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Bootleg DVDs — Page 66

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No kidding!?! I never saw an XVID option (though I admit I never looked.) What about the audio? FairUse converted the audio along with it (I dropped the 5.1 from 448kbps to 224). I've always run the video by itself through VDM (The PCM is a separate capture)

Like Molly said, you have to configure it to use XviD under the compression settings. If you use 2-pass (which you should), you'll have to configure and run it once for each pass. As for audio, I almost never use VDub's compression options, even with LAME acm, because they are far less extensive than those provided by dedicated audio encoding progs. There is a somewhat decent guide on how to encode mp3 with Lame using BeSweet at http://www.doom9.org/ac3tomp3.htm .

All-in-one backup solutions like GKnot or FairUse are convenient, but getting to know the options of the programs they actually use, although time consuming, is better. I hope you'll eventually make the dvd image itself available, as, depending on the encoding settings and quality, even a 2 CD rip can fail to accurately reflect the strengths of the original source.

I saw it. Nice stuff. When I get to my hom computer (Man, my father-in-law's DSL is fast!), I'll give it a shot. One quick question: at first glance, it lookss like you hacve me running an AVIsynth in VDM. Is this the case? If so, why use this versus VDM's own IVTC?

True, you would be using VDub for the actual compression. The difference is that Decomb (I've found) has much better field detection and produces better results overall (it is also still being actively developed and improved upon, much more so than that aspect of VDub). I hope this helps
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AVIs and VBR audio don't mix very well, unfortunately.

Moll.

"Right now the coffees are doing their final work." (Airi, Masked Rider Den-o episode 1)

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"MeBeJedi, please tell me you will use the PAL DVD's as a source, and not the NTSC ones."

I presume you meant "LD's", and I live in America. Besides, from what I've read, the PAL LD's don't make a tremendous difference.

"hope this helps"

Immensely. Hey, it's asking dumb questions and getting good answers that got me this far in the first place.

(BTW, please forgive me typing earlier. I was holding my 4-month-old son at the time. )

"I hope you'll eventually make the dvd image itself available, as, depending on the encoding settings and quality, even a 2 CD rip can fail to accurately reflect the strengths of the original source."

Well, for now, my concern is getting my current version on BitTorrent, just so everyone can see where I am right now. 4.7 GBs seems a lot to download, but maybe that's just me.

"AVIs and VBR audio don't mix very well, unfortunately."

Near as I can tell, FairUse used VBR audio, and it sounded great.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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No, I meant DVDs - the PAL LD's are most likly a cheap NTSC-2-PAL job. and 100 lines more resolution (16% more resolution) does make a significant difference - it's a similar difference anamorphic Vs non-anamorphic (the difference is 20% - meaning anamorphic NTSC has jut 4% more picture information than non-anamorphic PAL).
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Hi everybody! 1st time poster.



All the talk about getting the best possible transfer of the LDs has been fascinating ... MeBeJedi and Laserman, you're doing great work.

But yeah, with the incredible picture quality on the new DVDs, we're REALLY going to want versions of the O.T. DVDs that attempt to de-specialeditionize them. Even if it means cutting to a blurry laserdisc shot in the middle of an otherwise sharp transfer.

The good thing about using the DVDs for as much of the transfer as possible is that the number of shots you'll actually put in taken from the laserdisc will be fairly few. Therefore, you'll be able to put more work into them.

What I mean is - someone a few pages back said what may or may not have been a joke - that someone should take the pan & scan laserdiscs and overlay that larger image over the widescreen image, to add resolution to at least part of the image and bring it a bit closer to DVD standard.

Now you couldn't do that with a whole film, but if it's just for a few shots when you're de-SpecialEditionizing the DVD, that sounds like a damn good idea. If the Pan & Scan is staying relatively still during the shots you need, you could add a little bit of extra detail that would help a lot.

You would have to put a pretty thick feather around the edges of the Pan & Scan image so that the join with the widescreen image is seamless, but sounds good to me. I did a little bit of this exact thing myself for a project once.

