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Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released) — Page 44

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Originally posted by: Trooperman
I actually like that line, Erik. It’s simple and to the point.

But I actually don’t have that line at this time. When I borrowed “Man with the Golden Gun”, I forgot to rip that line, as fate would have it. If there is no prominent background music in the film at that time, then I’d really like to use the line.

Again, I’d love it if some kind person with “Golden Gun” could rip that line (“Forget the girl; she’s replaceable”). I have all of the other useful Chris Lee lines from that movie- I just need that one. I could try and borrow the film again, but that takes time.

This help would be very much appreciated!

-------------------

How's this:

Anakin: Padme is probably dead right now, because of you. Any last words?
Dooku: Come, come. The girl is replaceable.
Anakin: I'm about to take your head off.
Dooku: You get as much fulfillment out of killing as I do!
Anakin charges.

Obi-Wan: Anakin! No!


It's hard to write the scene without knowing what tone of voice Lee uses for "The girl is replaceable."


If he really thought she was dead, there wouldn't be the mild aggression that he shows in the movie, but pure rage.

That's what the new ADR could be used for. Besides, I don't think he really thinks she's dead, but in case she is, Dooku must die a painful death. It's the thought that counts, anyway. The thing is, we have to establish that Dooku's general smug attitude makes Anakin run at him more quickly than he would have otherwise.

EDIT: I love the line, "Prepare to meet your destiny," Marvolo.


I'd love to see SOTDS edited so that Anakin's rage is played up after Padme falls. Maybe a few closeup shots of him looking disraught and distracted as the gunship continues to pursue Dooku.

Anakin: I'm about to take your head off.

This sounds a bit contrived. If you really were in a fit of rage, I doubt you'd stop to make this kind of statement. You'd just go right ahead and do it. In addition, "Any last words?" sounds like Anakin already knows he's going to take on Dooku by himself, before he's been provoked by Dooku.

I guess my point is, Anakin should be upset, but still fairly rational until provoked by Dooku. Once that happens, he snaps and goes for it by himself.

Just my thoughts.

You know of the rebellion against the Empire?

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I'd love to see SOTDS edited so that Anakin's rage is played up after Padme falls. Maybe a few closeup shots of him looking disraught and distracted as the gunship continues to pursue Dooku.

That's a really good idea. Sometimes you get lost in the particulars of a scene and forget the big picture. I will definitely do this.

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Anakin: Padme is probably dead right now- because of you. Prepare to meet your destiny!
Dooku: Come, come. Forget the girl. She’s replaceable!
Anakin: AAAHHH

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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OK, for some reason, I'm not a fan of having Anakin saying: "You've *PROBABLY* killed my girl!"
At least the word "probably" should go. But that's just me. It just doesn't sound...right.

I'm not attached to the following, but have a look anyway:
"Not only have you killed many Jedi today, you've just killed Padme!"
or
"You've just taken Padme's life!"
or
"Lifeless she is!" -hey, maybe Yoda rubbed off on him!

The idea you're going for, Trooperman is great! And using other Chris Lee dialoge is a great idea! Any thought to using other dialoge for other characters (like Padme?)
Anyway, THIS scene is what I'm really looking foward to seeing! ...and of course the rest of the movie!

Again, if you need to take your time...take it! It'll be worth it!

SSWR’s YouTube channel

Attack of the Clones: Alternate Timeline Edit Thread:
https://originaltrilogy.com/topic/SSWRs-Attack-of-the-Clones-Alternate-Timeline-Edit/id/66888

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First, I love the Dukoo/Obi Wan clip-- exactly what I'm hoping from in this edit-- an emotional version of the PT!

Second, here's my vote for that Dukoo/Anakin dialogue. See if it works:

Anakin: Your attempt on Padme’s life will cost you. Prepare to meet your destiny.
Dooku: Forget the girl. She's replaceable. Come, come. Admit it-- You enjoy killing as much as I do.
Anakin: No! (He attacks)

I'd like to combine the two "insults" we've got going here so Dukoo hits Anakin with as much as we can give him. He gets under Anakin's skin with the first (the girl's nothing to him) and then twists the knife with the second (I sense much fear in you). I agree with others who think saying "probably killed my girl" just doesn't feel right. Let it be a definite anger over a definite attempt on Padme-- we'll determine later if it succeeded (speaking from Anakin's p.o.v.).

Keep up the great work.

