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Compendium: PT references in OUT

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In this thread, I'd like for everyone to contribute any dialogue from the OUT alluding to events which took place in the PT era. I want to see what, if anything, mentioned by the characters in the OUT matches what took place on screen in the PT - and if what the character said could have been incorrect by interpretation, rather than by fact.

Obi-Wan, of course, is a treasure trove of information in SW:

"I haven't gone by the name 'Obi-Wan' since, oh, before you were born."

Not literally true, but basically true. When he goes into hiding, there are only a few people throughout the galaxy who know his real name, so I don't think this is contradictory.

"[The Force] is an energy field, created by all living things. It penetrates us, surrounds us, binds the galaxy together."

True. The omission of midichlorians in this description doesn't alter the nature of the Force.

"Your father wanted you to have this [lightsaber] when you were old enough, but your uncle wouldn't allow it."

!? Now, Obi-Wan describes Anakin as a good man, though we saw precious little evidence of this in the PT. But let's take OWK at his word - maybe Anakin's goodness didn't take place during screen time. I think that the good man Anakin Skywalker used to be would definitely have wanted his kid to have his old lightsaber. The only thing that cheapens this (again, referring back to the clumsy PT) is that apparently, the Jedi didn't put a whole lot of time and care into lightsabers; you need one, you just go get a new one. Had the crafting of a new lightsaber been portrayed as a big deal in the PT, then Luke receiving his father's lightsaber would have indeed been an honor; for all we know, this was a replacement unit from the back wall of the Jedi warehouse.

"[Uncle Owen] didn't hold your father's ideals - he thought he should have stayed behind and not gotten involved."

For that matter, Padme didn't hold Anakin's ideals - Anakin belived in the idea of a benevolent dictatorship. I know that isn't what OWK meant - he was, I think, literally describing Anakin as an idealist, which as portrayed he most certainly was not.

It sounds like a serious family conflict if Obi-Wan remembers it so well - almost as if it should have been shown in the PT...

Princess Leia refers to some recent galactic history:

(to Obi-Wan) "Years ago, you served my father in the Clone Wars."

Really? And was Bail Organa was a Jedi General? For all I saw, there wasn't a plurality of Clone Wars - just one. It's like WWI and II - yes, Germany was on one side and the US on the other (extremely simplified version here) in both cases, but no one would call those two distinct events The World War. Similarly, just because the Clone War took place for many years across several planets, one cannot call it "The Clone Wars". I'd like to call this factually incorrect information, but Princess Leia is a diplomat, a whip-smart one; I doubt she would be badly informed here. I therefore have to believe that the original conception of the Clone Wars was not a single war, but several.

From ESB,  Obi-Wan directs Luke to the Dagobah system:

"There you will learn from Yoda, the Jedi Master who instructed me."

Had he finished that sentence with "...when I was a youngling.", I have no problem with this.

Yoda and Obi-Wan discuss Luke's potential:

-"You are reckless!" (didn't he mean, "Reckless, are you!"?)

-"So was I, if you'll remember."

I don't remember even a hint of reckless Obi-Wan. He hated flying, he did everything he was told, he was unwaveringly loyal to the Jedi Order. Maybe Obi-Wan was remembering Qui-Gon's attitude as his own, but one would assume that a Force-ghost would have a rather good memory.

More to come, but this is a rather enormous wall of text already so I'll stop.

Want to book yourself or a guest on THE VFP Show? PM me!

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You basically have to go through the OT with the thought that everything Obi-wan says is a lie, even when he's telling the truth.

It's terrible that the movies had to come to that, but that's the way it is.

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I seem to see less contradictions in these lines than you do.  

"Your father wanted you to have this [lightsaber] when you were old enough, but your uncle wouldn't allow it."

Obi does say "this weapon is your life." to Anakin, and though they both got spare lightsabers in AOTC's climax, it's still not unreasonable to think lightsabers are plenty important. Mace has a custom one, as does Dooku.

