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Babylon 5 - Broadcast NTSC (4:3)? — Page 5

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Update: I can capture HDMI. Yay!

I just need to fix an EDID issue which shouldn’t be a big deal. VUDU SD streams come out at 480p, so I’m hoping to capture at that (losslessly) and then encode from there. Thankfully, my 6x3TB RAID0 is up to the job.

My capture chain will be: PS3 =(HDMI)=> Orei HDS-102 =(HDMI)=> Blackmagic UltraStudio MiniRecorder =(Thunderbolt)=> PC.

A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.

I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!

—Teams Jetrell Fo 1, Jetrell Fo 2, and Jetrell Fo 3

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AntcuFaalb said:
So the SPFX are 30p?

They certainly seem to be, but I can’t absolutely rule out there being some hybrid material. If I have the chance, I’ll have a look at some of the other NTSC discs.

If this is the case, what if we used motion compensation to generate 4 intermediate frames for every group of five and then drop the originals? This would give us the 4:5 ratio we need without jerky movement.

Motion-compensated frame-interpolation could certainly generate intermediate frames, but when you generate so many, the resulting video is riddled with artifacts. What you suggest is even worse than the typical use of frame-interpolation to double frame-rates, because – as you say – the originals are discarded, leaving no “clean” frames that might otherwise draw some attention away from the deficiencies of the interpolated ones. Tackling the effects sequences in this fashion presents similar problems to the ones discussed in this thread.

The only issue left, I think, is figuring out what to do between each group of 4 because the lack of an intermediate frame there will result in its own jerkiness.

That would negate any advantage frame-interpolation has over simple decimation of the effects sequences; however, it should be possible to use SVPFlow or SmoothFPS2 to generate frames at evenly spaced motion-increments without a gap. As you’ve probably realized, I don’t recommend it.

JayArgonaut said:

Great news!

Indeed! Your efforts are much appreciated, AntcuFaalb. 😃

EDIT: I trimmed out one of the effects shots and…

  • a) recompressed it without changing anything (B5_orig)
  • b) changed the frame-rate to 23.976fps with SmoothFPS2 (B5_new).

https://mega.nz/#!9FUkGS7K!5ErgJO5KXsXjGQyoMJhBwHFVoY0eXuNeFzqrXsTklG0
https://mega.nz/#!4M1h3CJL!QKdbHvC6TgGQ7Lyx0ILB6NxflCT_gbwWvW31YhZISjs

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Over a year on, just wondered, has there been any progress on this?

Yesterday, Pick (UK/Europe) aired the original version of The Gathering and in 4:3. This made me hopeful that they’d also screen the 4:3 versions of the series - and I was ready to record the whole run, but alas, they’re using the same source as the DVDs.

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I doubt anyone ever bothered to remaster the original version. If the Laserdisc prices ever came down on Ebay, I’d be tempted to get as many as I could and start capturing them. That’s as close to the broadcast masters as you can get.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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The CGI scenes and the live action scenes which transition to or from CGI scenes are taken from a low resolution source, possibly LD, and cropped to 16:9. The same goes to many of the scenes with the text describing the cast and crew. However the “pure” live action scenes look like “new” film scans.

BTW I shared my copy of The Gathering years ago on myspleen, it’s 4:3 and the original version, and I bought it when it was new.

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I’ve never heard of Laserdisc being used this way. As good as the format was it would still be a notch below the broadcast masters, which would have been the full 525 lines of NTSC and likely digital.
In any case not every episode had an LD release.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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Was B5 ever released on PAL LaserDiscs?

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Not according the the Laserdisc Database.

originaltrilogy.com Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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I suspect JMS was thinking of the PAL masters that were used to produce the European VHS releases. If that was the case, perhaps WB did so because of the 625 line advantage?

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Hello, I have for you season 1 episode 1 “Midnight on the Firing Line” in the following formats for comparison, to demonstrate what exists and what would be possible in HD:

  • Region 1 DVD remux (16:9 720x480/60i) - interlaced and 3:2 pulldown, but proper speed
  • Region 2 DVD remux (16:9 720x576/25p) - 4% too fast, but higher resolution and progressive
  • 4:3 Webcap via HDMI (4:3 720x480/60p) - grainy, but CGI is uncropped
  • Dead^Man NWA’s 1080p fan edit from Usenet (16:9 1920x1080/60p)
  • Blu-Ray remux (16:9 1920x1080/24p)

Just kidding about the last one. It’s actually Farscape s01e01 which was professionally upscaled from the PAL masters, to show what is achievable without a new HD scan of the film stock.

https://mega.nz/#F!5OAzBJiR!G5U78Bkn38xxqghuPtBzCA

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Hi, I’m a B5 fan and are all the B5 VUDU episodes 4:3?

I’m very interested in the Pilot and S1 in 4X3, anyone cap these yet? Thanks.

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For the love of all the gods, will one of you Americans please get hold of those VUDU 4:3 episodes. If Europeans could buy stuff from VUDU, I would have done in a heartbeat.

VIZ TOP TIPS! - PARENTS. Impress your children by showing them a floppy disk and telling them it’s a 3D model of a save icon.

