because I cannot stand Ep. II in its current state. I don't know if MagnoliaFan liked the prequels to begin with, but I really can't stand them. I was raised on the OT. So my edit will turn out quite differently from his, I think.

So when Padme challenges Anakin to come with her to save Obi Wan, I wonder if it can become a kind of "awakening of the Force" scene. If Anakin can begin the scene, receiving Obi-Wan's message in a very down and defeated frame of mind (i.e. with sad music) -- a frame of mind which Padme pushes him out of. I think this could happen if she simply starts leaving to save Obi Wan without Anakin stopping her to discussing it as he does now. Their discussion has to happen differently. Anakin can listen as she says "He gave you strict orders to protect me and I'm going to save Obi Wan..." Then lay in some of the Force music before he smiles or get out of there without him smiling or...


That's a good idea. I've actually talked about heavily editing this scene earlier in the thread, because I can't stomach it in its current state. I'll think about it and talk about it a little later.

Other than that point, this edit fits beautifully as a set up for Ep III.


Oh boy! So you have seen ROTS! I'm seeing it opening night on Thursday. That's very encouraging though!


BTW, Ep III has visual design and sound cues for the dream you're trying to construct of Anakin seeing Shmi tied up. This is one change that will make Ep II and Ep III fit together better in quite a few ways.

Great! The only problem being that I have to wait until November to get that footage. Sounds like it's worth it, though.

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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Originally posted by: Trooperman


Oh boy! So you have seen ROTS! I'm seeing it opening night on Thursday. That's very encouraging though!



YES, saw ROTS at a USC screening and it made for a very personal experience that I cannot predict will happen to anyone else. In a nutshell, I think Lucas is releasing the fan-edit version himself this time for I wouldn't change a thing. If you have avoided spoilers as I had -- keep it up for there were lots of surprises to me.



BTW, Ep III has visual design and sound cues for the dream you're trying to construct of Anakin seeing Shmi tied up. This is one change that will make Ep II and Ep III fit together better in quite a few ways.

Great! The only problem being that I have to wait until November to get that footage. Sounds like it's worth it, though.


Not necessarily so -- the effect is probably something you can imitate well just by seeing and hearing it once yourself. But I will say no more until after you see it.

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Trooperman -

Your project sounds fantastic. I wish I had the technology or know-how to do the same.

I have a question/suggestion... Have you considered, or have you plans already, to rid the film of the line '…this is my girlfriend Beru'? Apart from being possibly the most uncomfortable and unnecessary reference scene (to the OT) in the film, the word 'girlfriend' seems way too out of place in the context of a SW film. It would be much better if the dialogue stopped with Owen saying: 'Owen Lars', moving straight to the ‘step-brother’ part (although that's a little hard to stomach in itself!) which would also cut the Beru and Padme lines. Or if that's not possible, whether you can just take the 'girl' part out of 'girlfriend', if it doesn't break up the continuity of the speech, or disturb the lip-synch too much?

Obviously, I don't entirely appreciate the logistics of what changes you can make, and I apologise if it creates difficulties, but it sounds like you are un-cheesing the film very nicely so far and that scene really marks a low point in terms of dialogue... Not to mention in terms of fanw*nk!

No offence meant to yourself (and indeed anyone else) if you like the original line, it could just be me… but I hope it isn’t!

Keep up the good work.
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Thanks very much, Arklaine. You're in luck; that line is gone along with Beru's line, "Hello." I agree that "girlfriend" doesn't sound right in a Star Wars movie. I was even considering removing Owen's dialogue revealing his name, because it seemed to introduce inconsistencies with SW (ANH). But Beru's line is gone, Padme's line is gone, and very possibly I will remove the "stepbrother" line as well.

One of the great things about the OT was its pace and also its character introductions. To get a feel for the characters, you didn't write a part in the script where they stood around and chatted/introduced themselves, you wrote something like the original Han/Greedo scene.

Greedo: I've been looking forward to this for a long time.
Han: Yes, I'll bet you have.

Bang. That sets up Han's character really nicely.

You know, another word that's out of place in the prequels is "cool." Characters never said "cool" in the OT, so removing it in the PT restores some of that classic quality to it (specifically TPM). It's sometimes those little things that really add up.

Thanks for the input!

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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When was cool?
If no-one can see the Force, is it really there?
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"Cool" was used extensively by Anakin in The Phantom Menace. I realize he's a kid, but still, I don't think people say "cool" in Star Wars.

