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4K restoration on Star Wars — Page 308

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MalàStrana said:

Yep. Ep 2 is bad but nowhere as bad as the ST.

Han: Hey Lando! You kept your promise, right? Not a scratch?
Lando: Well, what’s left of her isn’t scratched. All the scratched parts got knocked off along the way.
Han (exasperated): Knocked off?!

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Sure dude, sure. If you don’t have anything to say, you can leave silence be.

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MalàStrana said:
I hope they will edit trilogy boxsets so I can only buy the Original Hexalogy without the weird fanfic called “Sequel trilogy”.

I hope, but that’s unlikely

MalàStrana said:

Sure dude, sure. If you don’t have anything to say, you can leave silence be.

You answered a satirical post about opinions stated as facts, to state an opinion as fact.

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MalàStrana said:

Sure dude, sure. If you don’t have anything to say, you can leave silence be.

You’re quite the funny guy.

Han: Hey Lando! You kept your promise, right? Not a scratch?
Lando: Well, what’s left of her isn’t scratched. All the scratched parts got knocked off along the way.
Han (exasperated): Knocked off?!

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 (Edited)

Even in the 4K restoration thread about the Original Trilogy… people have to continue to air their off-topic gripes / views / agendas about Prequels and Sequels?

I strongly suggest it stops - and for those wish to continue the conversation about PT/ST etc go find the far more relevant thread(s).

Thank you.
 

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Slavicuss said:

Creox said:

Does anyone know WHY Lucas stubbornly clings to his decision? Is he embarrassed about the original release or is he just being that controlling of his creation? or is it something else?

I find his decision to date quite puzzling on the surface of it.

Spite. He’s pissed the fans didn’t take to his prequels the way they did the original films. So he denies them the originals they hold dear. That’s my take.

He also believes the original versions came up short (for whatever reasons) and wants to improve them, but that’s no excuse for trying to bury them. All versions can coexist as other box sets (CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND, ALIEN, BLADE RUNNER, etc) have demonstrated.

I cannot think of another director that has treated one of their films in this manner…does anyone know of one?

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Creox said:

Slavicuss said:

Creox said:

Does anyone know WHY Lucas stubbornly clings to his decision? Is he embarrassed about the original release or is he just being that controlling of his creation? or is it something else?

I find his decision to date quite puzzling on the surface of it.

Spite. He’s pissed the fans didn’t take to his prequels the way they did the original films. So he denies them the originals they hold dear. That’s my take.

He also believes the original versions came up short (for whatever reasons) and wants to improve them, but that’s no excuse for trying to bury them. All versions can coexist as other box sets (CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND, ALIEN, BLADE RUNNER, etc) have demonstrated.

I cannot think of another director that has treated one of their films in this manner…does anyone know of one?

Not as dramatic a situation as Star Wars but Milos Forman basically foresworn the theatrical cut of Amadeus after releasing the directors cut.

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 (Edited)

Creox said:

Slavicuss said:

Creox said:

Does anyone know WHY Lucas stubbornly clings to his decision? Is he embarrassed about the original release or is he just being that controlling of his creation? or is it something else?

I find his decision to date quite puzzling on the surface of it.

Spite. He’s pissed the fans didn’t take to his prequels the way they did the original films. So he denies them the originals they hold dear. That’s my take.

He also believes the original versions came up short (for whatever reasons) and wants to improve them, but that’s no excuse for trying to bury them. All versions can coexist as other box sets (CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND, ALIEN, BLADE RUNNER, etc) have demonstrated.

I cannot think of another director that has treated one of their films in this manner…does anyone know of one?

Many Directors Can’t treat their films or have another go at the film they wanted to make either the material is not available; sometimes like audio or footage lost but if they could, not many of them would start shoving loads of CGI in to restore their intentions.

This is the main point. If you are going to do something you restore something from what was planned that you could not do or cut for time constraints or censorship. Lucus has all the material Archived.

George’s edits do not really fit the normal condition of what one would wish for entirely when thinking restoration or directors cut or even extended cut it is basically revisionism and anything goes, it does not purport to any notion of “Ideas at the time” or loosely expanding upon original source material in a very radical sense.

