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Censorship

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I dunno if we already have a thread for this. If so, I apologize. But I read this little bit on TheDigitalBits just now and had to post it here...
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Also today, there's a story up over at CNN.com on a new DVD player from RCA that uses ClearPlay software to censor "objectionable" material out of movies on disc. So, you know... if you're just dying to show your underage kids movies like (for example) Dawn of the Dead, Last Tango in Paris or Natural Born Killers, but don't want them to see any naughty bits, this $70 piece of poo is right up your alley. MMmmmmm... makes me feel all warm and fuzzy and safe inside! Any guesses as to where you can buy this player? Yep... Wal-Mart, that retail bastion of moral decency which, to this day, still sells guns and ammo in its stores (Low Prices on Brands You Trust... like Beretta, Ruger and Savage!). I have nothing against guns - it's the hypocrisy that drives me crazy. Personally, I'd rather just wait until my kids were old enough to see a movie the way it was MEANT to be seen. Ah well. It's a truly puzzling world.

At the same time, this cracked me up and also made me worry about the sorry state of humanity. Aye aye aye.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
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Kevin A
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Have you guys seen "Cinema Paradiso"? That priest that watched the movies before the audience did, and ringed a bell on every scene he found to be "objectionable", so they would cut it? I can hear the priest yelling in italian and the bell right now, as I read this.

And about guns being selled in wal-mart, well, watch "bwoling in columbine" and you'll know how I feel about it. 'Nuff said.
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Never heard that about Cinema Paradiso. Did they actually edit based on his "bells"?
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
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Kevin A
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Heh, yah. I've read about it on a german tech newspage. Pretty darn silly if you ask me. Soon they'll invent the acme parent-o-mat (tm), so you don't have to go through the fuss of raising your childrem all by yourself. Good thing. Helps avoiding those uncomforting questions kids'll ask about the sorry state of the world and if it might be the grown ups that have something to do with it...

In fact Gundark told me Spielberg is having legal issues with the company who developed that device (if I remember correctly), because he objects the idea of such a player.
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I'd be curious to see how it filters stuff out and what parameters are used to determine "questionable content". That, in itself, would be funny as hell.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
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We've been discussing this over at HTF, and I wrote a paper on the lawsuit (Huntsman v. Soderbergh) for my Entertainment Law class. What the ClearPlay machine does is it uses software filters to mute dialogue and jump over certain scenes. This is facilitated by the timcode embedded in each DVD you buy. The filters in the player are customisable to various levels of intensity, and there are levels for language, violence, nudity, crude dialogue, and the like. You also have the option of never turning the filters on. This is a hot button topic that has a lot of people screaming censorship, but it really isn't if you stop and think about it. First, the DVD is never physically altered; it'll play just fine in any DVD player, including the ClearPlay model. Second, it's user-defined and controlled; while it's not the user that is making the edits, s/he is in control of whether or not the feature will actually be used, and to what extent. Third, and this is my biggest peeve about the court case, if Soderberg et al win, this will further restrict our freedoms as to how we can use copyrighted material. Fan edits? Fugeddaboudit. Chapter search? Ditto. Time code search? Ditto.
BTW, there is legal precedent for ClearPlay and other editing software producers to win this case. It's called Nintendo of America v. Lewis Galoob, more commonly known as the Game Genie case. Here, the judge ruled that Galoob's device did not infringe copyright by creating a derivative work; the derivative work was not in a fixed form, so a person could take the cartridge, w/o the Game Genie, and still play it normally. The parallels are obvious. As a side note, Intel has submitted a brief of amicus curiae supporting this side of the case.
What concerns me more are companies that rent and sell edited versions of movies @ a premium. These guys should have the book thrown @ them.

Princess Leia: I happen to like nice men.
Han Solo: I'm a nice man.

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fuck censorship.
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent."
Qui-Gon Jinn (R.I.P.)
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I'm not against censorship completely. I think I, as an adult, should be able to get something that has it's original content. But i have no problem with censored versions being available as well. That would not infringe on your constitutional right to choose, as long as both versions are available.
"May the force be with you!"
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you can also choose not to have it, or to have it...
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent."
Qui-Gon Jinn (R.I.P.)
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Its not enough to have this V-chip in every tv sold,now they make another useless gadget to censor the best part of movies.
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Originally posted by: GundarkHunter
Intel has submitted a brief of amicus curiae...

A what?

I can definitely see the parallels between this and the game genie case and so long as it doesn't have to be used, I guess it's not all bad. It almost sounded like the sort of thing that once you buy the player and plug it in, it automatically censors, no questions asked. Well, I guess if this opens up the movie market to some people who would not otherwise watch a movie, then more power to them. If they realize they can watch a movie without stuff that they don't want to see (even if that's not the director's intent), maybe they'll watch more movies and give some movies a larger DVD audience. Who knows?
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
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Originally posted by: Bossk
Never heard that about Cinema Paradiso. Did they actually edit based on his "bells"?


Yes, there was a scene in that movie in which the local priest (this was set in early 30s-40s Italy, I think) watched the movie alone and ringed a bell when he saw something that he thought to be inapropriated, like 2 people kissing and stuff. They would out a marker on the celulloid, and cut that scene afterwards.