Obi-Wan is also lying a great deal to Luke about Luke's past. This is probably partly because he's ashamed of his own role in what happened, and partly to protect Luke. it's one thing to learn your a Jedi, it's another the same afternoon to learn your dad is like, the worst person in the galaxy. Maybe Obi would have told the truth had he survived the Death Star.

"[Uncle Owen] didn't hold your father's ideals - he thought he should have stayed behind and not gotten involved."

Obi lying. See above.

Princess Leia refers to some recent galactic history:

(to Obi-Wan) "Years ago, you served my father in the Clone Wars."

Considering all of the seperate conflicts, political ramifications, culteres and governmental bodeis involved, I don't see why pluralizing "Clone Wars" would be totally unexpected. It happed in the Indian Wars of US History.

Obi-Wan does say his loyallty is to the Senate... to Democracy! So it's also not totally unreasonable to say he served Bail Organa, especially given that the entirety of the war takes place off screen, who's to say he didn't serve him specifically at points.

From ESB,  Obi-Wan directs Luke to the Dagobah system:

"There you will learn from Yoda, the Jedi Master who instructed me."

"Mrs. Iglesias is the teacher who instructed me." That's true. I don't see why I need to add "...when I was in 3rd grade." Especially when I'm talking to someone dying in the snow.

 Yoda and Obi-Wan discuss Luke's potential:

-"You are reckless!" (didn't he mean, "Reckless, are you!"?)

-"So was I, if you'll remember."

We never saw Obi when he was younger than 20 or so. He might very well have been wreckless, especially when he was a wee lad in Yoda's tutelage. Even at 20 he had a bit of attitude to QuiGon.

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"[Uncle Owen] didn't hold your father's ideals - he thought he should have stayed behind and not gotten involved."

Theres some good info about Owen Lars at the Star Wars.com Databank:

http://www.starwars.com/databank/character/owenlars/index.html

 

Apparently Owen thought Anakin should have stayed with his mother on Tatooine and not gotten involved with the Republic or the Jedi because of the affect Owen seen on his step-mother Shimi of being without Anakin. An older Owen did not want to see Luke leave Tatooine and possibly become a Jedi like his father because Owen feared that Luke may suffer the same fate as Anakin did. Also the Databank entry confirms an EU incident between Owen and Obi-Wan over young Luke, So I guess this confirms why Luke (in Episode 4) knows a Ben Kenobi but not an Obi-Wan Kenobi.

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R2-918 said:

"[Uncle Owen] didn't hold your father's ideals - he thought he should have stayed behind and not gotten involved."

Theres some good info about Owen Lars at the Star Wars.com Databank:

http://www.starwars.com/databank/character/owenlars/index.html

 

Apparently Owen thought Anakin should have stayed with his mother on Tatooine and not gotten involved with the Republic or the Jedi because of the affect Owen seen on his step-mother Shimi of being without Anakin.

Well that nice.  Too bad Owen's thoughts aren't actually in the film and we need 3rd party source to clarify that.

 

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Sluggo said:
R2-918 said:

"[Uncle Owen] didn't hold your father's ideals - he thought he should have stayed behind and not gotten involved."

Theres some good info about Owen Lars at the Star Wars.com Databank:

http://www.starwars.com/databank/character/owenlars/index.html

 

Apparently Owen thought Anakin should have stayed with his mother on Tatooine and not gotten involved with the Republic or the Jedi because of the affect Owen seen on his step-mother Shimi of being without Anakin.

Well that nice.  Too bad Owen's thoughts aren't actually in the film and we need 3rd party source to clarify that.

I always thought there was some kind of big blowup between Owen and Obi-Wan offscreen, I imagined Obi-Wan bringing Anakin's Lightsaber to give too a young Luke but Owen refused and ran Obi-Wan off and told him to leave Luke alone and never come back. It would have been funny if Obi-Wan waved his hand at Owen and said "you will let me give Luke this Lightsaber" Owen: "I will let you give the Lightsaber to Luke." Obi-Wan: "oh, by the way you will let me sleep with Beru"

 

 

 

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yeah Beru is quite the GILF.