Many Directors will just want to move on to their next project it’s water under the bridge.

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crissrudd4554 said:

Creox said:

Slavicuss said:

Creox said:

Does anyone know WHY Lucas stubbornly clings to his decision? Is he embarrassed about the original release or is he just being that controlling of his creation? or is it something else?

I find his decision to date quite puzzling on the surface of it.

Spite. He’s pissed the fans didn’t take to his prequels the way they did the original films. So he denies them the originals they hold dear. That’s my take.

He also believes the original versions came up short (for whatever reasons) and wants to improve them, but that’s no excuse for trying to bury them. All versions can coexist as other box sets (CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND, ALIEN, BLADE RUNNER, etc) have demonstrated.

I cannot think of another director that has treated one of their films in this manner…does anyone know of one?

Not as dramatic a situation as Star Wars but Milos Forman basically foresworn the theatrical cut of Amadeus after releasing the directors cut.

But I can still watch one or the other regardless…interesting. Thanks!

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 (Edited)

Creox said:

crissrudd4554 said:

Creox said:

Slavicuss said:

Creox said:

Does anyone know WHY Lucas stubbornly clings to his decision? Is he embarrassed about the original release or is he just being that controlling of his creation? or is it something else?

I find his decision to date quite puzzling on the surface of it.

Spite. He’s pissed the fans didn’t take to his prequels the way they did the original films. So he denies them the originals they hold dear. That’s my take.

He also believes the original versions came up short (for whatever reasons) and wants to improve them, but that’s no excuse for trying to bury them. All versions can coexist as other box sets (CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND, ALIEN, BLADE RUNNER, etc) have demonstrated.

I cannot think of another director that has treated one of their films in this manner…does anyone know of one?

Not as dramatic a situation as Star Wars but Milos Forman basically foresworn the theatrical cut of Amadeus after releasing the directors cut.

But I can still watch one or the other regardless…interesting. Thanks!

no you can not see theatrical version. It has been buried on that one at least in HD…

Enter the Dragon is also not available in it’s theatrical presentation.

There is not many out there but there are a few…

Look at it this way many theatrical cut’s could do with directors cuts but without the original theatrical version being ditched… If anything there are more theatrical cut’s needing Directors Cuts than there are Theatrical versions being made unavailable.

Let’s take the Apocalypse now! Final cut as an example… You could be upset that Coppolla never restored the scenes to the ending sequence and the End credits with the camp being napalmed, the shot of the Boat going passed the Plane that is crashed by the River. That is really the meat and potatoes and cinematic magic but it is glossed over.

It’s the Same for Lucus no doubt what you or I might see as the total 100% should be included or restored is glossed over and unimportant. The directors mind is what it is what he want’s to do and what he does not.

You can look in disbelief and shrug and say well why are you doing this?.. Apocalypse now is a massive miss on what could be too afraid to go there no doubt same as Lucus and from the same school and circle of friends but both with the power to do what they want with those films.

Coppolla went half way between Redux and theatrical with his final cut… He ducked away from that final sequence, he did not want to go there. Lucus has shown his hand he wants to revise his Star Wars and that is it.

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 (Edited)

Ronster said:

Creox said:

crissrudd4554 said:

Creox said:

Slavicuss said:

Creox said:

Does anyone know WHY Lucas stubbornly clings to his decision? Is he embarrassed about the original release or is he just being that controlling of his creation? or is it something else?

I find his decision to date quite puzzling on the surface of it.

Spite. He’s pissed the fans didn’t take to his prequels the way they did the original films. So he denies them the originals they hold dear. That’s my take.

He also believes the original versions came up short (for whatever reasons) and wants to improve them, but that’s no excuse for trying to bury them. All versions can coexist as other box sets (CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND, ALIEN, BLADE RUNNER, etc) have demonstrated.

I cannot think of another director that has treated one of their films in this manner…does anyone know of one?