And as for this edit, seeing Episode III has put a lot of things into perspective for me. I'm even more excited about doing an edit of Episode III than Episode II (it will be easier, as well), but I'm taking one project at a time. But I'm very very excited about doing that particular edit.

As for Episode II, Episode III has somewhat changed my plans for Episode II, because now I want to dub Grievous myself. I am not versatile enough an actor to do five different voices (Anakin, Lama-Su, Jedi Analysis Room robot, medical robot in Episode III, and General Grievous). Granted, the two robots are almost non-factors because the voice will be modified digitally and will unrecognizable. But I can do either Anakin and Lama-Su, or Anakin and Grievous, not both. Lama-Su and Grievous would sound too obviously similar.

So that changes things. I would still like to modify Lama-Su's dialogue to establish 1. Obi-Wan is concerned about the morality of the clones, 2. this is their first clone army, and 3. Boba Fett is Jango's natural son, and his mother is unknown. At least we can have some kind of mystery surrounding Boba Fett.

But it appears I have two options: Make a public request on these forums for someone with a good voice to record a mono .wav of Lama-Su dialogue (a lot of it is voiceover, some lip sync), and get it to me for use in my edit. The other option is to somehow get hold of a Portugese, Russian, or other obscure language track for Episode II, and extract the Lama-Su dialogue from that, subtitling it. The problem with that being that I have to replace and subtitle the voice for the other Kamino woman, who's performance I really liked. (After all those years...we were beginning to think you weren't coming). Actually, I don't mind the original voice of Lama-Su; I'd just like to change his dialogue.

Here's a thought: what if I were to secure obscure foreign language tracks for Ep. I and Ep. II (that nobody would recognize as a real language) and use that for Jar-Jar? Then, going back to do Episode I, I could use MagnoliaFan's, ADigitalMan's, and Hal's ideas for subtitles, but have a convincing alien voice. I would need to know that I had access to this for Episode I, however, before doing it for II. I realize I'm doing these in a rather odd order.

MTHaslett- I see exactly what you're talking about for the dream. I'll try to replicate the effect in Episode III somehow; it was very effective.

And please, anyone who can provide feedback or suggestions on foreign language tracks, it would be much appreciated. Also, now having seen Episode III, what do you know wish was in Episode II to tie-in or make more sense? Between MagnoliaFan's edit, Rebel Scumb's plans for his edit, all the fantastic ideas in this thread, and Anakin's voice redone, I'm confident that this will turn out beautifully. The more feedback, the better this project is.

Thanks!

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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Originally posted by: GundarkHunter
Better yet, let's get Tartakovsky to animate new versions of the prequels in the same style as Clone Wars. Whaddya think?


Whoa, that would be so cool! The battles would be twice as good.
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Originally posted by: Jaster Mareel
Originally posted by: GundarkHunter
Better yet, let's get Tartakovsky to animate new versions of the prequels in the same style as Clone Wars. Whaddya think?


Whoa, that would be so cool! The battles would be twice as good.

So what if the acting is a little lame or weak, NEWS FLASH....the acting has been weak in all the movies. Lucas uses little known actors save one or two. These actors have little experiance taking on leading roles. What makes these movies great is that despite the acting, the action makes up for it. In my opinion, it wouldn't be Star Wars with out the bad dialogue, or acting.


Ewan McGregor had the lead roll in Trainspotting, and that movie was amazing. His acting was fantastic. And Samuel L. Jackson is one of my favorite actors, yet for some reason, he doesn't do a great job in the PT...

-edit-
Um... Sorry for the double post. I clicked edit, but it posted a new message for some reason.
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I'd be willing to give the Lama Su dialogue a go. I'm not sure how good it'd be, but I'd be willing to try.
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Trooperman, after RotS I must ask, do you still plan on re-dubbing Anakin in THAT film? If you could try and keep your line readings in 2 as similar to Hayden as possibile then maybe Anakin having Hayden's voice in 3 can be attributed to his age. I just think Hayden gave a knockout performance in 3 and wouldn't want to lose it for anything.
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ChainsawAsh- That's wonderful. Do you have a reasonably appropriate voice?

Trooperman, after RotS I must ask, do you still plan on re-dubbing Anakin in THAT film? If you could try and keep your line readings in 2 as similar to Hayden as possibile then maybe Anakin having Hayden's voice in 3 can be attributed to his age. I just think Hayden gave a knockout performance in 3 and wouldn't want to lose it for anything.


