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Info & Ideas: ESB and ROTJ Wishlist — Page 5

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Originally posted by: Darth Lars

In my opinion, it is what Luke sees, so they should appear as Luke expects to see.
Leia looks at the same spot, but sees nothing. Luke expects to see a 45-year old healthy man and that is what I think the audience should also see. Sebastian Shaw was 76 years old.

If Christensen is in there, then for consistency's sake, Alec Guiness and Yoda should be exchanged for Ewan McGregor and a tadpole.


Then again, Luke only ever saw the real Anakin when he unmasked him on teh DSII. So Luke should really be expecting a pasty dude with no hair.
I suppose I agree that if they wanted to use Hayden, they should have make-upped him to look the proper age. But being a ghost and all I think it makes more sense for him to choose his outward appearance rather than it depending on who is looking at him. In both versions the ghost looks different than what Luke saw earlier.
In '83 he magically regained his hair and limbs (and complexion), and in '04 he magically became young again

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Originally posted by: Darth Lars
Originally posted by: Bobocop
But seriously, the Anakin head transplant doesn't really bother me. He's a ghost, so I think he just appears as he sees himself.
In my opinion, it is what Luke sees, so they should appear as Luke expects to see.
Leia looks at the same spot, but sees nothing. Luke expects to see a 45-year old healthy man and that is what I think the audience should also see. Sebastian Shaw was 76 years old.

If Christensen is in there, then for consistency's sake, Alec Guiness and Yoda should be exchanged for Ewan McGregor and a tadpole.

The point some of us are trying to make is that Vader kind of spent 20 or so years in this limbo. So he wasn't 'himself' when he aged from his late 20s or however old he was in ROTS, to when he finally redeemed himself. Both Obi-Wan and Yoda stayed true to themselves through-out there life, so their ghost images are that of the person they were when they died. But Vader's is of who he was before he fell to the Dark Side. I don't feel too strongly one way of the other, I guess. Hayden or Sebastian, it's a small moment and they both have their merits (Shaw has a nice loving father expression, so I won't complain however Adywan chooses to do it. Well, unless he rotoscopes Jake Llloyd in there, but I am confident he won't. Hah.

Originally posted by: Killbot
Originally posted by: Johnny Ringo

NOTHING in the movies indicates he is such a great bounty hunter. So he managed to capture Han Solo? Yeah, with the aid of a sith lord and a few dozen imperial troops. Even Greedo managed to find Solo....


When Fett is first introduced, Vader is adressing the bounty hunters, but makes a specific point of reminding Fett there are to be "no disintegrations." This makes Fett bad-ass in that he is the only one adressed individually by Vader. It implies that either Fett is notorious for disintegrating people in general, or there has been some kind of specific incident that Vader is reffering to... perhaps Fett has hunted someone down for the Empire or Vader at some point in the past, but disintegrated them? If that's the case, then why was he not only allowed to live, but called back for a new job? He must be bringing something to the table.

Then, when the Falcon disappears, Fett is the only one who figures out where it went. He arranges to have Slave One jettisoned with the garbage, and then somehow deduces that Han will head for Bespin. When Vader et all turn up at Cloud City, it's because Fett must've known about the Han/Lando connection.

In the carbon freezing chamber, Fett has the cajones to challenge Vader on his decision to freeze Han. Vader's response is to promise Fett money, instead of simply force-strangling him like he tends to do to other people who piss him off. Vader obviously either has some degree of respect for him, or at least sees him as too useful to kill.

Lastly Fett gets off the first few shots in his firefight with Luke, keeping him pinned down and escaping.

The guy's clearly a badass. Unless you bump his jet pack with a stick.



Vader telling Fett not to disintegrate could be construed that Fett is reckless and a lousy bounty hunter, actually. If he was an assassin, maybe it would make more sense. But it's like somebody telling Dog the Bounty Hunter not to blow the head off his quarry with a shotgun...