A friend of mine was watching Matrix Reloaded with his both 3 year old twin sons. His wife freaked out when she saw this. He claimed they were too young too understand what the violence onscreen was all about, and she said "oh yeah? watch this...", and told them both to play as they had guns. One of them shoot his brother with his finger, making "pow, pow" sounds, the other one throwed himself to the ground, as he was "dying". I don't know what to think about this... I've always belived that TV contributes to violence, when they show glorious non-fictional violence on TV. And at the same time, I belive in freedom of expression, and non-censorhip. Maybe we must evolute as a society and ban violence and hate from it, and THEN we'll be able to show extreme violence on TV to our kids with no fears.
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Bossk, a brief of amicus curiae is a document in support of a particular position on a case. In Canada, we call such parties intervenors, because they are intervening on behalf of one of the primary parties to the case.
As a side note, ClearPlay has a list of films that they will not create filters for, because they feel that the filtering would render these films incomprehensible. On this list are: Schindler's List, The Passion of the Christ, Saving Private Ryan, and several others. I would not be surprised to see either of Bill Hunt's picks added to the list.

Princess Leia: I happen to like nice men.
Han Solo: I'm a nice man.

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What are Bill Hunt's picks?
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
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kapgar.com
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Read your quote: Dawn of the Dead, Natural Born Killers, and Last Tango in Paris. I doubt if ClearPlay's core of subscribers would even be interested in these titles.

Princess Leia: I happen to like nice men.
Han Solo: I'm a nice man.

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Originally posted by: ricarleite
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Originally posted by: Bossk
Never heard that about Cinema Paradiso. Did they actually edit based on his "bells"?


Yes, there was a scene in that movie in which the local priest (this was set in early 30s-40s Italy, I think) watched the movie alone and ringed a bell when he saw something that he thought to be inapropriated, like 2 people kissing and stuff. They would out a marker on the celulloid, and cut that scene afterwards.

A friend of mine was watching Matrix Reloaded with his both 3 year old twin sons. His wife freaked out when she saw this. He claimed they were too young too understand what the violence onscreen was all about, and she said "oh yeah? watch this...", and told them both to play as they had guns. One of them shoot his brother with his finger, making "pow, pow" sounds, the other one throwed himself to the ground, as he was "dying". I don't know what to think about this... I've always belived that TV contributes to violence, when they show glorious non-fictional violence on TV. And at the same time, I belive in freedom of expression, and non-censorhip. Maybe we must evolute as a society and ban violence and hate from it, and THEN we'll be able to show extreme violence on TV to our kids with no fears.




I don't think the movies should be censored, but it appears that there are fewer and fewer family oriented shows and movies being made. A responsible parent doesn't want their kids watching something that has an abundance of blood and gore or excessive cussing in it. But yet there are very few forms of entertainment that are not adult oriented. Video games used to be something that kids could play without any repercussions. These days, the vast majority of the games have realistic blood, gore, excessive violence and yes, foul language in them. I don't think everything should be censored, but I don't think Barney should be a parent's only option for their kids. One thing that gets me is that people criticize Nintendo for making a few kid friendly video games, but they tend to forget about a few other games (such as Killer Instinct, The Legend Of Zelda, etc.) that adults like to play as well. As far as Game Genie is concerned, that was nothing more than cheat codes. You could play the game with or without it. There were no copyright infringements taking place.
"May the force be with you!"
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actually I have no problen devises of this sort. As long as you are not forced to buy them that is. It might be Censorship but only for those who are willing participants. As long as parents can choose whether or not to censor, I thinks its okay. People who want to watch the full version can still do so and people who want to watch the censored version can as well. All you are doing is giving parents the choice, isn't that what freedom is about, choice?
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I say bann such devices. Parents should not show there kids movies like Saving Private Ryan or The Terminator until they are old enough. My parents didn't and I think they made the right choice. If you want to watch something mature with your kids watch Finding Nemo. A movie thats mature enough for adults and accetable for children.
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I don't think banning the devices is necessary, jimbo. The market will decide whether or not such a product has any shelf life.

Princess Leia: I happen to like nice men.
Han Solo: I'm a nice man.

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Originally posted by: ricarleite
Have you guys seen "Cinema Paradiso"? That priest that watched the movies before the audience did, and ringed a bell on every scene he found to be "objectionable", so they would cut it? I can hear the priest yelling in italian and the bell right now, as I read this.

And about guns being selled in wal-mart, well, watch "bwoling in columbine" and you'll know how I feel about it. 'Nuff said.


Bowling for Columbine is a joke of a movie that combines lies, exaggerations, and forgery to get its point across.

The Wal-mart scenes are faked.

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are that the only scenes that are faked?
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent."
Qui-Gon Jinn (R.I.P.)
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And shouldn't parents be able to make that decision themselves?
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Originally posted by: motti_soL
are that the only scenes that are faked?


Here's a couple of websites that detail the lies in Bowling For Columbine:
Truth_About_Bowling Bowling For Truth

Michael Moore pulls every trick in the book, from lying about statistics and staging fake scenes (like the bank and wal-mart) to clever editing.
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interesting.
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent."
Qui-Gon Jinn (R.I.P.)