As I watched Revenge of the Sith, I was both impressed at how good Hayden's performance was (also how much it had improved since II) and also irritated, because he created so much to live up to. I realize I or anyone is hard-pressed to do a better job. However, I can't attribute the voice change to age, because it would be older/more mature voice to higher-pitched voice as time went by. It wouldn't really work. Also, the main purpose of the dubbing is to change the voice acting to a more mature level, with different inflections; otherwise, I might as well have not gone to the trouble, as it's a lot of work! Therefore, I have to use my voice for RotS, for continuity's sake.

Here is an idea, however, for my DVD version of Revenge of the Sith (and I won't be changing the title for that; just the crawl if possible). I can create two mixes for this movie: one with my voice for continuity, and another one with all the other changes I have made- but retaining Hayden's voice. Therefore, if you feel my performance is inferior and decide, "The heck with continuity!" then you can watch my version with Hayden's voice, as he does do a good job. This works for RotS and not SotDS because I am not changing any Anakin dialogue for RotS; my work will be purely for continuity with Ep. II.

It would be more work for me to do RotS this way, but it would probably please more people. It would also mean I couldn't approach it the same way I'm doing II; I would have to completely edit it prior to replacing the voices. Right now with II, I'm tackling the hardest aspect first, which is completely replacing all the dialogue, even for scenes I know I will not use (I can still include them on DVD as deleted). What I don't know is whether it would be worth it to do two mixes for RotS.

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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You'd have to decide whether my voice is appropriate or not; give me a line of dialogue and I'll read it and send it to you, if you like.
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More Anakin Character Story notes (upon further viewings)

After setting up Anakin in the opening scenes here are suggestions for maintaining the cooler, more mature Anakin:

Speeder chase:
Cut most of the banter. Let the excitement of the chase take over without the bickering. Maybe keep "What took you so long" but omit the response. The next conversation should be when Obi Wan says "Well, you lost him." Keep their exchange up through the line "I hate when he does that." That gives them some history and makes Anakin good since he kept his mouth shut before pulling this cool stunt.

When he crashes Zam's ship and has to roll on the ground, cut the action so he recovers almost instantaneously and starts running after Zam -- make him seem unstoppable rather than having that beat where he holds his ribs and catches his breath unconvincingly.

I think all the ObiWan/Anakin dialogue through this cantina scene is fine until Zam is dying in their arms. Anakin's angry "Tell us NOW" should be cut, leaving only his first, more sedate line reading.


Padme packing to leave:
OMIT this entire scene (please!).
REPLACE it with the shots of Anakin asleep in a bed having a nightmare about his mother. This is the perfect place to reinforce Anakin's primary problem: his dreams.

Arriving at Naboo:
Most of the Naboo stuff should favor the deleted scenes over what's there. I recommend a different order to the deleted scenes. First, of course, they fly in and Anakin tells Padme as they walk that he misses his mom (good stuff) and that he's glad Padme is a senator. OMIT the meeting with Queen Jamillia as unnecessary, unromantic and slow. Then they arrive at Padme's house and see her sister's kids. THEN GO TO PADME'S BEDROOM -- play out the scene where Anakin sees Padme's pictures and her past BEFORE the dinner scene where we meet Padme's family. This has the effect of making Padme and Anakin more mature -- able to settle themselves like adults before rushing in to say "Hi mom!" It also fuels the subtext of the dinner scene and the following KITCHEN scene as Padme has already revealed her personal side to Anakin without being urged by her family.

OMIT the balcony kiss scene. OMIT the grassy picnic scene.

Play out the fruit-dinner-for-two scene, but omit the reference to Obi Wan being "grumpy" if he saw this. That makes Anakin seem silly.

HEAVILY RE-EDIT the fireside-chat scene. As it begins Anakin and Padme are sitting quietly in this intimate setting with things to say, but neither of them brave enough to say it. Anakin breaks the quiet with a single sentence: "From the moment I met you, all those years ago, a day hasn't gone by when I haven't thought of you." Padme does not reply. She looks at him. He looks at her. She looks at him. We move in closer from shot to shot. Finally she comes to her senses and says "I can't, we can't. It's just not possible..." and she stands (action covered by edits). Anakin says nothing, but watches her as she turns to him again. Then he stands and has another idea, "You know, [edit] we could keep it a secret." Padme says "Then we'd be living a lie - one we couldn't keep up
even if we wanted to. I couldn't do that. Could you? Could you live like that?" Silence for a moment. ANAKIN: "No. You're right." Cut out on one of the best line-readings Christensen gives in the movie.