If you're sourcing from the DVDs, you'll have to just deal with a few of the little changes - fixed matte lines around the rancor etc., little matte painting changes - that's not worth going back to the blurrier laserdiscs for. (And who wants matte lines around the rancor on an '04 DVD anyway ...)

I suppose you could go into Final Cut Pro or whatever and artificially sharpen the laser image a little, and blur the DVD image a little if it's being intercut with laserdisc shots very quickly in a sequence ...

But the clips in Empire of Dreams will help, and anyway, at the very least you know you can put back Boba Fett's voice! Just undoing the sound changes will do wonders. And, y'know, if you cut out that ONE shot, the Greedo scene almost goes back to normal. And things like the X-Wings and Ben's Hut and the ghost shot are all effects shots or exterior shots anyway ... cutting to a lower quality version would barely be noticed.

You can also cheat in some shots by combining part of the laserdisc image with part of the DVD image if possible ... I wonder if that would help add some extra detail to the ROTJ ghosts and the "You don't need to see his identification" stormtrooper. Essentially painting out what Lucas painted in!

When you need to replace a shot that wipes, well, wipes can be redone easily enough (especially simple lines across the screen) ... in FCP you'd just set the keyframes for cropping the image and put in a pretty large feather, and you could easily make a shot that transitions nicely from laser to DVD with only a bit of blurring inbetween.

Get someone who's rotoed lightsabers for a fanfilm and you can even change the pink (ROTJ), green (ROTJ) and green/white (ANH) sabers to red/white, green/white and blue/white respectively. It'd be a bitch of a job, but it might be fun. I mean, if Dooku's saber can be made yellow ...

I know you've thought and agonized over all this already. Just saying.


I will be following progress on a patchwork '04/'93 edition with great interest.








P.S. And can I put in my vote that Biggs, "Close the blast doors!" and "I can see a lot better" be left in? And maybe the bantha herd, Oola's death and the windows on Cloud City? But not the rings on the explosions.

I keep waiting for someone to be totally silly and extend/alter the "Lapti Nek" sequence using the single-version vocals with making-of and video footage, just like Lucas "extended" it with Jedi Throw Rocks.

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I'd go further.

The 1997 version still has advantages over both versions, as it is remastered and still has more original footage than the 2004 version. What about a 3-way hodgepodge, between the 2004, 1997 and 1993 versions?

Moll.

"Right now the coffees are doing their final work." (Airi, Masked Rider Den-o episode 1)

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"Even if it means cutting to a blurry laserdisc shot in the middle of an otherwise sharp transfer"

Sorry, but no. Someday, people will realize that this is just going to look like shit. I prefer the consistency of an all-LD-transfer, but you are welcome do make your own.

"the number of shots you'll actually put in taken from the laserdisc will be fairly few."

And they will stick out like an albino in Compton. For all the complaints about the problems on the DVDs so far, I can't believe people want to mix up material of such different quality.

"I will be following progress on a patchwork '04/'93 edition with great interest."

Let me know when someone else does it.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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I understand your argument, MeBeJedi, and your version of the trilogy will certainly be worth ordering.

But a version like this would be worth ordering too, perhaps more so, and I know many people are already working on their own versions of the '04s ...

It doesn't have to be jarring - it's a lot easier to make a sharp transfer look bad than it is to make a blurry transfer look good.

The DVD shots could VERY easily be blurred/downgraded in certain scenes that will have to use laser footage. Perhaps with keyframing so that the blurring comes and goes subtly when needed.

There are certainly a lot of arguments for doing this, since 90% of the film remains essentially unaltered.

You could watch a pristine transfer for that 90%, and then certain scenes would slowly, gradually, briefly become the laserdisc versions we know and love.



And yeah Molly - if someone has the '97 laserdisc lying around, they could certainly get a better transfer of Mr. Sebastian Shaw's face.

I bet you that a shot of the three force ghosts could very easily be created from laserdisc (and perhaps DVD) material, and it could be inserted into the '04 DVDs, and no one would notice the quality change because they're ... ghosts. And Ben and Yoda could be sharpened til the cows come home if you use a little bit of the shot as seen on the new DVDs.

And hell - if you REALLY don't want to use the new DVDs, why not edit together the OT and SE LDs? Surely the SE LD has a better transfer when it's not being full of awful CGI.