Not as dramatic a situation as Star Wars but Milos Forman basically foresworn the theatrical cut of Amadeus after releasing the directors cut.

But I can still watch one or the other regardless…interesting. Thanks!

no you can not see theatrical version. It has been buried on that one at least in HD…

Enter the Dragon is also not available in it’s theatrical presentation.

There is not many out there but there are a few…

Look at it this way many theatrical cut’s could do with directors cuts but without the original theatrical version being ditched… If anything there are more theatrical cut’s needing Directors Cuts than there are Theatrical versions being made unavailable.

Let’s take the Apocalypse now! Final cut as an example… You could be upset that Coppolla never restored the scenes to the ending sequence and the End credits with the camp being napalmed, the shot of the Boat going passed the Plane that is crashed by the River. That is really the meat and potatoes and cinematic magic but it is glossed over.

It’s the Same for Lucus no doubt what you or I might see as the total 100% should be included or restored is glossed over and unimportant. The directors mind is what it is what he want’s to do and what he does not.

You can look in disbelief and shrug and say well why are you doing this?.. Apocalypse now is a massive miss on what could be too afraid to go there no doubt same as Lucus and from the same school and circle of friends but both with the power to do what they want with those films.

Damn…thanks again. The more you know.
Does that include AN Redux?

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 (Edited)

AN Redux came first then now he shaved it back to a halfway house between the theatrical and Redux all are available though on the new release.

Coppolla should Nudge him…

Although I’d say he Copped out of the possibilities of what I can see 😃

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Ronster said:

AN Redux came first then now he shaved it back to a halfway house between the theatrical and Redux all are available though on the new release.

Coppolla should Nudge him…

Although I’d say he Copped out of the possibilities of what I can see 😃

Groan!!

😃

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Here’s something: I can totally see myself in George’s shoes.
I remix & remaster music & I sometimes go back several times making new changes before I’m satisfied.
I do graphic design & so long as it’s a personal project with no deadline, it will be changed many many times months after “finishing” it.
I like to poke at & tweak my creations, often being much happier with it than I was before.
So, I don’t hold this against George at all. But, again, suppressing the original version is simply WRONG.

Ray’s Lounge
Biggs in ANH edit idea
ROTJ opening edit idea

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ray_afraid said:

Here’s something: I can totally see myself in George’s shoes.
I remix & remaster music & I sometimes go back several times making new changes before I’m satisfied.
I do graphic design & so long as it’s a personal project with no deadline, it will be changed many many times months after “finishing” it.
I like to poke at & tweak my creations, often being much happier with it than I was before.
So, I don’t hold this against George at all. But, again, suppressing the original version is simply WRONG.

I agree…and I think, from what I’ve read of this long thread, most people also agree. Just release the original, untouched but cleaned up and remastered along with every other version you want aka: Blade Runner.

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 (Edited)

That is correct…

My Top 10 that need something done…Re-Edit and Restore

1.An American Werewolf in London*

2.Conan The Barbarian

3.Star Wars (A New Hope)

4.Enter the Dragon

5.Apocalypse Now! (Still pending the Apocalypse)

6.Total Recall uncensored*

7.Dune David Lynch Directors Cut

8.Gladiator Uncensored version

9.Alien Further Extended and Uncensored

10.Stargate Extended and uncensored with completed special effects

*Never had alternate version

I Can dream though… Let’s face it. I’m still not Happy with most of the re-cuts that these films already had and this is the main Reason why it is important to always keep the theatrical versions. you always have that to go back to.

Star Wars stands out as a totally different beast to these films though.

Highlander would be 11th but it’s no biggie over the rest of these.

Raiders of the Lost Ark would be 12th but again it’s done well but it’s a tease on some deleted scenes.

13th Would be Jaws for the Alex Kitner Death Censorship amongst music cues removed and stuff.

Essentially when a alternate cut and deleted scenes surface or you know about what is missing you can get a syndrome about it some what, and It can be hard to shake off… But only on films of huge magnitude with amazing artistic merit.

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Michael Mann is actually pretty bad about this, too, with Last of the Mohicans being an excellent example.