Finally, on Naboo, the last scene to tinker with is Anakin deciding to leave. First, as the sunset begins the scene, we should be hearing a woman SCREAM and Tuskan Raider GRUNTS, Shmi saying "Anni!" and some man yelling "ANAKIN!" (That last bit from the voices that Yoda hears as Anakin kills the sand people later). This montage of sound should play until Padme comes out onto the porch with Anakin. Her voice should almost seem to make the yelling stop -- mirroring what Anakin says: "your presence calms me." Then, use editing to extend the last Padme beat -- let things soak in for her a little longer (using the close ups) before she says "I'll go with you." Then cut out before Anakin says anything else.

NOTE: that montage of sounds from Anakin's nightmare could be laid over Anakin one more time earlier in the film. I think it might be possible to take some shots of him at the window in the omitted "Padme's bedroom" scene and present them as if Anakin were at the window hearing Shmi's screams. This might be dropped in between scenes somewhere. Just to amp up the pressure - if it seems desirable.

Arriving on Tatooine
The shots of Padme and Anakin traveling together by cart are awkward and unnecessary. Cut from the master of the ship landing to a one-shot of Wato as Anakin says his first line to the pathetic little creature. Then cut to the master with Anakin, Padme and Wato and play out the scene. A Jedi finds his man immediately -- we don't need to see the "shoe leather" of how he got there.

Shmi dies
Cut the lines when Anakin tells the dying Shmi, "Stay with me mom, everything's going to be fine" -- just let him hold her helplessly as she dies saying "I love..." and lays her head back. OMIT the wide shot where he closes her eyes and stay with the close ups -- first Anni, then repeat one of Shmi dead, then Anni's final glaring flash of anger before cutting outside. This reduces the awkwardness of this scene greatly.

Shmi funeral
OMIT the awful eulogy. Bring up the music. After the sweeping master shot, cut to Anakin falling to his knees (omit his stepping forward). Then cut away to Padme before he reaches down awkwardly for a handful of dirt. Then come back to him for the lines "I promise I won't fail you again... I miss you so much." After adjusting the preceding Padme/Anakin scene (discussed upthread), this promise made over Shmi's grave will finally work -- meaning that he's trying to vow not to be a bad Jedi anymore. He's telling his mom what he wouldn't tell Padme -- he regrets killing all those sandpeople.

Obi-Wan's message
As Obi-Wan's message finishes on Padme's ship and in the Jedi council, OMIT the Windu line "stay where you are," so Anakin and Padme do not disobey a direct order. As Obi-Wan's message ends, we see Padme watching, she looks to Anakin... CUT TO: Yoda's lines, then Mace Windu's lines, then CUT TO: Anakin's close up reaction. Avoid the master shot where Anakin looks too laid back. Then let Padme talk about how close Geonosis is, let Anakin say "if he's still alive..." and CUT TO Padme saying "I'm going to save Obi Wan. If you plan to protect me, you'll have to come along." Intercut the Anakin close-ups where he looks upset to break up her flight-prep action and cut it so his reaction changes from upset to smiling. Then he sits down to fly away...


Jengo captures Anakin
Your ideas for the droid factory sound awesome. As that scene ends, I recommend using part of the Dukoo/Padme meeting scene or, at the very least, the trial scene before Padme and Anakin find themselves shackled together in that cart for the...

Padme/Anakin kiss scene
HEAVILY RE-EDIT this scene and it will work beautifully. First, the music is badly mis-cued in the original edit and secondly the dialogue is horrible. But the scene and the performances are good -- so try this: They stand together and Anakin reaches out to say "Don't be afraid." Padme replies "I'm not afraid to die." He looks at her. She looks at him with love. He looks at her with confusion, she looks at him with a little tear... closer we move until she says "I love you." He gives her a disbelieving look, but she looks at him with tears in her eyes -- we know she means it (this may require dropping out the dialogue on some shots and cutting so her lip-movement doesn't look like talking). Finally, they move in together to kiss and as they kiss the MUSIC CRESCENDOS! The current edit crescendos after they draw into the arena -- but by that time the important stuff is already over. This will work, the performances are there -- just held back by all that awful talking.