 

but there's nothing that indicates that Obi-Wan lies about anything else except Vader.

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How about Lucas was making it all up as he went and Obi Wan in Star Wars 1977 did not lie.  At that point Vader and Luke's father were two seperate characters and Leia was not the sister.

Plus Lucas can decide on something then change it years later.  Originally Obi Wan was owen's brother.  What Anakin's relation to Owen and kenobi is not known or destribed in the Return of the Jedi novelization.  But that same novelization also puts the Kibosh on Leia's mother dieing right when she was just born.

Yoda was originally obi wans teacher and not as the prequels crap all over the concept, neither were there characters like Maul, jar jar or qui gon.  There is no frickin midi chlorians this is just bad form of returning back to quantifying the force remember the Kiber crystal?

Also very bad idea since Lucas got the idea from mitochrondria.  Star Wars is space fantasy not science fiction.  If it was really science fiction well it would be science friction,lol.

It would be like trying to use plausible science to explain Eastern Mysticism, or the very basic form of meta physical new age spriitualism.

 

There are already a lot of retcons in the original trilogy between the films without the prequels having to add allsorts of stupid ones that make zero sense and actually make more questions than they answer.

The Emporer as an original concept and in the star wars novelization as well as in empire strikes back is a more mystery man behind the curtain wizard of oz type character than the cackling maniac in jedi.

In fact its not really described and may have been one of Alan Dean Fosters additions but the emperor may have been a victim as well, he was controlled by the very assistants and bootlickers who got him on the throne.   They through fear and treachery had the jedi killed.  Sounds more like Rome than star wars imperials.

Vader as originally written comes off as an Evil Ronin Samurai.  Or maybe one of the Knights Templar who went bad.

Oh and the reckless younger days of Kenobi were relocated to the EU junior novels jedi apprentice series.

Kind of like how to experience the full clone wars which were not told on screen you needed the comics the video games, the novels  and now 2 very contracdictory cartoons series.

Such cross media was not done since shadows of the empire and was done again with the force unleashed.

Too bad in recent years Lucasfilm products leave a lot to be desired, i remember when their games devision was second to none and when they made good films.

Now Star Wars and Indiana Jones are just a giant empire of merchandising without any other thought than making money.

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"Your father wanted you to have this [lightsaber] when you were old enough, but your uncle wouldn't allow it."

!? Now, Obi-Wan describes Anakin as a good man, though we saw precious little evidence of this in the PT. But let's take OWK at his word - maybe Anakin's goodness didn't take place during screen time. I think that the good man Anakin Skywalker used to be would definitely have wanted his kid to have his old lightsaber.

Yeah, but Obi Wan didn't say Anakin WOULD have wanted him to have the lightsaber. He said Anakin WANTED him to have it. And that's not the case. Anakin got chopped up and fried and Kenobi stole his lightsaber. No "Obi, give my lightsaber to my son." Until Anakin was messed up on Mustarfart he was using the lightsaber, not wanting it to be given to his son. And Kenobi took it, he wasn't given it for Luke. Anakin didn't even know he had a son. So this is a case of prequel revisionism, or of the Lucas just totally disregarding what was in the OT.

The description of Anakin as a good man could have been just Kenobi lying like he did about Vader killing Anakin (which only became a lie when Lucas changed Vader from Anakin's killer into the same guy), but looking at the OT, it gives you the impression that Anakin was a good man until he turned dark. Sure, the Vader-Anakin thing proves Kenobi can lie, but since that lie only came about because Lucas changed the story between ANH and ESB, I don't think we should go assume Kenobi was meant to be lying all over the place. I think we were supposed to get the impression that Kenobi was telling the truth about Anakin when he called him a good man. And then Lucas came along and revised the story and made Anakin a pain in the butt jerk. I think Lucas totally changed the personality he'd envisioned for Anakin.

