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"Luminous beings are we -- not this crude matter." ~~Master Yoda
"I find your lack of faith disturbing." ~~Lord Vader
Episode 3: Fan Editing Ideas Discussion — Page 15
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Originally posted by: Rebel Scumb
Ah, I understand now. I think this could still be the basis for a more mysterious reworking of things though. I have enough projects (DVD or otherwise) on my plate before I can consider another, but this might be a springboard to another one eventually.
Originally posted by: Commander Courage
Oooooo, I really like the implication of Sidious' true face being revealed. That's something I had a big issue with in RotS, Palpatine's disfigurement by force lightning. Can't say I agree with all of your editing decisions, but that one for sure is a good one. Of course the parallel of RotJ with Anakin considering his next move while watching the lightning is lost, but I really like Palpatine being a mask for Sidious the whole time (which is how it should have been done if Lucas' didn't want to stick with the dark side deteriation explanation that had been around for so long).
Wow, now that's a bold cut Rebel Scumb. While I do think it would go a long way toward preserving some of the mysteries and surprises of the OT, it leaves us with one very big continuity issue. Where does Obi-Wan get Anakin's saber to give Luke in ANH?
Well it doesn't perserve any of the surprises, we still see Anakin chared and burned get rescued by palpatine, and all the ensuing cyborgifcation. We can just assume he lost his limbs from the lava. He is climbing up the beach as per usual, all burned up when sidious arrives with the troopers to help him.
As for the saber, okay thats a bit of a reach, I still have the shot of Obi-wan picking it up off the ground, so presumably Anakin dropped it when he fell over the edge. Thats reaching a bit I know, but no more so then a lot of things Lucas has asked people to swallow from the prequels, and obviously if I had a shot of the saber falling from the tower to the ground where Obi-wan retrieves it I would use it.
But yeah, no secrets kept, sorry if I made it sound as though they were.
Well it doesn't perserve any of the surprises, we still see Anakin chared and burned get rescued by palpatine, and all the ensuing cyborgifcation. We can just assume he lost his limbs from the lava. He is climbing up the beach as per usual, all burned up when sidious arrives with the troopers to help him.
As for the saber, okay thats a bit of a reach, I still have the shot of Obi-wan picking it up off the ground, so presumably Anakin dropped it when he fell over the edge. Thats reaching a bit I know, but no more so then a lot of things Lucas has asked people to swallow from the prequels, and obviously if I had a shot of the saber falling from the tower to the ground where Obi-wan retrieves it I would use it.
But yeah, no secrets kept, sorry if I made it sound as though they were.
Ah, I understand now. I think this could still be the basis for a more mysterious reworking of things though. I have enough projects (DVD or otherwise) on my plate before I can consider another, but this might be a springboard to another one eventually.
Originally posted by: Commander Courage
Oooooo, I really like the implication of Sidious' true face being revealed. That's something I had a big issue with in RotS, Palpatine's disfigurement by force lightning. Can't say I agree with all of your editing decisions, but that one for sure is a good one. Of course the parallel of RotJ with Anakin considering his next move while watching the lightning is lost, but I really like Palpatine being a mask for Sidious the whole time (which is how it should have been done if Lucas' didn't want to stick with the dark side deteriation explanation that had been around for so long).
I agree that this is the way it should have gone as well. While I feel that Lucas has the right to disregard whatever someone else has introduced in the EU, this idea of the deterioration of the physical body seems to be perfect when you consider the corruption that the Dark Side brings. Power, but at a cost.
"Luminous beings are we -- not this crude matter." ~~Master Yoda
"I find your lack of faith disturbing." ~~Lord Vader
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which is how it should have been done if Lucas' didn't want to stick with the dark side deteriation explanation that had been around for so long.
the slow deterioration was such a good plan, I wish he had stuck with it
I agree that this is the way it should have gone as well. While I feel that Lucas has the right to disregard whatever someone else has introduced in the EU, this idea of the deterioration of the physical body seems to be perfect when you consider the corruption that the Dark Side brings. Power, but at a cost.
the slow deterioration was such a good plan, I wish he had stuck with it
I agree that this is the way it should have gone as well. While I feel that Lucas has the right to disregard whatever someone else has introduced in the EU, this idea of the deterioration of the physical body seems to be perfect when you consider the corruption that the Dark Side brings. Power, but at a cost.
Well its not just EU, that was the plan all the way up to the start of production on Ep3. Palpatine is clearly more disfigured at the end of EP2 then he is at the start of ep3. and even Ian Mcdiarmid described it as a slow decay, as did some of the Lucas people even for behind the scenes of Ep3, so this was a very last minute decision to make it an abrupt change.
and not for the better.
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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Yoda to Dagobah looks great to start with but as soon as the ship starts landing visually it doesn't look right to me...Yoda phone home.