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Ronster said:

That is correct…

My Top 10 that need something done…Re-Edit and Restore

1.An American Werewolf in London*

2.Conan The Barbarian

3.Star Wars (A New Hope)

4.Enter the Dragon

5.Apocalypse Now! (Still pending the Apocalypse)

6.Total Recall uncensored*

7.Dune David Lynch Directors Cut

8.Gladiator Uncensored version

9.Alien Further Extended and Uncensored

10.Stargate Extended and uncensored with completed special effects

*Never had alternate version

I Can dream though… Let’s face it. I’m still not Happy with most of the re-cuts that these films already had and this is the main Reason why it is important to always keep the theatrical versions. you always have that to go back to.

Star Wars stands out as a totally different beast to these films though.

Highlander would be 11th but it’s no biggie over the rest of these.

Raiders of the Lost Ark would be 12th but again it’s done well but it’s a tease on some deleted scenes.

13th Would be Jaws for the Alex Kitner Death Censorship amongst music cues removed and stuff.

Essentially when a alternate cut and deleted scenes surface or you know about what is missing you can get a syndrome about it some what, and It can be hard to shake off… But only on films of huge magnitude with amazing artistic merit.

I think the deleted footage from AN AMERICAN WEREWOLF IN LONDON is lost to time. I would love to see an extended cut with the three hobos mauled by the werewolf, but it looks like an impossible dream, sadly.

ALIEN, is another I would be thrilled to see extended. It very nearly happened! An extended cut was prepared with EVERYTHING back in - including previously unseen material - this version, I believe, was put together by Charles de Lauzirika.
The film’s director, Ridley Scott, viewed it and thought it was too long. He then came up with a compromise - ALIEN: THE DIRECTOR’S CUT - which contained very little added material but many edits made to the film and augmented with CGI.
I hope the original edit by Charles de Lauzirika still exists and will be released as bonus material one day.

An extended edit for JAWS will never happen, I think, as the director is satisfied with the film as is.

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While it’s pretty commonplace for films to be re-edited before home video release these days, few have had edits so substantial that they change the character and quality of the entire film as dramatically as the Star Wars original trilogy.

The closest I can think of is the Director’s Cut of Cinema Paradiso, which adds 49 minutes of material to a classic Award-winning bittersweet nostalgia film to turn it into a fairly cringeworthy stalker fantasy film. Not quite as ugly a transition as the Special Editions, but pretty darn close. Also, the original cut of Cinema Paradiso is not suppressed, which means the only problem is the market confusion of having two very different films being marketed under the same name.

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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Ronster said:

That is correct…

My Top 10 that need something done…Re-Edit and Restore

1.An American Werewolf in London*

2.Conan The Barbarian

3.Star Wars (A New Hope)

4.Enter the Dragon

5.Apocalypse Now! (Still pending the Apocalypse)

6.Total Recall uncensored*

7.Dune David Lynch Directors Cut

8.Gladiator Uncensored version

9.Alien Further Extended and Uncensored

10.Stargate Extended and uncensored with completed special effects

*Never had alternate version

I Can dream though… Let’s face it. I’m still not Happy with most of the re-cuts that these films already had and this is the main Reason why it is important to always keep the theatrical versions. you always have that to go back to.

Star Wars stands out as a totally different beast to these films though.

Highlander would be 11th but it’s no biggie over the rest of these.

Raiders of the Lost Ark would be 12th but again it’s done well but it’s a tease on some deleted scenes.

13th Would be Jaws for the Alex Kitner Death Censorship amongst music cues removed and stuff.

Essentially when a alternate cut and deleted scenes surface or you know about what is missing you can get a syndrome about it some what, and It can be hard to shake off… But only on films of huge magnitude with amazing artistic merit.

Just as an aside. I am looking forward to Villeneuve’s Dune next year more than I did with TROS. I know, I’m a heretic.