Anyway ...


obviously there's a place for both types of OT. The smart fan will be getting a laserdisc-sourced TK47/MeBeJedi, a damned '04 DVD set with Empire of Dreams, and some sharp editor's combination of both.

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"The 1997 version still has advantages over both versions, as it is remastered and still has more original footage than the 2004 version. What about a 3-way hodgepodge, between the 2004, 1997 and 1993 versions?"

The SE LD as a source would be far better. They are cleaned up, but are still near the same level as the O-OT LDs. In addition to this, you have the uncompressed video to ceate a master AVI from, rather than the MPEGs of the DVDs.

"it's a lot easier to make a sharp transfer look bad"

Which begs the question...why bother with such a sharp transfer in the first place. It's like getting a Porsche, but driving it in second gear so you don't go too fast. Know what I mean?
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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>>The SE LD as a source would be far better. They are cleaned up, but are still near the same level as the O-OT LDs. In addition to this, you have the uncompressed video to ceate a master AVI from, rather than the MPEGs of the DVDs.


Yeah, an SE/OT LD mix would be great. Someone should certainly do this.


>>Which begs the question...why bother with such a sharp transfer in the first place. It's like getting a Porsche, but driving it in second gear so you don't go too fast. Know what I mean?


Because you still have a Porsche. =) I mean, if you go with the laserdiscs for the whole thing, it will be blurry throughout. But with the new DVDs out, you can make 90% of it look slightly better, or completely perfect. You could choose your own level of blurriness, that's why.

There are more options now, clearly.

I mean, there's been a lot of talk about PAL laserdiscs and CAV versus CLV, to make your laserdisc transfers look SLIGHTLY better.

Surely it's worth the same amount of thought to making it look better still, by using a downgraded version of the '04 DVDs as often as possible?

I bring up blurring it because you said yourself you wanted "consistency."

I mean, it all starts to look kind of the same when you play a DVD5 on a normal sized TV screen anyway, right?
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"Because you still have a Porsche. =)"

LOL! Smartass

"I mean, it all starts to look kind of the same when you play a DVD5 on a normal sized TV screen anyway, right?"

Well, I've not seen the actual DVD's, but I almost cried when I compared DVD screen captures to my best LD transfers, and that's on my 15-inch computer screen. There's a big difference.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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I have to agree with MeBeJedi. I think a hybrid DVD based on the 2004 release would not be so good. Even if LD footage of the changed scenes could be spliced in, the framing would probably be off, so you'd have to crop the DVD source slightly throughout to compensate or stretch the image temporarily. Furthermore, a lot of the changes are in the soundtrack and musical cues, so it wouldn't be just cutting and pasting frames, but trying rework the score in places. Finally, there are just too many little changes that GL made. If it's only the big ones that bug you, then fine - but when every new cracked out sound effect, orange explosion, digitally-added blinking light/distraction, or farting noise (see: right before the trash compacter creature appears) triggers a torrent of resentment at the man responsible for all this... well, let's just say I'd rather watch a blurrier, but consistent LD transfer.
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Hey, drj - do you have any experience with FairUse?

Should I always use the "Rotate 90 degree" switch? I don't want another sideways XVID. (I want to give this program one more try tonight, so I can have an XVID ready to send to Rik tomorrow.)
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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Originally posted by: MeBeJedi
Hey, drj - do you have any experience with FairUse?


Can't say I have. I just downloaded the demo and tried to do a test, but it wouldn't let me use anything other than a DVD drive or an ISO as a source, so pffft. I'll PM you a (relatively) quick and easy way of doing it using AVISynth and VDub that you can try in case FairUse doesn't work out.

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Originally posted by: ZombieFlanders
Rikter: I'd love to see a picture of your DVD rack, or at least the Star Wars portion of it. Your wife must have the patience of a monk.


http://home.comcast.net/~newmexicoufo/My_Star_Wars_Movie_Collection.jpg

My VHS tapes are in storage still

“My skill are no longer as Mad as the once were” RiK

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Impressive.... most impressive!
Could we have a higher resolution one in order to be able to read the DVDs titles?
oh, and one pic of your left shelf would be great too!
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Wait 'til you guys see my pics of the toy collection I've seen (from the guy who gave me his Faces set.)
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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drjimmy526, turn on your PMs!