Finally, the battle scene where Amidala falls out of the ship and Obi-Wan has to fight Anakin's urge to stop and save her should stay -- that's great stuff and will work as-is to support this new Anakin story. I recommend keeping it as written.

BUT

The moment Anakin rushes in to attack Dukoo as Obi-Wan says "let's work together" comes out of no where. Even more so with these new edits. Try to cut it so that Dukoo zaps Anakin before Obi Wan and Anakin can get their plan together. That makes Dukoo more dangerous and keeps Anakin likable and smart. When he rushes in and gets whipped, he looks comically immature. It's beating a dead horse -- we get it, he has much to learn -- why does he have to look like such an idiot? Please consider this last opportunity to keep Anakin smart while still not a master yet.

With these changes, this movie will have a strong and likable Anakin. This will make him the Jedi who clearly has deep troubles and real love which in Episode III cause him to throw everything away for the chance to save Padme.

Good luck, Trooperman. I'm eager for you to knock this out of the park.

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@MTHaslett:
Woah! Some of those ideas of yours are really good. If Trooperman doesn't go for 'em, maybe you should start an edit of your own?
There are some things there that conflict with what Trooperman's already got planned (I think), but you never know, a "work-in-progress" is supposed to be an always-changing thing, hey?

To contact me outside the forum, for trades and such my email address is my OT.com username @gmail.com

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MTHaslett- I want you to come over and be my assistant editor! There's some really brilliant stuff in that last post. As Klokwerk said, some of it contradicts what I have planned already, but I will incorporate as much of this as possible. I'd also like to break your post down so as to comment on individual notes.

Speeder chase:
Cut most of the banter. Let the excitement of the chase take over without the bickering. Maybe keep "What took you so long" but omit the response. The next conversation should be when Obi Wan says "Well, you lost him." Keep their exchange up through the line "I hate when he does that." That gives them some history and makes Anakin good since he kept his mouth shut before pulling this cool stunt.

I definitely agree about the bickering. Although I am a bit partial to the "Well, you know, Master; I couldn't find the speeder I really liked." All dialogue after that will definitely be cut, but I still don't know about the aforementioned line.

Oh, and about the speeder chase: The big differences with this is alternate ship sounds for Zam's ship and the speeder (as well as color desaturation). Anakin's free-fall has been shortened. Some percussive music will be replaced with more orchestral music. The power couplings scene will probably be cut. And when Anakin first gets into the speeder and backs out of the lot, that was very unconvincing graphics, in my opnion. Too quick. So what I've done is end that scene with the shot where Anakin goes from right-frame to left of frame, going to the next scene. A backwards sideways wipe does the trick.


When he crashes Zam's ship and has to roll on the ground, cut the action so he recovers almost instantaneously and starts running after Zam -- make him seem unstoppable rather than having that beat where he holds his ribs and catches his breath unconvincingly.

Absolutely! Complete loss of momentum. Makes Anakin look wimpy and will be cut.


I think all the ObiWan/Anakin dialogue through this cantina scene is fine until Zam is dying in their arms. Anakin's angry "Tell us NOW" should be cut, leaving only his first, more sedate line reading.
Easy enough. But why? (just curious)

Padme packing to leave:
OMIT this entire scene (please!).

The only problem I can see with that is the fact that we don't know that Padme is leaving Jar-Jar behind with her responsibilities. I wa toying with shortening and re-editing this scene.

Padme: I do not like this idea of hiding.
Anakin: Well, I don't like this idea of leaving behind Jar-Jar to make political decisions. I know that idiot better than you do, Padme.
Padme: He's grown up. And so have you, Anakin.

I've kind of written myself into a corner, though. That whole thing may indeed go.

REPLACE it with the shots of Anakin asleep in a bed having a nightmare about his mother. This is the perfect place to reinforce Anakin's primary problem: his dreams.
That is definitely a perfect place to put it. But it could still work even if I used the other scene. The nightmare would end, and then wipe to Anakin staring out the window at the next scene.

Anakin/Padme romance scenes: I have made detailed plans as far as this goes. Here's what I've planned so far:

-Anakin/Padme talk on the way out of ship.
-Dinner scene. Edited so that scene ends with, "Yes. I'm afraid she is."
- Grassy picnic scene has been completely reworked. Starts with short montage of mountains while full-blown love theme plays (a la beginning of "Sound of Music". Fade to them rolling around on grass. Then, hard cut to heavily edited picnic scene. Boyfriend chat is removed. Scene ends with Anakin saying, "Well...if it works..." Clockwipe so as to reveal his smile at the last minute, similar to many of the Palpatine scenes.
-Heavily, radically edited version of the "first kiss" scene is in the edit. First of all, it's now a moonlit scene; not daytime. Secondly, Anakin isn't talking about sand; he's telling Padme, "I love you." It made more sense to have the kiss as the culmination of everything that had come before it.