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Creox said:

Ronster said:

That is correct…

My Top 10 that need something done…Re-Edit and Restore

1.An American Werewolf in London*

2.Conan The Barbarian

3.Star Wars (A New Hope)

4.Enter the Dragon

5.Apocalypse Now! (Still pending the Apocalypse)

6.Total Recall uncensored*

7.Dune David Lynch Directors Cut

8.Gladiator Uncensored version

9.Alien Further Extended and Uncensored

10.Stargate Extended and uncensored with completed special effects

*Never had alternate version

I Can dream though… Let’s face it. I’m still not Happy with most of the re-cuts that these films already had and this is the main Reason why it is important to always keep the theatrical versions. you always have that to go back to.

Star Wars stands out as a totally different beast to these films though.

Highlander would be 11th but it’s no biggie over the rest of these.

Raiders of the Lost Ark would be 12th but again it’s done well but it’s a tease on some deleted scenes.

13th Would be Jaws for the Alex Kitner Death Censorship amongst music cues removed and stuff.

Essentially when a alternate cut and deleted scenes surface or you know about what is missing you can get a syndrome about it some what, and It can be hard to shake off… But only on films of huge magnitude with amazing artistic merit.

Just as an aside. I am looking forward to Villeneuve’s Dune next year more than I did with TROS. I know, I’m a heretic.

As a huge fan of both the Dune novels and Villeneuve’s films, you’re not alone.

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 (Edited)

There’s a version of Night of the Living Dead where the co-writer & all 'round dumb schmuck John Russo added in scenes where the zombie apocalypse is said to be brought on by “Man’s sins” such as homosexuality. Original writer/director George A. Romero could do nothing about it, because the film is public domain (a whole other story). It’s the most shameless & repulsive revision to a film I’ve ever seen.
The only thing that makes Star Wars SEs worse is that the original version 1968 of NotLD is still readily available in HD (through Criterion no less!) & the awful 1999 version has been practically buried without a second release.
Still, to think I’ve told people that it ranks among my absolute favorite films & that they may have then gotten a version that makes me look zealously religious, sexist, racist & homophobic makes my freaking skin crawl.

Ray’s Lounge
Biggs in ANH edit idea
ROTJ opening edit idea

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I firmly think that there’s little to gripe about these days in respect to having access to the OOT. In just another year or two, 4K projects for the originals will be complete. The more years that pass by, the more the OOT is forgotten. Newer generations are used to the special editions and mesmerized by whatever new SW popcorn movie that comes out. I’m in that odd category where growing up, my SW were the 97 editions and the prequels were steadily getting released. Talk of the OOT was probably the most at its peak back then. That aspect is what led me to look for the originals later on.

I have to be brutally honest and say many effects feel dated in certain scenes compared to some changes that the 97 SE, arguably, improved upon (think stuff like the X Wings). However, I’m just the type of person that still rather have the first, Original version. Now, the reason I bring up 97 SE being “my” SW growing up is because I’m used to certain changes that it is somewhat jarring to watch ROTJ unaltered and have to listen to Yub Nub. In most cases, I’m sure it applies vice versa for the people that grew up on the OOT. I say that to say this: if I was a kid right now, I’d be totally immersed with the newer SW and seldom mess with the OT. Parents right now, whom aren’t the most tech savvy to even find the OOT, will just oblige to buy whatever DVD/streaming release that’s available.
I basically think that even if the OOT was released, who does it really serve? A few thousand people? Perhaps a hard pill to swallow, but just look to the Star Wars sub Reddit. Talk of the OOT is just about extinct. Roll your eyes all you want, but the kind of people posting in those places on the internet is more of the intended audiences. Why lift a finger for the minority of us?

The Rise of Failures

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TavorX said:

I firmly think that there’s little to gripe about these days in respect to having access to the OOT.

The suppression of history is wrong.
I’m personally more than happy with Despecilized, 4K-- & the Revisited projects for my Star Wars.
But wonderful fan projects don’t make what’s wrong right.

TavorX said:

I have to be brutally honest and say many effects feel dated in certain scenes

Of course they do. They are.
One day, Rise of Skywalker will look dated as well.

Ray’s Lounge
Biggs in ANH edit idea
ROTJ opening edit idea