TheBoost said:

Obi-Wan is also lying a great deal to Luke about Luke's past. This is probably partly because he's ashamed of his own role in what happened, and partly to protect Luke. it's one thing to learn your a Jedi, it's another the same afternoon to learn your dad is like, the worst person in the galaxy. Maybe Obi would have told the truth had he survived the Death Star.

He only lied about Anakin and Vader being two different people and Vader killing Anakin. And since that lie was not originally intended to be a lie and only became one when Lucas changed the story in the late 70s, I don't think we have reason to go assuming Kenobi is lying all over the place. And if the prequels are supposed to make us think Kenobi was lying all the time in the OT, then Lucas has turned Kenobi into a pathological liar, what a sad warping of a good character.

"[Uncle Owen] didn't hold your father's ideals - he thought he should have stayed behind and not gotten involved."

Obi lying. See above.

We're not given any reason in the OT to think it's a lie and I don't think it was intended to be a lie. It's not Obi lying, it's Lucas ignoring the OT.

Obi-Wan does say his loyallty is to the Senate... to Democracy! So it's also not totally unreasonable to say he served Bail Organa, especially given that the entirety of the war takes place off screen, who's to say he didn't serve him specifically at points.

Oh come on. It's pretty clear that that "you served my father thing" is evidence of things being envisioned differently when the OT was made. You can make excuses for it and try to explain it away, but really it sticks out as not sounding right when you compare it with the events of the OT. It sounds like Kenobi's regular position for the clone wars in general was as a general serving Bail Organa specifically. Not as a general serving the senate of which Bail Organa was a member, with possibly some period of direct service to Organa.

"There you will learn from Yoda, the Jedi Master who instructed me."

"Mrs. Iglesias is the teacher who instructed me." That's true. I don't see why I need to add "...when I was in 3rd grade." Especially when I'm talking to someone dying in the snow.

The way Obi Wan puts it implies Yoda was his sole or primary teacher. Obi Wan also says he wrongly thought he could teach Anakin as well as Yoda could, as if Jedi were otherwise normally taught by Yoda and Kenobi trying to teach Anakin was arrogant and foolish. As if the other option to Kenobi training Anakin was Yoda training him and as if a Jedi other than Yoda training Jedi was not normally the done thing. Yes you can rationalize it as not being too at odds with the prequels, but what it implies (and what was undoubtably originally intended) is indeed at oddds with the prequels. Not to mention the whole scenario it suggests of Kenobi spontaneously getting it into his head to train Anakin and going off and doing so independently is at odds with the prequels.

R2-918 said:

"[Uncle Owen] didn't hold your father's ideals - he thought he should have stayed behind and not gotten involved."

Theres some good info about Owen Lars at the Star Wars.com Databank:

http://www.starwars.com/databank/character/owenlars/index.html

 

Apparently Owen thought Anakin should have stayed with his mother on Tatooine and not gotten involved with the Republic or the Jedi because of the affect Owen seen on his step-mother Shimi of being without Anakin. An older Owen did not want to see Luke leave Tatooine and possibly become a Jedi like his father because Owen feared that Luke may suffer the same fate as Anakin did. Also the Databank entry confirms an EU incident between Owen and Obi-Wan over young Luke, So I guess this confirms why Luke (in Episode 4) knows a Ben Kenobi but not an Obi-Wan Kenobi.

 

Not all of that is in the databank entry as far as I can see. I think you're reading into it a bit. But of the part of that that IS in the databank entry, a significant part of it is in the expanded universe part of the entry, which probably means it was invented by some writer who wasn't involved in the films. Plus it was undoubtably written around the time AOTC and ROTS came out (or after) and long after the time the OT was made. I doubt much, if any, of what you list above was in Lucas's original backstory. At best it sounds like an attempt to fit the PT into the OT story after the fact. And let's remember that during the making of ROTJ Lucas decided to make Owen into Ben's brother (see the Annotated Screenplays), which made it into the novelization.