(but I do give the guy points for that trash move, that would seem that he's good at empathetic detecting, thinking in the same way as his pray)

Anyway, kind of going back on topic: I have a little bit of a concern. Adywan will probably be getting more and more popular, as will these projects. Seems to be that it's only a matter of time before LucasFilm hands out a Cease and Desist order...anybody else concerned of this?
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Unlike ANH, I don't think these movies require as much work. Aside from fixing the most jarring fx shots and the lightsabers, as well as to remove the worst Special Edition aditions, there really isn't much that needs to be done.

Personally, I would darken the Emperor's hologram A LOT in ESB. The Emperor's face is gradually revealed in ROTJ; it starts out entirely in shadow when he first arrives and we don't get a close-up until Luke arrives. In a way, we se Palpatine at the same time as Luke does.

This gradual reveal is IMO ruined by clearly showing his face fully in ESB. In light of the PT, it could be called a gradual re-introduction. Either way, the Emperor hologram should be changed to be more mysterious.
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Originally posted by: Chrille
Personally, I would darken the Emperor's hologram A LOT in ESB. The Emperor's face is gradually revealed in ROTJ; it starts out entirely in shadow when he first arrives and we don't get a close-up until Luke arrives. In a way, we se Palpatine at the same time as Luke does.


Not to be picky, but the original version has always been pretty clear for up to 17 years until the change. The idea of the Emperor being hidden and unknown is largely influenced by the prequels.
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You're right that his face was pretty clearly shown in the orginal ESB, albeit a bit darker than the present version as the abobe poster mentioned.

But there is definately a gradual reveal going on in Return of the Jedi. Since the two Emperors orginally looked vastly different (the first one being an old woman with monkey eyes I believe) that wasn't a problem back in 83. But now his scene in Empire ruins his introduction in Jedi. Therefore, the hologram should shroud his face more than it does now.
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ESB


*Fix the boom mike reflection in Luke's goggles on the TaunTaun.
*Make the Wampas fingers move and come in better contact with Luke's face when it knocks him off the TaunTaun.
*Fix the (one second or so) far left of the Wampa puppeteer' arm showing when the the Wampa chokes the TaunTaun.
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perhaps 'disintergrations' was Boba's handy little excuse whenever he couldn't catch his bounty 'dead' or 'alive'?

a bit like the classic Q: 'Where's your Homework?' A: Oh....um....er....the dog ate it!'

but seriously, I think the main aim of an fan-edit of the classic trilogy should be to try and undo any of the damage George has done on his subsequent revisions, so I'm all for seeing Sebastian Shaw back as jedi spirit, and not a weird morph of Hayden and Shaw.

Or perhaps remove Anakin completely from the scene, as according to ROTS Anakin shouldn't have learnt how to become 'one' with the force anyway, unless Qui Gon appeared to Darth Vader before he died and taught him how. (now that really would be an interesting scene!)
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Originally posted by: buddy-x-wing
Or perhaps remove Anakin completely from the scene, as according to ROTS Anakin shouldn't have learnt how to become 'one' with the force anyway, unless Qui Gon appeared to Darth Vader before he died and taught him how. (now that really would be an interesting scene!)


The problem with that is that it would deny the sense of closure which was the whole point of the shot in the first place!

How about we add everyone from the prequels including Jar Jar? Why not?
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Originally posted by: buddy-x-wing
unless Qui Gon appeared to Darth Vader before he died and taught him how. (now that really would be an interesting scene!)


What about a Qui Gon voiceover to Vader as he watches Palpatine fry Luke. It may be enough to imply that Qui Gon passed his secrets along to Vader.

You know of the rebellion against the Empire?

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Originally posted by: Erikstormtrooper
Originally posted by: buddy-x-wing
unless Qui Gon appeared to Darth Vader before he died and taught him how. (now that really would be an interesting scene!)


What about a Qui Gon voiceover to Vader as he watches Palpatine fry Luke. It may be enough to imply that Qui Gon passed his secrets along to Vader.