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So the series has just been added to Amazon Prime in the US, and it appears to be in 4:3…

a trolling bantha

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I only started a bit of the pilot movie (listed as episode 0 of season 1 on Prime) and it was 4:3. I’ve never seen the show myself, so I didn’t want to skip around and spoil myself by accident.

a trolling bantha

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Ah, well that’s disappointing…

a trolling bantha

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Damn it! Just found out the entire series on Vudu was on offer for $49 about a month ago. But looks to have expired. Not that I can actually access it since I’m not in US.

Keep an eye out for more deals in future I guess.

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Just a heads up for anybody looking for the laserdiscs: just got an email and apparently JMS is selling a bunch of items from his personal collection that includes laserdiscs. They’ll be for sale on http://www.thejoestore.com/ which goes online about an hour from when I’m posting this. Here’s the full text of the email:


J. Michael Straczynski–creator of Babylon 5 and Sense8, writer for such movies as Clint Eastwood’s Changeling and over a dozen comic book titles from The Amazing Spider-Man and Silver Surfer Requiem to Thor, Rising Stars to Dream Police–has teamed with Jason Davis–of HarlanEllisonBooks.com and long-time editor at B5Books.com–to offer hitherto unimagined treasures from his own private vault via TheJoeStore.com.

“For years I’ve had all these near-mint-condition artifacts from Babylon 5 and elsewhere under wraps,” Straczynski said, "thinking I might eventually donate them to a museum, but after thirty years of thought - I’m very deliberate that way - it seems to me that the best destination would be the hands of fellow fans who could appreciate them. This is particularly important since Amazon and Comet have brought along a lot of new fans who never had the chance to buy any of these now-unavailable treats. That these fans weren’t around In The Beginning shouldn’t preclude them from owning the cool stuff that was created for viewers at the height of the show’s original run.

"However, as a fan myself, I didn’t want to go through eBay or other high-priced auction sites because the whole point is to get these items, many of which have been unavailable for years, into the hands of fans in a way that’s affordable. So Jason came along with this solution.

“All of these items are from my own private collection, from TV series and other projects I’ve done, preserved as I first got them. Most of these items can’t be found at all online, or would be in poor condition. These are mostly mint, still in the box mementos, paraphernalia, collectibles, toys, books and other rarities. In most cases there are only a few of each item, so when they’re gone, they’re gone, and the final chance to get these long-lost treasures will come to an end.”

The online shop goes live at 11am Pacific Time on 9 October 2018 offering virtual shelves stocked with artifacts from the last 30 years of Straczynski’s career: Joe’s short stories (including the paperback adaptations of his Twilight Zone episodes and the elusive, highly-sought-after but never-reprinted B5 tales from Amazing Stories), novels (Demon Night and OtherSyde), and some of his best known comics, most of which are now sold out (Rising Stars, The Book of Lost Souls, Ten Grand, Sidekick, Dream Police and more–as well as convention exclusives, individual copies and entire 12 issue runs bundled together).

TheJoeStore.com has Babylon 5 DVDs, CDs, magazines, novels, bookmarks, and even the long-forgotten promotional buttons, T-shirts and pamphlets that Joe personally commissioned to promote “our last, best hope for peace” in the days before the pilot was filmed and broadcast. (B5 adjacent, there are T-shirts from Joe’s tenure as host of LA’s sf radio show, Hour 25, designed by the late Peter Ledger, who also created the earliest concept art for B5.)

Don’t see what you’re after? Feel free to inquire. We have very limited supplies–often just one or two–of Babylon 5 standees, Laserdiscs, and various action figures and games that we haven’t yet put online, but we’ll brave a journey to the Rim in an effort to fulfill your requests.

Best of all, Joe will sign selected items for a nominal fee.

Every order will be packed with a Joe’s Comics bookmark or sticker, and a photocopy of Joe’s “Sleeping in Light” teleplay will be packed with every order over $100 until our stock of those bonus items has been depleted.

The Joe Store opens at 11am Pacific Time, 9 October 2018. Remember, many items are in (very) short supply, so don’t be late.

Items range in price from $5-100.

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It’s a tossup for me between the 4:3 Vudu versions and Dead^Man NWA’s 1080p fan edit from Usenet .

The real best version of Babylon 5 would surely be a Dead^Man like enhancement of the Vudu copies. The mixed CGI/live-action scenes would look a lot better.

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I bought all of the episodes on VUDU and I’ve been capturing them.

Unfortunately, there are two issues:

  1. The little progress bar from my player is in the image for the first second of the capture. This is unfortunately unavoidable.

  2. The intro is strangely in letterboxed 16:9.

I think we can address #2 by having someone (myself?) capture the 4:3 intro from a S1, S2, S3, S4, and S5 LD since I believe the intro changes in each season. I have a sophisticated LD capturing setup if someone wants to let me borrow the five discs.

What should we do about #1?

A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.

I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!

—Teams Jetrell Fo 1, Jetrell Fo 2, and Jetrell Fo 3

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For #1, the web interface scales with the size of the browser window. If you you make it really tall, the interface is outside the video, like so. You’d need to capture from a pc, and make sure that you still get the video’s full resolution (you should be able to with a 1080p monitor). These bits unfortunately would be scaled (it looks like earlier in this thread you figured out how to get the streams at native 480, which is real cool).

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