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Obviously Yoda was originally intended to be Obi-Wan's master and Lucas messed it with Qui-Gon and had to retcon it all with the flimsy "Ah, but Yoda was his Kindergarden teacher" BS. No sense in defending it. It is lousy storytelling defined.

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vote_for_palpatine said:

Let me set this straght here.

Obi-Wan, of course, is a treasure trove of information in SW:

"I haven't gone by the name 'Obi-Wan' since, oh, before you were born."

Not literally true, but basically true. When he goes into hiding, there are only a few people throughout the galaxy who know his

real name, so I don't think this is contradictory. << OKAY

"[The Force] is an energy field, created by all living things. It penetrates us, surrounds us, binds the galaxy together."

True. The omission of midichlorians in this description doesn't alter the nature of the Force. << AGAIN OK

"Your father wanted you to have this [lightsaber] when you were old enough, but your uncle wouldn't allow it."

A jedi, upon knighthood, is given the choice to create his or her own lightsaber. A lightsaber being handed down to a padawan

from a jedi knight is an honor. And OWK was prolly right, Anakin would've wanted luke to have it. And if you think its not the same

one, recall after the duel in revenge of the sith, OWK picks up anakins saber before he walks away.

"[Uncle Owen] didn't hold your father's ideals - he thought he should have stayed behind and not gotten involved."

For that matter, Padme didn't hold Anakin's ideals - Anakin belived in the idea of a benevolent dictatorship. <<Correct, but uncle

owen would feel that way about anakin after he met him for that first time. and i'm sure he thought anakin was stupid to abandon

his mother for the jedi order. owen saw her lifestyle and prolly thought he should have stayed and took care of her.

 

Princess Leia refers to some recent galactic history:

(to Obi-Wan) "Years ago, you served my father in the Clone Wars."

Bail organa was a senator. he , like padme, were one of the senators who were against the war and all the chancelor's proposals.

He kept in close contact with the Jedi Order as he saw them as the only form of gov't not corrupted. why wouldn't he help Organa

in the war? He doesn't necesarily have to be a Jedi general.

From ESB,  Obi-Wan directs Luke to the Dagobah system:

"There you will learn from Yoda, the Jedi Master who instructed me."

I don't see what problem you have with this. Yoda trained OWK for a few years until Qui-Gon reached knighthood. then, i'm sure

yoda taught him more. Here's a reference of the Phantom Menace, "But master yoda told me to be mindful of the future,".

Yoda and Obi-Wan discuss Luke's potential:

-"You are reckless!" (didn't he mean, "Reckless, are you!"?)

-"So was I, if you'll remember."

I understand wat you mean with the firstpart, but OWK prolly was reckless before knighthood. as a padawan he prolly was a screw up and tried things on his own. Not to mention OWK went against all the Jedi and the code to protect Anakin from being expelled from the order.

 

 

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 And OWK was prolly right, Anakin would've wanted luke to have it. And if you think its not the same

But Kenobi didn't say Anakin would have wanted him to have it. He said Anakin WANTED him to have it. There's a difference. Kenobi's statement implies Anakin asked Kenobi to give the lightsaber to Luke, which just plain didn't happen.

Bail organa was a senator. he , like padme, were one of the senators who were against the war and all the chancelor's proposals.

He kept in close contact with the Jedi Order as he saw them as the only form of gov't not corrupted. why wouldn't he help Organa

in the war? He doesn't necesarily have to be a Jedi general.

But Leia didn't say Kenobi "helped" Organa in the war. She said he "served" Organa, which implies a situation a bit different from what we saw in the prequels. You can rationalize it to make it work (like Kenobi served the senate not Organa usually but did special missions for Organa specifically), but it sticks out as a clue that Lucas envisioned things differently back when he made ANH.