(By the way, I like the idea of seeing Anakin burn a little after seeing Padme fall-- but the big picture there is how he agrees to go on without her-- so the cuts should take us through that journey in his emotions. He's becoming a man and accepting Obi Wan's ways in spite of his emotions. He knows that's what will make him a Jedi. He knows that's what Padme would do. This key beat is undermined in the original cut and we need to prop it up to achieve what it is supposed to-- the climax of their love story. Now Anakin starts the movie with his emotions slipping out of control (because of his Force-connection to his mother), but he learns to control himself with Padme's help. This is one of the ways we're going to FEEL the impact of their love in this new cut -- as opposed to the original where we had to be told about their love and were never allowed to feel it.)

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Originally posted by: Trooperman
Originally posted by: Darth Richard
I'm just sort of thinking out load but what if for the "A Long Time Ago....." you changed it to the original version from the lost cut of STAR WARS.
I think it would be really cool if you have it say "A long, long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, and incredible adventure took place..."

Also one other thinking aloud kind of thing. Is ther anyway to write somthing somewhat poetic and have it before the "A Long...." and have it be from The Journal Of the Wills?
Maybe something like "During the time of the Clone Wars the chosen one was being tempted but the Dark Side". But something far more poetic.


That's a really good concept- for a saga edit. Recall that my original intent was to make a PT that worked with the original Star Wars trilogy, without having to alter the latter. That's why I was using the original title card in the original font.

If I can figure out seamless branching in time for this release, then this may be a possibility, though. Remember that I'm a newcomer to DVD authoring.

Maybe have two version of the DVD. The stand alone edit to match the OT, and then a version for the Ranch?
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Oh yeah! Forgot to mention the Dukoo/Obi clip! VERY nice! Such an "easy" edit too! Why wasn't this originally done? Missed oppertunity. Sad.

Anakin: Your attempt on Padme’s life will cost you. Prepare to meet your destiny.
THIS is something I was looking for, MTHaslett! That just flows much better.

(By the way, I like the idea of seeing Anakin burn a little after seeing Padme fall-- but the big picture there is how he agrees to go on without her-- so the cuts should take us through that journey in his emotions. He's becoming a man and accepting Obi Wan's ways in spite of his emotions. He knows that's what will make him a Jedi. He knows that's what Padme would do. This key beat is undermined in the original cut and we need to prop it up to achieve what it is supposed to-- the climax of their love story. Now Anakin starts the movie with his emotions slipping out of control (because of his Force-connection to his mother), but he learns to control himself with Padme's help. This is one of the ways we're going to FEEL the impact of their love in this new cut -- as opposed to the original where we had to be told about their love and were never allowed to feel it.)

Wow! Nicely said, MTHaslett. I like your insights!

SSWR’s YouTube channel

Attack of the Clones: Alternate Timeline Edit Thread:
https://originaltrilogy.com/topic/SSWRs-Attack-of-the-Clones-Alternate-Timeline-Edit/id/66888

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What is the name of the music used in the Obi-Wan/Dooku scene?
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I just had a good idea for the Anakin/Dooku exchange.

ANAKIN: “Your attempt on Padme’s life will cost you, Dooku. Prepare to meet your destiny.”
DOOKU: “Forget the girl. She’s replaceable.”
ANAKIN: “But your head isn’t.”
DOOKU: “I see you get as much fulfillment out of killing as I do.”
ANAKIN: “In your case, YES!” Anakin charges.
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'Fulfillment' is a bit heady. Replace it with 'pleasure' and I could see that interchange working. Possibly.
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Originally posted by: Weezer12
I just had a good idea for the Anakin/Dooku exchange.

ANAKIN: “Your attempt on Padme’s life will cost you, Dooku. Prepare to meet your destiny.”
DOOKU: “Forget the girl. She’s replaceable.”
ANAKIN: “But your head isn’t.”
DOOKU: “I see you get as much fulfillment out of killing as I do.”
ANAKIN: “In your case, YES!” Anakin charges.


No offense to you, Weeze, but just reading that makes me cringe. I cannot imagine actually seeing/hearing it in a movie. It just doesn't seem like a natural exchange at all.

Light speed too slow??
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Originally posted by: Weezer12
I just had a good idea for the Anakin/Dooku exchange.