I would have liked Obi-Wan/Yoda and baby Luke leaving the Tantive in a ship similar to the one Yoda leaves the Wookie planet in, landing, then having Qui-Gon' s ghost appear and explain about how he couldn't interfere and the Ghost thing, and would have explained how Luke felt Dagobah was familiar which isn't a big deal but would be a nice touch.
The Shaaki-Ti scene looks like an event out of the video game more than actual movie, poor acting.
The senate stuff is ok, I never cared for too much political stuff in SW, unless it was short & sweet like in ANH.
I only scenes I'd add are Palpatines shuttle approaching, and Dooku's "just because there are two of you..." clip from the video game.
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Although I really like the lightsaber fight between Palpy and Mace - the idea that his unorthodox fighting style is something the jedi were not prepared for.
I would also have preferred smoother deterioration. Maybe each active use of the Dark Side could be explained to increase the rate of deterioration.
I wonder if it would be worthwhile to alter his skin color to be less saturated before the duel and more blurry (to smoothen wrinkles) afterwards. I am not familiar with after effects tools at all, and am afraid that it might be too much manual work for too little effect.
When I look through the trailers I get the feeling that Palpatine's charge is longer there than in the movie... Perhaps those frames could replace the spinning. I'll have to rip and check frame by frame to be sure.
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Originally posted by: Rebel Scumb
Palpatine: Master Windu, I take it General Grevious has been destroyed then.....I must say you are here sooner than expected.
Windu: In the name of the Galactic senate of the Republic you're under arrest Chancellor.
Palpatine: I am the senate.
Palpatine stands, saber ejects, ignites all very fast. palpatine's spin attack cut, just see him charge. frames trimmed so he appears to be a lot faster and catches darthmaul style jedi by complete surprise instead of three jedi masters standing there like chumps/
more frames trimmed as kit and other jedi die, and mace exits into hallway. fight reduced down to bare essentials and best shots. All cutaways of anakin arriving are gone. The window shatters, cut to mace giving Palpatine a boot to the head.
Anakin enters.
Windu: The opression of the Sith will never return, you have lost.
Anakin walks up to watch
Windu: I'm going to end this one and for all.
Mace raises saber, anakin ignites his, severe's Mace's arm
Palpatine (removed no,no,no), you will die! (shooting lightning). **still looks human**
Mace gets fried goes out the window
Palpatine sighs with satisfaction, his true face revealed.
(removed "what have I done?")
Anakin slumps down...palpatine rises.
Palpatine: You are fulfilling your destiny Anakin......become my apprentice, learn to use the darkside of the force.
Anakin: I pledge myself to your teachings.
Palpatine: good... very good.
Palpatine: The force is strong with you....a powerful sith you will become, henceforth, you shall be known as darth.....vader.
Anakin: thank you my master
Palpatine: rise...
Palpatine: Master Windu, I take it General Grevious has been destroyed then.....I must say you are here sooner than expected.
Windu: In the name of the Galactic senate of the Republic you're under arrest Chancellor.
Palpatine: I am the senate.
Palpatine stands, saber ejects, ignites all very fast. palpatine's spin attack cut, just see him charge. frames trimmed so he appears to be a lot faster and catches darthmaul style jedi by complete surprise instead of three jedi masters standing there like chumps/
more frames trimmed as kit and other jedi die, and mace exits into hallway. fight reduced down to bare essentials and best shots. All cutaways of anakin arriving are gone. The window shatters, cut to mace giving Palpatine a boot to the head.
Anakin enters.
Windu: The opression of the Sith will never return, you have lost.
Anakin walks up to watch
Windu: I'm going to end this one and for all.
Mace raises saber, anakin ignites his, severe's Mace's arm
Palpatine (removed no,no,no), you will die! (shooting lightning). **still looks human**
Mace gets fried goes out the window
Palpatine sighs with satisfaction, his true face revealed.
(removed "what have I done?")
Anakin slumps down...palpatine rises.
Palpatine: You are fulfilling your destiny Anakin......become my apprentice, learn to use the darkside of the force.
Anakin: I pledge myself to your teachings.
Palpatine: good... very good.
Palpatine: The force is strong with you....a powerful sith you will become, henceforth, you shall be known as darth.....vader.
Anakin: thank you my master
Palpatine: rise...
Very, very nice.
War does not make one great.
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And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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War does not make one great.