I don't see what problem you have with this. Yoda trained OWK for a few years until Qui-Gon reached knighthood. then, i'm sure

yoda taught him more. Here's a reference of the Phantom Menace, "But master yoda told me to be mindful of the future,".

This has been addressed. The way Kenobi said it implied Yoda was Kenobi's primary teacher. It's clear that there is revision here. Qui Gon wasn't in the original backstory.

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The PT leaves us with basically three options:

1. Obi-Wan is lying about much that happened in the prequel-era. Some of this is understandable (Obi-Wan has a natural disinclination to tell Luke, "Your father was a whiny, bratty, creepy, immature sociopath who somehow managed to bungle up everything that the previous thousand generations had built and accomplished, and all of the evil and suffering in the universe is his fault." Or, "Your father would've wanted you to have this when you were old enough, provided he hadn't turned to the dark side, murdered children, choked your mother, and forced me to dismember him and leave him to burn to death in a pool of lava."), but some of Obi's other "lies" just don't make sense. The way he refers to Yoda as "the Jedi master who instrcuted me" seems incongruous with the depiction of Obi-Wan's training in the PT, but why would he lie about it? Seems pretty irrational to me. Likewise, as has been pointed out, Obi-Wan in the PT was anything but reckless...why would he lie about it, to Yoda of all people, the one person who really would know one way or another?

2. Obi-Wan is remembering everything wrong. Senility has set in, and in order to cope with the troubles of the past, Obi-Wan has invented a fantasy history in which Anakin really was a good (though ultimately misguided) guy, he really did smilingly ask Obi-Wan to give Luke his lightsaber, Qui-Gon never existed (perhaps a defense mechanism to deal with the pain of losing his one father figure), and what stray memories of Anakin's recklessness have gotten through Obi's senility, he has reinterpreted to be his own recklnessness before reaching maturity. I admit this is a stretch, but I much prefer it to the "liar Obi-Wan" interpretation given above. Of course, the biggest problem with this is that Obi seems to misremember the past even as a Force Ghost. Do the effects of psychological trauma and repressed memory really continue to afflict a person after becoming "one with the force"? I'm inclined to say no, though I suppose it's not impossible.

3. The PT is an elaborate forgery, and Obi-Wan is right (save, of course, for the little white lie about Vader killing Anakin). Some meddling wannabe historian pieced together a hodge-podge representation of the history of the Clone Wars, and ended up getting a lot of details wrong. The PT should be disregarded when it clashes with the account of a credible eye-witness: Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Of course, I find option '3' the easiest to swallow, but it won't fly with TFNers. I don't really see any other way out, though. I'm perfectly happy to just write off the PT as poorly-written revisionist historical-fiction and consider "canon" only that which doesn't conflict with the OT...

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Akwat Kbrana said:

The PT leaves us with basically three options:

1. Obi-Wan is lying about much that happened in the prequel-era. Some of this is understandable (Obi-Wan has a natural disinclination to tell Luke, "Your father was a whiny, bratty, creepy, immature sociopath who somehow managed to bungle up everything that the previous thousand generations had built and accomplished, and all of the evil and suffering in the universe is his fault." Or, "Your father would've wanted you to have this when you were old enough, provided he hadn't turned to the dark side, murdered children, choked your mother, and forced me to dismember him and leave him to burn to death in a pool of lava."), but some of Obi's other "lies" just don't make sense. The way he refers to Yoda as "the Jedi master who instrcuted me" seems incongruous with the depiction of Obi-Wan's training in the PT, but why would he lie about it? Seems pretty irrational to me. Likewise, as has been pointed out, Obi-Wan in the PT was anything but reckless...why would he lie about it, to Yoda of all people, the one person who really would know one way or another?

