Doctor Who — Page 55

towne32 said:

SilverWook said:

towne32 said:

TK-949 said:

towne32 said:

TK-949 said:


Currently I'm watching Torchwood as well as the first episodes of classic Doctor Who.

 People who don't enjoy classic british TV will probably find the first doctor hard to get through (though that first episode is enjoyable to most fans).

My girlfriend and I are watching classic Star Trek right now, so I'm in the 60s mood anyway. Just after Season 5 of nuWho I watched the wonderful TV movie "An Adventure in Space and Time" which made me curious about classic Doctor Who.

 The first few seasons are even more slow paced and low budget than Trek. It's more as if you're watching a play. They didn't cut or do reshoots unless they really had to (the entire set falls down, an actor curses, etc). So you'll see people slip up on their lines or repeat them, little stumbles here and there, the occasional set wobble. All part of the charm. :)

 Videotape was expensive (one factor in old episodes being erased) and video editing in post really didn't exist yet. It boggles my mind that videotape was sometimes spliced with a razor blade and glued together in the early days.

The behind the scenes stuff on the Hartnell era DVD's makes one appreciate how technically complex some stories were to pull off, essentially doing them like a "live" show.

To think I used to stress out over doing a simple three camera talk show back in college!

 It's true that editing was limited. But things were certainly spliced together and/or reshot. They had occasional on location shots for Hartnell (Dalek Invasion, Reign of Terror). My understanding is that the reshoots didn't happen due to being on an extremely tight time schedule. Setting everything up again took a lot of time, and going over the scheduled end time was extremely expensive. 

 They shot film when on location, (standard for nearly all BBC shows well into the 80's) so that allowed for retakes, and some editing before transferring it to tape.

I've heard about the dreaded countdown clock of studio time remaining, and the frenetic efforts to beat it.

SilverWook said:

towne32 said:

TK-949 said:

towne32 said:

TK-949 said:


Currently I'm watching Torchwood as well as the first episodes of classic Doctor Who.

 People who don't enjoy classic british TV will probably find the first doctor hard to get through (though that first episode is enjoyable to most fans).

My girlfriend and I are watching classic Star Trek right now, so I'm in the 60s mood anyway. Just after Season 5 of nuWho I watched the wonderful TV movie "An Adventure in Space and Time" which made me curious about classic Doctor Who.

 The first few seasons are even more slow paced and low budget than Trek. It's more as if you're watching a play. They didn't cut or do reshoots unless they really had to (the entire set falls down, an actor curses, etc). So you'll see people slip up on their lines or repeat them, little stumbles here and there, the occasional set wobble. All part of the charm. :)

 Videotape was expensive (one factor in old episodes being erased) and video editing in post really didn't exist yet. It boggles my mind that videotape was sometimes spliced with a razor blade and glued together in the early days.

The behind the scenes stuff on the Hartnell era DVD's makes one appreciate how technically complex some stories were to pull off, essentially doing them like a "live" show.

To think I used to stress out over doing a simple three camera talk show back in college!

 I suspect part of it was that the BBC just had really antiquated equipment and almost no money. (Not to mention a production crew that came out of radio, rather than film.)

After all, only one year after the first episode of Doctor Who, Gene Roddenberry in the US was able to make "The Cage," which is quite complex in terms of editing, and still fairly visually impressive.

ATMachine said:

SilverWook said:

towne32 said:

TK-949 said:

towne32 said:

TK-949 said:


Currently I'm watching Torchwood as well as the first episodes of classic Doctor Who.

 People who don't enjoy classic british TV will probably find the first doctor hard to get through (though that first episode is enjoyable to most fans).

My girlfriend and I are watching classic Star Trek right now, so I'm in the 60s mood anyway. Just after Season 5 of nuWho I watched the wonderful TV movie "An Adventure in Space and Time" which made me curious about classic Doctor Who.