See page 2 of this thread for screenshots of the rough cut.

Finally, on Naboo, the last scene to tinker with is Anakin deciding to leave. First, as the sunset begins the scene, we should be hearing a woman SCREAM and Tuskan Raider GRUNTS, Shmi saying "Anni!" and some man yelling "ANAKIN!" (That last bit from the voices that Yoda hears as Anakin kills the sand people later). This montage of sound should play until Padme comes out onto the porch with Anakin. Her voice should almost seem to make the yelling stop -- mirroring what Anakin says: "your presence calms me." Then, use editing to extend the last Padme beat -- let things soak in for her a little longer (using the close ups) before she says "I'll go with you." Then cut out before Anakin says anything else.

Great idea! I'll follow that by the letter.

The shots of Padme and Anakin traveling together by cart are awkward and unnecessary. Cut from the master of the ship landing to a one-shot of Wato as Anakin says his first line to the pathetic little creature. Then cut to the master with Anakin, Padme and Wato and play out the scene. A Jedi finds his man immediately -- we don't need to see the "shoe leather" of how he got there.

Precisely! That's a definite go. I really couldn't take the cart or the dumb droids.

Cut the lines when Anakin tells the dying Shmi, "Stay with me mom, everything's going to be fine" -- just let him hold her helplessly as she dies saying "I love..." and lays her head back. OMIT the wide shot where he closes her eyes and stay with the close ups -- first Anni, then repeat one of Shmi dead, then Anni's final glaring flash of anger before cutting outside. This reduces the awkwardness of this scene greatly.


Definitely. It will be done.

OMIT the awful eulogy. Bring up the music. After the sweeping master shot, cut to Anakin falling to his knees (omit his stepping forward). Then cut away to Padme before he reaches down awkwardly for a handful of dirt. Then come back to him for the lines "I promise I won't fail you again... I miss you so much." After adjusting the preceding Padme/Anakin scene (discussed upthread), this promise made over Shmi's grave will finally work -- meaning that he's trying to vow not to be a bad Jedi anymore. He's telling his mom what he wouldn't tell Padme -- he regrets killing all those sandpeople.


Yes! What I've also done with this scene is cropped the frames with a full view of Clieg so as to omit the hovering aspect of his wheelchair. Looks awkward.

As Obi-Wan's message finishes on Padme's ship and in the Jedi council, OMIT the Windu line "stay where you are," so Anakin and Padme do not disobey a direct order. As Obi-Wan's message ends, we see Padme watching, she looks to Anakin... CUT TO: Yoda's lines, then Mace Windu's lines, then CUT TO: Anakin's close up reaction. Avoid the master shot where Anakin looks too laid back. Then let Padme talk about how close Geonosis is, let Anakin say "if he's still alive..." and CUT TO Padme saying "I'm going to save Obi Wan. If you plan to protect me, you'll have to come along." Intercut the Anakin close-ups where he looks upset to break up her flight-prep action and cut it so his reaction changes from upset to smiling. Then he sits down to fly away...


Good idea about not disobeying Master Windu. As for this conversation, I have re-edited it differently so that Anakin is a stronger character, not being bossed around by Padme. Padme certainly contributes, but it's Anakin that ends up making the bad choice.


Your ideas for the droid factory sound awesome. As that scene ends, I recommend using part of the Dukoo/Padme meeting scene or, at the very least, the trial scene before Padme and Anakin find themselves shackled together in that cart for the...


I'll use the trial scene, with the Geonosian subtitles from the "lost edit" of Ep. II by Rebel Scumb. The dialogue is brilliant.

HEAVILY RE-EDIT this scene and it will work beautifully. First, the music is badly mis-cued in the original edit and secondly the dialogue is horrible. But the scene and the performances are good -- so try this: They stand together and Anakin reaches out to say "Don't be afraid." Padme replies "I'm not afraid to die." He looks at her. She looks at him with love. He looks at her with confusion, she looks at him with a little tear... closer we move until she says "I love you." He gives her a disbelieving look, but she looks at him with tears in her eyes -- we know she means it (this may require dropping out the dialogue on some shots and cutting so her lip-movement doesn't look like talking). Finally, they move in together to kiss and as they kiss the MUSIC CRESCENDOS! The current edit crescendos after they draw into the arena -- but by that time the important stuff is already over. This will work, the performances are there -- just held back by all that awful talking.