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And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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not to sound over anxious, but MF and ADM: when do you hope to have your cuts done? i can't wait to see them both
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Originally posted by: Rebel Scumb
Well its not just EU, that was the plan all the way up to the start of production on Ep3. Palpatine is clearly more disfigured at the end of EP2 then he is at the start of ep3. and even Ian Mcdiarmid described it as a slow decay, as did some of the Lucas people even for behind the scenes of Ep3, so this was a very last minute decision to make it an abrupt change.
and not for the better.
which is how it should have been done if Lucas' didn't want to stick with the dark side deteriation explanation that had been around for so long.
the slow deterioration was such a good plan, I wish he had stuck with it
I agree that this is the way it should have gone as well. While I feel that Lucas has the right to disregard whatever someone else has introduced in the EU, this idea of the deterioration of the physical body seems to be perfect when you consider the corruption that the Dark Side brings. Power, but at a cost.
the slow deterioration was such a good plan, I wish he had stuck with it
I agree that this is the way it should have gone as well. While I feel that Lucas has the right to disregard whatever someone else has introduced in the EU, this idea of the deterioration of the physical body seems to be perfect when you consider the corruption that the Dark Side brings. Power, but at a cost.
Well its not just EU, that was the plan all the way up to the start of production on Ep3. Palpatine is clearly more disfigured at the end of EP2 then he is at the start of ep3. and even Ian Mcdiarmid described it as a slow decay, as did some of the Lucas people even for behind the scenes of Ep3, so this was a very last minute decision to make it an abrupt change.
and not for the better.
Gotcha. I've given up trying to keep track of what Lucas did and didn't plan because of all the changes we've seen to everything over the years. That would have been pretty damned cool though.
"Luminous beings are we -- not this crude matter." ~~Master Yoda
"I find your lack of faith disturbing." ~~Lord Vader
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MagnoliaFan's is gonna rock. I'm looking forward to it most of all for the "preservation of the ESB surprise."
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This way it could preserve the "A New Hope" wookie surprise...namely, not screwing over Chewie's story arc by having him know Yoda and all that faggotry...
A thought.
<a href="http://www.bynkii.com/archives/2005/05/i_hates_lucas_i.html" title="www.bynkii.com/archives/2005/05/i_hates_lucas_i.html" target="_blank">.Truth.</a><br /><br />"Mmm....starcruiser crash!"
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ell-the-ewok.com
Fighting the frizzies, at 11.
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I'm looking forward to it most of all for the "preservation of the ESB surprise."
It's not gonnaaaa wooooooorrrrk.
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(Threepio hand me those binders..)
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How can the surprise be perserved without Obi-wan having a new padawan after anakin?
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.
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If you watched the films like this, it would appear that Obi Wan killed Anakin for being tempted to the dark side and that Obi Wan was lying to Luke to hide this dishonourable death.
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Originally posted by: AbsoluteDestiny
You could actually remove "Vader" from ROTS entirely.
If you watched the films like this, it would appear that Obi Wan killed Anakin for being tempted to the dark side and that Obi Wan was lying to Luke to hide this dishonourable death.
But you're forgetting that Obi-wan tells Luke that Vader was his apprentice, and even if the audience thought he was lying, Vader later confirms this when speaking to and about Obi-wan.
Obi-wan had no other apprentices, and since we'll have seen anakin go to the darkside in ep3 and he's obi-wan's apprentice its still 100% clear who Vader is.
Lucas should of had Obi-wan have two apprentices throughout the PT. one a red herring for Vader, and then anakin would of fought HIM on mustafar, they both fall in the lava, and then The emperor saves Vader, but we are made to assume that it is the other apprentice and only Obi-wan, Vader, palpatine and yoda know the truth
The only way the surprise could be preserved is if you tell both Anakin's and Luke's stories simultaneously over the course of three movies instead of six, through a series of flashbacks and flash-forwards (i.e. - The Godfather II). How else could you do it?
You could actually remove "Vader" from ROTS entirely.
If you watched the films like this, it would appear that Obi Wan killed Anakin for being tempted to the dark side and that Obi Wan was lying to Luke to hide this dishonourable death.
But you're forgetting that Obi-wan tells Luke that Vader was his apprentice, and even if the audience thought he was lying, Vader later confirms this when speaking to and about Obi-wan.
Obi-wan had no other apprentices, and since we'll have seen anakin go to the darkside in ep3 and he's obi-wan's apprentice its still 100% clear who Vader is.
Lucas should of had Obi-wan have two apprentices throughout the PT. one a red herring for Vader, and then anakin would of fought HIM on mustafar, they both fall in the lava, and then The emperor saves Vader, but we are made to assume that it is the other apprentice and only Obi-wan, Vader, palpatine and yoda know the truth
The only way the surprise could be preserved is if you tell both Anakin's and Luke's stories simultaneously over the course of three movies instead of six, through a series of flashbacks and flash-forwards (i.e. - The Godfather II). How else could you do it?
yeah exactly.
The other way is to watch ANH, ESB, and rotj up till the end of the dagobah stuff, then watch the PT, then the end of Jedi from the rebel meeting forward.
And I'm a monkey, in a long line of kings.