 The first few seasons are even more slow paced and low budget than Trek. It's more as if you're watching a play. They didn't cut or do reshoots unless they really had to (the entire set falls down, an actor curses, etc). So you'll see people slip up on their lines or repeat them, little stumbles here and there, the occasional set wobble. All part of the charm. :)

 Videotape was expensive (one factor in old episodes being erased) and video editing in post really didn't exist yet. It boggles my mind that videotape was sometimes spliced with a razor blade and glued together in the early days.

The behind the scenes stuff on the Hartnell era DVD's makes one appreciate how technically complex some stories were to pull off, essentially doing them like a "live" show.

To think I used to stress out over doing a simple three camera talk show back in college!

 I suspect part of it was that the BBC just had really antiquated equipment and almost no money. (Not to mention a production crew that came out of radio, rather than film.)

After all, only one year after the first episode of Doctor Who, Gene Roddenberry in the US was able to make "The Cage," which is quite complex in terms of editing, and still fairly visually impressive.

 The Cage was shot and edited entirely on 35mm film. It also reportedly cost over $600,000 to produce, a hefty sum for a tv pilot at the time.

True. But at least it could be edited. Didn't the BBC have ludicrously antiquated cameras that only allowed you to halt filming four times or so per setup?

I have absolutely no faith in Series 9 being any good whatsoever. I think I'd much prefer to watch the classic series instead. Then again, with everything that's happened so far, it's going to take a lot of butter to get me back in the pan...

Tobar said:

I'm about two thirds of the way through the Fifth Doctor. John Nathan-Turner's run of the show continues to get worse as the series goes on. Sad to see such a great show on the decline. =(

 Yes I remember that was a very sad time. I was so into the show during that time period too. That was when I was rubbing elbows with JNT during his American visits to promote the show on The New Jersey Network. 

ATMachine said:

True. But at least it could be edited. Didn't the BBC have ludicrously antiquated cameras that only allowed you to halt filming four times or so per setup?

 Stopping tape doesn't require turning the cameras off. I imagine they could overheat if you ran them all day, but in the range of a normal studio session they shouldn't be a problem.

I had the misfortune of using 1970's tube cameras in college, (because the studio was built in 1975, and not used until the mid 80's) and they did require "warming up" and a lot of tweaking. They were replaced with modern chip sensor cameras the moment I graduated of course. ;)

SilverWook said:

ATMachine said:

True. But at least it could be edited. Didn't the BBC have ludicrously antiquated cameras that only allowed you to halt filming four times or so per setup?

 Stopping tape doesn't require turning the cameras off. I imagine they could overheat if you ran them all day, but in the range of a normal studio session they shouldn't be a problem.

I had the misfortune of using 1970's tube cameras in college, (because the studio was built in 1975, and not used until the mid 80's) and they did require "warming up" and a lot of tweaking. They were replaced with modern chip sensor cameras the moment I graduated of course. ;)

I may have misremembered the bit about the cameras having to be halted, I confess.

They still could barely edit the program, however., since unlike with Star Trek, the Beeb filmed Doctor Who on videotape. The tape editing equipment then was so primitive that they had to film virtually every scene in sequence.

So the editing team had very little ability to go back and re-shoot sequences that "didn't work" or in which somebody flubbed a line. That stuff tended to get left in.

This also bespeaks a larger "show must go on" mentality -- the legacy of the BBC's origins in radio and stage drama (vs. the American TV networks which mainly grew out of Hollywood.)

You're forgetting a lot of classic American tv shows were based on popular radio programs. I Love Lucy being a prime example. NBC and CBS were radio networks well before television.

The American gothic soap opera Dark Shadows' on air goofs are just as infamous as Who.

Not quite complete, The Underwater Menace is finally getting a DVD release this year. ;)

I finished the classic series a month or two ago, and am currently listening to Big Finish audios, mostly of the eighth doctor (mainly to fill the gaps in between Seven and Nine). Not that the audio drama format is my favorite though. Pity there aren't any animated or narrated versions of the audio dramas.