2. Obi-Wan is remembering everything wrong. Senility has set in, and in order to cope with the troubles of the past, Obi-Wan has invented a fantasy history in which Anakin really was a good (though ultimately misguided) guy, he really did smilingly ask Obi-Wan to give Luke his lightsaber, Qui-Gon never existed (perhaps a defense mechanism to deal with the pain of losing his one father figure), and what stray memories of Anakin's recklessness have gotten through Obi's senility, he has reinterpreted to be his own recklnessness before reaching maturity. I admit this is a stretch, but I much prefer it to the "liar Obi-Wan" interpretation given above. Of course, the biggest problem with this is that Obi seems to misremember the past even as a Force Ghost. Do the effects of psychological trauma and repressed memory really continue to afflict a person after becoming "one with the force"? I'm inclined to say no, though I suppose it's not impossible.

3. The PT is an elaborate forgery, and Obi-Wan is right (save, of course, for the little white lie about Vader killing Anakin). Some meddling wannabe historian pieced together a hodge-podge representation of the history of the Clone Wars, and ended up getting a lot of details wrong. The PT should be disregarded when it clashes with the account of a credible eye-witness: Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Of course, I find option '3' the easiest to swallow, but it won't fly with TFNers. I don't really see any other way out, though. I'm perfectly happy to just write off the PT as poorly-written revisionist historical-fiction and consider "canon" only that which doesn't conflict with the OT...

I like all of you ideas, but 2 made me LOL.  Great thinking!

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Akwat Kbrana said:

Of course, I find option '3' the easiest to swallow, but it won't fly with TFNers. I don't really see any other way out, though. I'm perfectly happy to just write off the PT as poorly-written revisionist historical-fiction and consider "canon" only that which doesn't conflict with the OT...

 

 I wonder if the TFNers ever complain about OTdotcomers?

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I always figured we were a small and forgotton fringe of Star Wars fandom. The idea that mainstream fans notice us an complain about us is exciting. But I can hardly imagine it to be any sort of a reality.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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If mainstream star wars fandom is the original versions being buried and destroyed and only available in sixteen year old laserdisc quality i want nothing to do with the mainstream.

The same people who back up Lucas on cutting up the original negative which is almost never done. 

 

I can only think of a couple other examples Like the oneg for the premiere cut of Metropolis being altered, or Goldfinger.

How much money did the original star wars trilogy make for Lucas? 

I mean we can't even get a barebones straight up transfer of an original print or whatever else is available as a source outside the original negative.  How Much would a bare bones transfer to dvd in anamorphic cost?

And if Lucas does not want to do he can still reap benefits from the profits if he gave it over to a film archive like AFI, or give it to criterion.

I am sure there are people all over the world who love the original films and would offer their Prefessional services for free to restore these films.  Get an archival print, dvd or blu ray made.

Lucas hates the originals imho, he hates them even more because people hated the prequels and special editions and will never allow them on any modern format in anything approaching acceptable standards.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

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i won't comment. but yea, i bet we're one of the less known fan sites. far beyond the outer rim.
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-"You are reckless!"

-"So was I, if you'll remember."

Shoot me, for I'm about to cite the dreaded EU.  Obi-Wan almost wasn't chosen as a Padawan by anyone - heck, he even got sent off to work as a farm boy - because of his recklessness.  So there. :p

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Ahhhhhhhhh! *C3Px's head explodes*

 

Reading this whole thing is really annoying. PT information from the OT was pretty scarce. There were only a few plot points scattered throughout the trilogy that had to be taken into consideration while writing the PT, yet most of them were not. Now we seem to rely entirely on the EU and fanboyisms to explain these things. Does that seem right to you?

All Georgie had to do was watch his trilogy of films (or have one of his hired pawns do it for him) with a notebook in hand, and scribble down a quick note of everything that is mentioned about the past. Clearly he didn't do that. This single sheet list of plot points should have been constantly referred to during the writing process, and before the third script was finalized, every point should have had a check mark next to it indicating that it had been addressed or at least unscrewed with.