ANAKIN: “Your attempt on Padme’s life will cost you, Dooku. Prepare to meet your destiny.”
DOOKU: “Forget the girl. She’s replaceable.”
ANAKIN: “But your head isn’t.”
DOOKU: “I see you get as much fulfillment out of killing as I do.”
ANAKIN: “In your case, YES!” Anakin charges.


Ha ha! That's actually really funny (I think so, anyway). However, in this case I think the humour might undermine the point that Anakin is angry. I'm just afraid that Anakin will not come off as being as justified in his rush at Dooku.

Whereas MTH's version:

Anakin: Your attempt on Padme’s life will cost you. Prepare to meet your destiny.
Dooku: Forget the girl. She's replaceable. Come, come. Admit it-- You get as much fullfillment out of killing as I do.
Anakin: No! (He attacks)



...comes off as more dramatic. Know that I'm not just being polite, though; I'd love to use that exchange! It just doesn't seem right for the scene because the audience won't take the thing seriously after that, I don't think.


'Fulfillment' is a bit heady. Replace it with 'pleasure' and I could see that interchange working. Possibly.


I wish I had "pleasure", but I just checked the recording and it is in fact "fullfillment."


What is the name of the music used in the Obi-Wan/Dooku scene?

It's from the soundtrack of "Vertigo" (by Bernard Hermann). I thought it worked well with the scene, and it isn't the recognizable love theme, so I used it.

And in response to Darth Richard's question...yes, I could release a disc with the "Long time ago" title card changed. But I almost don't want to do that until I know if there's anything else that might need to be changed to fit into the series. Since there is no "series" at this point (just this movie), I'll probably just make one disc for now, and maybe figure out seamless branching.

-------------

I have finished the arena battle (aside from some mixing work), and I've cut the final confrontation between Yoda, Dooku, and Anakin. Wow. It took awhile to figure out exactly how it was going to work, but it's incredibly powerful (and suspenseful) now. All accomplished without any Force lightning, any rocks being thrown, or Yoda bouncing around with a lightsaber. And, I've cut out all of Yoda's ridiculous facial expressions and hand movements while lifting the pillar, in keeping with his teachings in ESB ("Size matters not"). I'm confident that the "old" George Lucas would like this sequence

-TM

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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Originally posted by: Trooperman
I have finished the arena battle (aside from some mixing work), and I've cut the final confrontation between Yoda, Dooku, and Anakin. Wow. It took awhile to figure out exactly how it was going to work, but it's incredibly powerful (and suspenseful) now. All accomplished without any Force lightning, any rocks being thrown, or Yoda bouncing around with a lightsaber. And, I've cut out all of Yoda's ridiculous facial expressions and hand movements while lifting the pillar, in keeping with his teachings in ESB ("Size matters not"). I'm confident that the "old" George Lucas would like this sequence

-TM


This is very exciting to hear. This is one of my most hated scenes from the movie, and I'm very interested to see how you've improved it (not that it would take much to improve it.)
Light speed too slow??
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The original Dooku/Obi-Wan scene was one of my favorites of the film, so maybe I'm just not as receptive to altering it as others are. One aspect I totally agree with is the visual cutting and close ups. The dialogue changes have me scratching my head though; why delete "Don't be so sure"? And while adding some more dramatic music to the scene may indeed be a benefit, this particular piece feels out of place. It doesn't help that it seems to come out of nowhere; there's no build up to the music or anything. I don't want to sound negative, I'm just offering some constructive criticism.

Also I'm going to try and be around more frequently then I have been over the past few months. I've been incredibly busy in the real world lately. But once again I offer my services as a creative consultant. Let the work continue...
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Originally posted by: Commander Courage
The original Dooku/Obi-Wan scene was one of my favorites of the film, so maybe I'm just not as receptive to altering it as others are. One aspect I totally agree with is the visual cutting and close ups. The dialogue changes have me scratching my head though; why delete "Don't be so sure"? And while adding some more dramatic music to the scene may indeed be a benefit, this particular piece feels out of place. It doesn't help that it seems to come out of nowhere; there's no build up to the music or anything. I don't want to sound negative, I'm just offering some constructive criticism.

Also I'm going to try and be around more frequently then I have been over the past few months. I've been incredibly busy in the real world lately. But once again I offer my services as a creative consultant. Let the work continue...