Problem with that is that it just seems really heavy-handed and somewhat anvilicious. I always liked the subtlety of Vader just looking at Luke, and then back at the Emperor, and going for him, with no clues to his mindset but what Prowse puts into the performance. From a storytelling standpoint, it doesn't need anything else, and would be compromising the character (in the theatrical, it's Vader/Anakin making the decision for himself, not anyone else prompting or influencing him) for the sake of continuity. If it comes down to one or the other, I would much rather compromise continuity for the sake of character.
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lol I can imagine how that conversation would go

Qui Gon: " Anakin , remember me? i't's Qui Gonn, long time no see! sorry I didn't take the time to 'chat' with you when you were a young Jedi and before you turned to the dark-side, but I promise you, if you ever have a change of heart and decide you want to redeem yourself before the Emperor kills your son, then just throw the Emperor down that reactor shaft and I'll teach you that cool trick I taught Obi-wan about cheating death and coming back as a force-ghost yadda yadda yadda! and to sweeten the deal, if you take off the mask and have a tender moment with your son I'll even make you look like you did 20 years ago before that nasty accident!

We Got a deal?"
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Hows about ampin up sidious lighting in ROTJ

The person your searching for simply does not exist

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I haven't read this thread all the way threw so I don't know if anyone has addressed this yet, but I have an issue with the new scene of the Emperor in ESB. Part of the magic of the Emperor (if you haven't seen ep 1-3 of course) is you don't really know who this guy is. He was a shadowy figure with a calm well spoken British accent. I'm not crazy about the new make-up. To me it looks dodgy in moments and at times, the angles and make-up make him look over-weight. I think he should look a bit more obscure, as he did prequels. perhaps even garble the transmission slightly (but not too much), they are after all just coming out of an asteroid field.

Blade Runner: The Complete Collection

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Originally posted by: focuspuller
I haven't read this thread all the way threw so I don't know if anyone has addressed this yet, but I have an issue with the new scene of the Emperor in ESB. Part of the magic of the Emperor (if you haven't seen ep 1-3 of course) is you don't really know who this guy is. He was a shadowy figure with a calm well spoken British accent. I'm not crazy about the new make-up. To me it looks dodgy in moments and at times, the angles and make-up make him look over-weight. I think he should look a bit more obscure, as he did prequels. perhaps even garble the transmission slightly (but not too much), they are after all just coming out of an asteroid field.


I agree about the make-up. In ROTJ he looked a bit greener too (but that could be the lighting). His voice definitely sounds better in ROTJ, than in the prequels.

But other things that need enhancements:
ESB:
- The shot of the AT-AT foot coming down on Luke's speeder looks fake, perhaps a CG replacement?
- The added windows in Cloud City need new continuity, because now there isn't.
- The ending shot needs all the ships jumping into lightspeed, and then fade to the credits. In early versions it used to be that way, but for some reason it has been changed.

ROTJ:
- Impact wounds on the people Luke attacks with his lightsaber. He swings with it like a madman and everybody acts like they're injured, but I don't see any wounds.
- Explosion of the shield generator is way too big.
- The explosion of the Death Star's main reactor always looked a bit crummy to me. Could it be enhanced?

And of course a lot of other things, but those have already been listed here.


Oh, by the way, Adywan, it's totally cool that you're doing this!!! . Everything (from what I've seen) looks great!
Can't wait for the dvd, and the other movies .

I want to learn the ways of the Force and become a Jedi like my father.
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The ending shot needs all the ships jumping into lightspeed, and then fade to the credits. In early versions it used to be that way, but for some reason it has been changed.


Which early versions are you referring to?
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Originally posted by: Sluggo
The ending shot needs all the ships jumping into lightspeed, and then fade to the credits. In early versions it used to be that way, but for some reason it has been changed.

Which early versions are you referring to?


According to IMDb the early versions (theatrical, first VHS, perhaps some laserdiscs too) had the last shot intact. It looks kinda strange when you look at it, and it would be great to see it back again.


The original version has the Rebel fleet hyperspace out immediately before the end credits. Follow-up versions (THX re-release, Special Edition and DVD) all cut to the end credits before the hyperspace jump.
I want to learn the ways of the Force and become a Jedi like my father.
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Originally posted by: KubrickFan
Originally posted by: Sluggo
The ending shot needs all the ships jumping into lightspeed, and then fade to the credits. In early versions it used to be that way, but for some reason it has been changed.

Which early versions are you referring to?


