Sign In

Despecialized V 4K77: Dawn of Justice — Page 2

Author
Time
 (Edited)

DB2 said:

towne32 said:

SnooPac said:

DB2 said:

Thanks. I’m going to take a look at the 4K77 DNR 1080p version. It sounds like there are different versions with different color timings (Rob, Sanjuro, etc.)?

One see out there is “STAR-WARS-4K77-180p-DNR-001209.$K77.1080p.DNR.35mm.x264-v1.0.nfo-yEnc”

I believe that’s Rob’s release which uses Sanjuro’s colours.
Rob also made a version 1.1 of the same thing (I don’t remember what was wrong with 1.0).

Then there’s a different version labeled 1.2. It’s done by someone else other than Rob (SkyDude) that is also using Sanjuro’s colours, but with some difference in the DNR process.

Not sure if either 1.1 or 1.2 are available on newsgroups…

Don’t quote me on any of that, I could be wrong. But that’s how I understand it.

(I’ve quoted you on that. You may be thinking of 4K83 where Rob was able to use Sanjuro’s grade on the DNR version)

IIRC, Sanjuro’s colors are great, but due to the work flow, not easily applied to the DNR version. Rob’s DNR version has his own color grading. It is maybe not as consistent as Sanjuro’s (which is very professional looking), but it’s a much more neutral grading than the very first release no-DNR. The first release had very heavy tints that people sometimes are after for these technicolor type gradings (like Harmy’s 2.5). That first grade is not my cup of tea, but both Sanjuro’s grade and Rob’s DNR grade are excellent.

So is the 1.0 I noted above Rob’s which uses Sanjuro’s colors?

For 4K77? I guess I wasn’t as clear as I intended to be. What I’m trying to say is that there is no DNR version of Rob’s that uses Sanjuro’s colors (if I’m not mistaken). There was:

The original no-DNR 4K release. It’s graded very minimally and a bit of a ‘refined’ taste in terms of color.

Rob’s DNR version. He also removed the reel change markers. He graded it himself. It generally looks great, even if it’s not necessarily perfect. It’s 1000x better than the previous color in my very biased opinion. I think there’s only one version of this, though the ISO fixes some subtitle sync.

Sanjuro then had a number of color grading versions of the no-DNR version (1.1-1.4). It will take a lot of manual effort, as I understand it, to apply them to a DNR version. I don’t believe that has been done.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

towne32 said:

DB2 said:

towne32 said:

SnooPac said:

DB2 said:

Thanks. I’m going to take a look at the 4K77 DNR 1080p version. It sounds like there are different versions with different color timings (Rob, Sanjuro, etc.)?

One see out there is “STAR-WARS-4K77-180p-DNR-001209.$K77.1080p.DNR.35mm.x264-v1.0.nfo-yEnc”

I believe that’s Rob’s release which uses Sanjuro’s colours.
Rob also made a version 1.1 of the same thing (I don’t remember what was wrong with 1.0).

Then there’s a different version labeled 1.2. It’s done by someone else other than Rob (SkyDude) that is also using Sanjuro’s colours, but with some difference in the DNR process.

Not sure if either 1.1 or 1.2 are available on newsgroups…

Don’t quote me on any of that, I could be wrong. But that’s how I understand it.

(I’ve quoted you on that. You may be thinking of 4K83 where Rob was able to use Sanjuro’s grade on the DNR version)

IIRC, Sanjuro’s colors are great, but due to the work flow, not easily applied to the DNR version. Rob’s DNR version has his own color grading. It is maybe not as consistent as Sanjuro’s (which is very professional looking), but it’s a much more neutral grading than the very first release no-DNR. The first release had very heavy tints that people sometimes are after for these technicolor type gradings (like Harmy’s 2.5). That first grade is not my cup of tea, but both Sanjuro’s grade and Rob’s DNR grade are excellent.

So is the 1.0 I noted above Rob’s which uses Sanjuro’s colors?

For 4K77? I guess I wasn’t as clear as I intended to be. What I’m trying to say is that there is no DNR version of Rob’s that uses Sanjuro’s colors (if I’m not mistaken). There was:

The original no-DNR 4K release. It’s graded very minimally and a bit of a ‘refined’ taste in terms of color.

Rob’s DNR version. He also removed the reel change markers. He graded it himself. It generally looks great, even if it’s not necessarily perfect. It’s 1000x better than the previous color in my very biased opinion. I think there’s only one version of this, though the ISO fixes some subtitle sync.

Sanjuro then had a number of color grading versions of the no-DNR version (1.1-1.4). It will take a lot of manual effort, as I understand it, to apply them to a DNR version. I don’t believe that has been done.