I couldn't get VD or VDM to load the .avs file.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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MeBeJedi,

When you get to ESB, are you going to mix the sound back into the film of the snowspeeder spinning out of control and exploding? I really wish they would have left that sound in there on the Def. Coll. and Faces LD's and VHS tapes. It is on every other source.

I was wondering what type of LD Player you have. I have the Pioneer CDL-D703 which is the second best LD Player behind the Elites. The only thing keeping it second best is the lack of an AC-3 output which can easily be added. The best non-Elite player is the D704 which does have AC-3. Both the D703 and D704 models are identical except the AC-3 output. I just saw a D703 on Ebay for $40.99 with some included LD's and the remote. The D704's I saw on there where going for $175.00 which is a little steep. I did pay $220.00 for mine back in 2002, but it came with the manual, remote, and original box.

Patrick

"When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk." - Tuco from The Good, The Bad And The Ugly
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Originally posted by: MeBeJedi
drjimmy526, turn on your PMs! I couldn't get VD or VDM to load the .avs file.


Oops, they're on now . PM me the exact text of the error message you received, if any, and the contents of the script you used.
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Holy crap, Rikter. That's even more than I was expecting. I'm surprised you didn't name your daughter Leia!

Patrick/MeBeJedi: I have the Mitsubishi clone of the 704, but unless you're within easy driving distance of DC, I'm afraid I won't be much help. Now, if you could find someone who has an HLD-X9 or -X0, that would be sublime. Supposedly they're the nearest thing to watching an LD at DVD quality. Someone with an Elite CLD-99 or -97 would be a lot easier to find.
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"I was wondering what type of LD Player you have."

I have a 701, and my wife would castrate me if I got another one. Anyone here 1) have a 703/704 and 2) live near San Bernardino, CA?

"unless you're within easy driving distance of DC"

I have a friend in Maryland...

Actually, to be quite honest, I think the "sparklies" are in the LD transfer, rather than a player by-product. If someone has an excellent set of the Def. Col., that would be a better (and cheaper) option.

BTW, it would appear that my XVID is done. I just have to play it to check.
MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
JediRandy: They're certainly beyond any repair you're capable of making.


MeBeJedi: You aren't one of us.
Go-Mer-Tonic: I can't say I find that very disappointing.


JediRandy: I won't suck as much as a fan edit.
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Omigawd! Rikter.....that pic is just sick!
"If morons could fly, it'd be pitch black." - Anonymous
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noob kingsama here, i was just wondering which would be better, a) going with the methods of getting a dvd copy mentioned through out this form, or b) going full LD.

My THX o-OT got lost/stolen when my mom moved while i was in my senior year in college.... and i WILL NOT watch the SE or new DVD's, well maybe watch but never pay for...

i need your help
,
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v170/Kingsama/samasig.jpg
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Originally posted by: Kingsama
noob kingsama here, i was just wondering which would be better, a) going with the methods of getting a dvd copy mentioned through out this form, or b) going full LD.

My THX o-OT got lost/stolen when my mom moved while i was in my senior year in college.... and i WILL NOT watch the SE or new DVD's, well maybe watch but never pay for...

i need your help
,


There´s an awful lot of hassle involved with watching those laserdisc, a LOT of disc/side swapping, the sheer size of the things, laser rot and plus those old laserdiscplayers are pretty dodgy I hear and support for them is probably almost non-extistent today. From what I´ve seen and read the best transfer out there, the TR47 versions are pretty much identical to the Definitive Edition CAV laserdiscs so your best bet IMO would be to get that version (or wait a few weeks/months and see how the MeBeJedi transfers turn out). But then again if you don´t mind all the laserdisc hassle then going for the LD is ofcourse a viable option, at least then you´ll have the OT in it´s absolute best form currently available. I´ve got my set of the TR47 versions and I´m massively pleased with them.

peace,

Rebelscum
peace,

Rebelscum