Hey CC! Nice to have you back. Part of your concern with the music may be the volume; I could turn it down a bit. After watching the whole scene in context, however, I don't think the music comes out of nowhere. Maybe that'll help. It's like the scene in the original SW when Luke and Ben are talking. They hit an important topic (the Force), and the music suddenly starts. The beginning of that scene is unscored. I'm not saying it's the same thing, but I think maybe it'll feel better when you see the whole scene. As for me, removing the music is now more of a distraction than leaving it in

As for the little dialogue changes, I really don't have any deep reasons for them; I just did what I thought flowed well. Basically I thought that with a couple lines, we kind of lost some subtlety. Like, "Don't be so sure, young Jedi." The following line implies that Obi-Wan shouldn't be so sure. Just shortening it to "Young Jedi!" gives his line a more disgusted tone. As if to say, "How would you know? I knew him better than you did."

Originally posted by: boreddusty


This is very exciting to hear. This is one of my most hated scenes from the movie, and I'm very interested to see how you've improved it (not that it would take much to improve it.)


I don't want to give too much away, but know that it is very climactic and powerful now. I put a lot into this sequence, because I think they basically destroyed the character of Yoda in one fell swoop with this sequence.

---------------------


Things are looking very good. Firstly, I now have all of the ADR recordings for Lama-Su. They are all mixed into the picture.

Secondly, I now have all of the ADR recordings for NUTE GUNRAY. Many of you may know that I was planning to just follow the lead of the editors on Episode I in regards to alien languages (before InfoDroid quit the project). Suddenly, I realized that this was not possible, and also that I didn’t have any foreign language tracks to use for Nute, and also Jar-Jar. That’s when Sluggo came in and offered to take care of it. For Nute Gunray and his companion, he got two fluent speakers of Cebuano, a variant of the Tagalog language. Not only did they do an EXCELLENT job, but the audio quality itself is stunning (better than my setup). And the best part is that for any Tagalog speakers that may wind up watching this (however few), the spoken lines actually translate into the English subtitles. And proper nouns are obviously included. I’ll see if I can’t post a couple clips to show you. Anyway, all of Nute's lines are now mixed into the picture.

I am so happy with how Nute Gunray turned out, and I’m really looking forward to hearing Jar-Jar in the future. Apparently, Uncle Owen is being recorded this weekend, so all that leaves is “hairy_hen” as the blue guy that helps Palpatine, and a yet uncast actor to be the voice of the stormtroopers. I have most of the stormtrooper lines written already, however. PM me if you’re interested and you have a good imitation of this voice- I have some interesting dialogue for you.

So, what it’s looking like is that the video will be more or less locked down next week, September will be devoted to the creation of the PCM stereo audio mix, October will be fine-tuning, final color timing, quality control, and basically a catch-all for anything I didn’t get to, and we’re looking at an encode and release in November.

Stay tuned!

-TM

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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Yeah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! November!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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Trooperman,

Are the clonetrooper voices going to be done in the classic Original Trilogy style, or in the Temuera Morrison style?

I hope they will be in the OT style. Morrison's accent just didn't sound right for the clonetroopers IMHO.

You know of the rebellion against the Empire?

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Points taken, TM. I know you're trying to lock things down at this point, but would you consider trying Qui-Gon's Theme (the soft version played as he dies in Obi-Wan's arms) into the conversation at that point? I think it would be an effective tie-in, but maybe you were trying to ignore TPM's music completely. It might be something I experiment with if I have time, I think it has potential. I guess it really comes down to my thinking the scene would be served better by another piece of music than the one from "Vertigo."

Anyway, that's VERY exciting news about the language tracks. That's a mjor hurdle out of the way. As you mentioned that's one of the things that put Starkiller Ranch on it's indefinite hiatus. You mentioned Stormtrooper voices, what's your stance on Jango himself? I thought it would be an interesting idea to dub his voice to be more OT-Boba Fett like when wearing the helmet, assuming it had a Vader-like modulator in it. This would go well with your OT-inspired idea the Stormtroopers all have different voices.
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I want to say that I, for one, disagree with comments about the new music in the Obi Wan/Dukoo scene-- I find it fits perfectly and is cued beautifully by the context in which it appears. "Building up" to it wouldn't make sense, it is cued by the surprise that Dukoo brings up Qui Gonn. It has the exact tone of menace and power that the scene lacked before-- now it feels like Dukoo is actually getting under Obi Wan's skin where before it was all perfunctory.

I also find the new dialogue cuts improve the way the scene plays. It is less arch and more like dialogue. As ever, I am happily surprised by your instincts TM and await your next fantastic surprise (whatever it may be).