Cool. I’ll get to take a look at the 1.0 DNR version probably tomorrow…or late tonight. I want to try and watch Empire despecialized tonight if I can.

It was very cool to see the despecialized Star Wars the other night. Felt so authentic for a change. The audio was impressive on it too.

Man, I suffered with the 2004 DVDs and 2011 BDs for waaayy too long. I could never watch all of the GOUT DVD as the PQ bothered me too much. But the small number of clips used for the despecialized was fine.

But all of this is really great stuff.

Author
Time

4K77 version 1.0 is NOT Sanjuro’s grade. The no-DNR 1.0 is white balanced to the sprocket holes.

4K77 no-DNR v1.4 has Sanjuro’s grade and a new scan of the opening crawl (1.0 used the SSE crawl upscaled from 1080p).

The DNR versions of 4K77 all have an entirely different color grade by williarob, in addition to some more cleanup than the no-DNR. The MKV versions use the SSE crawl upscaled from 1080p, and the Blu-Ray version uses the new 4K scan of the crawl.

This is all for SW. For ROTJ/4K83, Sanjuro’s grade is v1.1 for the no-DNR release, and v1.1 or v1.2 for the DNR release (v1.2 being SkyDude’s DNR settings and the basis for the v1.2 Blu-Ray release). All ROTJ v1.0s were graded by ohteedee if I’m not mistaken.

a trolling bantha

Author
Time

towne32 said:

SnooPac said:

DB2 said:

Thanks. I’m going to take a look at the 4K77 DNR 1080p version. It sounds like there are different versions with different color timings (Rob, Sanjuro, etc.)?

One see out there is “STAR-WARS-4K77-180p-DNR-001209.$K77.1080p.DNR.35mm.x264-v1.0.nfo-yEnc”

I believe that’s Rob’s release which uses Sanjuro’s colours.
Rob also made a version 1.1 of the same thing (I don’t remember what was wrong with 1.0).

Then there’s a different version labeled 1.2. It’s done by someone else other than Rob (SkyDude) that is also using Sanjuro’s colours, but with some difference in the DNR process.

Not sure if either 1.1 or 1.2 are available on newsgroups…

Don’t quote me on any of that, I could be wrong. But that’s how I understand it.

(I’ve quoted you on that. You may be thinking of 4K83 where Rob was able to use Sanjuro’s grade on the DNR version)

IIRC, Sanjuro’s colors are great, but due to the work flow, not easily applied to the DNR version. Rob’s DNR version has his own color grading. It is maybe not as consistent as Sanjuro’s (which is very professional looking), but it’s a much more neutral grading than the very first release no-DNR. The first release had very heavy tints that people sometimes are after for these technicolor type gradings (like Harmy’s 2.5). That first grade is not my cup of tea, but both Sanjuro’s grade and Rob’s DNR grade are excellent.

Damnit, don’t know how I misread that. Yes, I was thinking of 4k83.
Actually, to save face, I’ll assume that DB2 had it as 83, then edited after I posted my message 😛.

But thanks for the correction.

Author
Time

SnooPac said:

towne32 said:

SnooPac said:

DB2 said:

Thanks. I’m going to take a look at the 4K77 DNR 1080p version. It sounds like there are different versions with different color timings (Rob, Sanjuro, etc.)?

One see out there is “STAR-WARS-4K77-180p-DNR-001209.$K77.1080p.DNR.35mm.x264-v1.0.nfo-yEnc”

I believe that’s Rob’s release which uses Sanjuro’s colours.
Rob also made a version 1.1 of the same thing (I don’t remember what was wrong with 1.0).

Then there’s a different version labeled 1.2. It’s done by someone else other than Rob (SkyDude) that is also using Sanjuro’s colours, but with some difference in the DNR process.

Not sure if either 1.1 or 1.2 are available on newsgroups…

Don’t quote me on any of that, I could be wrong. But that’s how I understand it.

(I’ve quoted you on that. You may be thinking of 4K83 where Rob was able to use Sanjuro’s grade on the DNR version)

IIRC, Sanjuro’s colors are great, but due to the work flow, not easily applied to the DNR version. Rob’s DNR version has his own color grading. It is maybe not as consistent as Sanjuro’s (which is very professional looking), but it’s a much more neutral grading than the very first release no-DNR. The first release had very heavy tints that people sometimes are after for these technicolor type gradings (like Harmy’s 2.5). That first grade is not my cup of tea, but both Sanjuro’s grade and Rob’s DNR grade are excellent.