Just imagine how much different the shape of Star Wars fandom would be today. Even if I still didn't like the movies, even if the acting still sucked and much of the silliness remained intact, it'd be a lot harder to complain about them without any enjoyment hemmoraging plots holes riddling the things.

 

-Owen thought Obi-Wan was just a crazy old man

-served my father during the clone wars

-father's lightsaber, wanted you to have it when you were old enough

-Anakin was a good friend

etc.

Pretty simple stuff. All it would have taken. As they say, an ounce of prevention...

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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I think we have a hint in ROTS about Owen not liking very much Obi-Wan.

It's when Obi brings young Luke. Only Beru comes to Obi-Wan, then she brings the baby to Owen. He obviously did not want to talk with a Jedi.

Jedi are keepers of the justice, but they represent war from Owen's point of view.

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Ah, you are right, TMBTM. Owen's dislike of Jedi, Obi-Wan, etc., was clearly explained in that single abstract gesture.

The scene was ridiculous anyway.This young married couple are out enjoying their favorite past time of starting up at the sky while standing in their backyard, and suddenly out of the darkened desert a strange cloaked and hooded figure riding a retarded looking animal emerges. Instead of the gruff farmer man grabbing his rife and going to see what this cloaked figure wants, he sends his petite and delicate looking little wife to check it out while he continues to stare at the setting suns. The young woman approaches the cloaked and shadowy stranger, and he hands her a bundle of something. Oh! It's a little baby! Mommy was wrong! Babies don't come from storks! They come from shady looking men in cloaks mounted upon stupid looking beast of burden! She turns her back to the shadowy man and runs back to her husband. "Owen, Owen, look! All our efforts in trying various positions has finally paid off! I knew I wasn't barren!" "Beru, what are you talking about? Who was that dangerous looking figure who wandered in from the desert? What's that bundle you're holding?" "Oh... I have no idea who he was... But look! He brought us a baby!" "Oh, that's nice dear. Raise him as soon as you can, I am thinking of letting go of a few of our hired hands and need all the extra help I can get. My word Beru! This sunset is beautiful!"

 

 

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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C3PX said:

Ah, you are right, TMBTM. Owen's dislike of Jedi, Obi-Wan, etc., was clearly explained in that single abstract gesture.

The scene was ridiculous anyway.This young married couple are out enjoying their favorite past time of starting up at the sky while standing in their backyard, and suddenly out of the darkened desert a strange cloaked and hooded figure riding a retarded looking animal emerges. Instead of the gruff farmer man grabbing his rife and going to see what this cloaked figure wants, he sends his petite and delicate looking little wife to check it out while he continues to stare at the setting suns. The young woman approaches the cloaked and shadowy stranger, and he hands her a bundle of something. Oh! It's a little baby! Mommy was wrong! Babies don't come from storks! They come from shady looking men in cloaks mounted upon stupid looking beast of burden! She turns her back to the shadowy man and runs back to her husband. "Owen, Owen, look! All our efforts in trying various positions has finally paid off! I knew I wasn't barren!" "Beru, what are you talking about? Who was that dangerous looking figure who wandered in from the desert? What's that bundle you're holding?" "Oh... I have no idea who he was... But look! He brought us a baby!" "Oh, that's nice dear. Raise him as soon as you can, I am thinking of letting go of a few of our hired hands and need all the extra help I can get. My word Beru! This sunset is beautiful!"

 

 

 

 Mmm, maybe Obi-wan gave them a "phone call" before, don't you think? ;)

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I think Owen may have thought that Anakin should have stayed with him and Anakin's step-father and help them out with the moisture farm, after all Cliegg was married to Anakin's mother making Anakin a part of the Lars family and Cliegg even lost his leg looking for Shimi after the Sand People kidnapped her, Anakin could have been a big help for Cliegg and Owen on the farm.