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MTHaslett, not to be nitpicky, but his name is spelt "Dooku" not "Dukoo". Also, I agree with you about the music, I think it is fine the way TM has it.


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Obviously a bit more work is needed to synch the dialogue to the lips (but people will be reading the subtitles anyway). Also, the subtitles are not in the correct font right now. But at least you get an idea of what his voice is like.

going to be done in the classic Original Trilogy style, or in the Temuera Morrison style?

I'd like them done in the OT style. Since accents are learned and not genetic, there's no problem there.

You mentioned Stormtrooper voices, what's your stance on Jango himself? I thought it would be an interesting idea to dub his voice to be more OT-Boba Fett like when wearing the helmet, assuming it had a Vader-like modulator in it. This would go well with your OT-inspired idea the Stormtroopers all have different voices.

That's a really good idea. And to my knowledge, Jango only has one line with his helmet on. "Boba... get on board!" I'll see what I can do to modulate it.

As for the Qui-Gon cue, I can certainly try it and see how it works compared to the Hermann cue. If it's just the fact that it's from "Vertigo", I've used a good deal of other music from other movies as well. And there are the shots from Blade Runner and Dune. But if you watch "Vertigo" and you notice the cue, you'll see that it means something completely different in the context of that film.

I think it would be an effective tie-in, but maybe you were trying to ignore TPM's music completely.

See, that's the thing- I don't yet know how much of the original TPM soundtrack is being kept. I have retained "Duel of the Fates" and "Anakin's Theme" so far, but not much else.

I'm also stumped about what music to use for the clonetroopers marching below (with Lama-Su and Obi-Wan observing). The Trade Federation march? The Imperial March? A new march I'm thinking might be used in Ep. I? The Imperial March is a good idea, except that I want to have some musical tie-in between Ep. I and II.

-TM

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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Thats an interesting direction to take with the nemoidians. I know you havn't had time to manipulate them yet, but I think there could be some more distortion or "alien" kind of sound you could mix with it. I'm sure there are some programs like this on your audio altering software. I would suggest writing some different dialouge for them, I was never satisfied with the stilted dialouge that was written for the villians of the PT. You could even change the emotion of the scene by writing entirely different impressions from Gunray to Dooku. But I think its a neat direction to take and the voice acting isn't that bad, just needs to be creeped out a bit.

As far as music for the scene of marching clones.....I thought it was mentioned a long while ago that the imperial marched would be introduced for this scene and I thought that it was a fantastic idea. I'm sure someone could change my mind with an alternate cue (Mthaslett, CC?) ........but i'd rather go for anything other than the trade federation theme from TPM.

Maybe we should talk about Jar Jars voice soon, I feel that trying to fix this character for all of us to bear is going to be a tricky task and although we can achieve it, it is going to be difficult. What does everybody feel would be interesting ways of portraying his style of dialouge and pitch? In other words, before knowing what jar jar sounded before TPM came out, what did you imagine him sounding like?
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Indeed, should Jar Jar talk in the same high pitched voice but in a different language? The current voice doesn't bother me as much as long as Ahmed Best is keeping the conversation straight forward. The squealing is what gets on my nerves. Putting the voice in a different language would eliminate that much maligned 'Stepin Fetchit' aspect. I think the voice needs to keep some of the original tone, or the shock of something new will drive folks bonkers. Remember the outcry at Anakin's dub? I'd say that Jar Jar's voice needs to be different, but familiar. Or as George would say, "Same thing, only better!"
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Oh, as far as Nute's voice goes, I like it so far. In the cantina of the original Star Wars, all the cantina creatures sounded they were talking from the bottom of a bucket. Could a little underlying base or echo be added to Nute?
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Hey TM, did the new lines I sent you sync up to the video well enough?

http://i.imgur.com/7N84TM8.jpg

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Trooperman, I have the exact march for the clone parade scene.

http://www.griskey.com/music.php

Download the track titled "KOTOR March (End Credits)"

I think that would be absolutely PERFECT for the clone parade scene. It has a build up, that menacing quality, and, I think with the right editing, a suitable length. Let me know what you think.

And Trooperman, will you be adding the "OT-trooper" voice effect to the clones in SOTD? You know, it's that "click" the trooper's helmets make whenever they speak a line. I think that would go a long way towards establishing a connection between your SOTD and the classic trilogy.