Damnit, don’t know how I misread that. Yes, I was thinking of 4k83.
Actually, to save face, I’ll assume that DB2 had it as 83, then edited after I posted my message 😛.

But thanks for the correction.

Snoopac, you know what they say about assumptions. 😃 I didn’t edit anything in that regard about 83.

Odd as I am not seeing anything other than 1.0 out there for 4K77 whether DNR or non DNR. Two different versions of 1.0 for 4K77 were missing files so no luck there. Hmmmm.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

DNR has 2 versions, that are identical in everything but the crawl:

  • the MKV has the upscaled 1080p SSE crawl.
  • the ISO has the 4K crawl.

But they’re essentially the same, same DNR settings, same color grade, same dirt and scratches, etc. They both utilize Williarob’s color grade. I’ll repeat what ChainsawAsh said: there are NO versions of 4K77 DNR with Sanjuro’s grade.

NoDNR has 2 versions as well, though they have more differences:

  • versions 1.0 (1080p & 4K) of the MKVs, the one released on May of last year. That has the original color grade which wasn’t really color corrected (mainly white balanced IIRC), and the 1080p SSE crawl.
  • versions 1.4 (1080p & 4K) of the MKVs, which have Sanjuro’s color grade and the 4K crawl.

I might’ve missed one thing or another but this is basically it.

Author
Time

Omni said:

DNR has 2 versions, that are identical in everything but the crawl:

  • the MKV has the upscaled 1080p SSE crawl.
  • the ISO has the 4K crawl.

But they’re essentially the same, same DNR settings, same color grade, same dirt and scratches, etc. They both utilize Williarob’s color grade. I’ll repeat what ChainsawAsh said: there are NO versions of 4K77 DNR with Sanjuro’s grade.

NoDNR has 2 versions as well, though they have more differences:

  • versions 1.0 (1080p & 4K) of the MKVs, the one released on May of last year. That has the original color grade which wasn’t really color corrected (mainly white balanced IIRC), and the 1080p SSE crawl.
  • versions 1.4 (1080p & 4K) of the MKVs, which have Sanjuro’s color grade and the 4K crawl.

I might’ve missed one thing or another but this is basically it.

Which of the 4K77 are your faves?

Author
Time

CatBus said:

GodMars said:

No one else has experienced crushed blacks and blown-out whites with 4K77?

Depends what you mean.

4K77 DNR suffers a complete loss of detail in areas of certain shots depending on the lighting, and scenes with any sort of brightness or darkness skew in those directions pretty heavily. This is on a calibrated 4K TV. I assume this is an issue with the source, but I’ve never seen anyone else mention it.

Author
Time

GodMars said:

CatBus said:

GodMars said:

No one else has experienced crushed blacks and blown-out whites with 4K77?

Depends what you mean.

4K77 DNR suffers a complete loss of detail in areas of certain shots depending on the lighting, and scenes with any sort of brightness or darkness skew in those directions pretty heavily. This is on a calibrated 4K TV. I assume this is an issue with the source, but I’ve never seen anyone else mention it.

I’ve noticed it. It’s one of the reasons I still prefer DeEd, even though I’ll be the first to admit Star Wars DeEd has some serious issues in its own right. Nobody brings it up likely because there’s not likely anything to be done about it, and it’s considered tolerable to some, and there are other preservations for those who don’t like it.

Also, you must keep this in mind – if the whites were blown out and blacks crushed in the theatrical showings, then 4K77 has done its job in reproducing the theatrical experience. Lower-contrast sources like negatives and IPs create a different “Blu-ray”-ish look that I (and likely you) prefer, but it may simply not be theatrically accurate.

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

Author
Time

Yeah, it’s a “sourced from a release print” thing. They got super lucky with the 4K83 print since it was (assuming I remember right) a show print that’s a couple generations closer to the negative than a release print would be, so it was A) rarely projected and thus in much better shape, and B) not nearly as contrasty, so you don’t have the crushed blacks or clipped whites that the 4K77 print has in some areas.

a trolling bantha

Author
Time

ChainsawAsh said:

Yeah, it’s a “sourced from a release print” thing. They got super lucky with the 4K83 print since it was (assuming I remember right) a show print that’s a couple generations closer to the negative than a release print would be, so it was A) rarely projected and thus in much better shape, and B) not nearly as contrasty, so you don’t have the crushed blacks or clipped whites that the 4K77 print has in some areas.

Yeah, the 4K83 print is simply stunning. I’ve only seen one print in better shape, and that’s (what I’ve seen of) Poita’s Empire print. Which is pretty good news on the Star Wars preservation front…

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)