I will definitely re-edit that scene, even more heavily than you have described. Music will definitely crescendo as they kiss; then, cut out of scene to the arena; no need for the cheesy shot of them riding out into the arena, especially with change in music.


Finally, the battle scene where Amidala falls out of the ship and Obi-Wan has to fight Anakin's urge to stop and save her should stay -- that's great stuff and will work as-is to support this new Anakin story. I recommend keeping it as written.


Still thinking of improvements on this...


With these changes, this movie will have a strong and likable Anakin. This will make him the Jedi who clearly has deep troubles and real love which in Episode III cause him to throw everything away for the chance to save Padme.


Definitely! Thanks so much for all of this great advice. Your name will go in the credits. Sorry I can't say more; I'm busy right now but will chat more about this later.

Well since your doing this, I think that this scene would be good to be in it. The "you haven't learned anything Anakin." Make's the "I try" line less akward(in my oppinion). The footage is on one of the Trailers and, in the music video on the DVD.


I will include that line. It's great and it does lower the awkwardness of the following line.

Thanks so much! The overall quality of this is shooting up exponentially with each of these posts, and I'm so excited to do it. Yesterday, I bought a new NVIDIA video card to replace the lousy one I own currently, so I will soon be able to complete some scenes
for the final cut.

Trooperman


Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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Is it possible to add a scream from Padmé just before Anakin gets hit in the head in the droid factory? This way, the reason why the robot arm hits him is because he is distracted by Padmé (otherwise he should have been able to avoid that arm because he is a Jedi) Maybe also add a shot when he turns around after the scream (from earlier in the sequence).




BTW, I still say leave the muzzle flash out entirely. It isn't really realistic to have a bright white flash everytime a blaster fires. It's not like they have any powder to burn. The only light from a blaster should come from the beam itself.


I'll think about this.


I think the flash only happens when the laser beams from the blaster hit something, and not when the blaster is fired.
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Well since your doing this, I think that this scene would be good to be in it. The "you haven't learned anything Anakin." Make's the "I try" line less akward(in my oppinion). The footage is on one of the Trailers and, in the music video on the DVD.





I will include that line. It's great and it does lower the awkwardness of the following line.

I just checked the DVD and, the full exchange is on the music video and, the trailer ("I've heard this leson before" "you haven't learned anything Anakin"). I think the trailer music from the exchange is much less obvious if you can't take it out. That is if your not dubbing Obi-wan's voice with someone else's as, well(I haven't read the entire thread). Also, I was just reading some more deleted scenes there and, realized something.
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Jango knew about Order 66. *******************************************************************
Look at the Apartment scene again. *************************************************************
When he's talking about the job of the clones.*****************************************************
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http://twister111.tumblr.com
Previous Signature preservation link

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Some great ideas of late, especially MTHaslett.

Before there had been quite a debate over the Yoda/Dooku duel. I had originally supported no lightsabers, but force lightning, but after Rots and what they did with Yoda and Dooku's characters I believe things would be best if as soon as Dooku sees Yoda's approaching, he flings the crane (or whatever) onto Obi-Wan and Anakin and flees to his ship. I think these were Trooperman's initial thoughts on it anyway, so good foresight on that. The Sidious/Yoda confrontation will be infinitely more powerful once *it* is Yoda's big reveal instead of the duel with Dooku. Lucas jumped the gun on that one. Not to mention there isn't a hint of force lightning from Dooku in RotS, and the whole master/apprentice rivalry between him and Yoda went absolutely nowhere.


About the beginning of the duel Trooperman, I know you had discussed cutting out Anakin charging Dooku, cut away to something else, and when we come back Anakin is already writhing on the floor. But Obi-Wan and Anakin have a great exchange in RotS: "This time we'll do it together," "I was about to say that." You lose that in your version. So the thought occured to me, although this is probably impossible, can the force lightning be somehow "painted out" to have it appear as if Dooku throws Anakin hard across the room? Any thoughts on that?
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That would be difficult, as he would have to either find the unaltered, pre-forcelighting shot, or paint the lightning out frame by frame.

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