According to IMDb the early versions (theatrical, first VHS, perhaps some laserdiscs too) had the last shot intact. It looks kinda strange when you look at it, and it would be great to see it back again.


The original version has the Rebel fleet hyperspace out immediately before the end credits. Follow-up versions (THX re-release, Special Edition and DVD) all cut to the end credits before the hyperspace jump.


Well i saw ESB on its opening day and the ending has always been the same. . I'm curious to where they got their information especially the mention of the scene existing in an early video release. I'm sure if this did exist then there would be footage to back this up. i haven't seen any mention of this being part of the 70mm release either. So it looks like IMDb screwed up.

ANH:REVISITED
ESB:REVISITED

DONATIONS TOWARDS MATERIALS FOR THE REVISITED SAGA

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I think IMDb is incorrect about this. We researched this quite extensively over on the 70mm ESB thread. The end of ESB was different, but it was because they added new model shots. Maybe the original 70mm version had a leap to hyperspace, but the IMDb is the only source for this item. I haven't seen this claim anywhere else.
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Originally posted by: Sluggo
I think IMDb is incorrect about this. We researched this quite extensively over on the 70mm ESB thread. The end of ESB was different, but it was because they added new model shots. Maybe the original 70mm version had a leap to hyperspace, but the IMDb is the only source for this item. I haven't seen this claim anywhere else.



What was the original like, then? I'm curious.
Still, it could be added. It would look better as the ending, I think.
I want to learn the ways of the Force and become a Jedi like my father.
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Originally posted by: KubrickFan
Originally posted by: Sluggo
I think IMDb is incorrect about this. We researched this quite extensively over on the 70mm ESB thread. The end of ESB was different, but it was because they added new model shots. Maybe the original 70mm version had a leap to hyperspace, but the IMDb is the only source for this item. I haven't seen this claim anywhere else.



What was the original like, then? I'm curious.
Still, it could be added. It would look better as the ending, I think.


KFan, try here. I put up some screen caps of what the original and the reshoot shots were.

Creating a reconstructed 70mm version of Empire is a worty project just waiting for someone to jump in and get it done.
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First of all, thank you very much adywan for sharing this with all of the world and giving everyone a chance to contribute with there Ideas. Your ANH is everything I wished It would of been. You are very tallented, I wish I had your knowledge and artistic talent.

Now here are my suggestions and wishes.

-1- ROTJ Bobba Fett absolutely deserve a better death. Maby Solo shot him or something, then Fett fel in the pit.

-2- ROTJ Fett should fly out of the sarlac pit using his jet pack (like in "tales from the bounty hunter").

-3- ROTJ & ESB I wish all the creatures be more articulate (like the job you did in the Cantina). All the creatures in Jabba's palace badly need it.

-4- ROTJ The speeder bike chase is already pretty good, but the acting from Hamil's part is terrible. Can you adjust the "side by side" part so that it realy looks more like the scout trooper pushes Luke off his bike?

-5- ESB This one is a long shot but I always dreamed of seeing this. Before Chewie finds 3PO disassembled on Bespin, it would be cool to see Vader finding 3PO and holding his head in his hands. Just a reminder that he is the maker. I've seen this in a comic I think.

-6- ESB The sock puppet that comes out of the asteroid needs a little bit of a face lift.

-7- ROTJ I always thaught Sebastian Shaw was a terrible choice for Vader. He doesn`t look at all like an old Hayden Christensen. I'm not even sure his huge head fits inside the helmet. Can anything be done to somewhat modify his patato head?

-8- ROTJ I'm with those who think that there shouldn't be a ghost of Anakin.
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I hope you didn't register Just to write that...If you are joking, It's hardly funny and if you are serious then I think you are in the wrong place. Comments like this -

"I always thaught Sebastian Shaw was a terrible choice for Vader. He doesn`t look at all like an old Hayden Christensen."


- are sure to ruffle feathers.

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I would assume that he meant to say that "I always thought Hayden Christensen was a terrible choice for Vader. He doesn`t look at all like a young Sebastian Shaw ", as the prequels were made after the original trilogy.
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That's what they want you to think....