As for which doctor is the best, I'm not sure I think like that. I see each doctor as a fragment of the same person, and it's hard to compare one doctor to the other. If I wanted to make comparisons, it would be more toward the eras rather than the doctors themselves.

The First doctor era, and to a lesser extent the Second, had enjoyable moments, but for the most part were very slow.

The pace that the Third doctor era has would be carried over for most of the rest of the show. While I liked many of the Pertwee serials, I wasn't a big fan of the big usage of the Obstructive Buracrat trope, and find Season 7 as a whole overrated because of it.

I look at the Fourth doctor era, like many, as 3 different eras: Gothic Horror, Comedy, and Hard Sci-Fi. Each period had strengths and weaknesses. When I first saw Tom Baker's performance in "Robot", I wasn't sure whether I would like the fourth doctor or not. It took me a few more serials before I felt comfortable with his doctor, similar to how I saw Hartnell and Colin Baker for the first time. Of Tom Baker's seven seasons, I think Season 16 is the weakest, but at least it had "City of Death".

The fifth doctor era is probably the last where consistently good stories were written, though it had it's own problems. "Warriors of the Deep" probably foreshadowed how bad stories would get in the next few seasons.

I wasn't sure I'd be comfortable with the sixth doctor after That Moment in "The Twin Dillema". As bad as that serial was as an introduction to Colin Bakers incarnation as well as bad as a whole, it still had a couple decent moments. The worst sixth doctor serial, possibly the worst doctor who serial as a whole, is "Timelash", which made my eyes bleed a minute or two of watching. Season 22 did produce some enjoyable serials, like "Vengence on Varos", "The Two Doctors", and "Attack of the Cybermen". "Mark of the Rani" was bad, but Whoflix made it a little easier to swallow. I wasn't the biggest fan of "Revelation of the Daleks", though to be fair it's the most competent Davros has ever been since Genesis. Season 23 is one which I saw entirely in Whoflix form. Of the Whoflix Trial serials, I enjoyed Mind Warp.

I really wasn't a fan of how Season 24 did things. "Time and the Rani" is just garbage, probably the worst introductory serial in Doctor Who history. It was just painful to look at. "Paradise Towers" and "Delta and the Bannerman" both had interesting ideas, but were harmed by the silly presentation. "Dragonfire" is probably the best Season 24 serial, hinting at the better serials of the next two seasons. "Remembrence of the Daleks" is fun to watch, the only problem is the special effects, which seem more dated than older serials. I didn't really care for "The Happiness Patrol" and "Silver Nemesis". "Greatest show in the Galaxy" was really good though. "Battlefield" wasn't great, but it was nice to see the Brigadier make one final appearence in Classic Doctor Who. "Ghost-Light" and "Survival" were very confusing serials that made little effort to explain what's going on. Finally, "The Curse of Fenric" is a great serial, except for the ending. I'm not going to spoil it, but sometimes it makes me wonder how Ace could forgive the Doctor so easily. In case you couldn't tell, I didn't really care for Seven's era.

Eight...had his opening and his ending, and I'm not ready to watch his ending. Who though that the TV Movie would be a good introduction to Doctor Who as a whole? It confused me a little, and I saw most of the classic series beforehand.

Well, that's my opinion of the classic doctor's eras :P

I WILL NOT DIE!

...TO ELEVATOR MUSIC!

Tobar said:

They had multiple X-rays that they purposefully disregarded and then completely ignored their patient's pleas that he had special medical needs.

To be fair, I think that's a reference to the first Pertwee story. From what I can remember, the doctors in the hospital that take care of Pertwee dismiss the x-Ray as a double exposure, and are baffled by a sample of his blood (it's too sticky or something). Then again I could be remembering that bit from the novelisation by Terrance Dicks, which my dad would read to me when I was little.

Still doesn't excuse the Doctors in the 1996 special from being woefully incompetent though.

http://www.doctorwhonews.net/2015/09/whatever-happened-to-web-of-fear-3.html